Zone1 Let’s abolish racist policies starting with the two most obvious and systemic

[irosie91]

Lets take 'race' off credit card applications, housing applications loan applications and job applications.

do they ask "race" on job applications?

 

[Lisa558]

Well people need some help to achieve. People can be born to parents who are poor but well educated. One of the most common reasons for kids doing well used to be a women marrying into a lower class. Research has shown over and over that the biggest difference in whether a child achieves is the education of the main care giver. Are you meaning Universities lower their standards?

Yes, universities lower their standards for blacks, while maintaining higher standards for whites, and, more recently, Asians.

 

[Hellbilly]

do they ask "race" on job applications?

Some do.

 

[Lisa558]

Government is the biggest violator of discrimination in hiring practices based on race. I that was supposed to be illegal but it seems government can break the law.

At least we are going to get rid of the racist policies in college admissions next year, when the SCOTUS takes the Harvard case.

In case you haven’t heard of it, Harvard was so desperate to justify why blacks with lower grades and scores were getting in while Asians with far superior metrics were getting rejected that they devised a subjective test on personality and scored Asians as being “unlikeable.”

Now reverse that. Can you imagine the uproar if Harvard rejected blacks with a top GPA and let in whites with far worse grades, and when asked to justify it, said that blacks were unlikeable?!

 

[alexa]

Yes, universities lower their standards for blacks, while maintaining higher standards for whites, and, more recently, Asians.

As I understand this, it will probably be for a small number of students and intended to be for a short while. It should be intended to be for a short while because it ought to go along with sorting out the reason why they need to be given the extra help. One of the main reason is not being used to seeing people with colour there so not trying for it. I can give you a person example of this. Thatcher was our first female PM. My daughter was born soon after she first became PM. She saw being a PM as a job she could do from a very early age, though she did prefer the idea of being a hairdresser....but the most important part, she thought you had to be a woman to be PM. If Black people do not see Black people coming out of top Universities they are not going to see it as something they can achieve.

 

[Lisa558]

As I understand this, it will probably be for a small number of students and intended to be for a short while. It should be intended to be for a short while because it ought to go along with sorting out the reason why they need to be given the extra help. One of the main reason is not being used to seeing people with colour there so not trying for it. I can give you a person example of this. Thatcher was our first female PM. My daughter was born soon after she first became PM. She saw being a PM as a job she could do from a very early age, though she did prefer the idea of being a hairdresser....but the most important part, she thought you had to be a woman to be PM. If Black people do not see Black people coming out of top Universities they are not going to see it as something they can achieve.

It’s not a short time….it’s been going on for decades. There was a big case when I was in college - in the 1970s - in which a white student rejected from a med school sued because blacks with lower grades and scores were accepted.

And blacks would still be getting into top universities even if race were abolished as a factor - just not as many.

Finally, remember that for each black who was accepted only because he was black, a white or Asian with better grades and scores was rejected, and had to go to a lesser school. Why should blacks get into a school that wouldn’t otherwise be admitted to, and whites have to go elsewhere?

 

[1srelluc]

When one makes a choice on which human to pick for a political position one race must be chosen, whether you like the choice or not.

 

[irosie91]

It’s not a short time….it’s been going on for decades. There was a big case when I was in college - in the 1970s - in which a white student rejected from a med school sued because blacks with lower grades and scores were accepted.

And blacks would still be getting into top universities even if race were abolished as a factor - just not as many.

Finally, remember that for each black who was accepted only because he was black, a white or Asian with better grades and scores was rejected, and had to go to a lesser school. Why should blacks get into a school that wouldn’t otherwise be admitted to, and whites have to go elsewhere?

yes----affirmative action that went into effect in the 1960s was SUPPOSED
to be a temporary fix----until things 'evened out' It is clear that interested
persons reject the idea of "temporary" and seem to insist that "things will
NEVER even out"

 

[Ralph Norton]

When one makes a choice on which human to pick for a political position one race must be chosen, whether you like the choice or not.

The point is to choose the PERSON, not the RACE. Did you not understand that?

 

[BlackSand]

Lets take 'race' off credit card applications, housing applications loan applications and job applications.

.

Whenever asked on an application ... Mark "Other" and write "Human".
It works ... I have never been denied credit cards, loans, jobs or housing.

If you want to stop playing the silly race game ... Start with yourself ...

.​

 

[alexa]

It’s not a short time….it’s been going on for decades. There was a big case when I was in college - in the 1970s - in which a white student rejected from a med school sued because blacks with lower grades and scores were accepted.

And blacks would still be getting into top universities even if race were abolished as a factor - just not as many.

Finally, remember that for each black who was accepted only because he was black, a white or Asian with better grades and scores was rejected, and had to go to a lesser school. Why should blacks get into a school that wouldn’t otherwise be admitted to, and whites have to go elsewhere?

