Lets Deal With Documented Facts For A Change

[rosends]

you are molding your arguments to fit your ends. all i am saying is be cconsistant. so you think people have the right to take by force of arms the lands they inhabited at your arbitrary date of 2000 years ago, or better yet, a date of their choosing?

I'm not molding anything -- I am asking about the consequences of a real world event and your opinion about how to deal with it. Should we retroactively reject the British 1947 partition? As it relates to the mideast, I never set any arbitrary date -- 2000 years ago or otherwise. I have intentionally NOT set a particular date; I asked for one from people who think that there can be such a date but i didn't posit one.

I thrive on calm and quiet and am more the pacifist (or even coward) than anything else. My neuroses tend towards the staid and predictable.


if you you believe in a war of the jungle then does this mean you have no problem with what others would call israel's "aggression"? Wouldn't that be as justified as anything else? And as to my point, it is simply to find an answer to a question of consistency -- do you feel that Britain had no right to partition in 1947 and create refugees and violence and thus we should undo partition?

Should we retroactively reject the British 1947 partition?

-- do you feel that Britain had no right to partition in 1947...

There was no partition in 1947.

do you mean that there was no implementation of the UN Partition Plan after 72 percent of the UN voting members voted "for" it, because of the May war? Do you feel that Britain and the UN had a right to propose and pass a partition plan?

 

[P F Tinmore]

I'm not molding anything -- I am asking about the consequences of a real world event and your opinion about how to deal with it. Should we retroactively reject the British 1947 partition? As it relates to the mideast, I never set any arbitrary date -- 2000 years ago or otherwise. I have intentionally NOT set a particular date; I asked for one from people who think that there can be such a date but i didn't posit one.

I thrive on calm and quiet and am more the pacifist (or even coward) than anything else. My neuroses tend towards the staid and predictable.


if you you believe in a war of the jungle then does this mean you have no problem with what others would call israel's "aggression"? Wouldn't that be as justified as anything else? And as to my point, it is simply to find an answer to a question of consistency -- do you feel that Britain had no right to partition in 1947 and create refugees and violence and thus we should undo partition?

-- do you feel that Britain had no right to partition in 1947...

There was no partition in 1947.

do you mean that there was no implementation of the UN Partition Plan after 72 percent of the UN voting members voted "for" it, because of the May war? Do you feel that Britain and the UN had a right to propose and pass a partition plan?

Of course they had no right. Palestine was not theirs to give away.

 

[sealadaigh]

you are molding your arguments to fit your ends. all i am saying is be cconsistant. so you think people have the right to take by force of arms the lands they inhabited at your arbitrary date of 2000 years ago, or better yet, a date of their choosing?

I'm not molding anything -- I am asking about the consequences of a real world event and your opinion about how to deal with it. Should we retroactively reject the British 1947 partition? As it relates to the mideast, I never set any arbitrary date -- 2000 years ago or otherwise. I have intentionally NOT set a particular date; I asked for one from people who think that there can be such a date but i didn't posit one.

i'm cool with that myself. i thrive on chaos and while i do not seek out or believe that violence is the best way to solve problems, i am not at all a non-violent person or paciist. i've been in the army and i've been in west belfast and i have skills. i also have what i like to call an "amorality switch" in my brain that allows me to function well in civil and polite society when it is off but when i click it on, i can get the bad jobs done dispassionately with little or no serious long term effects on my psyche other than the occasional nightmare when i am caught of guard..

I thrive on calm and quiet and am more the pacifist (or even coward) than anything else. My neuroses tend towards the staid and predictable.

"therefore jew, though justice be thy plea"...really is a two way street...and as we say in the streets and jungles..."reap the whirlwind, motherfucker."

do you have any point at all and would you get to it, or would you rather continue with this obvious sophistry dance? i'm good either way.

if you you believe in a war of the jungle then does this mean you have no problem with what others would call israel's "aggression"? Wouldn't that be as justified as anything else? And as to my point, it is simply to find an answer to a question of consistency -- do you feel that Britain had no right to partition in 1947 and create refugees and violence and thus we should undo partition?

i didn't say i believed in the law of the jungle. in fact, i said i did not seek it out. i merely said i was good at it. usually skill comes with experience and i think you will find that those good at it are those most likely to avoid the use of those skills.

if you haven't figured out that i am entirely opposed to "aggression" then you have not read my posts. i am adamantly and irrevocably opposed to aggression and applaud those who defend against it. european jews and their descendents are the aggressors, having acquired that mantle from the british.

i was and am totally against the partition. england had no right to any of it and european jews have no right to any of it. pragmatically though. the solution is not to undo whats been done. israel has not gelled yet though. i think israel needs to honestly negotiate with HAMAS and the PLO based on 181 and release marwan barghouti to lead those negotiations.

if however, there is any pushing in the sea to be done, i am solidly behind the palestinians, they have been the ones who have sought honest solution. israel has lied and been deceptive at every single turn. i hope they (the palestinians) show mercy on the descendents of those few indigenous jews in the region.

i also hope some solution is reached before a world wide backlash occurs against the jews who finance this brutal occupation of the west bank and the siege of gaza.

