Is it a sin to seek knowledge?

[GreatestIam]

Is it a sin to seek knowledge?


Is it a sin to want to open one’s eyes instead of being blind?


Is it a sin to do as scriptures urge us to do?


Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.


Gen 3:2 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil:


Adam and Eve were doing exactly what we are all told by scriptures to do, yet God seemed quite upset.


Why is seeking knowledge and ignoring a vile command to remain in ignorant bliss wrong or a sin?


Are you sinning when you seek knowledge and becoming more like God?


Regards

DL

 

[Steven_R]

Yes. Knowledge threatens power structures, including religious and state institutions. It is far better for those in charge for the masses to be willingly ignorant and to blindly accept whatever is being told to them. Kings, priests, and gods keep their comfy positions when nobody looks up and asks questions.

 

[HaShev]

Adam (i.e. man) and Eve (his second bride) was not gaining knowledge, they were eating from that forbidden mix of knowledge that was both good and harmfully evil.
They weren't covering up their literal nakedness the Hebrew means to cover up from their deceptions.
When we mix truth with deceptive accounts it's called propaganda. Enough truths in the mix snd deception to make you think it's real when it's false.
Remember the church itself says Genesis is discussing the serpent (false prophet) and Christians tell you Rome would lift high this farce. Put 2 & 2 together Eve is the Church (second bride of man). Jesus already called himself the Necsash (serpent).

 

[Penelope]

Adam (i.e. man) and Eve (his second bride) was not gaining knowledge, they were eating from that forbidden mix of knowledge that was both good and harmfully evil.
They weren't covering up their literal nakedness the Hebrew means to cover up from their deceptions.
When we mix truth with deceptive accounts it's called propaganda. Enough truths in the mix snd deception to make you think it's real when it's false.
Remember the church itself says Genesis is discussing the serpent (false prophet) and Christians tell you Rome would lift high this farce. Put 2 & 2 together Eve is the Church (second bride of man). Jesus already called himself the Necsash (serpent).

Jesus called himself the serpent? When was that?

 

[Foxfyre]

Is it a sin to seek knowledge?


Is it a sin to want to open one’s eyes instead of being blind?


Is it a sin to do as scriptures urge us to do?


Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.


Gen 3:2 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil:


Adam and Eve were doing exactly what we are all told by scriptures to do, yet God seemed quite upset.


Why is seeking knowledge and ignoring a vile command to remain in ignorant bliss wrong or a sin?


Are you sinning when you seek knowledge and becoming more like God?


Regards

DL

The problem with any scripture is the difference between reading it as it means in our 21st century language and understanding or reading it through the eyes of those who wrote it.

Reading through the eyes of those who wrote it, the second Creation story in Genesis is the allegorical teaching of the Garden of Eden and the original sin, or the first occasion in which humankind, given free will, spoiled God's perfect Creation. The sin was not in seeking knowledge, but in the effort to become as wise and powerful as God instead of loving and obeying God.

From Genesis 3:
“You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. 5 “For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

The message as demonstrated throughout scripture is we will always suffer negative consequences when we decide we are smarter, wiser, stronger, or more clever than God and bypass His counsel in favor of our own desires.

 

[HaShev]

you said: "The sin
was not in seeking knowledge, but in the
effort to become as wise and powerful as
God instead of loving and obeying God."

Isn't the story even christians themselves teach that the false prophet will be claimed and lifted as a god by Rome? Did they not emulate and imposter the Head of hosts in the world to come and place themselves in their imposter throne in Rome and even call the figure they created their god and Popes were called god?
There is your answer: they surely did make themselves like God and the hosts, but they aren't the Temple or messengers giving us the message, they are the ones warned would entice Adam (man) and his bride (the church) to oartake of this fobidden mixed teachings.
Mixing The Torah with paganism.
Mixing Judaic resurrection teachings with underworld hades death cultism teaching, mixing Teshuva with false clearances on sins, mixing intelligent resolve of conflict with violent means instead. Mixing teaching that is good and true with that which is false and evil= a blind world being lead astray. Hence the oathetic nature of humanity today and always.

