Minimum wage hike bankrupts company.

[beagle9]

No because that would be socialist. Are you trying to offload your business budget deficits onto the taxpayer? Hehehe!

If a business runs in a deficit it doesn't last very long.

But hey all those people that lose their jobs because of a ridiculously high MW will be supported by your taxes so you might as well pay more for that

Our taxes are subsidizing their low wages right now

The more people you want to support, the more it's going to cost. Hiding the cost by forcing employers to pay artificially inflated wages is a false hope.

Right now they are profiting off of artificially low wages

No they are payng wages that reflect the skill level and the contribution employees bring to the business they work for.

In most cases they are, but in some cases there definitely is vulnerability issues where the temptation to exploit labor does arise, and is found on occasion. It best to punish the bad players quickly, and protect the good ones by doing so.

 

[Slyhunter]

I would rather be a Democrat making $15.00 an hour than a Republican making $7.25.

I would rather be eeking out a living on my own then being dependant on those who don't want to have anything to do with me. I am not good enough to do these work at home jobs. I keep getting fired when I hit the 4 month mark and they figure it out. I can't do the jobs I'm smart enough to do because I can't walk with my foot the way it is. I'd prefer to be dead, but my family needs the income I keep making off of these work at home jobs.

It's hard believing in Liberty and at the same time being a member of a family who couldn't support themselves without government handouts.

But most people wouldn't need handouts if they had jobs that paid a living wage.
But, people who own businesses should have the right to pay what they want to pay as long as there are people willing to take that pay to work.

I believe in Freedom, but I believe in doing whatever I have to do for my family to survive too.
So pay me and my family a living wage or I'll go rob a bank and party until they arrest me and take me to my new retirement home.

It\s hard for me to pick a side.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

https://www.foxnews.com/us/restauran...for-bankruptcy

Well, imagine that .

That's what will happen when sources demand that unskilled/uneducated employees get these kind of wages. These current politicians (4 freshman congresswomen) are demanding minimum wages be raised across the board & free health care along with other freebies for all.

It's both anecdotal and out of context.
In the same article it also cites bad decisions led to troubles - BUT - the big sign is - they are closing none of the affected restaurants. So little hard to swallow the reasoning.
Bankruptcy courts only work if you can show precisely that either the costs are no longer a part of doing business, or you have a specific plan to lower/eliminate those costs. When filing bankruptcy and keeping the entities open - you can't just take a bunch of bills and say "help I can't pay!".... doesn't work like that in business bankruptcies.

Yeah, I'm a bit put off by a congress person saying "they made some bad choices"..... Really? What choices? If the the $10 Million dollar increase in labor costs, wasn't the problem, then tell me what the problem was?

What were the bad decisions?

Here's my problem with your logic.

If the minimum wage was the problem, they would be closing the stores in the area affected by the minimum wage.

Not exactly. Just not entirely true.

Let's say you open a store, with the idea that you are going to make $400,000 profit year over year. Based on that idea, you have investors that expect a $250,000 payment on their investment. Maybe these are creditors, or bond holders, whatever.

Now say that due to minimum wage hikes, your profits drop to $200,000. Meanwhile other stores fall to even lower profits.

Those stores providing that $200,000 profit, might be the most profitable stores you own... yet you will still have to file bankruptcy, because you can't pay $250,000 to your creditors on $200,000 profit.

Do you understand now? The fact that they are not closing the stores in Portland does not necessarily mean anything.

And this is also why, you should never listen to the words of a life long politicians, on how business is run, or how bankruptcy works.

Jessyn Farrell has never run, or had, a private sector job in her entire life. That is exactly why she can say ignorant stuff like “They made some bad business decisions,” said former Washington State Rep. Jessyn Farrell of Civic Ventures. “There were a couple openings that didn’t go well, and I think what’s really telling is they aren’t closing restaurants in Seattle.”.

Here's a girl who has never done anything but live off tax payers her entire life, and has never run so much as a lemonade stand, and here she is trying to tell you what it means if they don't close a store in Seattle?

I wasn't offering an opinion.
Just stating a fact. When filing a commercial bankruptcy, the courts are not simply going to let you walk away from debt and go on with business as usual. Courts don't do that.
Let's say you borrowed $1 mil to expand the business into another revenue stream. But it didn't work. In order to get relief for that debt, you have to show the courts you are selling all of the assets attributed to that debt as well as all other costs related to it. (Say you hired 8 more people...those 8 people have to also go) You can still operate with the core business, but have to liquidate everything else.
With these restaurants, if they were losing money and built up XX dollars of debt - they can't simply go to the courts and say "help!!"... and the courts relieve the debt and everything goes on as before. The courts will absolutely not relieve your debts without you showing specifically how you are going to reorganize the business showing those losses will not occur again.

