Is there a god?

[evenflow1969]

I, personally, believe that there is a god. What that means, though, I have been struggling with for quite some time. Therefore, I pose the questions:

1. If there is a god, what does that mean?
2. If there is not a god, what does that mean?

I am looking for opinion, obviously, I do not believe there will ever be proof, or empirical evidence (at least not until rapture, assuming that there is a god). What I am looking for here is what people believe. What leads you to believe what you do? Why?

Let me be clear, I am NOT looking for evangelism of any kind here. I am looking for what the presence of god (or lack of a god) means to you. I know this is a pretty ambiguous thread, and I do that on purpose, because I do not ant to influence the way anyone responds. I want to open a discussion about what your beliefs (whatever they are) have shaped who you are, how you look at religion (in general), and how you look at the world.

I believe that I am standing in the bible. If you want clues from a creator look at that entities creation. The elegance and complexity of the way things work suggest intelligent design in my opinion. The odds are astronomical that so many independent variables work together in such a way that not only does the universe exist but exists thru an infinity of time. The universe is a never ending chemical reaction never finding balance and stopping. This is such an amazing feet that it can not be by chance it highly suggests that some interference happened. That all being said I have a hard time believing the bibles of men! Considering all the species living on earth which is just one of trillions upon trillions of planets and stars in an endless universe, to think we are the most important is folly. Only hubris of the most extreme can believe this! I see the world I n which I am a part of and how it's nature works and I see that nature wastes nothing! It is very unlikely that nature has waisted the rest of the universe in terms of it holding life. Is there life out there? With out a doubt in my mind! To think we are most important out of all of it suggests a creature that needs constant affirmation and would be unlikely to be a creators favorite. The universe was built to last, that appears to be the over riding theme of nature not what happens in the individal lives of humans. What ever happens in the universe only happens to keep the reaction going. What happens to us indivdually does matter but only by a tiney fraction in an infinate universe!

 

[ding]

So what about a flood that drowned everyone regionally for 40 days? No proof for that either. And the Chinese may have known about a flood but they didn't know about Noah.

So god made Adam out of nothing or was evolution involved?

You ARE cherry-picking because at some points you say "they didn't mean that" and at others you quote word for word. That, my friend, is called cherry-picking the bible.

You are not going to prevail by being dishonest. I said there are both literal and figurative truths in the Bible. And I've told you the writers were limited by the lack of knowledge - meaning they would not know that California existed, so how could they know it didn't get flooded?

The duty of a Christian is to know how to separate the figurative from the literal. It is NOT a process of cherry picking:

II Timothy 2: 14 and 15 reads:

"14 Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.

15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth."

And yes, the Chinese knew of Noah AND there are strong arguments that they knew Noah himself:

Migration to China

" I said there are both literal and figurative truths in the Bible."

That's called cherry-picking. Now you know.

And if you choose to not believe certain things in the bible as being true, how can you justify believing other parts to be true? Who decides? And how? By simply saying "this is stupid and can't have happened so it's figurative, but this part sounds like something someone could have said, so we go with it"? Flip a coin?

No. That is called intellectual honesty. The Bible has several literary types; allegorical, historical, law, poetic, prophetic, epistle and proverbial. I'm sure others may add or subtract to this list, but this is a pretty good start. When trying to understand the meaning of passages it is helpful to understand which literary type one is reading and also to place or read the passage in the proper historical light. Something that people who are intellectually dishonest don't do.

Taz knows better than to make the arguments he / she is making. But now there is an even better explanation for Bible interpretation. Thanks for the good job.

You guys are living in a fantasy world. None of the big stuff in the bible can be proven to have happened. Like seriously, you think that god poofed man into being? That's a seriously thick slice of nonsense. And that the earth was formed before the sun? It's completely unfounded and goes against all scientific knowledge.

Spoken like a militant atheist on a mission.

 

[ding]

" I said there are both literal and figurative truths in the Bible."

That's called cherry-picking. Now you know.

And if you choose to not believe certain things in the bible as being true, how can you justify believing other parts to be true? Who decides? And how? By simply saying "this is stupid and can't have happened so it's figurative, but this part sounds like something someone could have said, so we go with it"? Flip a coin?

