Is America To Blame?

[lizzie]

Because it's their House of Saud, not ours. The street level perception is something that needs to be handled in the Saudi nation, not by us.

Yeah, but you support that house with business, but more importantly, arms...

And what's the problem with the Saudis having arms?

 

[Charles_Main]

A question that has been done over and over. Frankly I tire of the Debate.

Suffice to say that if we do not fill the roll of the worlds Main power. Someone else will.

Why not just mind your own business? Can't hurt....

If you think minding your own business can't hurt. You are a fool. We minded our own business before WWII how did that work out?

Like I said, If we do not fill the roll of the worlds main power, Someone else will, and it might not be someone we want calling the shots.

 

[Dr Grump]

Most Americans DO believe this country to be the best in the world. That is not unusual. We were raised in this system and this is our world - our idea of what is best from our perspective and our perspective is us, for most of us. That's quite natural.

Saying we are the best doesn't equate to our ramming our system down another's throat. Of course, we do our best to influence (sometimes by force, but more often through economic influence, which unfortunately will not be as influential of an option for us because our economy now sucks) other nations to develop a similar system because, as I said, that is in our best interest.

The reason it is in our best interest is because we rarely have an overall adversarial relationship (either with respect to national security or with trade) with a nation that has a system of governement based on democracy.

Bottom line, the more nations in the world that are democracy-based, the more securethe USA will be - our best interest.

I hope that makes sense.

That is the same with all countries, but that doesn't mean you get to ride rough shod over other countries - well you shouldn't be able to anyway, not while talking about freedoms etc.

It does make sense, but it doesn't make it right...

I've never been one to like the old "don't do as I do, do as I say" analogy...

 

[Dr Grump]

Because it's their House of Saud, not ours. The street level perception is something that needs to be handled in the Saudi nation, not by us.

Yeah, but you support that house with business, but more importantly, arms...

And what's the problem with the Saudis having arms?

Nothing...if they were a democracy....

 

[Dr Grump]

If you think minding your own business can't hurt. You are a fool. We minded our own business before WWII how did that work out?

Like I said, If we do not fill the roll of the worlds main power, Someone else will, and it might not be someone we want calling the shots.

Just beccuase you're the biggest kid on the block, doesn't mean you have to flex your muscles ALL the time....

You will always be one of the world's biggest powers...always...(well until you split up into about three different countries in about 200-300 years time)...

 

[lizzie]

Yeah, but you support that house with business, but more importantly, arms...

And what's the problem with the Saudis having arms?

Nothing...if they were a democracy....

Are you saying that only democracies should have arms?

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

A question that has been done over and over. Frankly I tire of the Debate.

Suffice to say that if we do not fill the roll of the worlds Main power. Someone else will.

Why not just mind your own business? Can't hurt....

If you think minding your own business can't hurt. You are a fool. We minded our own business before WWII how did that work out?

Like I said, If we do not fill the roll of the worlds main power, Someone else will, and it might not be someone we want calling the shots.

No, we didn't. Not even close.

 

[lizzie]

You will always be one of the world's biggest powers...always...(well until you split up into about three different countries in about 200-300 years time)...

If we split up, it won't take 200-300 years for it to happen.

 

[Charles_Main]

If you think minding your own business can't hurt. You are a fool. We minded our own business before WWII how did that work out?

Like I said, If we do not fill the roll of the worlds main power, Someone else will, and it might not be someone we want calling the shots.

Just beccuase you're the biggest kid on the block, doesn't mean you have to flex your muscles ALL the time....

I agree, I am not trying to justify every action we have taken. I am simply stating we need to maintain our strength and influence to remain able to react before problems get big, and that if we become unable to project power, someone else will fill that gap, and it is likely to be someone we are less then friendly with.

IMO anyways

 

[Dr Grump]

You will always be one of the world's biggest powers...always...(well until you split up into about three different countries in about 200-300 years time)...

If we split up, it won't take 200-300 years for it to happen.

I think California, NM, Arizona and parts of Texas will form their own country. Some people think they will join Mexico, but most Spanish-speaking Americans hate the place and its lawlessness, so I'm pushing more towards them forming their own country. Maybe some of the northern states will join Canada, and I think everything East of the Mississippi will stay part of the USA...

...my two cents..

 

[jillian]

Why not just mind your own business? Can't hurt....

If you think minding your own business can't hurt. You are a fool. We minded our own business before WWII how did that work out?

Like I said, If we do not fill the roll of the worlds main power, Someone else will, and it might not be someone we want calling the shots.

No, we didn't. Not even close.

actually, we did... until pearl harbor.

lots of lives lost til then.

 

[Charles_Main]

If you think minding your own business can't hurt. You are a fool. We minded our own business before WWII how did that work out?

