Official 2010 Baseball Thread

[Paulie]

so that truth prevails!

If the truth is that the ball did in fact swerve around the bag foul, and replay showed this, then you're still not explaining why the rule needs to change.

The ball is judged where it was at the bag. It's so damn simple, dude!

Jeez. I get it. I've gotten it for 25 years!

I know what the rule IS. I'm stating that it should change. Baseball has changed rules many times before. In this case the ball SHOULD be fair if it bounces fair and lands fair. Not too difficult to understand WHY I think so.

Because it can bounce fair and foul a million times until it passes the bag.

At some point you have to cut it off and make the call, and the bag happens to be where the call is made.

There's been many rule changes or amendments that I understood and agreed with, but yours I do not.

I like that intangibles like acts of god can affect the outcome of the game. If we just make tiny little rules to remedy all those situations it ruins it.

Let the ball do what it will, and judge based on the rule that exists. It's simple. Sometimes a bounce goes your way, sometimes it doesn't. That's just sports IN GENERAL.

 

[Paulie]

Alright dude, I'd say you were vindicated now after last night's terrible call against the Phils in the 8th.

Howard goes to make a tag on Michael Bourn running down the first base line and Bourn clearly runs way out of the base path to avoid it, and is called safe. Never in my life have I seen a runner that far into foul territory on the base line and not be called out:

Now THIS is a rule that needs to be re-done, because it's too vague:

7.08

Any runner is out when --

(a) (1) He runs more than three feet away from his baseline to avoid being tagged unless his action is to avoid interference with a fielder fielding a batted ball. A runner’s baseline is established when the tag attempt occurs and is a straight line from the runner to the base he is attempting to reach safely;

But I bet since the Phils lost because of it, you think THIS rule is just fine the way it is, right?

 

[Truthspeaker]

If the truth is that the ball did in fact swerve around the bag foul, and replay showed this, then you're still not explaining why the rule needs to change.

The ball is judged where it was at the bag. It's so damn simple, dude!

Jeez. I get it. I've gotten it for 25 years!

I know what the rule IS. I'm stating that it should change. Baseball has changed rules many times before. In this case the ball SHOULD be fair if it bounces fair and lands fair. Not too difficult to understand WHY I think so.

Because it can bounce fair and foul a million times until it passes the bag.

At some point you have to cut it off and make the call, and the bag happens to be where the call is made.

There's been many rule changes or amendments that I understood and agreed with, but yours I do not.

I like that intangibles like acts of god can affect the outcome of the game. If we just make tiny little rules to remedy all those situations it ruins it.

Let the ball do what it will, and judge based on the rule that exists. It's simple. Sometimes a bounce goes your way, sometimes it doesn't. That's just sports IN GENERAL.

Only in this case the ball never bounced foul. All it ever did was bounce in fair territory.

 

[Truthspeaker]

Alright dude, I'd say you were vindicated now after last night's terrible call against the Phils in the 8th.

Howard goes to make a tag on Michael Bourn running down the first base line and Bourn clearly runs way out of the base path to avoid it, and is called safe. Never in my life have I seen a runner that far into foul territory on the base line and not be called out:

Now THIS is a rule that needs to be re-done, because it's too vague:

7.08

Any runner is out when --

(a) (1) He runs more than three feet away from his baseline to avoid being tagged unless his action is to avoid interference with a fielder fielding a batted ball. A runner’s baseline is established when the tag attempt occurs and is a straight line from the runner to the base he is attempting to reach safely;

But I bet since the Phils lost because of it, you think THIS rule is just fine the way it is, right?

You see I think he should have been called out. It was a blown call but we're not even yet. You still need to endure one more of those. But I agree with you on this one. I don't know how umpires miss something as obvious as this. It's freakin easy to see. The guy's on the grass. Last time I checked, the grass is not the basepath. If you're that blind, you're first clue that the guy is out is that the 6'5" long first baseman is IN the basepath diving for the runner and misses.

 

[Missourian]

Cards are going to need to rally in the ninth if their going to overcome their 3 run deficit and defeat the Nationals.

 

[Truthspeaker]

Cards are going to need to rally in the ninth if their going to overcome their 3 run deficit and defeat the Nationals.

Cards, Giants and Phillies all having tough times with weak teams lately.

 

[Truthspeaker]

Cards are going to need to rally in the ninth if their going to overcome their 3 run deficit and defeat the Nationals.

Cards, Giants and Phillies all having tough times with weak teams lately.