No. That is called intellectual honesty. The Bible has several literary types; allegorical, historical, law, poetic, prophetic, epistle and proverbial. I'm sure others may add or subtract to this list, but this is a pretty good start. When trying to understand the meaning of passages it is helpful to understand which literary type one is reading and also to place or read the passage in the proper historical light. Something that people who are intellectually dishonest don't do.

Taz knows better than to make the arguments he / she is making. But now there is an even better explanation for Bible interpretation. Thanks for the good job.

You guys are living in a fantasy world. None of the big stuff in the bible can be proven to have happened. Like seriously, you think that god poofed man into being? That's a seriously thick slice of nonsense. And that the earth was formed before the sun? It's completely unfounded and goes against all scientific knowledge.

You have to differentiate between what superstitious and irrational people claim and whats actually written.

It does not say that God poofed man into existence.

He was formed by God from the dust of the earth who breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and then became a living being.

You really have to read more carefully and think more deeply of you ever hope to become a living being yourself.

"He was formed by God from the dust of the earth who breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and then became a living being." If that's really how you think man came into being then ipso fatso, you live in a total fantasy world. And I'm sure that you realize it now.

Again an allegorical account of an actual event that was 6000 years ahead of science. You did come from dust, stardust.

 

[The Sage of Main Street]

I certainly don’t believe in the god religions refer to.

Well, religions are philosophies on how we should live life, treat others, etc. Everyone follows a religion, in many cases, their own.

I never had a problem with religion till they got political.

And Muslims.

And joe Lieberman buddying up with George bush on Iraq. He was representing Israel not his home state.

Religion, good god, what is it good for absolutely nothing say it again war! Lol

Well, I was raised a Catholic, but some would say I'm not a true Catholic because I don't necessarily believe everything the church teaches. I am NOT a fan of this pope nor am I fan of the many sexual abuse scandals that have plagued the church. I think the church is under extraordinary attack from dark forces, but I'll understand if that causes you to roll your eyes. Ha!

"Blessed Are the Meek"

It's the absurd Catholic explanation of why birth control is wrong that helped me see through the anti-abortion cult. Catholic dogmatists believe that every sperm cell is a potential person, so letting semen go to waste in a scumbag is murder.

Why didn't Jesus have sex if He wanted to live like a human being? Not only does that legitimize questions about his sexual preference, it started his religion on a frigid fear of sex. Since Christianity is a tool of authoritarian bullies who want no man to act like a man, that explains their Puritanism.

 

[ding]

" I said there are both literal and figurative truths in the Bible."

That's called cherry-picking. Now you know.

And if you choose to not believe certain things in the bible as being true, how can you justify believing other parts to be true? Who decides? And how? By simply saying "this is stupid and can't have happened so it's figurative, but this part sounds like something someone could have said, so we go with it"? Flip a coin?

No. That is called intellectual honesty. The Bible has several literary types; allegorical, historical, law, poetic, prophetic, epistle and proverbial. I'm sure others may add or subtract to this list, but this is a pretty good start. When trying to understand the meaning of passages it is helpful to understand which literary type one is reading and also to place or read the passage in the proper historical light. Something that people who are intellectually dishonest don't do.

Taz knows better than to make the arguments he / she is making. But now there is an even better explanation for Bible interpretation. Thanks for the good job.

You guys are living in a fantasy world. None of the big stuff in the bible can be proven to have happened. Like seriously, you think that god poofed man into being? That's a seriously thick slice of nonsense. And that the earth was formed before the sun? It's completely unfounded and goes against all scientific knowledge.

Scientific knowledge according to a mortal man???

In your dishonest desperation to deny even the possibility of a God, you accuse every believer of "cherry picking." When that don't work out for you, you then ascribe your own interpretations to certain words and phrases. If God thundered down from the Heavens and admonished you, you would STILL deny his existence.

But I am confident that if others are paying attention and checking out the links, they will find you are blowing smoke on this one. Saying you were wrong wouldn't begin to cover it.

