Pedophilia Deserves Civil Rights, Says New York Times’ Op-ed

[flacaltenn]

Well then this lady isn't thinking straight. Because someone who has only PONDERED the child abuse leading up to pedophilia needs "no additional civil rights".. That person will be treated in confidence and has no reason to come out of the closet or "out" himself. What? Are we all suppose to give him a big hug for declaring as a POTENTIAL pedophile??

In that case --- NO ONE knows what "threat to society" that individual might be anyway.. The REALITY IS that folks PROGRESS to the act of pedophilia along paths of all sort of illegal acts. These are also "PRE" pedophiles.. Does she think these child abusers ought to have "extended civil rights" and legal protections so that they can be a Carnival ride worker or a school janitor with no stigma attached?

I'm not sure what the laws are, but if someone goes for help don't psychologists need to report them as a threat to children?

The employment aspect is more clear - you can fire the accounting clerk in your company if you find out their pedophilia but you can't fire the employee on prozac who suffers from depression.

But she's not talking about making life cushy for child abusers. Her one example was civil commitment for identified pedophiles coming out of prison on a child abuse charge. This is an extra-judicial sentence. They're committed for mental health counseling by standards which don't apply to suicidal people. I'm of the position that if society wants to lock people away that they do it via courts, not mental health orders which don't have any standards behind them.

Most of her op-ed wasn't dealing with child abusers but non child abusers. There is no such thing as a PRE-Pedophile, there is a PRE-Child abuser. They're not the same thing. By your standards everyone who gets angry at someone is a Pre-Murderer.

Let's be clear.. Even Psychology Today understands that if you want to define what leads to pedophilia --- you look for previous acts of child abuse. The author can't think straight if she thinks that "non-child abusers" need ANY KIND of protection..

Please read...

How Can We Spot a Child Molester Psychology Today

Interviews with, and questionnaires given to, pedophiles are among our attempts to learn what child molesters say about their desires and behavior. Although the offenders who skulk around playgrounds or have difficulty hiding their desires are obvious, they’re not that prevalent. We must be concerned with those who skillfully hide their predilections so that they can practice undetected for years.

Pedophiles are often placed into one of four categories. The first is themysoped. These offenders are interested in molesting and sexually abusing children because they want to physically harm them.

A second type is the regressed child offender. This individual generally has relations with adults, but offends against a child because of a stressful event in the offender’s life that makes him seek someone he can control.

The fixated child offender is stuck at an early stage of psychosexual development. He has little to no activity with people his own age and is often uncomfortable around adults. He loves children and does not want to hurt them, so he rationalizes that abuse is actually affection.

Finally, the naïve pedophile is the individual who, for all intents and purposes, has no sense of right and wrong. The offender is often mentally retarded or unstable, and does not comprehend the rules of normal society.

When researchers Reuben Lang and Roy Frenzel interviewed 52 incest and 50 pedophilic offenders, they found that the average age of child molesters is thirty-four. Updated stats indicate that 25% are over 40. A typical modus operandi is to befriend the parents and offer to babysit the victims. They are attracted to situations in which children are easily attainable, and might even set them up. They gradually insert themselves into the victims’ lives.

THAT my bud --- is the definition of "Pre-Pedophile"... And when Psychology Today wants to spot the signs of Child Abusers --- they know enough to POLL pedophiles for the answers..

 

[Rikurzhen]

So I don't think the OP will get many reply's from the board's resident liberal's supporting this ladies opinion, (not even from a dyed-in-the-wool liberal like myself) other than support for her right to have that opinion and advocate for that leprous group. It's her right to make herself a social pariah if she has the balls.

As a conservative I'll step forward and defend most of what that professor has written. I have no problem with this:

Acknowledging that pedophiles have a mental disorder, and removing the obstacles to their coming forward and seeking help, is not only the right thing to do, but it would also advance efforts to protect children from harm.​

Good for you. And I see there's a couple of other posters willing to support the rights of non-offending pedophiles. Maybe being a father of two daughters affects my judgement on this one.