Padres finally sliding, Phillies looking good, Giants now just 3 back. If this is the lincecum we see the rest of the year, The Padres will be fighting the Phillies for the Wild Card.

Cardinals phone in season. wtf

 

[Truthspeaker]

Padres slide increases to 8 games. Giants just 3 back.

 

[Paulie]

We're not even CONTEMPLATING the wild card my man.

 

[Truthspeaker]

We're not even CONTEMPLATING the wild card my man.

Of course, because you don't want to accept the FACT that the Braves are a better team.

 

[Paulie]

We're not even CONTEMPLATING the wild card my man.

Of course, because you don't want to accept the FACT that the Braves are a better team.

This makes no sense.

Hudson lowe jurrjens doesn't match up against Halladay oswalt hamels, first of all. In a playoff series it would take a ton of luck for them to overcome that.

Then u got no chipper, who normally kills us. Lee not better than howard. A rookie in the outfield. Prado is good but hes no utley. Gonzalez is good but he's no rollins.

The only edge I'd give them is mccann, even tho ruiz is mr clutch this year and having a career year. But ruiz has been to the playoffs 3 times with 2 WS including a ring. He knows how to win.

You're out of your mind. Talk to me after these upcoming meetings between the 2 of us. That will help get things figured out.

 

[Truthspeaker]

We're not even CONTEMPLATING the wild card my man.

Of course, because you don't want to accept the FACT that the Braves are a better team.

This makes no sense.

Hudson lowe jurrjens doesn't match up against Halladay oswalt hamels, first of all. In a playoff series it would take a ton of luck for them to overcome that.

Then u got no chipper, who normally kills us. Lee not better than howard. A rookie in the outfield. Prado is good but hes no utley. Gonzalez is good but he's no rollins.

The only edge I'd give them is mccann, even tho ruiz is mr clutch this year and having a career year. But ruiz has been to the playoffs 3 times with 2 WS including a ring. He knows how to win.

You're out of your mind. Talk to me after these upcoming meetings between the 2 of us. That will help get things figured out.

I knew that would get you fired up.

Comparisons:
C-McCann vs Ruiz= no comparison. We won't waste time there= +1 Braves
1b-Derek Lee .250, 16hr, 63rbi vs Ryan Howard.277,24,85= even
2b-Martin Prado-.317, 15,60, vs Chase what hav u done for me LUtley-.270,11,43=+1 Braves
SS-Omar Infante-.346,7,39 and hot as blazes vs. Jimmy not the same Rollins-.244,7,35=+2 Braves
3b-Troy Glaus-.240,16,70 vs Placido Polanco-.306,6,43=Glaus more productive so +3Braves
OF-Erick Hinske-.254,10,46 vs Shane Victorino-2.52,16,59,24sb's= +2 Braves
OF-Melkey Cabrera-.259,4,38 vs Jayson Werth-.293,18,63=+1 Braves
OF-Jason Heyward-.284,16,65 vs Raul Ibanez-.258,12,64=+2 Braves
Better lineup? Advantage Braves.

Better Staff?
Tim Hudson(15-5), 2.24ERA vs Roy Halladay(16-10)2.27ERA=+3 Braves
Tommy Hanson(9-10) 3.60 vs Roy Oswalt (10-13) 3.01= +2 Braves
Derek Lowe(11-12) 4.53 vs Cole Hamels (8-10) 3.31= +1 Braves
Kris Medlen(6-2)3.68 vs Kyle Kendrick (9-7)4.72= +2 Braves
Jair Jurrgens(6-4)4.38 vs Joe Blanton(6-6) 5.15=+3 Braves

While numbers can change, numbers don't lie and the most important number is wins in which the Phillies are trailing the Braves.

Don't step in to my statistical world son with your hometown emotions.
I just proved from an objective standpoint that the Braves are better than the Phillies. I'm not a fan of either.

 

[Oddball]

Featured | DET@MIN: Valencia wins it with a walk-off single - Video | twinsbaseball.com: Multimedia

 

[Paulie]

Of course, because you don't want to accept the FACT that the Braves are a better team.

This makes no sense.

Hudson lowe jurrjens doesn't match up against Halladay oswalt hamels, first of all. In a playoff series it would take a ton of luck for them to overcome that.

Then u got no chipper, who normally kills us. Lee not better than howard. A rookie in the outfield. Prado is good but hes no utley. Gonzalez is good but he's no rollins.

The only edge I'd give them is mccann, even tho ruiz is mr clutch this year and having a career year. But ruiz has been to the playoffs 3 times with 2 WS including a ring. He knows how to win.