Archaeologist claims evidence of Noah’s biblical flood

If YOU could read, you'd know that I'm agnostic, as I see no proof for or against the possibility of a god, and am open to changing my mind either way given real proof, whatever it is. But so far I haven't found anything that proves that a god exists, or that proves that a 40 days flood covered the whole world, or even all of the Middle East, if you're one of those regionalist flood apologists.

Bullshit. You are a militant atheist on a mission.

 

[ding]

You're here. That is all the facts I need.

That makes no sense, as per usual.

It would make sense if you would learn how to read.

Everything with you folks is a secret code. Must make you feel important.

Most of the OT and all of the NT were written either during or after oppression and conquest when their enemies tried to impose their way of life on the authors.

As in any counterculture, they wrote in code. As intelligent and sophisticated in writing as they were, they also cursed the enemy at the same time they blessed whoever was in the wise.

Why is that so hard to believe?

Because it doesn't even seem plausible that the bible is some sort of code book to find an invisible being. It would make a good science fiction movie, but in real life, it makes no logical sense.

Wrong. The Bible is a how to book. How to live and how not to live.

 

[ding]

God made bad breath so he doesn’t care, anyways, I doubt that there’s tooth paste in heaven, so no biggie.

I’m simply going to wait for god with an open heart, can’t be any fairer than that.

God is the God of the living. You can't blame God for your poor hygiene.
'
God doesn't visit foul and loathsome creatures, much less the dead.

Even if they dropped their drawers bent over and winked.

God tossed Adam and Eve out of Eden for having hetero sex. I wouldn’t even have to wink.

You read the story and thats what you got out of it? God tossed Adam and Eve out of Eden for having hetero sex?

okey dokey..very funny, ha ha. But, Wait a minute! ... Where's your proof? lol... what a maroon!


Obviously you never understood the lessons in The Tale of the Puppet either..

If naughty boys remain on Pleasure Island for too long those donkeys ears are there to stay. (Pinocchio 3:14)

You are the proof.

Thems the breaks. You should have listened to the talking cricket. Ask any scientist.

I would say that I felt sorry for you if I did. Really, I would..

You have to know how to read the bible,
God wanted Adam to stay in homo heaven with Him, but Adam chose the chick and now we're all fucked!

Bathhouse Eden

Because Adam was stuck on Steve, Eve got so horny she started seeing phallic images everywhere, even one that started talking to her.

You and Taz are two peas in a pod. Your worldview is an intellectual dead end.

 

[LA RAM FAN]

I, personally, believe that there is a god. What that means, though, I have been struggling with for quite some time. Therefore, I pose the questions:

1. If there is a god, what does that mean?
2. If there is not a god, what does that mean?

I am looking for opinion, obviously, I do not believe there will ever be proof, or empirical evidence (at least not until rapture, assuming that there is a god). What I am looking for here is what people believe. What leads you to believe what you do? Why?

Let me be clear, I am NOT looking for evangelism of any kind here. I am looking for what the presence of god (or lack of a god) means to you. I know this is a pretty ambiguous thread, and I do that on purpose, because I do not ant to influence the way anyone responds. I want to open a discussion about what your beliefs (whatever they are) have shaped who you are, how you look at religion (in general), and how you look at the world.

Nope indeed not. The hardest thing indeed to come to grips with for posters here is we have been indoctrinated by our parents and what they taught before us by THEIR parents that there is a god and you cant go wrong being a christian.

I like most americans was brought up and taught by my parents that god created us and to go to church and sunday school and read the bible. this is hard for most people to accept but its a complete waste of time. when i tried to argue with my parents there is no god they would say-then how did you get here,how did the world get here? simple explanation for that.

Just study evolution,makes FAR more sense how we got here and how the world was created,than the bible or there being a god and a devil. Its a little complicated and hard to figure out at FIRST but if you stick with it and dont give up on reading it,it will make sense to you and you will understand it It is the hardest thing to accept for most americans,I get that.But as i saidmwhen you sit through and study it,it makes far more sense than anything our parents taught us or anything the bible said.LOL

Just think about it for a minute.GOOD PEOPLE die all the time,you see news items on the news all the time how a bus full of christians turned over and many were killed,happens everyday all the time. wow thats some kind of god out there protecting you there. The world is wayyyyy too fucked up for there to be a god out there.

