Is there a god?

[hobelim]

You're here. That is all the facts I need.

That makes no sense, as per usual.

It would make sense if you would learn how to read.

Everything with you folks is a secret code. Must make you feel important.

Most of the OT and all of the NT were written either during or after oppression and conquest when their enemies tried to impose their way of life on the authors.

As in any counterculture, they wrote in code. As intelligent and sophisticated in writing as they were, they also cursed the enemy at the same time they blessed whoever was in the wise.

Why is that so hard to believe?

Because it doesn't even seem plausible that the bible is some sort of code book to find an invisible being. It would make a good science fiction movie, but in real life, it makes no logical sense.

We sent out a spacecraft with a gold record on it with detailed instructions how to get to the earth announcing to whoever might be out there that we live in complete confusion and we just wanted to say hello.. lol..

It was like someone tossed a pebble into the middle of the ocean hoping for a response from a whale..

We did this...


Is it not plausible that higher intelligences would have beat us to the punch with a more sophisticated means of establishing communications providing the solutions to our problems on earth before we even thought of seeking help from the cosmos?

 

[Taz]

That makes no sense, as per usual.

It would make sense if you would learn how to read.

Everything with you folks is a secret code. Must make you feel important.

Most of the OT and all of the NT were written either during or after oppression and conquest when their enemies tried to impose their way of life on the authors.

As in any counterculture, they wrote in code. As intelligent and sophisticated in writing as they were, they also cursed the enemy at the same time they blessed whoever was in the wise.

Why is that so hard to believe?

Because it doesn't even seem plausible that the bible is some sort of code book to find an invisible being. It would make a good science fiction movie, but in real life, it makes no logical sense.

We sent out a spacecraft with a gold record on it with detailed instructions how to get to the earth announcing to whoever might be out there that we live in complete confusion and we just wanted to say hello.. lol..

It was like someone tossed a pebble into the middle of the ocean hoping for a response from a whale..

We did this...


Is it not plausible that higher intelligences would have beat us to the punch with a more sophisticated means of establishing communications providing the solutions to our problems on earth before we even though of seeking help from the cosmos?

It's plausible that aliens manipulated the DNA of early man, who was ape-like for millions of years and then somewhat suddenly has become an intelligent being than can travel through the universe in around 100,000 years or less.

 

[Taz]

You guys are living in a fantasy world. None of the big stuff in the bible can be proven to have happened. Like seriously, you think that god poofed man into being? That's a seriously thick slice of nonsense. And that the earth was formed before the sun? It's completely unfounded and goes against all scientific knowledge.

You have to differentiate between what superstitious and irrational people claim and whats actually written.

It does not say that God poofed man into existence.

He was formed by God from the dust of the earth who breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and then became a living being.

You really have to read more carefully and think more deeply of you ever hope to become a living being yourself.

"He was formed by God from the dust of the earth who breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and then became a living being." If that's really how you think man came into being then ipso fatso, you live in a total fantasy world. And I'm sure that you realize it now.

The story is just about higher intelligences trying to educated a dumb animal taken from the wild with little to no success and then returned to where he was taken from.


If you keep thinking that I am trying to justify a belief in how the first human came into being fantasy, even after I told you time and time again that I am not, you are at best not too swift.,

It comes across like brain damage.

And the sane guy is the one who believes this: "He was formed by God from the dust of the earth who breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and then became a living being."?

What I believe is not directly connected to the literal meaning of the words used like coded language that just flew right over your pointy little head.

Oh, more secret code. I should have guessed. I bet you know how to speak Klingon as well.

So what's the secret meaning of that phrase? Is it something that doesn't make you sound like a complete fool, or simply more of the same secret language stuff?

 

[EGR one]

So what about a flood that drowned everyone regionally for 40 days? No proof for that either. And the Chinese may have known about a flood but they didn't know about Noah.

So god made Adam out of nothing or was evolution involved?