You're out of your mind. Talk to me after these upcoming meetings between the 2 of us. That will help get things figured out.

I knew that would get you fired up.

Comparisons:
C-McCann vs Ruiz= no comparison. We won't waste time there= +1 Braves
1b-Derek Lee .250, 16hr, 63rbi vs Ryan Howard.277,24,85= even
2b-Martin Prado-.317, 15,60, vs Chase what hav u done for me LUtley-.270,11,43=+1 Braves
SS-Omar Infante-.346,7,39 and hot as blazes vs. Jimmy not the same Rollins-.244,7,35=+2 Braves
3b-Troy Glaus-.240,16,70 vs Placido Polanco-.306,6,43=Glaus more productive so +3Braves
OF-Erick Hinske-.254,10,46 vs Shane Victorino-2.52,16,59,24sb's= +2 Braves
OF-Melkey Cabrera-.259,4,38 vs Jayson Werth-.293,18,63=+1 Braves
OF-Jason Heyward-.284,16,65 vs Raul Ibanez-.258,12,64=+2 Braves
Better lineup? Advantage Braves.

Better Staff?
Tim Hudson(15-5), 2.24ERA vs Roy Halladay(16-10)2.27ERA=+3 Braves
Tommy Hanson(9-10) 3.60 vs Roy Oswalt (10-13) 3.01= +2 Braves
Derek Lowe(11-12) 4.53 vs Cole Hamels (8-10) 3.31= +1 Braves
Kris Medlen(6-2)3.68 vs Kyle Kendrick (9-7)4.72= +2 Braves
Jair Jurrgens(6-4)4.38 vs Joe Blanton(6-6) 5.15=+3 Braves

While numbers can change, numbers don't lie and the most important number is wins in which the Phillies are trailing the Braves.

Don't step in to my statistical world son with your hometown emotions.
I just proved from an objective standpoint that the Braves are better than the Phillies. I'm not a fan of either.

My god dude, there's so much wrong with all of that

How you gave the edge to the braves on a lot of them, first of all.

Oswalt and Hamels both now have sub-3 ERA's and losing records because they lead the league in worst run support. Wins and losses are not really all that important in determining a pitcher's value. If your defense is committing errors and your offense isn't scoring runs, it doesn't matter how well you pitch, you will lose. You know that VERY WELL being a Giants fan.

Oswalt's been a BEAST since coming to Philly. He has a sub-2 ERA and is something like 5 or 6 and 1. You can't count the guy's record after being in Houston most of the year. Giving Hanson the edge on that is just STUPID.

And Derek Lowe gets the edge on Hamels?

4.53 era vs. Hamels sub-3 ERA? And Lowe gets the edge? Are you fucking kidding me?

And you're probably the only non-braves fan that thinks Hudson gets the edge over Halladay. That isn't even worth debating.

I don't know how you came up with so many edges to the Braves on that offensive comparison, either. Glaus more productive than Polanco? You're high on crack my man. Polanco has been a fucking STUD for us this year at 3rd. He puts the ball in play and consistently hits for .300 every season. Glaus is having a mediocre season, for him. I'll give you EVEN on that comparison, only because he's driven in more runs.

I'll give you Infante, even though Rollins provides the intangible for us that we seriously lack without him - the spark plug and the leadership. We win way more ball games with him than without him, regardless of how sexy his numbers are.

And I don't even know what the fuck you're thinking on these:

OF-Erick Hinske-.254,10,46 vs Shane Victorino-2.52,16,59,24sb's= +2 Braves
OF-Melkey Cabrera-.259,4,38 vs Jayson Werth-.293,18,63=+1 Braves

Vic has 6 more HR and almost 15 more RBI, plus the SB's and the gold glove. How the fuck does the edge go to ATL???

And how the FUCK does Cabrera get the edge over Werth? Werth has 5 times the HR and twice the RBI, and 40 more points in AVG. Explain how the braves get the edge there

1b-Derek Lee .250, 16hr, 63rbi vs Ryan Howard.277,24,85= even

Even? Howards numbers are all better than Lee's, so how is it even?

I've always enjoyed talking baseball with you on here, but I'm starting to wonder about you now...

 

[Oddball]

Thome crushes two more, to take sole possession of #9 on the all-time HR list.

http://minnesota.twins.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?content_id=11722343&topic_id=8877600&c_id=min

Those old school ivory jerseys are friggin' magical.