 

[ding]

Ok, maybe this will be of more interest to you. Assume, for a moment, there is a god, and that said god created the entire universe. What tells you that we, as mere humans, would have the ability to come even close to comprehending what that god is, let alone "real proof" that said god exists? What tells you that we have the ability to explain such an entity? Such an entity would, I say is, so far beyond our ability to comprehend that we really have no hope of EVER understanding. Therefore, what you ask for is far beyond your ability to comprehend, and is, therefore, completely futile. Unless, of course, you can explain where all the matter in the universe came from... If not a god, then what? It just always has been? Where did the laws of nature come from? If evolution is the truth, then why did life on this planet only start once? Do you understand what the odds of THAT scenario are, that life, spontaneously, started only once in the entire history of the world?

Just because at this point in time we don't know where all matter comes from doesn't default over to it being from an invisible being. That's pure fantasy.

If evolution isn't the truth, then do you believe that god just started plopping people around there earth? How did that work exactly? He made Adam out of thin air, then ripped out one of his ribs to make Eve?

What I do have a problem with is you classifying my beliefs as "fantasy" That is really quite offensive to me, therefore I request you stop using that term. .

"To Inhibit Them, Pretend They Offend"

You want us to believe that there are no fantasies then. And why should we care about offending someone who interferes with others, such as with abortion? On that matter, influence other Christians not to have abortions; don't tip the scales in an election in order to get a legislator who will impose your Puritanical sadism on the rest of society. Most likely, he will be a GreedHead looter, so you can go to your imaginary Hell.

At conception a new genetically distinct human life is created. Not just any human life, but one that has never existed before and will never exist again. This is scientific fact. From a legal perspective it is a specific person and has the same inalienable rights as you.

Who is that person's advocate if not us?

Fetus Fetish

A true God, if such a Being were possible, would not want unwanted children to be born. He would take what you claim are their souls directly to Heaven, and be grateful to abortion doctors for assisting Him. Second, a just God would not make the sex drive so strong that it would put His people in such a fix. Third, a bridge under construction may look like a bridge and you may even be able to walk across it, but if you use it prematurely for what it was intended, you will drown. So it is not a bridge.

Fourth, what society would ever name and bury miscarriages and register their deaths? You're just Puritan bullies who are outraged by women getting a little fun and comfort from what nature has given them. Your bossy know-it-all power play using invented religion sets people up for all the economic and political power games of the anti-social snakes.

You know the mind of a true God, do you? You have the intellectual capability of a militant atheist. Here is the extent of your intellectual capability...

You practice critical theory which is the Cultural Marxist theory to criticize what you do not believe to arrive at what you do believe without ever having to examine what you believe. You confuse critical theory for critical thinking. Critical thinking is the practice of challenging what one does believe to test its validity. Something you never do. That is the extent of your intellectual capability.

 

[ding]

Wounded Knee Pest Control

What makes you believe that all four of those are evil under any circumstances?

I don't know what that is. Please explain.

Whirled Wad Wub

It is perfectly clear. Quit pretending it isn't, in order to evade the question. That is a typical Internet act.

I wasn't sure what the "wounded knee pest control" thing was, but I'll keep playing.

dingbat was saying that peace and harmony led to virtuous societies. The ones he named were filled with all kinds of nasty shit. So not peaceful, harmonious or virtuous.

No. ding said, that logic and history show that virtue leads to peace and harmony within individuals and within societies.

But you haven't shown this to be true, your example were far from it.

No. Creation, and everything which has unfolded since creation proves the existence of God. You deny that tangible evidence can be used as evidence, so I know how stupid you are.

 

[K9Buck]

You confuse critical theory for critical thinking. Critical thinking is the practice of challenging what one does believe to test its validity. Something you never do. That is the extent of your intellectual capability.

Don't cast your pearls to the swine and let the dead bury their dead.