You ARE cherry-picking because at some points you say "they didn't mean that" and at others you quote word for word. That, my friend, is called cherry-picking the bible.

You are not going to prevail by being dishonest. I said there are both literal and figurative truths in the Bible. And I've told you the writers were limited by the lack of knowledge - meaning they would not know that California existed, so how could they know it didn't get flooded?

The duty of a Christian is to know how to separate the figurative from the literal. It is NOT a process of cherry picking:

II Timothy 2: 14 and 15 reads:

"14 Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.

15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth."

And yes, the Chinese knew of Noah AND there are strong arguments that they knew Noah himself:

Migration to China

" I said there are both literal and figurative truths in the Bible."

That's called cherry-picking. Now you know.

And if you choose to not believe certain things in the bible as being true, how can you justify believing other parts to be true? Who decides? And how? By simply saying "this is stupid and can't have happened so it's figurative, but this part sounds like something someone could have said, so we go with it"? Flip a coin?

No. That is called intellectual honesty. The Bible has several literary types; allegorical, historical, law, poetic, prophetic, epistle and proverbial. I'm sure others may add or subtract to this list, but this is a pretty good start. When trying to understand the meaning of passages it is helpful to understand which literary type one is reading and also to place or read the passage in the proper historical light. Something that people who are intellectually dishonest don't do.

Taz knows better than to make the arguments he / she is making. But now there is an even better explanation for Bible interpretation. Thanks for the good job.

You guys are living in a fantasy world. None of the big stuff in the bible can be proven to have happened. Like seriously, you think that god poofed man into being? That's a seriously thick slice of nonsense. And that the earth was formed before the sun? It's completely unfounded and goes against all scientific knowledge.

Scientific knowledge of the universe and it's creation is extremely limited. Many theories, few facts.

A computer programmer can create games that are almost lifelike. It would stand to reason that a far superior intelligence could do much better and on a grander scale. The Bible hints that all of this is not real, and the laws of physics can be suspended if one has enough faith in his/her ability to do so. If it is not real, then all of it is illusion.

 

[evenflow1969]

I, personally, believe that there is a god. What that means, though, I have been struggling with for quite some time. Therefore, I pose the questions:

1. If there is a god, what does that mean?
2. If there is not a god, what does that mean?

I am looking for opinion, obviously, I do not believe there will ever be proof, or empirical evidence (at least not until rapture, assuming that there is a god). What I am looking for here is what people believe. What leads you to believe what you do? Why?

Let me be clear, I am NOT looking for evangelism of any kind here. I am looking for what the presence of god (or lack of a god) means to you. I know this is a pretty ambiguous thread, and I do that on purpose, because I do not ant to influence the way anyone responds. I want to open a discussion about what your beliefs (whatever they are) have shaped who you are, how you look at religion (in general), and how you look at the world.

If there is I bet he is pissed!

 

[Humorme]

" I said there are both literal and figurative truths in the Bible."

That's called cherry-picking. Now you know.

And if you choose to not believe certain things in the bible as being true, how can you justify believing other parts to be true? Who decides? And how? By simply saying "this is stupid and can't have happened so it's figurative, but this part sounds like something someone could have said, so we go with it"? Flip a coin?

No. That is called intellectual honesty. The Bible has several literary types; allegorical, historical, law, poetic, prophetic, epistle and proverbial. I'm sure others may add or subtract to this list, but this is a pretty good start. When trying to understand the meaning of passages it is helpful to understand which literary type one is reading and also to place or read the passage in the proper historical light. Something that people who are intellectually dishonest don't do.

Taz knows better than to make the arguments he / she is making. But now there is an even better explanation for Bible interpretation. Thanks for the good job.

You guys are living in a fantasy world. None of the big stuff in the bible can be proven to have happened. Like seriously, you think that god poofed man into being? That's a seriously thick slice of nonsense. And that the earth was formed before the sun? It's completely unfounded and goes against all scientific knowledge.

Scientific knowledge according to a mortal man???