 

[Truthspeaker]

My god dude, there's so much wrong with all of that

AU CONTRAIRE. I'd say it's right on the money.

How you gave the edge to the braves on a lot of them, first of all.

My dear, poor Pauli Phanatic. I did not give the Braves the advantage in every category. I was counting points for one team or the next. You missed my whole point. When I say plus one it was only referring to that position comparison. At the end of the day the comparison showed that the Braves were 3 total points better if you were comparing position by position. I'll redo it for you to clear up.

Oswalt and Hamels both now have sub-3 ERA's and losing records because they lead the league in worst run support.

Poor run support is a reason why the Phillies are not better than the Braves. The Braves hitters support their pitchers slightly better than the Phillies.

Wins and losses are not really all that important in determining a pitcher's value. If your defense is committing errors and your offense isn't scoring runs, it doesn't matter how well you pitch, you will lose. You know that VERY WELL being a Giants fan.

Truly stated. I know but I'm not going to hash all the stats. I'm also going on this years stats alone. All reputations thrown out the window.

Oswalt's been a BEAST since coming to Philly. He has a sub-2 ERA and is something like 5 or 6 and 1. You can't count the guy's record after being in Houston most of the year. Giving Hanson the edge on that is just STUPID.

As per my first explanation I did give Oswalt the edge. He's clearly better in every way. Especially considering the bulk of his stats coming from Houston.

And Derek Lowe gets the edge on Hamels?

No Hamels got the edge.

4.53 era vs. Hamels sub-3 ERA? And Lowe gets the edge? Are you fucking kidding me?

No Hamels got the edge. He's a better pitcher.

And you're probably the only non-braves fan that thinks Hudson gets the edge over Halladay. That isn't even worth debating.

Now this is worth debating. And I'm not saying that in the end Hudson will go down as a greater historical pitcher than Halladay. Halladay is and will go down a the superior, but not this year. I gave the edge to Hudson because he is having a slightly better season. The numbers don't lie. Hudson could end up with the Cy Young. Check every one of his stats. He's having a ridiculous year. Even more ridiculous than Halladay. That's why I gave him the nod. Below in red are the edges which the pitcher has the advantage. You'll see the stats are very similar, nearly identical but in the most critical stats, Hudson has the slight edge, ERA, Batting average against, Wins. Where Halladay, a favorite if we're talking last year, is the leader in the sexier stats like strikeouts and complete games.
1. Tim Hudson
1. T Hudson
ATL 15W 6L 2.30era 28g 28gs 1cg 1sho 191.2ip 152h 51r 49er 12hr 6hbp 59bb 113k 1.10whip .222baa 5.39k/9


2. R Halladay
PHI 17W 10L 2.36ERA 29G 29GS 8CG 3sho 221.0ip 204h 64r 58er 21hr 5hbp 28bb 196K 1.05whip .245oba 7.98k/9

I don't know how you came up with so many edges to the Braves on that offensive comparison, either.

I'm sure you get me now.

Glaus more productive than Polanco? You're high on crack my man. Polanco has been a fucking STUD for us this year at 3rd. He puts the ball in play and consistently hits for .300 every season. Glaus is having a mediocre season, for him. I'll give you EVEN on that comparison, only because he's driven in more runs.

At the end of the day the measure of a more productive hitter is always runs scored or rbi. Glaus leads Polanco in both. Runs and hits that drive in runs are ultimately more important than any other stat. All other states are mere indicators but not absolute. Runs are absolute. Runs cannot be denied and also show the clutch ability of a player.


I'll give you Infante, even though Rollins provides the intangible for us that we seriously lack without him - the spark plug and the leadership. We win way more ball games with him than without him, regardless of how sexy his numbers are.

And I don't even know what the fuck you're thinking on these:

OF-Erick Hinske-.254,10,46 vs Shane Victorino-2.52,16,59,24sb's= +2 Braves
OF-Melkey Cabrera-.259,4,38 vs Jayson Werth-.293,18,63=+1 Braves

I would be insane if I gave the edge to the braves on either of these two. That's why the edge went down from 3 with Shane and down from 2 with Werth.

Philadelphia is plus one in the outfield because they take two out of the three matchups.

1b-Derek Lee .250, 16hr, 63rbi vs Ryan Howard.277,24,85= even

Even? Howards numbers are all better than Lee's, so how is it even?

Howard is the clear edge this year. The braves started off up one matchup with Mcann getting the edge over the phillies catcher. It went back even when Howard took the matchup with Lee.
Even Lee's best season is not better than Howard's best season.