 

[Blues Man]

If a business runs in a deficit it doesn't last very long.

But hey all those people that lose their jobs because of a ridiculously high MW will be supported by your taxes so you might as well pay more for that

Our taxes are subsidizing their low wages right now

The more people you want to support, the more it's going to cost. Hiding the cost by forcing employers to pay artificially inflated wages is a false hope.

Right now they are profiting off of artificially low wages

No they are payng wages that reflect the skill level and the contribution employees bring to the business they work for.

In most cases they are, but in some cases there definitely is vulnerability issues where the temptation to exploit labor does arise, and is found on occasion. It best to punish the bad players quickly, and protect the good ones by doing so.

It is not possible to exploit employees who willingly agreed to work for an agreed upon wage.

People sell their labor to an employer. would you say a person selling any commodity exploits those who freely and willingly purchase that commodity ?

 

[hadit]

https://www.foxnews.com/us/restauran...for-bankruptcy

Well, imagine that .

That's what will happen when sources demand that unskilled/uneducated employees get these kind of wages. These current politicians (4 freshman congresswomen) are demanding minimum wages be raised across the board & free health care along with other freebies for all.

Yep,
Some jobs are only worth so much… Political correctness doesn’t know it’s ass from a hole in the ground when it comes to economics

How much do you pay an employee that makes you all of your money?

no employee makes all of the money for one company.

A business that employees people would not exist if no one provided the space, equipment and the materials needed to operate.

The business owner is the one who takes all the risk employees risk nothing and don't forget every single employee has agreed to sell his labor to his employer for an agreed upon price

Payroll tax is accounted for when hiring as it is an expense just like SUTA and FUTA taxes and workers comp

And if the MW didn't exist you would pay what ever you had to to keep your best employees.

You have never run a business have you?

But you can't deny that your business will have to deal with wage pressure don't you? You can't put your Mexican day laborers to make the sandwiches in your wawa shop. And even if you could, they too work for higher than the minimum wage. I agree that there is too much regularive pressure on wages and employment. But you are the slave of an omnipotent government. And there are too many zombies wanting a job from you that you don't have. You will go bankrupt and join the zombies. At least that doesn't threaten you with jail, like taxation does. So the minimum wage prank is still the lesser evil. Isn't it?

Anyone who hires illegals should be fined 5000 a day for every illegal worker

An artificially high MW is not good for any business that operates on a high volume low profit margin and since most jobs that pay MW are high volume low profit what do you think will happen to all those MW jobs?

Fines don't work. Case in point; The banking industry has been fined >$200B since 2009, Equifax has been fined $600M, and neither have shown any signs of cleaning up their act. Jail the bums, including tRump.

Change the law, then you can. Have fun storming the castle.

Existing law already includes jail time.

So why haven't you put Trump in jail yet? Falling down on the job there.

 

[hadit]

Non-answer. Again; How much do you pay an employee that makes you all of your money?

You pay him less than the amount he contributes to the bottom line. The premise of your question is false, because no employee makes a company all of its money.

Onepercenter has no real business knowledge otherwise he wouldn’t ask silly question. He claims he owns businesses that pay his employees more per hour, uses all superior products to make whatever he makes, and sells it for less than his competitors that pay their employees less and buy inferior products. He claims he pays his janitors over $50,000 a year and they are his lowest paid employees. His model would automatically put every other competitor out of business but he claims they are still there. Just the dumbest BS to come down the pike.

Yet, you can't answer the silly question.

Already answered. I never had one employee make all my money.

What about the collective of employees?

What about them? It takes the entire company to make all the money, and that includes management.

 

[Slyhunter]

Our taxes are subsidizing their low wages right now

The more people you want to support, the more it's going to cost. Hiding the cost by forcing employers to pay artificially inflated wages is a false hope.

Right now they are profiting off of artificially low wages

No they are payng wages that reflect the skill level and the contribution employees bring to the business they work for.

In most cases they are, but in some cases there definitely is vulnerability issues where the temptation to exploit labor does arise, and is found on occasion. It best to punish the bad players quickly, and protect the good ones by doing so.

