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You make a good point. But Butkus and Nightrain were two of the greatest of all time. Both would be all pros today.The NFL players of yesteryear would be laughed out of the league. Too small, too slow and too weak
Let's see Tom Brady get up.after being sacked by Dick Butkus, under the old rules. Let's see Julian Edelman go across the middle knowing that "Night Train" Lane will be there waiting for him.
Nasty makes up for a lot of physical differences. As does today's set of non-contact rules.
Was Bob Joey the leader of those teams? Because Brady is. He's not just a piece of the puzzleDamn Candycane...you really can be logical. I didn't think it possible.Guys like Marino, Peyton and even Dan Fouts were great Fantasy Football QBs and put up great numbers. But when considering the GOAT, you gotta have some rings
Peyton won two rings but was not terribly impressive in either win. He is more remembered for getting to the playoffs with one of the best records in the league and then losing at home
I loved Joe Montana, one of the most clutch QBs ever. Even at Notre Dame, he had heart and would not quit. The game was never over as long as Joe had the ball and there was time on the clock
Brady has the same type of mentality. I just think that over the years, and he is now 40, he has eclipsed Montana
So by that rationalization…wouldn’t Robert Horry be considered a “greater” player than Magic Johnson? Magic only has 5 rings; Horry has seven.
Not a chance. Those two were freaks of nature.The NFL players of yesteryear would be laughed out of the league. Too small, too slow and too weak
Let's see Tom Brady get up.after being sacked by Dick Butkus, under the old rules. Let's see Julian Edelman go across the middle knowing that "Night Train" Lane will be there waiting for him.
Nasty makes up for a lot of physical differences. As does today's set of non-contact rules.
LOL
Today's players would bowl right over Dick Butkus and run circles around Night Train Lane
Not a chance. Those two were freaks of nature.
Great article on Butkus. He had size, speed, and determination few linebackers in the game today possess. He would be considered the greatest ever if he played today, just as was on his day. Those who played against him know full well.You make a good point. But Butkus and Nightrain were two of the greatest of all time. Both would be all pros today.The NFL players of yesteryear would be laughed out of the league. Too small, too slow and too weak
Let's see Tom Brady get up.after being sacked by Dick Butkus, under the old rules. Let's see Julian Edelman go across the middle knowing that "Night Train" Lane will be there waiting for him.
Nasty makes up for a lot of physical differences. As does today's set of non-contact rules.
Growing up in Detroit I saw both play. Butkus was truly amazing to watch. I got his autograph when he visited my high school back in the 70s. Off the field he was a mild mannered gentleman. On the field, his was a crazed animal.
Exactly. Both would have played much longer than they did.Not a chance. Those two were freaks of nature.
Imagine what they'd be like with today's training and medical advances.
For their day....yesNot a chance. Those two were freaks of nature.The NFL players of yesteryear would be laughed out of the league. Too small, too slow and too weak
Let's see Tom Brady get up.after being sacked by Dick Butkus, under the old rules. Let's see Julian Edelman go across the middle knowing that "Night Train" Lane will be there waiting for him.
Nasty makes up for a lot of physical differences. As does today's set of non-contact rules.
LOL
Today's players would bowl right over Dick Butkus and run circles around Night Train Lane
I can't agree. Few linebackers today possess the talent Butkus had. With the advanced training and techniques used today, Butkus would have played 10 more years (as he said).For their day....yesNot a chance. Those two were freaks of nature.The NFL players of yesteryear would be laughed out of the league. Too small, too slow and too weak
Let's see Tom Brady get up.after being sacked by Dick Butkus, under the old rules. Let's see Julian Edelman go across the middle knowing that "Night Train" Lane will be there waiting for him.
Nasty makes up for a lot of physical differences. As does today's set of non-contact rules.
LOL
Today's players would bowl right over Dick Butkus and run circles around Night Train Lane
Neither works out to the level today's players do. Neither had the size or speed needed in today's game
You really can't compare any athlete in any sport from fifty years ago to those of today
favre blew so many games on interceptions this is just redonkulousBrady is good no doubt but not the best. Think Bret Farve.
I know this thread is about Brady, but Butkus was without question the greatest linebacker of all time and maybe the greatest football player of all time.
Great video here....there is not a linebacker in the game today, that hits like he did. I loved watching him play.
I can't agree. Few linebackers today possess the talent Butkus had. With the advanced training and techniques used today, Butkus would have played 10 more years (as he said).For their day....yesNot a chance. Those two were freaks of nature.The NFL players of yesteryear would be laughed out of the league. Too small, too slow and too weak
Let's see Tom Brady get up.after being sacked by Dick Butkus, under the old rules. Let's see Julian Edelman go across the middle knowing that "Night Train" Lane will be there waiting for him.
Nasty makes up for a lot of physical differences. As does today's set of non-contact rules.
LOL
Today's players would bowl right over Dick Butkus and run circles around Night Train Lane
Neither works out to the level today's players do. Neither had the size or speed needed in today's game
You really can't compare any athlete in any sport from fifty years ago to those of today
He had speed and size that matched many LBs today. But few had his desire and love of the game.
Aside from Moss (who, I must say, he never won with), Brady has had about three truly GREAT targets: Edelman, Gronk, and Welker.When you consider Brady's inability to run or even avoid the rush, plus the fact that for many years he did not have great receivers like Jerry Rice or Lynn Swan to throw to or a great running back like Franco Harris or Roger Craig to hand off to, I think he has to be considered the best of all time. He did it on his smarts, arm, and determination.