Like I said, If we do not fill the roll of the worlds main power, Someone else will, and it might not be someone we want calling the shots.

No, we didn't. Not even close.

actually, we did... until pearl harbor.

lots of lives lost til then.

I think his point is we were meddling behind the scenes, and he would be correct. However what we were not doing, Or more to the point is, what we were not capable of. Is reacting sooner. That fact is why since then we have tried to always remain able to project power, and react earlier to developing situations.

Now as long as we retain that capability we will be labeled an imperial power. Whether we flex or not. IMO

 

[lizzie]

I think California, NM, Arizona and parts of Texas will form their own country. Some people think they will join Mexico, but most Spanish-speaking Americans hate the place and its lawlessness, so I'm pushing more towards them forming their own country. Maybe some of the northern states will join Canada, and I think everything East of the Mississippi will stay part of the USA...

...my two cents..

Hmm, if that happens, I want Oklahoma and Louisiana in my country too. People in those two states are tough, with the exception of most of New Orleans. Okies have grit. Louisianians are inventive and industrious. Texas would be surrounded and protected on all sides- that's a good thing.

 

[Liberty]

if america was imperialistic we would have conquered both japan and australia, iraq, and most of the western hemisphere by now. People who say the US is imperialistic do not know the definition of imperialistic.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

If you think minding your own business can't hurt. You are a fool. We minded our own business before WWII how did that work out?

Like I said, If we do not fill the roll of the worlds main power, Someone else will, and it might not be someone we want calling the shots.

No, we didn't. Not even close.

actually, we did... until pearl harbor.

lots of lives lost til then.

Trade embargoes on Japan and supporting the Allies wasn't exactly minding our own business. But not only did we not mind our own business around the time of World War 2, but there was World War 1, the war with the Philippines, the Spanish-American War, etc... Clearly "minding our own business" wasn't an American policy in the late-19th and early-20th centuries.

 

[Charles_Main]

if america was imperialistic we would have conquered both japan and australia, and most of the western hemisphere by now. People who say the US is imperialistic do not know the definition of imperialistic.

Clearly, and we would not be moving towards leaving Iraq, and all those oil contract in Iraq would be ours, and We would still control Germany and much of western Europe. Mexico would be ours as we once sacked mexico city. lol I mean come on people. We may not always do the right thing, but when you call us imperialist you are betraying your utter ignorance to the fact that we are like no nation on earth that has ever existed.

Name another nation that has sacrificed so much Blood and treasure, and repeatedly then returned the conquered land to the conquered?

Call it what you want, but it is not Imperialism in the purest form of the word by any means.

 

[AllieBaba]

If America were imperialistic, we would own Germany, Panama, Iraq, Afghanistan and probably England. If we wanted that shithole, we could have had it.

We aren't imperialistic. And only a douche equates standing up for freedom as "flexing muscles" and something negative.

When you're the #1 power in the world, and you defend freedom everywhere, you don't stop promoting it and fighting for it. Ever. You don't take a rest and let the Chinese, or the Cubans, or the Russians be the captain while you take a little rest.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

if america was imperialistic we would have conquered both japan and australia, iraq, and most of the western hemisphere by now. People who say the US is imperialistic do not know the definition of imperialistic.

Then perhaps it's time for our troops to leave Japan, at the very least? Something tells me they're not a threat anymore.

 

[jillian]

I think his point is we were meddling behind the scenes, and he would be correct. However what we were not doing, Or more to the point is, what we were not capable of. Is reacting sooner. That fact is why since then we have tried to always remain able to project power, and react earlier to developing situations.

Now as long as we retain that capability we will be labeled an imperial power. Whether we flex or not. IMO

I think we intentionally stayed out of WWII until we had no choice. Most of this country saw it as not our battle... what they knew of it they saw as a jewish problem.

i don't think our responses since then have had anything to do with trying to make up for not acting sooner then. i think it had to do with cold-war expansionist attitudes... which, fairly, were often in response to soviet expansionist attitudes.

this new interventionism doesn't have the same basis... its oil politics.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

if america was imperialistic we would have conquered both japan and australia, and most of the western hemisphere by now. People who say the US is imperialistic do not know the definition of imperialistic.

Clearly, and we would not be moving towards leaving Iraq, and all those oil contract in Iraq would be ours, and We would still control Germany and much of western Europe. Mexico would be ours as we once sacked mexico city. lol I mean come on people. We may not always do the right thing, but when you call us imperialist you are betraying your utter ignorance to the fact that we are like no nation on earth that has ever existed.

Name another nation that has sacrificed so much Blood and treasure, and repeatedly then returned the conquered land to the conquered?

Call it what you want, but it is not Imperialism in the purest form of the word by any means.

Returned the conquered land to the conquered, with a puppet government and our military still firmly in place.