 

[ding]

Ok, maybe this will be of more interest to you. Assume, for a moment, there is a god, and that said god created the entire universe. What tells you that we, as mere humans, would have the ability to come even close to comprehending what that god is, let alone "real proof" that said god exists? What tells you that we have the ability to explain such an entity? Such an entity would, I say is, so far beyond our ability to comprehend that we really have no hope of EVER understanding. Therefore, what you ask for is far beyond your ability to comprehend, and is, therefore, completely futile. Unless, of course, you can explain where all the matter in the universe came from... If not a god, then what? It just always has been? Where did the laws of nature come from? If evolution is the truth, then why did life on this planet only start once? Do you understand what the odds of THAT scenario are, that life, spontaneously, started only once in the entire history of the world?

Just because at this point in time we don't know where all matter comes from doesn't default over to it being from an invisible being. That's pure fantasy.

If evolution isn't the truth, then do you believe that god just started plopping people around there earth? How did that work exactly? He made Adam out of thin air, then ripped out one of his ribs to make Eve?

It is beyond my understanding, something I can accept. Apparently you cannot, that's not a fault, just an observation. Some people require more evidence than I do. I have no problem with that. What I do have a problem with is you classifying my beliefs as "fantasy" simply because you do not share them. That is really quite offensive to me, therefore I respectfully request you stop using that term. I thank you in advance.

You're offended because you live in a fantasy world? That's what it is when you have ZERO proof. If that makes you upset, well then maybe you're not as okay with it as you think.

And I believe it is YOU who lives in the fantasy world. I have tons of evidence and reasons to believe in a Creator.

I'm on the side of science, you're not. Science is where it's at, not your book of stories you don't even believe yourself. Science continually looks further, your book is stuck in an ignorant past.

You deny science. Most militant atheists do.

 

[ding]

Ok, maybe this will be of more interest to you. Assume, for a moment, there is a god, and that said god created the entire universe. What tells you that we, as mere humans, would have the ability to come even close to comprehending what that god is, let alone "real proof" that said god exists? What tells you that we have the ability to explain such an entity? Such an entity would, I say is, so far beyond our ability to comprehend that we really have no hope of EVER understanding. Therefore, what you ask for is far beyond your ability to comprehend, and is, therefore, completely futile. Unless, of course, you can explain where all the matter in the universe came from... If not a god, then what? It just always has been? Where did the laws of nature come from? If evolution is the truth, then why did life on this planet only start once? Do you understand what the odds of THAT scenario are, that life, spontaneously, started only once in the entire history of the world?

Just because at this point in time we don't know where all matter comes from doesn't default over to it being from an invisible being. That's pure fantasy.

If evolution isn't the truth, then do you believe that god just started plopping people around there earth? How did that work exactly? He made Adam out of thin air, then ripped out one of his ribs to make Eve?

What I do have a problem with is you classifying my beliefs as "fantasy" That is really quite offensive to me, therefore I request you stop using that term. .

"To Inhibit Them, Pretend They Offend"

You want us to believe that there are no fantasies then. And why should we care about offending someone who interferes with others, such as with abortion? On that matter, influence other Christians not to have abortions; don't tip the scales in an election in order to get a legislator who will impose your Puritanical sadism on the rest of society. Most likely, he will be a GreedHead looter, so you can go to your imaginary Hell.

At conception a new genetically distinct human life is created. Not just any human life, but one that has never existed before and will never exist again. This is scientific fact. From a legal perspective it is a specific person and has the same inalienable rights as you.

Who is that person's advocate if not us?

No, the fetus doesn't have the same rights as a person.

See. You just denied science right there.

 

[Taz]

Maybe the BB wasn't the beginning but part of an endless cycle of expansion and collapse?

That's possible, but I've seen no evidence to support that theory.

There likely can't be any proof so it'll stay a theory. But it can only be said that the BB was the start of our current universe.

 

[ding]

I understand the teachings, apparently better than you do. There is no geologic proof for a worldwide flood that lasted 40 days and drowned nearly everyone on earth. How do you explain that?

