JimBowie1958
Old Fogey
- Sep 25, 2011
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Contrary to current Dimocrat talking points, but lying to the FBI is not always a crime. It is if you are in an official interview for the purposes of an investigation. There is no crime in a woman lying to the FBI about her age in some informal 'no big deal' conversation. It's not as if the FBI agents have some law that mandates everyone tell FBI agents the truth at all times no matter when or where.
General Flynn, for example, was in charge of some classified information, which discussions with the Russian ambassador regarding sanctions etc, would be classified material. So Flynn actually had a legal obligation to lie about anything they had no justifiable cause to hear or read. To get Flynn to tell them the classified stuff, they had to tell them that they had a need to know as part of an official investigation AND THEY DID NOT DO THAT. They are also obligated to tell that person that IN THAT SETTING any lie to them would be a crime and, again, they failed to do so.
Mueller releases key documents of FBI interview with Michael Flynn
Now Dims can keep pretending that a major officer for an administration that handled classified information should always spill their guts if an FBI agent ever asks them a question, but that assertion is plainly ludicrous on its face.
I deal with classified information as part of my job, and for me to give someone a false statement regarding that information is not illegal or morally a lie as these people do not have a justified reason to know that classified information. Flynn's deceptions were justified as he did not know he was being asked as part of a criminal investigation. Period. He did not lie to the FBI in the context of his job to protect classified information, and Trump is right to say Flynn did not lie to the FBI. Flynn got fired for lying to the VP Pence.
More strangeness about that interview is here.
As to the FBI doing shit like that, they do it all the time. The Richard Jewel case is one of the most outrageous cases of FBI deception to entrap a person.
American Nightmare: The Ballad of Richard Jewell
So Jewel had saved a whole bunch of lives and the FBI treated him like Ossama binLaden and tried to entrap him.
So lets not pretend the FBI would not deceive Flynn here; that is their MO.
General Flynn, for example, was in charge of some classified information, which discussions with the Russian ambassador regarding sanctions etc, would be classified material. So Flynn actually had a legal obligation to lie about anything they had no justifiable cause to hear or read. To get Flynn to tell them the classified stuff, they had to tell them that they had a need to know as part of an official investigation AND THEY DID NOT DO THAT. They are also obligated to tell that person that IN THAT SETTING any lie to them would be a crime and, again, they failed to do so.
Mueller releases key documents of FBI interview with Michael Flynn
The documents – some of which are heavily redacted – were released in response to U.S. District Judge Emmet G. Sullivan ordering prosecutors to hand over the government's files related to the FBI’s questioning of Flynn by Friday afternoon. The order came after Flynn's legal team said in a filing that the FBI discouraged Flynn from bringing a lawyer to the interview and agents never advised him false statements in that setting could constitute a crime. The newly released documents confirm those claims.
The documents include then-FBI Deputy Director Andrew McCabe’s notes after talking with Flynn to arrange his interview with the FBI. It also includes a so-called "302" report documenting what Flynn told anti-Trump agent Peter Strzok and one other agent during their conversation at the White House. That July 2017 report, though, specifically came from an interview with Strzok in which the Flynn encounter was discussed -- and not the original Flynn interview. It was unclear why no "302" report from the interview itself was included.
The 302 report stated that Strzok and the other agent “both had the impression at the time that Flynn was not lying or did not think he was lying.”
The documents include then-FBI Deputy Director Andrew McCabe’s notes after talking with Flynn to arrange his interview with the FBI. It also includes a so-called "302" report documenting what Flynn told anti-Trump agent Peter Strzok and one other agent during their conversation at the White House. That July 2017 report, though, specifically came from an interview with Strzok in which the Flynn encounter was discussed -- and not the original Flynn interview. It was unclear why no "302" report from the interview itself was included.
The 302 report stated that Strzok and the other agent “both had the impression at the time that Flynn was not lying or did not think he was lying.”
Now Dims can keep pretending that a major officer for an administration that handled classified information should always spill their guts if an FBI agent ever asks them a question, but that assertion is plainly ludicrous on its face.
I deal with classified information as part of my job, and for me to give someone a false statement regarding that information is not illegal or morally a lie as these people do not have a justified reason to know that classified information. Flynn's deceptions were justified as he did not know he was being asked as part of a criminal investigation. Period. He did not lie to the FBI in the context of his job to protect classified information, and Trump is right to say Flynn did not lie to the FBI. Flynn got fired for lying to the VP Pence.