 

[rosends]

There was no partition in 1947.

do you mean that there was no implementation of the UN Partition Plan after 72 percent of the UN voting members voted "for" it, because of the May war? Do you feel that Britain and the UN had a right to propose and pass a partition plan?

Of course they had no right. Palestine was not theirs to give away.

thanks. I'll alert the Pakistanis. 1947 was a busy year for British partitions.

 

[P F Tinmore]

do you mean that there was no implementation of the UN Partition Plan after 72 percent of the UN voting members voted "for" it, because of the May war? Do you feel that Britain and the UN had a right to propose and pass a partition plan?

Of course they had no right. Palestine was not theirs to give away.

thanks. I'll alert the Pakistanis. 1947 was a busy year for British partitions.

Indeed, we are still living with British fuck-ups.

 

[sealadaigh]

do you mean that there was no implementation of the UN Partition Plan after 72 percent of the UN voting members voted "for" it, because of the May war? Do you feel that Britain and the UN had a right to propose and pass a partition plan?

Of course they had no right. Palestine was not theirs to give away.

thanks. I'll alert the Pakistanis. 1947 was a busy year for British partitions.

please do. why in the world would you think europran powers should have the right to slice and dice and institute boundaries between tribal cultures willy nilly, throwing them into a conflict with each other.

the UN has and is evolving. do you think indigenous peoples have rights? i think their rights are supreme. do you know when the UN officially recognised the rights of indigemous peoples....about five years ago, or sixty years after 1947. and yet they refuse to recognise or give full rights to the palestinians, even though their numbers are about equal to the israelis.

 

[irosie91]

I support the RIGHTS of all indigenous peoples-----based on the definition of refugees from indigenous lands-----I have hundreds of relatives who are jews ----far more INDIGENOUS---to several lands that describe themselves as "ISLAMIC" than any of those invading dogs from arabia Thus all should have right to RETURN TO A THOROUGHLY DE ISLAMITIZED LAND

 

[eots]

I support the RIGHTS of all indigenous peoples-----based on the definition of refugees from indigenous lands-----I have hundreds of relatives who are jews ----far more INDIGENOUS---to several lands that describe themselves as "ISLAMIC" than any of those invading dogs from arabia Thus all should have right to RETURN TO A THOROUGHLY DE ISLAMITIZED LAND

Why do you even try to pretend you are not a hate filled racist ?

 

[kvetch]

seal, you said:

i've been in the army and i've been in west belfast and i have skills. i also have what i like to call an "amorality switch" in my brain that allows me to function well in civil and polite society when it is off but when i click it on, i can get the bad jobs done dispassionately with little or no serious long term effects on my psyche other than the occasional nightmare when i am caught of guard..

as a brit who opposes UK's dreadful antics in ireland and all over the world down the centuries

and also the partition of, palestine and ireland and the worst partition of all...india / pakistan where more died in that one year, 1947 than in all israel pal wars put together

what were you doing in west belfast, can I ask??

i thought you were an irish yank

 

[kvetch]

Of course they had no right. Palestine was not theirs to give away.

thanks. I'll alert the Pakistanis. 1947 was a busy year for British partitions.

please do. why in the world would you think europran powers should have the right to slice and dice and institute boundaries between tribal cultures willy nilly, throwing them into a conflict with each other.

the UN has and is evolving. do you think indigenous peoples have rights? i think their rights are supreme. do you know when the UN officially recognised the rights of indigemous peoples....about five years ago, or sixty years after 1947. and yet they refuse to recognise or give full rights to the palestinians, even though their numbers are about equal to the israelis.

as you know seal the UN is only as good as its 5 veto wielding powers allow it to be

should be 6; india should have one too with its 1.2 billion folx

and israel has an effective veto as well because it controls congress which controls US foreign policy

 

[sealadaigh]

seal, you said:

i've been in the army and i've been in west belfast and i have skills. i also have what i like to call an "amorality switch" in my brain that allows me to function well in civil and polite society when it is off but when i click it on, i can get the bad jobs done dispassionately with little or no serious long term effects on my psyche other than the occasional nightmare when i am caught of guard..

as a brit who opposes UK's dreadful antics in ireland and all over the world down the centuries

and also the partition of, palestine and ireland and the worst partition of all...india / pakistan where more died in that one year, 1947 than in all israel pal wars put together

what were you doing in west belfast, can I ask??

i thought you were an irish yank

i was born in colonial singapore of an irish-american father and irish mother. i grew up in france, poitiers and la rochelle, and NYC and spent considerable time with my republican grandparnts, cousins, and friends in the ballymurphy estates...back and forth and back and forth i left for good in 1985 too many people had gone.i now live in the pacific northwest. the weather soothes me.

i bear no ill will towards the british people but i want their government out of irish business and i want their soldiers out of the six counties.

that will happen when the voting provisions of the good friday/belfast agreement take effect. it is past due.

i hope that is what you meant by "what were you doing in west belfast".