Yes, Ideally it would be a short time because all the other things would be sorted out. It is extremely hard. Another way of looking at this is that every child in a democracy deserves the same start. Clearly it does not happen but when we are thinking about democracy and with the belief that we all deserve an equal start, we do put in things like 'first start' programs and in the UK they do make a difference though were stopped after 2008. I know you have had them too and that is one of the other ways to help to bring those, particularly those with parents who are very poor and did not get a good education, a fairer start.

Ok maybe you had something personal in that someone you knew lost their place in med school because of positive affirm. It is understandable that that would upset you and possibly you believe it changed her/his life and I do not think anything of this nature should ever be made public. The chances are that that person had a better start. In that way what s/he achieved might not be as much as someone coming from a black home and I get that some of them will be getting a good start as well.. However if the intent is to let black people see that they can do this, then giving them the place has validity. Not good for the person who lost their place but that should not have been made public and there really is no reason to believe that that person was more capable that the person who got the place. A few marks really means very little.

I don't think I know enough about

And blacks would still be getting into top universities even if race were abolished as a factor - just not as many.

to comment and I think I have already answered the last paragraph or are you suggesting these are now all black Universities?

 

[irosie91]

Yes, Ideally it would be a short time because all the other things would be sorted out. It is extremely hard. Another way of looking at this is that every child in a democracy deserves the same start. Clearly it does not happen but when we are thinking about democracy and with the belief that we all deserve an equal start, we do put in things like 'first start' programs and in the UK they do make a difference though were stopped after 2008. I know you have had them too and that is one of the other ways to help to bring those, particularly those with parents who are very poor and did not get a good education, a fairer start.

Ok maybe you had something personal in that someone you knew lost their place in med school because of positive affirm. It is understandable that that would upset you and possibly you believe it changed her/his life and I do not think anything of this nature should ever be made public. The chances are that that person had a better start. In that way what s/he achieved might not be as much as someone coming from a black home and I get that some of them will be getting a good start as well.. However if the intent is to let black people see that they can do this, then giving them the place has validity. Not good for the person who lost their place but that should not have been made public and there really is no reason to believe that that person was more capable that the person who got the place. A few marks really means very little.

I don't think I know enough about

to comment and I think I have already answered the last paragraph or are you suggesting these are now all black Universities?

I experienced and survived the era------In the 1960s the idea of a bit of LEG UP
SPECIFICALLY FOR BLACKS-----seemed to be a kind of reasonable SMOOTH OUT
idea----albeit flawed by the RACIST ISSUE-----some get too much and some
get nothin'. However it was SUPPOSED TO BE VERY TEMPORARY and it has
gotten way out of hand------to the point of a facilitation of overt criminality. Not
and issue of "all black" universities

 

[TheParser]

And you hit on another problem caused when schools lower standards for blacks. The poor white kids, who despite their poverty were bright and studious and made excellent marks, are tossed by the wayside to make room for a black with far inferior grades and scores.

Back in the 1970s when bussing was in vogue, a certain religious group here in Los Angeles demanded bussing.

Well, they got their wish.

Buses full of disadvantaged young men and women were bussed to a certain high school famous for its high academic standards.

As you can guess, the standards quickly went south. As did peace and order.

How did that idealistic religious group respond?

Well, sir/ma'am, they removed their children from that once great high school and established private high schools for children of their religious faith.

In 2022, those religious-based high schools are thriving and regularly send their graduates to the best universities in the nation.

 

[Moonglow]

The point is to choose the PERSON, not the RACE. Did you not understand that?

yet when you chose the person you chose their race, why is that so hard to understand?

 

[Lisa558]

yet when you chose the person you chose their race, why is that so hard to understand?

Who says I choose the person based on race? I always chose the best candidate during the 20 years I ran my business. Most of the time the best qualified WAS white, but that’s to be expected since most people are white. I hired blacks when they were the best qualified, and I also hired Asians. Also hired gays.

All I cared about was who could do the best job.

 

[Moonglow]

Who says I choose the person based on race? I always chose the best candidate during the 20 years I ran my business. Most of the time the best qualified WAS white, but that’s to be expected since most people are white. I hired blacks when they were the best qualified, and I also hired Asians. Also hired gays.

All I cared about was who could do the best job.

I never said you hired according to race, I also had to hire people that were available in the area. Race never entered into it since in NW Arkansas they didn't allow minorities to live in the area until the Hispanic invasion.

 

[Lisa558]

I never said you hired according to race, I also had to hire people that were available in the area. Race never entered into it since in NW Arkansas they didn't allow minorities to live in the area until the Hispanic invasion.

Yup. There were areas that kept Jews out too. Not sure of your point.

 

[ninja007]

Whatever economic issues the u.k is dealing with, white people come first.

as they should, a mostly white country. duh.