In your dishonest desperation to deny even the possibility of a God, you accuse every believer of "cherry picking." When that don't work out for you, you then ascribe your own interpretations to certain words and phrases. If God thundered down from the Heavens and admonished you, you would STILL deny his existence.

But I am confident that if others are paying attention and checking out the links, they will find you are blowing smoke on this one. Saying you were wrong wouldn't begin to cover it.

Archaeologist claims evidence of Noah’s biblical flood

If YOU could read, you'd know that I'm agnostic, as I see no proof for or against the possibility of a god, and am open to changing my mind either way given real proof, whatever it is. But so far I haven't found anything that proves that a god exists, or that proves that a 40 days flood covered the whole world, or even all of the Middle East, if you're one of those regionalist flood apologists.

There is no point with attempting to reason with you. I pray to God you never have to serve on a jury. You lack discernment. You can't weight evidence because it's beyond you took at the facts.

What is it that you think you have to post all day long about this? No life?

 

[Humorme]

Taz, If you use the senses that you have not tapped into, you will find that God does speak to all men.

Have you ever heard of a mother that suddenly woke up in the middle of the night knowing that something terrible had happened to her son or daughter only to receive a call hours later confirming it?

You have senses that you have yet to tap into because if it don't fit YOUR personal definitions and presuppositions it doesn't exist. Yet the whole time you're oblivious as to what is happening all around you.

There’s no proof that that woman was contacted by god, it’s pure wishful thinking.

Again, you don't have any way of contradicting the facts.

It's not a fact until it can be proven.

You're here. That is all the facts I need.

That makes no sense, as per usual.

Blah, blah, blah. You haven't time to read the links, just make silly posts.

 

[Humorme]

God tossed Adam and Eve out of Eden for having hetero sex. I wouldn’t even have to wink.

You read the story and thats what you got out of it? God tossed Adam and Eve out of Eden for having hetero sex?

okey dokey..very funny, ha ha. But, Wait a minute! ... Where's your proof? lol... what a maroon!


Obviously you never understood the lessons in The Tale of the Puppet either..

If naughty boys remain on Pleasure Island for too long those donkeys ears are there to stay. (Pinocchio 3:14)

You are the proof.

Thems the breaks. You should have listened to the talking cricket. Ask any scientist.

I would say that I felt sorry for you if I did. Really, I would..

Adam and Eve get punished for disobeying God's command and atheists want to focus on it all being about sex???

They don't like going further into history for fear of being faced with the truth.

Hey, it's a made up story so I'm allowed to make stuff up as well, why do you get to have all the fun?

I haven't made anything up. I've given links to what archaeologists and other scientists say. They're pretty much satisfied with the account of Noah being true.

I wonder what you'd think if America broke out into a major world war and all this computer junk was destroyed. There was no more record of our existence as satellites were shot down, etc, and a hundred years later, even if someone found a hard drive, it would be like hieroglyphics to the modern archaeologists. People would then look to that body of circumstantial evidence and argue that you ever existed.

Being mostly trained in law, as a legal matter, the weight of evidence says the flood account IS true, not the dishonest way you present it, however. Science seems to be in agreement. If this were a flood thread, and it is not, I'd present many different hypotheses and introduce many witness accounts. But, you wouldn't know when you lost because you've closed the door as well as your mind.

What evidence shows that the flood is true? I've never seen any evidence for a 40 day worldwide flood. And no, scientists aren't satisfied enough to say that the story of Noah happened. You made that up. Your previous link only showed some scientists looking for evidence of a regional flood of not so great proportions that the story of Noah MIGHT BE BASED ON. Man, you live in a fantasy world.

You live in the fantasy world. You have yet to acknowledge that I DO NOT SUPPORT A WORLD WIDE FLOOD THEORY.

 

[Humorme]

You want to criticize the Bible and can't even spell the word Ark.

The Bible is true. It's just as accurate as any source you rely on. The problem is, the Bible was limited by the number of words in the Greek and Hebrew language that could not be directly translated directly into another language.