 

[there4eyeM]

The 'sin' was disobedience. They had been told not to do something.
The error was in immersing humanity into dualism; "good" and "evil". It was the 'knowledge', knowing in a dualistic way, that tore the universe in two. Things are not that way in themselves; we bring separation to existence.

 

[HaShev]

Penelope:

The serpent speaks:
Genesis uses the term 'nachash' for the serpent. This word means "serpent" at Numbers 21:9, and Jesus used nachash (serpent) to refer to himself in John 3:14

Now read Genesis 3:4

In Genesis 3:4 the temptation by the Serpent (as the "shining one" not a viper type snake) saying:
"eat from this tree and "ye shall not surely die."

This becomes very familar - a false promise from the followers who call hanging on a tree, the cross.
Jesus "the bright shining one" said, "Believe in my cross (tree) and you will not die" - found in the book of Matthew and Thomas.
The New Testament also says that Jesus remarked, "He who seeks to save his life will lose it." as well as saying: "Unless the seed die it cannot bring forth fruit."

Note: the vision both Paul and Constantine had of Jesus was of a shining ( luciferous ) one calling himself Jesus.
Iconographs are of shining luciferous light eminating from this image including from the sacred heart just as in: 2Peter-
“So we have the prophetic message more fully confirmed. You will do well to be attentive to this as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star (LUCIFER)rises
in your hearts.” - 2 Peter 1:19


[See here etymology of "Lucifer": "[ the morning star, a fallen rebel archangel, THE Devil, fr. OE. fr. Latin, the morning star, fr. Lucifer light-bearing, fr. luc light + -fer -ferous--more at LIGHT]" (Webster's, p.677)

 

[Foxfyre]

you said: "The sin
was not in seeking knowledge, but in the
effort to become as wise and powerful as
God instead of loving and obeying God."

Isn't the story even christians themselves teach that the false prophet will be claimed and lifted as a god by Rome? Did they not emulate and imposter the Head of hosts in the world to come and place themselves in their imposter throne in Rome and even call the figure they created their god and Popes were called god?
There is your answer: they surely did make themselves like God and the hosts, but they aren't the Temple or messengers giving us the message, they are the ones warned would entice Adam (man) and his bride (the church) to oartake of this fobidden mixed teachings.
Mixing The Torah with paganism.
Mixing Judaic resurrection teachings with underworld hades death cultism teaching, mixing Teshuva with false clearances on sins, mixing intelligent resolve of conflict with violent means instead. Mixing teaching that is good and true with that which is false and evil= a blind world being lead astray. Hence the oathetic nature of humanity today and always.

No, I think that is making things harder than they have to be. It really isn't complicated. The ancient Hebrews, forerunners of the modern Jews, believed that everything that exists and everything that happens comes from the one true God. The only deviance from that is in their ability to defy or disobey God for which a righteous God must then enforce the consequences of His own Law. In that, they deviated from and rejected all the Pagan culture and beliefs and became something unique and totally different that endured the millennia as no other people did.

"Sin" is that which disobeys God and spoils God's perfect creation and in so doing harms ourselves and/or others, either directly, or as consequence that can be visited on many generations to come. There is nothing in ancient pagan belief to compare to that.

 

[Penelope]

Penelope:

The serpent speaks:
Genesis uses the term 'nachash' for the serpent. This word means "serpent" at Numbers 21:9, and Jesus used nachash (serpent) to refer to himself in John 3:14

Now read Genesis 3:4

In Genesis 3:4 the temptation by the Serpent (as the "shining one" not a viper type snake) saying:
"eat from this tree and "ye shall not surely die."

This becomes very familar - a false promise from the followers who call hanging on a tree, the cross.
Jesus "the bright shining one" said, "Believe in my cross (tree) and you will not die" - found in the book of Matthew and Thomas.
The New Testament also says that Jesus remarked, "He who seeks to save his life will lose it." as well as saying: "Unless the seed die it cannot bring forth fruit."

