No Indictment in Eric Garner Case

[reason10]

8216 Bad laws made bad cops Did NYC 8217 s cigarette tax lead to Eric Garner 8217 s death Twitchy​

As long as you understand that the cops did not write those laws. They were merely doing their job.

 

[Skull Pilot]

I have been reading along and, except for a couple of assholes, this thread seems about like the debate I would expect to hear from 25 Grand Jurors trying in good faith to effect justice.

If I was on the Grand Jury, and knowing just what I know from the video and the opinions I have read and heard, well....ELEVEN..... "I can't breathe" s" is way too many.

I would have voted for an indictment of Involuntary Manslaughter.

I was at work one day and a fellow worker started saying I can't breathe and no one was touching him he was just having a heart attack.

For all we know or for all the cops knew for that matter was he was just saying that. People say all kinds of things when they are getting arrested and it doesn't make them all true.

IMO if he really couldn't breathe he wouldn't have been able to say anything at all

_______________________________________________________

So, your position is that he was likely lying when he conveyed this to the Cops eleven times, and so the Cops were reasonable to ignore him. I wonder why he chose "I can't breahe" to lie to the Cops about.

If I gonna lie to the Cops, I am gonna say: "I Didn't do it." Or something like that.

"I can't breathe" ELEVEN times to four Cops on top of him ought to have conveyed some distress, even desperation, and the fact that it didn't is negligence so gross as to be culpable. It seems to me anyway.

Now if he said something ELEVEN times he could obviously take a breath each time no?

And I have never said the cops didn't contribute to the situation just that the so called choke hold did not kill him. Watch the video the cop never really had a choke hold locked in and his arm was on the guy's neck for less than 10 seconds

But my position is that Garner put everything in motion. If he would have just shut his trap and behaved himself he would not have dies that day

 

[Sarah G]

The case is whether excessive use of force was used just like the case of the 12 year old Black kid that was killed by cops here in Cleveland. Civil rights is being taken up again and it's about time. MLK died fighting peacefully for basic human rights and the protesters are taking their lead from that time.

It can't be dropped now or all will be lost. We need our police force but they must be accountable.

The cop that killed that Cleveland kid was on the verge of being let go because he is incompetent. Too bad he wasn't let go before that little boy was murdered by him.

 

[Boss]

The case is whether excessive use of force was used just like the case of the 12 year old Black kid that was killed by cops here in Cleveland. Civil rights is being taken up again and it's about time. MLK died fighting peacefully for basic human rights and the protesters are taking their lead from that time.

It can't be dropped now or all will be lost. We need our police force but they must be accountable.

The cop that killed that Cleveland kid was on the verge of being let go because he is incompetent. Too bad he wasn't let go before that little boy was murdered by him.

Well I don't know about the Cleveland case but this case is very different from Ferguson. I agree that we need an accountable police force, I have no problem with officers being held accountable. But in this case, the man died because he was in poor health and couldn't withstand the trauma of being forcibly apprehended after resisting arrest. I don't think the force was unusually excessive and in "normal" circumstances, would not have resulted in death.

What bothers me most is the insinuation that the cops killed this man for selling loosies. IF that were the case, IF they had walked up and shot the man in the head for selling loosies... then I'd fucking be in NYC protesting myself! THAT would be a travesty of justice! THAT would be excessive force! THAT would be a moral outrage! But THAT is not what happened here.

He was placed under arrest in accordance with the law, and he resisted. There was physical confrontation and he was taken to the ground. The trauma of this along with his health conditions resulted in his death, and it's sad... really sad that he died. I wish that he hadn't died and I'm positive the officers wish he hadn't died. No one is arguing that he deserved to die. It was no one's intention for him to die. He wasn't "executed in the streets" as some have claimed... He certainly wasn't "executed because he was black!"

 

[Sarah G]

The case is whether excessive use of force was used just like the case of the 12 year old Black kid that was killed by cops here in Cleveland. Civil rights is being taken up again and it's about time. MLK died fighting peacefully for basic human rights and the protesters are taking their lead from that time.

It can't be dropped now or all will be lost. We need our police force but they must be accountable.