Add to that, the Bible was written to, for, and about a specific people. The Bible only acknowledges preadamites, for example. It gives no details about them. But, science, history and the Bible all agree on their existence.

I was taking the spelling from hob, so take that up with my jew.

So was the Flood a worldwide flood or a myth?

Science can uncover the existence of something, I agree, but so far, no god has been discovered by science. So you either take it all or leave it all, you can't start cherry-picking science as well.

NOBODY is cherry picking stuff. Do you want to troll or have a civil conversation?

In my opinion, the flood was NOT worldwide. For one thing, the Chinese were aware of Noah; the flood overflowed the Tarim Basin and it was duly noted by Chinese historians.

Scientifically, if we presume the flood covered the entire earth - and use that to be synonymous with the planet, then the critics win. There are places where the rain would have to be six miles deep. We know that was not the case. Moses could only write about the land as he knew it. And so as far as the eye could see and far as people traveled in the time of Moses, everything was under water.

People are operating under this false assumption that the Bible was about all the men on earth; however, this is easily proven to be an error believers cannot accept. The Bible only claims to be about one people. Genesis 5 : 1 states: "This is the book of the generations of Adam." The Bible does not claim to be about the predecessors of Adam. The only relevance other people have in the Bible relative to Adam is when their paths crossed.

There are both literal and figurative truths in the Bible. The Bible, correctly interpreted, does not say that God created man in six "days" we understand the term; it does not say that that the flood covered the whole world.

The term earth comes from the Hebrew word ehrets and as used in Genesis and only means a common country, land, nations, wilderness... but never does it mean the entire planet.

So what about a flood that drowned everyone regionally for 40 days? No proof for that either. And the Chinese may have known about a flood but they didn't know about Noah.

So god made Adam out of nothing or was evolution involved?

You ARE cherry-picking because at some points you say "they didn't mean that" and at others you quote word for word. That, my friend, is called cherry-picking the bible.

No, Taz. This has been explained to you dozens of times. The fact that YOU keep cherry picking the Bible by making literal interpretations of allegorical accounts is how I know you are a militant atheist on a mission.

The 40 day flood wasn't meant to be allegorical, you moved the goalposts there because you know that such a flood has no geologic proof. And if you're allowed to cherry-pick the bible like that, why can't I? does it have to be cherry-picked in a certain way?

Your standard canard is getting boring and watching you get your rump kicked on this issue in't entertaining.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

lol...Listen up Taz.

you have a terminal case of the cooties.

Wait all you like but God will never come to you in your current condition. Would you accept the invitation of a decomposing zombie who wanted you to visit him in his lair?

No?

Take a whiff of your breath. Is it really any wonder why to you God is nowhere in sight?

Looks like even real people that you know exist can't stand the stench for more than a few minutes.

I guess that I am your only hope and even I won't do for you what you have to do for yourself to become a creature capable and worthy of comprehension.....

God made bad breath so he doesn’t care, anyways, I doubt that there’s tooth paste in heaven, so no biggie.

I’m simply going to wait for god with an open heart, can’t be any fairer than that.

God is the God of the living. You can't blame God for your poor hygiene.
'
God doesn't visit foul and loathsome creatures, much less the dead.

Even if they dropped their drawers bent over and winked.

God tossed Adam and Eve out of Eden for having hetero sex. I wouldn’t even have to wink.

You read the story and thats what you got out of it? God tossed Adam and Eve out of Eden for having hetero sex?

okey dokey..very funny, ha ha. But, Wait a minute! ... Where's your proof? lol... what a maroon!


Obviously you never understood the lessons in The Tale of the Puppet either..

If naughty boys remain on Pleasure Island for too long those donkeys ears are there to stay. (Pinocchio 3:14)

You are the proof.

Thems the breaks. You should have listened to the talking cricket. Ask any scientist.

I would say that I felt sorry for you if I did. Really, I would..