Note: the vision both Paul and Constantine had of Jesus was of a shining ( luciferous ) one calling himself Jesus.
Iconographs are of shining luciferous light eminating from this image including from the sacred heart just as in: 2Peter-
“So we have the prophetic message more fully confirmed. You will do well to be attentive to this as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star (LUCIFER)rises
in your hearts.” - 2 Peter 1:19


[See here etymology of "Lucifer": "[ the morning star, a fallen rebel archangel, THE Devil, fr. OE. fr. Latin, the morning star, fr. Lucifer light-bearing, fr. luc light + -fer -ferous--more at LIGHT]" (Webster's, p.677)

Yes the Hebrews were healed when looking upon the serpent on the pole as Christians are healed when looking up to Jesus dying on the cross for healing , and the morning star is venus, but Jesus is the bright morning star which out shines the morning star. Are you trying to say that Jesus is Lucifer?

 

[Bonzi]

Is it a sin to seek knowledge?


Is it a sin to want to open one’s eyes instead of being blind?


Is it a sin to do as scriptures urge us to do?


Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.


Gen 3:2 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil:


Adam and Eve were doing exactly what we are all told by scriptures to do, yet God seemed quite upset.


Why is seeking knowledge and ignoring a vile command to remain in ignorant bliss wrong or a sin?


Are you sinning when you seek knowledge and becoming more like God?


Regards

DL

Here's a quote for you....

1 Corinthians 3:19-20
19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, “He catches the wise in their own craftiness”; 20 and again, “The Lord knows the thoughts of the wise, that they are futile.”

 

[GreatestIam]

Adam (i.e. man) and Eve (his second bride) was not gaining knowledge, they were eating from that forbidden mix of knowledge that was both good and harmfully evil.
They weren't covering up their literal nakedness the Hebrew means to cover up from their deceptions.
When we mix truth with deceptive accounts it's called propaganda. Enough truths in the mix snd deception to make you think it's real when it's false.
Remember the church itself says Genesis is discussing the serpent (false prophet) and Christians tell you Rome would lift high this farce. Put 2 & 2 together Eve is the Church (second bride of man). Jesus already called himself the Necsash (serpent).

I hate that when a Jew pops up to add intelligent dialog to my threads. It is so un-Christian and throws me off. Just kidding.

The Jews though do not see a fall from gaining knowledge they see it as man's elevation. That is why Jews do not have an original sin concept. Right?

Further, Jews have a high respect for the serpent as shown with Moses' serpent headed staff.

Do I have that about right?

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

Is it a sin to seek knowledge?


Is it a sin to want to open one’s eyes instead of being blind?


Is it a sin to do as scriptures urge us to do?


Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.


Gen 3:2 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil:


Adam and Eve were doing exactly what we are all told by scriptures to do, yet God seemed quite upset.


Why is seeking knowledge and ignoring a vile command to remain in ignorant bliss wrong or a sin?


Are you sinning when you seek knowledge and becoming more like God?


Regards

DL

The problem with any scripture is the difference between reading it as it means in our 21st century language and understanding or reading it through the eyes of those who wrote it.

Reading through the eyes of those who wrote it, the second Creation story in Genesis is the allegorical teaching of the Garden of Eden and the original sin, or the first occasion in which humankind, given free will, spoiled God's perfect Creation. The sin was not in seeking knowledge, but in the effort to become as wise and powerful as God instead of loving and obeying God.

From Genesis 3:
“You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. 5 “For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

The message as demonstrated throughout scripture is we will always suffer negative consequences when we decide we are smarter, wiser, stronger, or more clever than God and bypass His counsel in favor of our own desires.

Yes but scriptures urge us to be Godlike and God admits in Eden that A & E did just that.

Would you punish your child for wanting to and taking the steps to be just like you?

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

The 'sin' was disobedience. They had been told not to do something.
The error was in immersing humanity into dualism; "good" and "evil". It was the 'knowledge', knowing in a dualistic way, that tore the universe in two. Things are not that way in themselves; we bring separation to existence.