The cop that killed that Cleveland kid was on the verge of being let go because he is incompetent. Too bad he wasn't let go before that little boy was murdered by him.

Well I don't know about the Cleveland case but this case is very different from Ferguson. I agree that we need an accountable police force, I have no problem with officers being held accountable. But in this case, the man died because he was in poor health and couldn't withstand the trauma of being forcibly apprehended after resisting arrest. I don't think the force was unusually excessive and in "normal" circumstances, would not have resulted in death.

What bothers me most is the insinuation that the cops killed this man for selling loosies. IF that were the case, IF they had walked up and shot the man in the head for selling loosies... then I'd fucking be in NYC protesting myself! THAT would be a travesty of justice! THAT would be excessive force! THAT would be a moral outrage! But THAT is not what happened here.

He was placed under arrest in accordance with the law, and he resisted. There was physical confrontation and he was taken to the ground. The trauma of this along with his health conditions resulted in his death, and it's sad... really sad that he died. I wish that he hadn't died and I'm positive the officers wish he hadn't died. No one is arguing that he deserved to die. It was no one's intention for him to die. He wasn't "executed in the streets" as some have claimed... He certainly wasn't "executed because he was black!"

You should go protest then. They might as well have shot him in the head. They didn't have to subdue him even, they could have said get in the car, you're going downtown, we saw you selling the loosies. He dropped to the ground himself when they did the choke hold. He had given up by then, he was saying he couldn't breathe by then, he had no intention of harming any officer. They murdered him for a lame little crime that wouldn't have even gotten him any time at all.

Fuck all of you who are making excuses for the ignorant cops that murdered a guy who was standing on the street. No really fuck you.

 

[georgephillip]

You should go protest then. They might as well have shot him in the head. They didn't have to subdue him even, they could have said get in the car, you're going downtown, we saw you selling the loosies.

Does anyone know if Garner was in possession of loosies at the time of his arrest? DemocracyNow! presented a theory Garner was not at his usual sales location when this incident took place, and Garner had just broken up a fight between two citizens; that fight was the call officers responded to, and when they spotted Garner, they jumped to all the wrong conclusions.

 

[RKMBrown]

BOSS SAID:

“Okay, for all of you libtards who are defending Eric Garner...”

The ignorance exhibited by you and most others on the right is remarkable, not surprising, but remarkable nonetheless.

No one is 'defending' Garner, there's nothing to 'defend.'

In their attempt to detain Garner, the police used unauthorized, unwarranted excessive force that resulted in his wrongful death.

It is that unauthorized, unwarranted excessive force which is at issue, not Garner's words or actions.

This is not a left/right thing this is authoritarian vs liberty, force vs human compassion...

 

[RKMBrown]

The split second that Garner refused to submit to arrest or handcuffing, his status 'graduated' from illegal sales of 'loosies', to Resisting Arrest.

Resisting Arrest opens-up a whole different Can of Whoop-Ass, and removes a whole bunch-a barriers to the use of force.

The dumb lard-ass should not have resisted arrest.

This is doubly-true for someone who knew his health was so poor that he could not withstand a few seconds of wrestling with a handful of cops.

I feel sorry for the guy, and his family, but, the truth of the matter is - both legally and ethically - he brought this down upon his own head.

Perhaps, in the next life, he'll know better, and submit to arrest.

That's right, say no to the cops and you're a dead man walking.

 

[RKMBrown]

You should go protest then. They might as well have shot him in the head. They didn't have to subdue him even, they could have said get in the car, you're going downtown, we saw you selling the loosies.

Does anyone know if Garner was in possession of loosies at the time of his arrest? DemocracyNow! presented a theory Garner was not at his usual sales location when this incident took place, and Garner had just broken up a fight between two citizens; that fight was the call officers responded to, and when they spotted Garner, they jumped to all the wrong conclusions.

We was not under arrest. the loosies thing is trumped up bullshit
He broke up a fight and the cops like to harass this guy.

 

[georgephillip]

We was not under arrest. the loosies thing is trumped up bullshit
He broke up a fight and the cops like to harass this guy.