It is not possible to exploit employees who willingly agreed to work for an agreed upon wage.

People sell their labor to an employer. would you say a person selling any commodity exploits those who freely and willingly purchase that commodity ?

unless they are in desperate need to survive or support their families.

 

[Blues Man]

The more people you want to support, the more it's going to cost. Hiding the cost by forcing employers to pay artificially inflated wages is a false hope.

Right now they are profiting off of artificially low wages

No they are payng wages that reflect the skill level and the contribution employees bring to the business they work for.

In most cases they are, but in some cases there definitely is vulnerability issues where the temptation to exploit labor does arise, and is found on occasion. It best to punish the bad players quickly, and protect the good ones by doing so.

It is not possible to exploit employees who willingly agreed to work for an agreed upon wage.

People sell their labor to an employer. would you say a person selling any commodity exploits those who freely and willingly purchase that commodity ?

unless they are in desperate need to survive or support their families.

They still agree and they can use that job as a stepping stone instead of a bed

All any MW job is is a way to gain experience and then use that experience for a promotion or to get a better paying job.

The idea that a MW job is anything else is ridiculous.

The fact that only 3% of the workforce actually earns the federal MW is proof that 97% of the workforce did what I just outlined

 

[anotherlife]

Our taxes are subsidizing their low wages right now

The more people you want to support, the more it's going to cost. Hiding the cost by forcing employers to pay artificially inflated wages is a false hope.

Right now they are profiting off of artificially low wages

No they are payng wages that reflect the skill level and the contribution employees bring to the business they work for.

In most cases they are, but in some cases there definitely is vulnerability issues where the temptation to exploit labor does arise, and is found on occasion. It best to punish the bad players quickly, and protect the good ones by doing so.

It is not possible to exploit employees who willingly agreed to work for an agreed upon wage.

People sell their labor to an employer. would you say a person selling any commodity exploits those who freely and willingly purchase that commodity ?

Yes, and that is why there are laws against cornering any commodity market. Except against cornering the labor commodity. Now why is that?

 

[Papageorgio]

You pay him less than the amount he contributes to the bottom line. The premise of your question is false, because no employee makes a company all of its money.

Onepercenter has no real business knowledge otherwise he wouldn’t ask silly question. He claims he owns businesses that pay his employees more per hour, uses all superior products to make whatever he makes, and sells it for less than his competitors that pay their employees less and buy inferior products. He claims he pays his janitors over $50,000 a year and they are his lowest paid employees. His model would automatically put every other competitor out of business but he claims they are still there. Just the dumbest BS to come down the pike.

Yet, you can't answer the silly question.

Already answered. I never had one employee make all my money.

What about the collective of employees?

What about them? It takes the entire company to make all the money, and that includes management.

This is why I know he is clueless in business, he takes into account no one other than the employee. He has an us vs. management approach which excludes every other expense.

 

[hadit]

Onepercenter has no real business knowledge otherwise he wouldn’t ask silly question. He claims he owns businesses that pay his employees more per hour, uses all superior products to make whatever he makes, and sells it for less than his competitors that pay their employees less and buy inferior products. He claims he pays his janitors over $50,000 a year and they are his lowest paid employees. His model would automatically put every other competitor out of business but he claims they are still there. Just the dumbest BS to come down the pike.

Yet, you can't answer the silly question.

Already answered. I never had one employee make all my money.

What about the collective of employees?

What about them? It takes the entire company to make all the money, and that includes management.

This is why I know he is clueless in business, he takes into account no one other than the employee. He has an us vs. management approach which excludes every other expense.

I have seen that, yes.

 

[Blues Man]

The more people you want to support, the more it's going to cost. Hiding the cost by forcing employers to pay artificially inflated wages is a false hope.

Right now they are profiting off of artificially low wages

No they are payng wages that reflect the skill level and the contribution employees bring to the business they work for.

In most cases they are, but in some cases there definitely is vulnerability issues where the temptation to exploit labor does arise, and is found on occasion. It best to punish the bad players quickly, and protect the good ones by doing so.

It is not possible to exploit employees who willingly agreed to work for an agreed upon wage.

People sell their labor to an employer. would you say a person selling any commodity exploits those who freely and willingly purchase that commodity ?

Yes, and that is why there are laws against cornering any commodity market. Except against cornering the labor commodity. Now why is that?

So you think ALL labor is part of the same market?