As above so below.

Is there not an above and below or are you more into Gnostic Christian thinking.


Jesus said, "If those who attract you say, 'See, the Kingdom is
in the sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you. If they
say to you, 'It is under the earth,' then the fish of the sea will
precede you. Rather, the Kingdom of God is inside of you, and it is outside of you. [Those who] become acquainted with [themselves] will find it; [and when you] become acquainted with yourselves, [you will understand that] it is you who are the sons of the living Father. But if you will not know yourselves, you dwell in poverty and it is you who are that poverty."


Here is a mind exercise. Tell me what you see when you look around. The best that can possibly be or an ugly and imperfect world?

Candide.
"It is demonstrable that things cannot be otherwise than as they are; for as all things have been created for some end, they must necessarily be created for the best end.”

Do you see the best of all possible worlds and a perfect kingdom or do you see something less?

Regards
DL

 

[TrinityPower]

Getting back to the original post...everyone does understand there is a difference between seeking knowledge and seeking wisdom

 

[GreatestIam]

Is it a sin to seek knowledge?


Is it a sin to want to open one’s eyes instead of being blind?


Is it a sin to do as scriptures urge us to do?


Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.


Gen 3:2 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil:


Adam and Eve were doing exactly what we are all told by scriptures to do, yet God seemed quite upset.


Why is seeking knowledge and ignoring a vile command to remain in ignorant bliss wrong or a sin?


Are you sinning when you seek knowledge and becoming more like God?


Regards

DL

Here's a quote for you....

1 Corinthians 3:19-20
19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, “He catches the wise in their own craftiness”; 20 and again, “The Lord knows the thoughts of the wise, that they are futile.”

Gen 3;22 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil:

This does not say A & E gained wisdom. It says they gained knowledge. So why are you quoting something on wisdom?

Regards
DL

 

[GreatestIam]

Getting back to the original post...everyone does understand there is a difference between seeking knowledge and seeking wisdom

I would hope so. Many know many things but I know few wise people.

But knowledge is a requirement if one wishes to develop wisdom.

Regards
DL

 

[Foxfyre]

Is it a sin to seek knowledge?


Is it a sin to want to open one’s eyes instead of being blind?


Is it a sin to do as scriptures urge us to do?


Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.


Gen 3:2 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil:


Adam and Eve were doing exactly what we are all told by scriptures to do, yet God seemed quite upset.


Why is seeking knowledge and ignoring a vile command to remain in ignorant bliss wrong or a sin?


Are you sinning when you seek knowledge and becoming more like God?


Regards

DL

The problem with any scripture is the difference between reading it as it means in our 21st century language and understanding or reading it through the eyes of those who wrote it.

Reading through the eyes of those who wrote it, the second Creation story in Genesis is the allegorical teaching of the Garden of Eden and the original sin, or the first occasion in which humankind, given free will, spoiled God's perfect Creation. The sin was not in seeking knowledge, but in the effort to become as wise and powerful as God instead of loving and obeying God.

From Genesis 3:
“You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. 5 “For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

The message as demonstrated throughout scripture is we will always suffer negative consequences when we decide we are smarter, wiser, stronger, or more clever than God and bypass His counsel in favor of our own desires.

Yes but scriptures urge us to be Godlike and God admits in Eden that A & E did just that.

Would you punish your child for wanting to and taking the steps to be just like you?

Regards
DL

And where do you read in the Genesis stories that God wants us to be godlike or referred to Adam and Eve in that way? God obviously intended that mankind be obedient and walk in the way ordained by God which was to enjoy God's perfect creation.

The Genesis stories are symbolic of the sin entering the world, first in the individual Eve, spread to the man Adam, and later on we see how it pervaded the entire family and Cain and Abel, then to the community in the story of Noah, and then throughout the world in the story of Babel. And all along the way we see the consequences and results of that sin as a righteous God will not go against His own Law. We see the old-fashioned Jewish explanations for why things are the way they are, and that there are consequences for sin. And there is a repetitive theme of Creation - Sin - Judgment - Consequence - Redemption that runs through it all.