Media Narrative by Those Who Were Even More Careless About Accuracy

Perhaps the Flood represents the extermination of the subhuman Neanderthal predators. Or the mass destruction caused by the global warming at the end of the Ice Age. "Forty days" probably represents only the tail end of what those who passed on the story actually witnessed.

All of the worldwide flood myths from every continent was most likely inspired by the aftermath of whatever celestial object left a crater 25 times the size of meteor crater in Arizona at the bottom of the Indian Ocean. The billions of metric tons of water instantly vaporized into the atmosphere could easily have caused a weeks long deluge of torrential rain and superstorms washing away every settlement situated near rivers and streams and even dry washes in the deserts not to mention the mega tsunamis that would have wiped out every coastal civilization.

So the Hebrews used that event as the basis to teach moral lessons to their children with a fictitious and metaphorical narrative using only a little hyperbole because they wouldn't have needed much. Whats so hard to believe or understand about that?

It could be one of the reasons that a belief in an invisible being in the sky of unimaginable power to destroy everything began all around the world.

Obviously the destruction was real and obviously whatever mighty supernatural being caused it needed to be appeased because obviously he was mad about something....

Do you have a link to this asteroid coming down around what, 6000 years ago?

Again you read the Bible literally to make that claim to fit your agenda.

I'm asking about HIS version of what happened, I just want to see where we go with this, to something that make total sense, or to more of his gibberish. He's saying an asteroid came down around that time and create the flood, now I need a link to said asteroid. No need for an agenda.

No. You just are doing what militant atheists do.

 

[ding]

Are you being serious, or just facetious? HOW ELSE WOULD IT EXPRESS ITSELF? Furthermore, it was not God who expressed himself through a book. God expressed himself through men, and commanded men to write an account of said expression. Therefore, the Bible, Koran, Torah, and all other religious documents are, at most, man's interpretation of God's will. Are you really so uneducated as to not understand that?

Is god so lame that he can't express himself directly to me, and that I can only get in touch with him through a 2000 year old book of non-stop nonsense not in evidence written by people who were so primitive that they hadn't even been able to invent toilet paper at that time? Do you understand THAT?

If that is your understanding, then you really do not understand the teachings as I know them. I am not inclined to attempt to explain them to you, as you seem to have utter contempt of the idea, and therefore I see it as an exercise in futility.

I understand the teachings, apparently better than you do. There is no geologic proof for a worldwide flood that lasted 40 days and drowned nearly everyone on earth. How do you explain that?

That the event of a flood is widely documented in all cultures of antiquity and that their knowledge of the world was limited. To them it was a world wide flood. It did happen. You want to read it literally because that fits your agenda.

You need to move the goalposts away from a 40 day flood because you know that that couldn't have happened. So now the story of a 600 year old man who may or may not have been sailing around to 40 days, or not, with 2 of every animal, or not, or maybe 2 of every regional animal, or not...can be shoehorned into your fantasy world.

You mean the allegorical account of an actual event that you read literally?

 

[Taz]

You are not going to prevail by being dishonest. I said there are both literal and figurative truths in the Bible. And I've told you the writers were limited by the lack of knowledge - meaning they would not know that California existed, so how could they know it didn't get flooded?

The duty of a Christian is to know how to separate the figurative from the literal. It is NOT a process of cherry picking:

II Timothy 2: 14 and 15 reads:

"14 Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.

15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth."

And yes, the Chinese knew of Noah AND there are strong arguments that they knew Noah himself:

Migration to China

" I said there are both literal and figurative truths in the Bible."

That's called cherry-picking. Now you know.

And if you choose to not believe certain things in the bible as being true, how can you justify believing other parts to be true? Who decides? And how? By simply saying "this is stupid and can't have happened so it's figurative, but this part sounds like something someone could have said, so we go with it"? Flip a coin?

No. That is called intellectual honesty. The Bible has several literary types; allegorical, historical, law, poetic, prophetic, epistle and proverbial. I'm sure others may add or subtract to this list, but this is a pretty good start. When trying to understand the meaning of passages it is helpful to understand which literary type one is reading and also to place or read the passage in the proper historical light. Something that people who are intellectually dishonest don't do.