I too have two daughters. I don't though use politics to my benefit. I'm not threatened by illegal immigrants but poor Americans are. I advocate for them. Black males have a 25% year-round idleness rate and employers prefer to hire illegal Mexicans rather than more troublesome black males. I advocate for black males because they're Americans. I don't personally want to fire anyone because of their race or religion or sexual orientation but I advocate for those who have had their human rights to do so stripped away from them.

I wouldn't want them around somebody with a loaded weapon that I didn't know and trust and I just don't know any pedophiles and I don't think I could ever trust one enough to give him the right to be around my kids without me there as a watchdog

False security. You don't know what evil lurks in the heart of men. You don't know any OUTED pedophiles. That makes you feel safe? Not me. I'd rather know that a guy is OUT and getting help so that I could keep an eye on him than not know and feel a false sense of security.

Of course I would have been more impressed with your standing for certain rights for this group if you had voiced it before my post. Because of our past disagreements I'm thinking your contrariness may be just to be contrary, or did I miss something? What I'm saying is I have yet to be impressed by your integrity.

Your post was #101. My first post was #73 and then, wait for it, #100. Trust me, I'm not going to go to the trouble of defending an unpopular position just to egg you on.

 

[Noomi]

Just how FUCKED UP MENTALLY, can Liberals get...read about it in the N.Y. SLIMES!!!

Daily Caller ^

The nation’s tough anti-pedophilia laws are unfair to pedophiles, according to an op-ed published by The New York Times’ editors. “One can live with pedophilia and not act on it,” says Margo Kaplan, an entrepreneurial assistant law professor at Rutgers University, and a former lawyer for the American Civil Liberties Union. Tragically, the roughly 1 percent of “people who are sexually attracted to children] must hide their disorder from everyone they know — or risk losing educational and job opportunities, and face the prospect of harassment and even violence,” she wrote.....

She's right. A person can harbor an attraction toward children but never act on it. I don't define those people as pedophiles.

 

[Rikurzhen]

Let's be clear.. Even Psychology Today understands that if you want to define what leads to pedophilia --- you look for previous acts of child abuse. The author can't think straight if she thinks that "non-child abusers" need ANY KIND of protection..

Please read...

THAT my bud --- is the definition of "Pre-Pedophile"... And when Psychology Today wants to spot the signs of Child Abusers --- they know enough to POLL pedophiles for the answers..

I did read that article and it suffers from the limiation I already noted, it only studies those people who have offended. Even the title gives it away "How Can We Spot a Child Molester?"

A pedophile is to a child molester like a sober alcoholic is to a soused alcoholic. Even that doesn't work so well because a sober alcoholic was presumably a drinker at some point. Better is a virgin homosexual to a sexually active homosexual. The virgin knows that he likes looking at sweaty construction workers but never acts on it. These people exist but we have no clue about them. That's a problem. How can they control themselves without acting?

The research you quote was developed from interviews with offenders:

When researchers Reuben Lang and Roy Frenzel interviewed 52 incest and 50 pedophilic offenders, they found that the average age of child molesters is thirty-four. Updated stats indicate that 25% are over 40.
​

Again, back to the title "How Can We Spot a Child Molester?"

 

[Rikurzhen]

Just how FUCKED UP MENTALLY, can Liberals get...read about it in the N.Y. SLIMES!!!

Daily Caller ^

The nation’s tough anti-pedophilia laws are unfair to pedophiles, according to an op-ed published by The New York Times’ editors. “One can live with pedophilia and not act on it,” says Margo Kaplan, an entrepreneurial assistant law professor at Rutgers University, and a former lawyer for the American Civil Liberties Union. Tragically, the roughly 1 percent of “people who are sexually attracted to children] must hide their disorder from everyone they know — or risk losing educational and job opportunities, and face the prospect of harassment and even violence,” she wrote.....