You have to know how to read the bible,
God wanted Adam to stay in homo heaven with Him, but Adam chose the chick and now we're all fucked!

Bathhouse Eden

Because Adam was stuck on Steve, Eve got so horny she started seeing phallic images everywhere, even one that started talking to her.

 

[Humorme]

Taz, having ignored the many links provided does not want an answer to the OP's question. What he wants is to dispute the Noahic flood account when scientist after scientist has confirmed the flood as an event.

Much of the belief or disbelief is mired in controversy over interpretations of the facts. Science has provided scientific explanations for the parting of the seas so that Moses could cross. Lots of ancient cities confirming that the people of biblical times and their history has been confirmed by archaeology.

What you will not see from non-believers is how to get something from nothing. Unless and until they give you a credible explanation for that, they have nothing except skepticism.

When one applies the laws of the Bible to their own lives, they suddenly find they have a more fulfilling life. If you study the prophecies and see how much of that is accurately predicted - it is quite impressive. Contrast that to mortals like Nostradamus, whose cryptic writings had to have an event happen and then people make the event fit the predictions.

I have a theory myself that people who don't want to believe in a God, don't believe in themselves. As such, they want all people to be as miserable in their lives as they are in theirs. That is why we have people like Taz, who feels it necessary to have over 100 posts here and NOT having looked at all the evidence... and he realizes that we cannot cover every sentence of that on a single thread.

So, for me, if Taz cannot take the time to look at the real evidence, there's nothing more we can say.

 

[Humorme]

God made bad breath so he doesn’t care, anyways, I doubt that there’s tooth paste in heaven, so no biggie.

I’m simply going to wait for god with an open heart, can’t be any fairer than that.

God is the God of the living. You can't blame God for your poor hygiene.
'
God doesn't visit foul and loathsome creatures, much less the dead.

Even if they dropped their drawers bent over and winked.

God tossed Adam and Eve out of Eden for having hetero sex. I wouldn’t even have to wink.

You read the story and thats what you got out of it? God tossed Adam and Eve out of Eden for having hetero sex?

okey dokey..very funny, ha ha. But, Wait a minute! ... Where's your proof? lol... what a maroon!


Obviously you never understood the lessons in The Tale of the Puppet either..

If naughty boys remain on Pleasure Island for too long those donkeys ears are there to stay. (Pinocchio 3:14)

You are the proof.

Thems the breaks. You should have listened to the talking cricket. Ask any scientist.

I would say that I felt sorry for you if I did. Really, I would..

You have to know how to read the bible,
God wanted Adam to stay in homo heaven with Him, but Adam chose the chick and now we're all fucked!

Bathhouse Eden

Because Adam was stuck on Steve, Eve got so horny she started seeing phallic images everywhere, even one that started talking to her.

The level of disrespect for this topic you've shown should make you feel embarrassed and ashamed.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

I, personally, believe that there is a god. What that means, though, I have been struggling with for quite some time. Therefore, I pose the questions:

1. If there is a god, what does that mean?
2. If there is not a god, what does that mean?

I am looking for opinion, obviously, I do not believe there will ever be proof, or empirical evidence (at least not until rapture, assuming that there is a god). What I am looking for here is what people believe. What leads you to believe what you do? Why?

Let me be clear, I am NOT looking for evangelism of any kind here. I am looking for what the presence of god (or lack of a god) means to you. I know this is a pretty ambiguous thread, and I do that on purpose, because I do not ant to influence the way anyone responds. I want to open a discussion about what your beliefs (whatever they are) have shaped who you are, how you look at religion (in general), and how you look at the world.

I would rephrase your question and substitute "creator" in place of "God".

So, where did this Creator come from? Our forefathers presumed the same thing and that is why some Rights are above the law. Thank God - the Declaration of Independence says Creator, but either way, aren't you glad our country acknowledges certain Rights on that premise?

Something had to come first that didn't need another to cause it to come into existence, right?