More strangeness about that interview is here.
As to the FBI doing shit like that, they do it all the time. The Richard Jewel case is one of the most outrageous cases of FBI deception to entrap a person.
American Nightmare: The Ballad of Richard Jewell
Within minutes, Don Johnson and Diader Rosario knocked on Jewell's door. They exuded sincerity, Jewell recalled. "They told me they wanted me to come with them to headquarters to help them make a training film to be used at Quantico," he said. Johnson played to Jewell's pride. Despite the reporters in the parking lot and the call from Anthony Davis, Jewell had no doubt that they were telling the truth. He drove the short distance to F.B.I. headquarters in Buckhead in his own truck, but he noticed that four cars were following him. "The press is on us," Jewell told Johnson when they arrived. "No, those are our guys," Johnson told him. This tactic would continue through the next 88 days and be severely criticized: Why would you have an armada of surveillance vehicles stacked up on a suspected bomber?
It was then that Jewell started to wonder why he was at the F.B.I., but he followed Johnson and Rosario inside. ...
As Jewell sat in a small office, he wondered why the cameraman recording the interview was staring at him so intently. After an hour, Johnson was called out of the room. When he returned, he said to Jewell, "Let's pretend that none of this happened. You are going to come in and start over, and by the way, we want you to fill out this waiver of rights."
"At that moment a million things were going through my head," Jewell told me. "You don't give anyone a waiver of rights unless they are being investigated. I said, 'I need to contact my attorney,' and then all of a sudden it was an instant change. 'What do you need to contact your attorney for? You didn't do anything. We thought you were a hero. Is there something you want to tell us about?'" Jewell grew increasingly apprehensive and later recalled thinking, These guys think I did this.
When the agents took a break, Jewell asked to use the phone. "I called Watson four times. I called his brother. I told his parents that I had to get hold of Watson—it was urgent. I was, like, 'I have to speak to him right now.' What was going on was that Washington was on the phone with Atlanta. The people in Washington were giving them questions." Jewell said he knew this because the videotapes in the cameras were two hours long and "Johnson and Rosario would leave every 30 minutes, like they had to speak on the phone." The O.P.R. report, however, would assert that no one at headquarters knew about the videotaping or the training-film ruse. Lying to get a statement out of a suspect is, in fact, not illegal, but clearly Johnson and Rosario were not making decisions on their own. Even the procedure of having a fleet of cars follow a suspect was an intimidation tactic used by the F.B.I. Later, according to Jewell, Johnson and Rosario would both tell him privately that they believed he was innocent, but that the investigation was being run by the "highest levels in Washington."
It was then that Jewell started to wonder why he was at the F.B.I., but he followed Johnson and Rosario inside. ...
As Jewell sat in a small office, he wondered why the cameraman recording the interview was staring at him so intently. After an hour, Johnson was called out of the room. When he returned, he said to Jewell, "Let's pretend that none of this happened. You are going to come in and start over, and by the way, we want you to fill out this waiver of rights."
"At that moment a million things were going through my head," Jewell told me. "You don't give anyone a waiver of rights unless they are being investigated. I said, 'I need to contact my attorney,' and then all of a sudden it was an instant change. 'What do you need to contact your attorney for? You didn't do anything. We thought you were a hero. Is there something you want to tell us about?'" Jewell grew increasingly apprehensive and later recalled thinking, These guys think I did this.
When the agents took a break, Jewell asked to use the phone. "I called Watson four times. I called his brother. I told his parents that I had to get hold of Watson—it was urgent. I was, like, 'I have to speak to him right now.' What was going on was that Washington was on the phone with Atlanta. The people in Washington were giving them questions." Jewell said he knew this because the videotapes in the cameras were two hours long and "Johnson and Rosario would leave every 30 minutes, like they had to speak on the phone." The O.P.R. report, however, would assert that no one at headquarters knew about the videotaping or the training-film ruse. Lying to get a statement out of a suspect is, in fact, not illegal, but clearly Johnson and Rosario were not making decisions on their own. Even the procedure of having a fleet of cars follow a suspect was an intimidation tactic used by the F.B.I. Later, according to Jewell, Johnson and Rosario would both tell him privately that they believed he was innocent, but that the investigation was being run by the "highest levels in Washington."
So Jewel had saved a whole bunch of lives and the FBI treated him like Ossama binLaden and tried to entrap him.
So lets not pretend the FBI would not deceive Flynn here; that is their MO.