You think that the labor of a neurosurgeon is equal to that of a night watchman?

People SELL their labor to an employer of their own free will. The price they get depends on how much their labor is worth in the marketplace

 

[anotherlife]

Right now they are profiting off of artificially low wages

No they are payng wages that reflect the skill level and the contribution employees bring to the business they work for.

In most cases they are, but in some cases there definitely is vulnerability issues where the temptation to exploit labor does arise, and is found on occasion. It best to punish the bad players quickly, and protect the good ones by doing so.

It is not possible to exploit employees who willingly agreed to work for an agreed upon wage.

People sell their labor to an employer. would you say a person selling any commodity exploits those who freely and willingly purchase that commodity ?

Yes, and that is why there are laws against cornering any commodity market. Except against cornering the labor commodity. Now why is that?

So you think ALL labor is part of the same market?

You think that the labor of a neurosurgeon is equal to that of a night watchman?

People SELL their labor to an employer of their own free will. The price they get depends on how much their labor is worth in the marketplace

So you agree with me then. If a single employer corners the entire marketplace of a skill, then the value of that will be zero, including the skill of the neurosergon. Therefore the laws that I mentioned above for protecting commodity markets still should apply.

 

[Papageorgio]

Right now they are profiting off of artificially low wages

No they are payng wages that reflect the skill level and the contribution employees bring to the business they work for.

In most cases they are, but in some cases there definitely is vulnerability issues where the temptation to exploit labor does arise, and is found on occasion. It best to punish the bad players quickly, and protect the good ones by doing so.

It is not possible to exploit employees who willingly agreed to work for an agreed upon wage.

People sell their labor to an employer. would you say a person selling any commodity exploits those who freely and willingly purchase that commodity ?

Yes, and that is why there are laws against cornering any commodity market. Except against cornering the labor commodity. Now why is that?

So you think ALL labor is part of the same market?

You think that the labor of a neurosurgeon is equal to that of a night watchman?

People SELL their labor to an employer of their own free will. The price they get depends on how much their labor is worth in the marketplace

I can't understand why this principle is so hard to understand. The more of a demand and skill needed to do a task, the more money you will make. I wouldn't have a night watchman perform neurosurgery however a neurosurgeon could be a night watchman. The pool to get a night watchman's job is a lot larger than the pool of jobs for a neurosurgeon. If you are real good at a job, you will make more than an average person at a job. If you want to make more money, increase your skill level or open your own business.

 

[Blues Man]

No they are payng wages that reflect the skill level and the contribution employees bring to the business they work for.

In most cases they are, but in some cases there definitely is vulnerability issues where the temptation to exploit labor does arise, and is found on occasion. It best to punish the bad players quickly, and protect the good ones by doing so.

It is not possible to exploit employees who willingly agreed to work for an agreed upon wage.

People sell their labor to an employer. would you say a person selling any commodity exploits those who freely and willingly purchase that commodity ?

Yes, and that is why there are laws against cornering any commodity market. Except against cornering the labor commodity. Now why is that?

So you think ALL labor is part of the same market?

You think that the labor of a neurosurgeon is equal to that of a night watchman?

People SELL their labor to an employer of their own free will. The price they get depends on how much their labor is worth in the marketplace

So you agree with me then. If a single employer corners the entire marketplace of a skill, then the value of that will be zero, including the skill of the neurosergon. Therefore the laws that I mentioned above for protecting commodity markets still should apply.

There is no way to corner the market on any one single skill so no I don't agree with you.

Employers do not create the labor market they buy labor from it.

YOU create and control your own labor market by gaining a set of skills and selling those skills to an employer who is shopping for employees.

 

[Papageorgio]

No they are payng wages that reflect the skill level and the contribution employees bring to the business they work for.

In most cases they are, but in some cases there definitely is vulnerability issues where the temptation to exploit labor does arise, and is found on occasion. It best to punish the bad players quickly, and protect the good ones by doing so.

It is not possible to exploit employees who willingly agreed to work for an agreed upon wage.

People sell their labor to an employer. would you say a person selling any commodity exploits those who freely and willingly purchase that commodity ?

Yes, and that is why there are laws against cornering any commodity market. Except against cornering the labor commodity. Now why is that?

So you think ALL labor is part of the same market?

You think that the labor of a neurosurgeon is equal to that of a night watchman?