 

[sealadaigh]

thanks. I'll alert the Pakistanis. 1947 was a busy year for British partitions.

please do. why in the world would you think europran powers should have the right to slice and dice and institute boundaries between tribal cultures willy nilly, throwing them into a conflict with each other.

the UN has and is evolving. do you think indigenous peoples have rights? i think their rights are supreme. do you know when the UN officially recognised the rights of indigemous peoples....about five years ago, or sixty years after 1947. and yet they refuse to recognise or give full rights to the palestinians, even though their numbers are about equal to the israelis.

as you know seal the UN is only as good as its 5 veto wielding powers allow it to be

should be 6; india should have one too with its 1.2 billion folx

and israel has an effective veto as well because it controls congress which controls US foreign policy

unlike most people who complain about the UN, i am unwilling to throw iut the baby of a good idea in its creation with the bathwater of it lagging way behind in the ust governance of a global populaation.

i have no idea why france and the UK, are permanant members other than the victor/spoils rule.

a very good case could be made for india being a permaanant member, as well as indonesia and brazil. one could also maybe argue for nigeria and pakistan and a few others.

whatever though, i do not believe in one country having veto power. i think they should run that like the supreme court of the USA.

and i think israel should be kicked into the asia-pacific group instead of the western-european and other groups.

 

[MJB12741]

Problem is nobody cares what you think. But please continue to entertain us.

please do. why in the world would you think europran powers should have the right to slice and dice and institute boundaries between tribal cultures willy nilly, throwing them into a conflict with each other.

the UN has and is evolving. do you think indigenous peoples have rights? i think their rights are supreme. do you know when the UN officially recognised the rights of indigemous peoples....about five years ago, or sixty years after 1947. and yet they refuse to recognise or give full rights to the palestinians, even though their numbers are about equal to the israelis.

as you know seal the UN is only as good as its 5 veto wielding powers allow it to be

should be 6; india should have one too with its 1.2 billion folx

and israel has an effective veto as well because it controls congress which controls US foreign policy

iunlike most people who complain about the UN, i am unwilling to throw iut the baby of a good idea in its creation with the bathwater of it lagging way behind in the ust governance of a global populaation.

i have no idea why france and the UK, are permanant members other than the victor/spoils rule.

a very good case could be made for india being a permaanant member, as well as indonesia and brazil. one could also maybe argue for nigeria and pakistan and a few others.

whatever though, i do not believe in one country having veto power. i think they should run that like the supreme court of the USA.

and i think israel should be kicked into the asia-pacific group instead of the western-european and other groups.

 

[irosie91]

I believe that indigenous people have rights-----the jews of the Middle east have a right to live free of islamic murder, rape, pillage and filth. I also believe that same is true for the Christians of the middle east and all of africa I was delighted when ----a tiny victory against the murder rape and enslavement program of Khartoum was accomplished I look forward to progress for the RIGHTS OF ALL PEOPLE in the entire continent

LONG LIVE JEWISH YATHRIB

 

[MJB12741]

Amen! Let there be peace already!

i believe that indigenous people have rights-----the jews of the middle east have a right to live free of islamic murder, rape, pillage and filth. I also believe that same is true for the christians of the middle east and all of africa i was delighted when ----a tiny victory against the murder rape and enslavement program of khartoum was accomplished i look forward to progress for the rights of all people in the entire continent

long live jewish yathrib

 

[MJB12741]

Israel Matzav: 'Palestinian' terrorists fire over 60 rockets and mortars in last 24 hours

 

[Hossfly]

Israel Matzav: 'Palestinian' terrorists fire over 60 rockets and mortars in last 24 hours

Sherri sez the IDF is butchering and killing innocent civilians by the thousands in an ongoing invasion of Gaza as we speak. She even has pictures to prove her charges. I can't find out anything from any media. It must be like the London blitz over there. All communications out. According to war corrrespondent Sherri.

 

[patrickcaturday]

Problem is nobody cares what you think. But please continue to entertain us.

Just as a matter of curiosity, if no one cares what Seal says, why do you continue to follow him around from post to post and from thread to thread. Please let us know what enthralls you so. Seems as if you are fixated on his every word. The real PROBLEM is why you would think anyone would be interested in anything you have to say since in all of your postings you only seem to have 3 original ideas. Beleive me those are getting real old. You are like a broken record.

 

[MJB12741]

Well as we learned our US media is controlled by the Zionists. Lets try Al Jazeera for the truth? Heh Heh.

Israel Matzav: 'Palestinian' terrorists fire over 60 rockets and mortars in last 24 hours

Sherri sez the IDF is butchering and killing innocent civilians by the thousands in an ongoing invasion of Gaza as we speak. She even has pictures to prove her charges. I can't find out anything from any media. It must be like the London blitz over there. All communications out. According to war corrrespondent Sherri.

 

[MJB12741]

She is so funny. I tell ya, IT'S A MASSACRE! Heh Heh!

Israel Matzav: 'Palestinian' terrorists fire over 60 rockets and mortars in last 24 hours

Sherri sez the IDF is butchering and killing innocent civilians by the thousands in an ongoing invasion of Gaza as we speak. She even has pictures to prove her charges. I can't find out anything from any media. It must be like the London blitz over there. All communications out. According to war corrrespondent Sherri.