According to the version being reported at DemocracyNow, Garner normally sold loosies near the Staten Island ferry terminal; it's my understanding his arrest took place at an entirely different location. It should be a matter of public record whether or not he had loosies in his possession at the time of his takedown, no?

 

[dannyboys]

1. The chokehold is not illegal.
2. The man died 4 hours later, likely caused by his poor health and not from choking.

It was pretty obvious when he said that he couldn't breathe repeatedly.

NYPD chokehold arrest of Eric Garner ruled homicide by Medical Examiner - CBS News

Garner's death was caused by compression of neck and chest, and his prone positioning during physical restraint by police, the New York City Medical Examiner's office announced Friday. Asthma, heart disease and obesity were listed as contributing factors.

No one can talk when they can't breath. The career criminal told the cops he "couldn't breath" 12 times.

 

[dannyboys]

Yeah they are. You either choke right then and there, or you don't. Once the choke hold is released you begin breathing again. Dying 4 hours later is caused by other things. Perhaps precipitated by the choke hold, but you don't choke to death 4 hours after you are choked. It's physically impossible.

It put him into a coma.

He died b/c he was morbidly obese. He had an existing heart problem. He had asma from smoking for 35 years.
He died of heart failure. The next time he tried to jack-off he would have likely died from over exertion.
The doctors can keep people alive who are in a coma for years. Wise up.

 

[dannyboys]

A gun shot and a choke...two VERY different things.

If they end in and contribute to a homicide, they really are not.

Yeah they are. You either choke right then and there, or you don't. Once the choke hold is released you begin breathing again. Dying 4 hours later is caused by other things. Perhaps precipitated by the choke hold, but you don't choke to death 4 hours after you are choked. It's physically impossible.

The act performed does not have to be the one that directly caused the death, it just has to contribute. His heart attack was caused by a combination of weight, diet, and yes, the choke hold and stress of the arrest.

Of course, but you said they are the same, they are not.

Trauma is trauma, a bullet can lead to system failure, its just that bleeding out is a more common occurrence.

The arrest contributed to his death. The debate can be about the death being an indictable homicide, but it was a homicide.

One stupid c*** on MSNBC claimed that if only the cop hadn't gone to work that day "none of this would have happened".
Un fucking believable.

 

[RKMBrown]

1. The chokehold is not illegal.
2. The man died 4 hours later, likely caused by his poor health and not from choking.

It was pretty obvious when he said that he couldn't breathe repeatedly.

NYPD chokehold arrest of Eric Garner ruled homicide by Medical Examiner - CBS News

Garner's death was caused by compression of neck and chest, and his prone positioning during physical restraint by police, the New York City Medical Examiner's office announced Friday. Asthma, heart disease and obesity were listed as contributing factors.

No one can talk when they can't breath. The career criminal told the cops he "couldn't breath" 12 times.

You're an asshole.

 

[dannyboys]

People with heart conditions can have a heart attack just from getting really upset. The typical chokehold doesn't kill anyone. I've seen people crying and yelling for police to let go of their spouses and not because they are being hurt, but because they don't want them arrested.

It's sad that the guy died, but the cop was merely subduing a suspect that fought. How was he supposed to know the guy's heart was a ticking time bomb? When you resist, cops will do what they need to take you down.

Hindsight is always 20/20, but you have to put yourself in the cop's place at the time. Taking down a suspect who is fighting you isn't something that is done gently. Little hard when you are literally fighting with the person to get them to stop and sit still. Had the guy cooperated, it might have been different, but then maybe not. If he had not encountered police and gone home, there is a good chance he was on the verge of a heart attack already.

We weren't privy to all the evidence presented to the grand jury, but they would have had to see proof that the cop knowingly and willfully harmed the guy. I don't see how the cop could have known about the guy's condition. It's possible the guy didn't know how bad off his heart was.

If a person is choked to death, they die on the spot. An autopsy would have shown the cause of death. Without knowing all the details, it's too hard to judge. I would guess the grand jury had information not released to the public yet.

I know police use the chokehold all the time and this is rare, so there must have been other things at play here, like the guy's general health. I just can't buy that a cop murdered someone in front of witnesses. I really can't believe that.