 

[GreatestIam]

Is it a sin to seek knowledge?


Is it a sin to want to open one’s eyes instead of being blind?


Is it a sin to do as scriptures urge us to do?


Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.


Gen 3:2 And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil:


Adam and Eve were doing exactly what we are all told by scriptures to do, yet God seemed quite upset.


Why is seeking knowledge and ignoring a vile command to remain in ignorant bliss wrong or a sin?


Are you sinning when you seek knowledge and becoming more like God?


Regards

DL

The problem with any scripture is the difference between reading it as it means in our 21st century language and understanding or reading it through the eyes of those who wrote it.

Reading through the eyes of those who wrote it, the second Creation story in Genesis is the allegorical teaching of the Garden of Eden and the original sin, or the first occasion in which humankind, given free will, spoiled God's perfect Creation. The sin was not in seeking knowledge, but in the effort to become as wise and powerful as God instead of loving and obeying God.

From Genesis 3:
“You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. 5 “For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

The message as demonstrated throughout scripture is we will always suffer negative consequences when we decide we are smarter, wiser, stronger, or more clever than God and bypass His counsel in favor of our own desires.

Yes but scriptures urge us to be Godlike and God admits in Eden that A & E did just that.

Would you punish your child for wanting to and taking the steps to be just like you?

Regards
DL

And where do you read in the Genesis stories that God wants us to be godlike or referred to Adam and Eve in that way? God obviously intended that mankind be obedient and walk in the way ordained by God which was to enjoy God's perfect creation.

The Genesis stories are symbolic of the sin entering the world, first in the individual Eve, spread to the man Adam, and later on we see how it pervaded the entire family and Cain and Abel, then to the community in the story of Noah, and then throughout the world in the story of Babel. And all along the way we see the consequences and results of that sin as a righteous God will not go against His own Law. We see the old-fashioned Jewish explanations for why things are the way they are, and that there are consequences for sin. And there is a repetitive theme of Creation - Sin - Judgment - Consequence - Redemption that runs through it all.

I recognize that there are many recurring themes. Some good and some evil.

But to your question. You are correct that Genesis does not speak of us striving to be God like but it does clearly elsewhere.

Matthew 5:48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

The rest is just good basic parenting that any parent would recognize.

Are you a parent and don't you want your children to reach or exceed whatever you are and can put into them?

As a parent, that is not only my goal but also my duty.

Would God have less of a duty to his children knowing that they can become as Gods in the knowing of good and evil?

Is God less responsible of a parent than humans?

Regards
DL

P. S.
Scriptures say that Eve was deceived so sin came through the man.
This leads to a stranger situation where Adam is more culpable yet God reward him with dominion over Eve. I would have thought that it would have been the other way around but then Christianity would not be the immoral misogynistic creed it is if it acted out of character.

 

[HaShev]

Further, Jews have a high respect for the serpent as shown with Moses' serpent headed staff.

Do I have that about right?

Regards
DL

No, first of all how do you deduce Jews having respect for the serpent of Genesis through a staff that turned into a snake that was never a prophet and that swallowed the Egyptian snake?
Note: the staff (Hashevet) swallowed the Egyptian Nesasch (serpent) and we all surely know that Yeshu and the Jesus image both are reflective of Egyptian mythology including underworld teachings (to never die life in death=promise of the serpent in Genesis 3.)
and including the fact we know the Hanotzrim cult taught their god to be the rays of light between the sun and earth and Jesus was depicted as this luciferous light as Nesasch refers to a radiating snake light which is what the staff appeared like when swallowing up the serpent. They'd be describing a lazer beam like affect or lightening bolt, which is possible in that era with egyptian battery technology attached to a rod like staff especially knowing the description of the ark of the covenant which carried the Hashevet. So like how we confuse the word use of "clouds" as literal, so to does the serpent get confused as a literal snake when it's a radiant type snake.