Taz knows better than to make the arguments he / she is making. But now there is an even better explanation for Bible interpretation. Thanks for the good job.

You guys are living in a fantasy world. None of the big stuff in the bible can be proven to have happened. Like seriously, you think that god poofed man into being? That's a seriously thick slice of nonsense. And that the earth was formed before the sun? It's completely unfounded and goes against all scientific knowledge.

Spoken like a militant atheist on a mission.

Just pointing out that his views are contrary to science. You can't handle that.

 

[ding]

Burckle Crater - Wikipedia

So you're saying that those resulting mega-tsunamis, as they called them, were the basis for the flood story? If they were in the Indian ocean, they wouldn't have impacted that side of the Middle East. And did some guy make a huge boat before hand and round up all the local animals? Or is that made up?

It would have impacted that area in the form of a deluge of torrential rain, just like in the story. Some guy on a mountain must have seen the splash and described it as the fountains of the deep opened up...All the pieces fit perfectly. It would boggle our minds. Imagine what it would have done to people 6000 years ago?

And yes, there probably was a guy who was prophetically warned and saved a few local animals... The arc of course could itself be just a metaphor as well as the animals he saved.

Moses built the arc of the covenant.

Burckle Crater - Wikipedia

So you're saying that those resulting mega-tsunamis, as they called them, were the basis for the flood story? If they were in the Indian ocean, they wouldn't have impacted that side of the Middle East. And did some guy make a huge boat before hand and round up all the local animals? Or is that made up?

It would have impacted that area in the form of a deluge of torrential rain, just like in the story. Some guy on a mountain must have seen the splash and described it as the fountains of the deep opened up...All the pieces fit perfectly. It would boggle our minds. Imagine what it would have done to people 6000 years ago?

And yes, there probably was a guy who was prophetically warned and saved a few local animals... The arc of course could itself be just a metaphor as well as the animals he saved.

Moses built the arc of the covenant.

So none of the bible stories are actually true.

Arc of the covenant never existed, no proof, so another myth.

This is how I know you are a militant atheist, Taz. You are on a mission.

So you have nothing to add to this conversion except something you repeat over and over again... Hope it at least makes you feel better.

I think calling you out for what you are is an important part of this conversation, Taz.

 

[ding]

" I said there are both literal and figurative truths in the Bible."

That's called cherry-picking. Now you know.

And if you choose to not believe certain things in the bible as being true, how can you justify believing other parts to be true? Who decides? And how? By simply saying "this is stupid and can't have happened so it's figurative, but this part sounds like something someone could have said, so we go with it"? Flip a coin?

No. That is called intellectual honesty. The Bible has several literary types; allegorical, historical, law, poetic, prophetic, epistle and proverbial. I'm sure others may add or subtract to this list, but this is a pretty good start. When trying to understand the meaning of passages it is helpful to understand which literary type one is reading and also to place or read the passage in the proper historical light. Something that people who are intellectually dishonest don't do.

Taz knows better than to make the arguments he / she is making. But now there is an even better explanation for Bible interpretation. Thanks for the good job.

You guys are living in a fantasy world. None of the big stuff in the bible can be proven to have happened. Like seriously, you think that god poofed man into being? That's a seriously thick slice of nonsense. And that the earth was formed before the sun? It's completely unfounded and goes against all scientific knowledge.

Spoken like a militant atheist on a mission.

Just pointing out that his views are contrary to science. You can't handle that.

Which scientific facts would that be, Taz?

 

[Taz]

That makes no sense, as per usual.

It would make sense if you would learn how to read.

Everything with you folks is a secret code. Must make you feel important.

Most of the OT and all of the NT were written either during or after oppression and conquest when their enemies tried to impose their way of life on the authors.

As in any counterculture, they wrote in code. As intelligent and sophisticated in writing as they were, they also cursed the enemy at the same time they blessed whoever was in the wise.

Why is that so hard to believe?

Because it doesn't even seem plausible that the bible is some sort of code book to find an invisible being. It would make a good science fiction movie, but in real life, it makes no logical sense.

Wrong. The Bible is a how to book. How to live and how not to live.

"How to be an idiot" book, ok.