People SELL their labor to an employer of their own free will. The price they get depends on how much their labor is worth in the marketplace

So you agree with me then. If a single employer corners the entire marketplace of a skill, then the value of that will be zero, including the skill of the neurosergon. Therefore the laws that I mentioned above for protecting commodity markets still should apply.

No it wouldn't, to maintain the market, you still need skill to keep any potential competition at bay.

 

[anotherlife]

In most cases they are, but in some cases there definitely is vulnerability issues where the temptation to exploit labor does arise, and is found on occasion. It best to punish the bad players quickly, and protect the good ones by doing so.

It is not possible to exploit employees who willingly agreed to work for an agreed upon wage.

People sell their labor to an employer. would you say a person selling any commodity exploits those who freely and willingly purchase that commodity ?

Yes, and that is why there are laws against cornering any commodity market. Except against cornering the labor commodity. Now why is that?

So you think ALL labor is part of the same market?

You think that the labor of a neurosurgeon is equal to that of a night watchman?

People SELL their labor to an employer of their own free will. The price they get depends on how much their labor is worth in the marketplace

So you agree with me then. If a single employer corners the entire marketplace of a skill, then the value of that will be zero, including the skill of the neurosergon. Therefore the laws that I mentioned above for protecting commodity markets still should apply.

There is no way to corner the market on any one single skill so no I don't agree with you.

Employers do not create the labor market they buy labor from it.

YOU create and control your own labor market by gaining a set of skills and selling those skills to an employer who is shopping for employees.

People don't create labor markets, because they don't invest into learning skills that no employer wants. Conversely, if an industry consolidates to a single or very few employers in a skill set, then it corners that skill market. For example, this explains why there has been no more Mozarts born in the music industry, but endless low skill pop music reproduction instead.

 

[anotherlife]

In most cases they are, but in some cases there definitely is vulnerability issues where the temptation to exploit labor does arise, and is found on occasion. It best to punish the bad players quickly, and protect the good ones by doing so.

It is not possible to exploit employees who willingly agreed to work for an agreed upon wage.

People sell their labor to an employer. would you say a person selling any commodity exploits those who freely and willingly purchase that commodity ?

Yes, and that is why there are laws against cornering any commodity market. Except against cornering the labor commodity. Now why is that?

So you think ALL labor is part of the same market?

You think that the labor of a neurosurgeon is equal to that of a night watchman?

People SELL their labor to an employer of their own free will. The price they get depends on how much their labor is worth in the marketplace

So you agree with me then. If a single employer corners the entire marketplace of a skill, then the value of that will be zero, including the skill of the neurosergon. Therefore the laws that I mentioned above for protecting commodity markets still should apply.

No it wouldn't, to maintain the market, you still need skill to keep any potential competition at bay.

a cornered market is no longer a market, it is a pre-arranged deal wheel.

 

[Papageorgio]

It is not possible to exploit employees who willingly agreed to work for an agreed upon wage.

People sell their labor to an employer. would you say a person selling any commodity exploits those who freely and willingly purchase that commodity ?

Yes, and that is why there are laws against cornering any commodity market. Except against cornering the labor commodity. Now why is that?

So you think ALL labor is part of the same market?

You think that the labor of a neurosurgeon is equal to that of a night watchman?

People SELL their labor to an employer of their own free will. The price they get depends on how much their labor is worth in the marketplace

So you agree with me then. If a single employer corners the entire marketplace of a skill, then the value of that will be zero, including the skill of the neurosergon. Therefore the laws that I mentioned above for protecting commodity markets still should apply.

No it wouldn't, to maintain the market, you still need skill to keep any potential competition at bay.

a cornered market is no longer a market, it is a pre-arranged deal wheel.

Can you give me an example of a cornered market.

 

[DOTR]

https://www.foxnews.com/us/restauran...for-bankruptcy

Well, imagine that .

That's what will happen when sources demand that unskilled/uneducated employees get these kind of wages. These current politicians (4 freshman congresswomen) are demanding minimum wages be raised across the board & free health care along with other freebies for all.

Just think if child labor was legal and we could pay them a dollar an hour... think how many jobs could be created and how fast businesses would grow!

Maybe we could pay employees more than companies profit in a year!

That would workout great for America!

Fuck those greedy paycheck creators!

I know! It’s all good though, a few more years of robot development and then the biz owners won’t even need workers. They can sit on their lazy butts while R2D2 gets our corporate masters paid!!

And we all know business exists to give out jobs. Its why these lazy business owners started businesses!