The Lord of the Lies

"Had to"? It is dishonest, aggressive, and predatory to exclude the alternative, which is that things existed forever, but could change forms, as in the Thermodynamic Law of Conservation of Energy.

Ironically, theists claim that God has existed forever. Then they pretend that nothing else has, so God had to create all that. But the only thing their God has created is money in the collection plate. That was truly created out of nothing, because God is nothing.

 

[hobelim]

It would make sense if you would learn how to read.

Everything with you folks is a secret code. Must make you feel important.

Most of the OT and all of the NT were written either during or after oppression and conquest when their enemies tried to impose their way of life on the authors.

As in any counterculture, they wrote in code. As intelligent and sophisticated in writing as they were, they also cursed the enemy at the same time they blessed whoever was in the wise.

Why is that so hard to believe?

Because it doesn't even seem plausible that the bible is some sort of code book to find an invisible being. It would make a good science fiction movie, but in real life, it makes no logical sense.

We sent out a spacecraft with a gold record on it with detailed instructions how to get to the earth announcing to whoever might be out there that we live in complete confusion and we just wanted to say hello.. lol..

It was like someone tossed a pebble into the middle of the ocean hoping for a response from a whale..

We did this...


Is it not plausible that higher intelligences would have beat us to the punch with a more sophisticated means of establishing communications providing the solutions to our problems on earth before we even though of seeking help from the cosmos?

It's plausible that aliens manipulated the DNA of early man, who was ape-like for millions of years and then somewhat suddenly has become an intelligent being than can travel through the universe in around 100,000 years or less.

Alrighty then.. If something like that happened, doesn't it follow that they would tend to their experiment, pruning the branches that were fruitful and destroying the ones that were destructive?

According to every prophet who reported first hand experiences of encounters with creatures from another sphere of superior intelligences the law was given as instruction, a light that shows the way out of the darkness and chaos the world has been in for millions of years.

It wasn't until Jesus came and cleared things up for his friends about how to correctly understand and conform to the instruction of the law that had been lost to time ever since the death of Moses that they began to have prophetic dreams and visions themselves, altered states of consciousness, out of body experiences, and direct communication with God and living creatures not of this world.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

In other words, you have no real proof so you scapegoat your made up god and say that it's so on another level that there can be no proof. Oldest trick in The Book. YAWWWWN!

Ok, maybe this will be of more interest to you. Assume, for a moment, there is a god, and that said god created the entire universe. What tells you that we, as mere humans, would have the ability to come even close to comprehending what that god is, let alone "real proof" that said god exists? What tells you that we have the ability to explain such an entity? Such an entity would, I say is, so far beyond our ability to comprehend that we really have no hope of EVER understanding. Therefore, what you ask for is far beyond your ability to comprehend, and is, therefore, completely futile. Unless, of course, you can explain where all the matter in the universe came from... If not a god, then what? It just always has been? Where did the laws of nature come from? If evolution is the truth, then why did life on this planet only start once? Do you understand what the odds of THAT scenario are, that life, spontaneously, started only once in the entire history of the world?

Just because at this point in time we don't know where all matter comes from doesn't default over to it being from an invisible being. That's pure fantasy.

If evolution isn't the truth, then do you believe that god just started plopping people around there earth? How did that work exactly? He made Adam out of thin air, then ripped out one of his ribs to make Eve?

What I do have a problem with is you classifying my beliefs as "fantasy" That is really quite offensive to me, therefore I request you stop using that term. .

"To Inhibit Them, Pretend They Offend"

You want us to believe that there are no fantasies then. And why should we care about offending someone who interferes with others, such as with abortion? On that matter, influence other Christians not to have abortions; don't tip the scales in an election in order to get a legislator who will impose your Puritanical sadism on the rest of society. Most likely, he will be a GreedHead looter, so you can go to your imaginary Hell.

At conception a new genetically distinct human life is created. Not just any human life, but one that has never existed before and will never exist again. This is scientific fact. From a legal perspective it is a specific person and has the same inalienable rights as you.