Bullshit...Manning has-consistently-choked in the postseason.I used to think Joe Montana was the greatest ever, but I'm wondering if Tom Brady is the best.
What do you think?
Byproduct of the system... Had Manning been in the same system then you might argue Manning was the greatest...
Montana has four conference championships and four Super Bowl rings.Don't people give jim kelly a lot of credit just for making it to 4 superbowls and losing them? OK, now consider if Brady loses that will be 3 times he lost a Superbowl?There are 3 greatest quarterbacks of all time with 4 Superbowls each Brady, Montana and Bradshaw. If he wins this one, Brady is number one.
So wouldn't you say a QB who made it to 3 superbowls and lost them was pretty damn good? So even if you took away bradys 4 superbowl wins you would admit he's pretty damn good. How many men have been to 3 superbowls? Not many. He's either going to be 4 wins 3 loses or 5 wins 2 loses. Either way that's a lot more winning than anyone else. I'd rather have bradys career than anyone elses
Brady is going to his seventh Superbowl and has been to eleven AFC Championship games and 33 total playoff games
Quite a career
You’re right. He’s not responsible for it but if he had started his career in 1980 instead of 2000, he’d be facing the following:
Defensive backs who could get away with MUCH more in terms of coverage, stick-um, and defensive units that had much more freedom to decapitate the QB. Consider this. In 1980, the total number of passes was 13,705. And there was 627 interceptions.
In 2016, there was nearly 5,000 more pass attempts made by NFL quarterbacks but over 200 fewer interceptions.
Some of this increase in passing is due to expansion and new/replacement teams in Jacksonville, Carolina, Houston and Cleveland but it would stand to reason that the dilution of QBs (it being a far more complex position) would lead to more interceptions, not fewer. Also, it would stand to reason that the field being the same size, the athletes being bagger, stronger, and faster would mean more interceptions etc…
Year PA INT
2016 18298 415
2006 16389 520
1996 15966 542
1986 14469 581
1980 13705 627
Put another way, In 1980, when Joe Montana started making his name…there were 28 teams. The Raiders had 35 interceptions as a team. The Saints had the fewest with 12. In the pass happy 2016 season with about 5,000 more passes, the KC Chiefs lead the league with 18 INTs…6 teams had 10 or fewer grabs.
Clearly, the league favors passers more now than ever before; or at least in recent history.
Brady has been assisted by the expansion more than most as well. Three of the new franchises that found their way into the league are AFC teams, Houston, Cleveland and Jacksonville.
Houston is a -28 on 106 wins and 134 losses
Cleveland (who has NEVER won more than 10 games since reinstatement) is apparently -200 with 88 wins and 200 losses
Jacksonville are a -42: 155-197-0
You think Brady/NE has done well against these guys? You’re right 7 and 0 against the Jags, 6 and 1 against the Texans and 7 and 2 against the Browns (since 1999). Of course, expansion has a tendency to lower the barriers for entry. One could argue that he, a 6th round choice, benefitted from it as well. If the Jags, Panthers, and Browns not been there, 18 more players would have been on the board when Brady was selected…who is to say whether the Patriots had one of them ahead. Further…the AFC east competition for the Patriots has not exactly been a model of consistency. Miami has had 8 coaches since 2000, so has Buffalo. The Gents have had 5. Presumably, that is 21 different playbook, 21 different philosophies, lord knows how many different GMs, PPDs, and coordinators.
Again, let me stress, none of this is something that benefits Brady directly. It’s simply the environment he has prospered in and every other QB had essentially the same opportunity. Brady is great but it is hard to find another QB that has benefitted as much from the environment as TB—or one that has mercilessly dispatched his foes.
I try to avoid comparing statistics between era's. The game has changed significantly
I don't see any benefit from expansion. You still have to finish at the top of the heap....which Brady has done repeatedly
Montana had to beat 27 other teams, Brady had to beat 31 other teams (Vince Lombardi's Packers only had to beat 13 other teams)
So if you can't really compare statistics you have to look at:
Did they win championships?
Did they come up big in the clutch?
Both Brady and Montana did both. I give Brady a slight edge now, and hands down if he beats the Falcons
Brady and Montana have the same number of Super Bowl wins. Montana never lost a SB. I'm not sure how, by your stated metric, that would put Brady ahead. Montana would seem to be more "clutch" based on winning percentage in the big game and stats (no INT in his 4 SBs).
Either one of them are perfectly valid to argue as the best of the SB era.
Jim Brown was the greatest all time.
Unlike Brady, Montana was and is a PROVEN CHEATER. Might want to move out of that glass house, kid.I used to think Joe Montana was the greatest ever, but I'm wondering if Tom Brady is the best.
What do you think?
Quarterback for football player?
For player I would go with Jerry Rice.
For QB- well stats be damned- I will go with Joe Montana.
Perhaps I am biased.
Brady is good no doubt but not the best. Think Bret Farve.
There are 3 greatest quarterbacks of all time with 4 Superbowls each Brady, Montana and Bradshaw. If he wins this one, Brady is number one.
cheaters dont count so if we are talking greatest in the superbowl era,the only question is who is the best quarterback in the modern day era between Bradshaw and Montana?same as how Barry Bonds does not count as having the record for most home runs in a season so the question would be who is the greatest home run hitter Ruth or Maris.