Chokeholds are against NYPD policy. So at the very least this asshole cop should be fired and stripped of his pension.

Sorry, but I haven't been following this case and there is always a lot of bullshit reported so who knows what to believe anymore?

The guy was talking during the chokehold, so wasn't actually being strangled. Not everyone's heart gives out that easily and the man's health had to play a part.

After the Ferguson bullshit, I am skeptical and take bias witness testimony with a grain of salt. I haven't read much on the official investigation.

So you are saying that his health killed him even though he was clearly alive when they attempted to detain him?

Epic fail huh? Cop's like I got this!! Jumps on king kong to show off his mma choke hold technique... king kong doesn't fight.. just falls to the ground and dies two hrs later. Whooops.

I think it was just one hour later he was pronounced dead. He appeared to have shut down while on the sidewalk.

Fucking liar! He died fours hours later from massive heart failure.
BTW. The GJ heard Garner's doctor and reviewed all of Garner's medical records which showed Garner's heart was going to explode any day. Garner's heart would have exploded the next time he tried to reach his fat ass to wipe it from the exertion.
There are a few million negroes just like Garner walking around with hearts ready to explode. Does that mean every time a cop arrests one of them the cop is responsible for the negro's death from heart failure?

 

[Boss]

The case is whether excessive use of force was used just like the case of the 12 year old Black kid that was killed by cops here in Cleveland. Civil rights is being taken up again and it's about time. MLK died fighting peacefully for basic human rights and the protesters are taking their lead from that time.

It can't be dropped now or all will be lost. We need our police force but they must be accountable.

The cop that killed that Cleveland kid was on the verge of being let go because he is incompetent. Too bad he wasn't let go before that little boy was murdered by him.

Well I don't know about the Cleveland case but this case is very different from Ferguson. I agree that we need an accountable police force, I have no problem with officers being held accountable. But in this case, the man died because he was in poor health and couldn't withstand the trauma of being forcibly apprehended after resisting arrest. I don't think the force was unusually excessive and in "normal" circumstances, would not have resulted in death.

What bothers me most is the insinuation that the cops killed this man for selling loosies. IF that were the case, IF they had walked up and shot the man in the head for selling loosies... then I'd fucking be in NYC protesting myself! THAT would be a travesty of justice! THAT would be excessive force! THAT would be a moral outrage! But THAT is not what happened here.

He was placed under arrest in accordance with the law, and he resisted. There was physical confrontation and he was taken to the ground. The trauma of this along with his health conditions resulted in his death, and it's sad... really sad that he died. I wish that he hadn't died and I'm positive the officers wish he hadn't died. No one is arguing that he deserved to die. It was no one's intention for him to die. He wasn't "executed in the streets" as some have claimed... He certainly wasn't "executed because he was black!"

You should go protest then. They might as well have shot him in the head. They didn't have to subdue him even, they could have said get in the car, you're going downtown, we saw you selling the loosies. He dropped to the ground himself when they did the choke hold. He had given up by then, he was saying he couldn't breathe by then, he had no intention of harming any officer. They murdered him for a lame little crime that wouldn't have even gotten him any time at all.

Fuck all of you who are making excuses for the ignorant cops that murdered a guy who was standing on the street. No really fuck you.

Try to keep from being emotional. The cops did not kill the man, he died as a result of his poor health and the trauma caused by his resisting arrest and being subdued. If they had said "get in the car" he would have refused, he did not want to be arrested. He was not going to be arrested voluntarily under any circumstance... so what should they have done? What should cops do if someone doesn't want to be arrested?

I've watched the video, I get it... this is a bizarre case where the man happened to die because he resisted arrest and was in poor health. It looks bad on the video, it seems they were a little rough, the charge doesn't seem to be that big of a deal, but the guy resisted arrest. It keeps coming back to that one detail. You say he had given up... well it was too late to do that, he had already chosen to resist. You don't know what his intentions were or what he may have done if they had let go of him. What if they had let him up and he grabbed one of the officers guns and killed 4 or 5 cops? Wouldn't the question then be... well why did they let him up?