Who is that person's advocate if not us?

Fetus Fetish

A true God, if such a Being were possible, would not want unwanted children to be born. He would take what you claim are their souls directly to Heaven, and be grateful to abortion doctors for assisting Him. Second, a just God would not make the sex drive so strong that it would put His people in such a fix. Third, a bridge under construction may look like a bridge and you may even be able to walk across it, but if you use it prematurely for what it was intended, you will drown. So it is not a bridge.

Fourth, what society would ever name and bury miscarriages and register their deaths? You're just Puritan bullies who are outraged by women getting a little fun and comfort from what nature has given them. Your bossy know-it-all power play using invented religion sets people up for all the economic and political power games of the anti-social snakes.

 

[K9Buck]

"Had to"? It is dishonest, aggressive, and predatory to exclude the alternative, which is that things existed forever, but could change forms, as in the Thermodynamic Law of Conservation of Energy.

It sounds like ABG theory (Anything but God). But, yea, maybe the universe has just always existed. Although the evidence of the Big Bang suggests that the universe had a beginning.

 

[sealybobo]

I, personally, believe that there is a god. What that means, though, I have been struggling with for quite some time. Therefore, I pose the questions:

1. If there is a god, what does that mean?
2. If there is not a god, what does that mean?

I am looking for opinion, obviously, I do not believe there will ever be proof, or empirical evidence (at least not until rapture, assuming that there is a god). What I am looking for here is what people believe. What leads you to believe what you do? Why?

Let me be clear, I am NOT looking for evangelism of any kind here. I am looking for what the presence of god (or lack of a god) means to you. I know this is a pretty ambiguous thread, and I do that on purpose, because I do not ant to influence the way anyone responds. I want to open a discussion about what your beliefs (whatever they are) have shaped who you are, how you look at religion (in general), and how you look at the world.

What people hope and what people really believe are two different things. If there is a god what does that mean? It means you better try to be a good person because being bad could lead to punishment or bad karma.

It also means answering the question of what happens after you die.

Nothing leads me to believe we are any different than a whale or cat. We aren’t chosen or special just incredibly lucky to be living.

No god ever visited so everything we thing we know has been brainwashed into us for 2000 years.

Science says there is no god. So what does it mean? It means enjoy and appreciate that you were born and got to live

 

[sealybobo]

"Had to"? It is dishonest, aggressive, and predatory to exclude the alternative, which is that things existed forever, but could change forms, as in the Thermodynamic Law of Conservation of Energy.

It sounds like ABG theory (Anything but God). But, yea, maybe the universe has just always existed. Although the evidence of the Big Bang suggests that the universe had a beginning.

This one universe sure. Is it the only? We can’t know that. What was before? We can’t know that either. At least not yet

 

[K9Buck]

It means you better try to be a good person because being bad could lead to punishment or bad karma.

I know you don't believe but I'll share with you anyway.

A number of people who have had NDE's have shared accounts of how they had a "life review". In their reviews, they themselves could feel the pain that they had caused others. I think our creator wants us to love one another and do no harm. Perhaps we re-visit the harm we cause others in our own life review so that we can understand our own evil and learn from it so that, hopefully, we don't want to do it again. By the way, I also don't believe we just automatically appear in Heaven. I believe we have a "purging" process (purgatory) in which we are spiritually cleansed before entering into Heaven. It's sort of like your kids coming in after playing outside in the mud, they've got to get cleaned up before they can join you in the family room, so to speak.

 

[K9Buck]

This one universe sure. Is it the only? We can’t know that. What was before? We can’t know that either. At least not yet

As long as we're living, we're not going to have absolute proof. Although there are people who swear that they died and met Jesus or Satan, etc. Many of them have been hardcore atheists. Anyway, what I look for is the preponderance of the evidence. I believe we have a creator, but I don't KNOW that we do. In my view, however, the evidence FOR a creator significantly outweighs any evidence to the contrary.