I've always enjoyed talking baseball with you on here, but I'm starting to wonder about you now...

It's ok, you can put your shirt back on now.

 

[Paulie]

My god dude, there's so much wrong with all of that

AU CONTRAIRE. I'd say it's right on the money.

How you gave the edge to the braves on a lot of them, first of all.

My dear, poor Pauli Phanatic. I did not give the Braves the advantage in every category. I was counting points for one team or the next. You missed my whole point. When I say plus one it was only referring to that position comparison. At the end of the day the comparison showed that the Braves were 3 total points better if you were comparing position by position. I'll redo it for you to clear up.


Poor run support is a reason why the Phillies are not better than the Braves. The Braves hitters support their pitchers slightly better than the Phillies.


Truly stated. I know but I'm not going to hash all the stats. I'm also going on this years stats alone. All reputations thrown out the window.


As per my first explanation I did give Oswalt the edge. He's clearly better in every way. Especially considering the bulk of his stats coming from Houston.


No Hamels got the edge.


No Hamels got the edge. He's a better pitcher.


Now this is worth debating. And I'm not saying that in the end Hudson will go down as a greater historical pitcher than Halladay. Halladay is and will go down a the superior, but not this year. I gave the edge to Hudson because he is having a slightly better season. The numbers don't lie. Hudson could end up with the Cy Young. Check every one of his stats. He's having a ridiculous year. Even more ridiculous than Halladay. That's why I gave him the nod. Below in red are the edges which the pitcher has the advantage. You'll see the stats are very similar, nearly identical but in the most critical stats, Hudson has the slight edge, ERA, Batting average against, Wins. Where Halladay, a favorite if we're talking last year, is the leader in the sexier stats like strikeouts and complete games.
1. Tim Hudson
1. T Hudson
ATL 15W 6L 2.30era 28g 28gs 1cg 1sho 191.2ip 152h 51r 49er 12hr 6hbp 59bb 113k 1.10whip .222baa 5.39k/9


2. R Halladay
PHI 17W 10L 2.36ERA 29G 29GS 8CG 3sho 221.0ip 204h 64r 58er 21hr 5hbp 28bb 196K 1.05whip .245oba 7.98k/9



I'm sure you get me now.


At the end of the day the measure of a more productive hitter is always runs scored or rbi. Glaus leads Polanco in both. Runs and hits that drive in runs are ultimately more important than any other stat. All other states are mere indicators but not absolute. Runs are absolute. Runs cannot be denied and also show the clutch ability of a player.


I'll give you Infante, even though Rollins provides the intangible for us that we seriously lack without him - the spark plug and the leadership. We win way more ball games with him than without him, regardless of how sexy his numbers are.

And I don't even know what the fuck you're thinking on these:


I would be insane if I gave the edge to the braves on either of these two. That's why the edge went down from 3 with Shane and down from 2 with Werth.

Philadelphia is plus one in the outfield because they take two out of the three matchups.

1b-Derek Lee .250, 16hr, 63rbi vs Ryan Howard.277,24,85= even

Even? Howards numbers are all better than Lee's, so how is it even?

Howard is the clear edge this year. The braves started off up one matchup with Mcann getting the edge over the phillies catcher. It went back even when Howard took the matchup with Lee.
Even Lee's best season is not better than Howard's best season.

I've always enjoyed talking baseball with you on here, but I'm starting to wonder about you now...

It's ok, you can put your shirt back on now.

I don't have time right now to get into this but I will say that I stand corrected on the way you scored the comparisons. I thought you were giving a 1 for a small edge and 2 or 3 for a bigger edge. I didn't catch on to the fact that you were just adding or subtracting 1 as you went along. I see now that you gave phi the edge on a lot of those.

I will be back later to debate the rest though

 

[Truthspeaker]

Padres monumental collapse continues. Giants just 1 game back now.

 

[Oddball]

Thome hits the shit out of another one...Three of 'em over for the weekend.

Somebody sign this dude up!

Baseball Video Highlights & Clips | Must C Crushed: Thome hits a mammoth home run - Video | MLB.com: Multimedia

 

[Truthspeaker]

That was a man sized homer. 480 feet is awesome power. I wish they would post the distances of every homer that gets hit.

Padres finally win a game after 10 game skid. Giants win again after shutout of Snakes. 1 game back in division and 1 and a half back of wild card. Lincecum tonight versus Barry Enright of the D-backs. Tiny Tim regains his form and we'll run away with the division.