Again... I honestly feel sorry for the guy and his family, this did not need to happen and it wasn't the intention of the officers for this to happen. Still, I am not getting any answer as to what exactly are the cops supposed to do with someone who refuses to be arrested? The cops have a duty to uphold the law... even stupid liberal laws they don't like. If the perp resists arrest, they have to use physical force to make the arrest, there is no other option. They don't have crystal balls, they don't know if someone is in such poor health they can't withstand physical restraint.

Furthermore, his race has not a damn thing to do with anything here. I would say the same thing if he were white and the officers were black. In fact, one of the sergeants in charge was a black woman, which the media is conveniently avoiding in the reporting. He wasn't being picked on or profiled, singled out because he was a black man. Race had nothing to do with this.

 

[Ravi]

Chokeholds are against NYPD policy. So at the very least this asshole cop should be fired and stripped of his pension.

Sorry, but I haven't been following this case and there is always a lot of bullshit reported so who knows what to believe anymore?

The guy was talking during the chokehold, so wasn't actually being strangled. Not everyone's heart gives out that easily and the man's health had to play a part.

After the Ferguson bullshit, I am skeptical and take bias witness testimony with a grain of salt. I haven't read much on the official investigation.

So you are saying that his health killed him even though he was clearly alive when they attempted to detain him?

Epic fail huh? Cop's like I got this!! Jumps on king kong to show off his mma choke hold technique... king kong doesn't fight.. just falls to the ground and dies two hrs later. Whooops.

I think it was just one hour later he was pronounced dead. He appeared to have shut down while on the sidewalk.

Fucking liar! He died fours hours later from massive heart failure.
BTW. The GJ heard Garner's doctor and reviewed all of Garner's medical records which showed Garner's heart was going to explode any day. Garner's heart would have exploded the next time he tried to reach his fat ass to wipe it from the exertion.
There are a few million negroes just like Garner walking around with hearts ready to explode. Does that mean every time a cop arrests one of them the cop is responsible for the negro's death from heart failure?

You're an asshole.

 

[dannyboys]

The video shows him dead at the scene. And he laid there, dead for quite a long while.

People that say he walked off are wrong because they cart off his lifeless body to an ambulance at 6:10 in the video.

Liar. He body was still alive hours hours later until his heart exploded. Too many of 'Big Gulps' and two packs a day will do that.

 

[RKMBrown]

Chokeholds are against NYPD policy. So at the very least this asshole cop should be fired and stripped of his pension.

Sorry, but I haven't been following this case and there is always a lot of bullshit reported so who knows what to believe anymore?

The guy was talking during the chokehold, so wasn't actually being strangled. Not everyone's heart gives out that easily and the man's health had to play a part.

After the Ferguson bullshit, I am skeptical and take bias witness testimony with a grain of salt. I haven't read much on the official investigation.

So you are saying that his health killed him even though he was clearly alive when they attempted to detain him?

Epic fail huh? Cop's like I got this!! Jumps on king kong to show off his mma choke hold technique... king kong doesn't fight.. just falls to the ground and dies two hrs later. Whooops.

I think it was just one hour later he was pronounced dead. He appeared to have shut down while on the sidewalk.

Fucking liar! He died fours hours later from massive heart failure.
BTW. The GJ heard Garner's doctor and reviewed all of Garner's medical records which showed Garner's heart was going to explode any day. Garner's heart would have exploded the next time he tried to reach his fat ass to wipe it from the exertion.
There are a few million negroes just like Garner walking around with hearts ready to explode. Does that mean every time a cop arrests one of them the cop is responsible for the negro's death from heart failure?

Lying POS

 

[Asclepias]

1. The chokehold is not illegal.
2. The man died 4 hours later, likely caused by his poor health and not from choking.

It was pretty obvious when he said that he couldn't breathe repeatedly.

NYPD chokehold arrest of Eric Garner ruled homicide by Medical Examiner - CBS News

Garner's death was caused by compression of neck and chest, and his prone positioning during physical restraint by police, the New York City Medical Examiner's office announced Friday. Asthma, heart disease and obesity were listed as contributing factors.

No one can talk when they can't breath. The career criminal told the cops he "couldn't breath" 12 times.

Youre a fetid asshole.