She's right. A person can harbor an attraction toward children but never act on it. I don't define those people as pedophiles.

They are pedophiles, just not child abusers. Pedophilia is a condition, not a crime. Child abuse is the crime.

 

[flacaltenn]

Let's be clear.. Even Psychology Today understands that if you want to define what leads to pedophilia --- you look for previous acts of child abuse. The author can't think straight if she thinks that "non-child abusers" need ANY KIND of protection..

Please read...

THAT my bud --- is the definition of "Pre-Pedophile"... And when Psychology Today wants to spot the signs of Child Abusers --- they know enough to POLL pedophiles for the answers..

I did read that article and it suffers from the limiation I already noted, it only studies those people who have offended. Even the title gives it away "How Can We Spot a Child Molester?"

A pedophile is to a child molester like a sober alcoholic is to a soused alcoholic. Even that doesn't work so well because a sober alcoholic was presumably a drinker at some point. Better is a virgin homosexual to a sexually active homosexual. The virgin knows that he likes looking at sweaty construction workers but never acts on it. These people exist but we have no clue about them. That's a problem. How can they control themselves without acting?

The research you quote was developed from interviews with offenders:

When researchers Reuben Lang and Roy Frenzel interviewed 52 incest and 50 pedophilic offenders, they found that the average age of child molesters is thirty-four. Updated stats indicate that 25% are over 40.
​

Again, back to the title "How Can We Spot a Child Molester?"

Point is --- to identify child molesters they INTERVIEWED PEDOPHILES. Why is that??

If all you're interested in is sober alcoholics, you don't need civil rights. OR legal protection of any kind.. The POS NYTimes Op Ed is completely muddled thinking about a non-existent issue. The folks she describes are not pedophiles. I don't know what they are -- and never would a psychologist.. Trying to DIAGNOSE a pedophile without some evidence of child abuse is like trying to DIAGNOSE an alcoholic who's never had a weekly bender.. No patient history -- no disease. Am I missing something here? You think you can take a blood test or DNA and find it?? Or rely on someone having fantasies to DIAGNOSE them officially as a pedophile..

Nope --- not possible..

 

[Rikurzhen]

To DIAGNOSE a pedophile without some evidence of child abuse is like trying to DIAGNOSE an alcoholic who's never had a weekly bender.. No patient history -- no disease.

DIAGNOSE. Here's the scene, a patient sitting in the psychologist's office:

Patient: "Doc, all of my sexual fantasies are focused on 10 year old boys. I know it's wrong, I always avoid being alone with children, I don't want to hurt any child, but when I'm alone I think about those naked boys and me on a desert island, blah blah blah. What can I do to stop fixating on naked 10 year old boys? Help me please.​

You're telling me that this guy is not a pedophile in your books?

This guy is a pedophile but he's not a child molester. Like the op-ed writer noted, pedophilia is a diagnosis, not a crime. Child abuse is the crime.

 

[Picaro]

I'd be curious why the NY Times felt it deserved ink.

Because its editorial board is made up of sociopaths.

 

[Picaro]

Pedophilia, according to the author, is a recognized mental illness. Homosexuality is not.

Pretty simple.

Actually they are similar, and the reasons one is and the other isn't are political, not due to science.

 

[Picaro]

Didn't you know this was going to happen? It is the next natural fight after same sex marriage.

Its someones opinion not a political platform chicken little.

Actually it is a political platform, and pedo gangs and their fronts were part of the modern gay rights movement. It was only after Jesse Helms fought Clinton over UN NGO status for American gay groups that the various homosexual activist groups suddenly got interested in doing something about removing them, because of the bad press, not any particular aversion to them being part of 'The Rainbow'. Some lesbian activists were active in condemning them over the years, but most male homosexuals saw nothing wrong with having kiddie rapers around.

Feminist Nikki Craft on kiddie raper ads in feminist magazines, and about lesbians fighting NAMBLA participation in Gay Pride parades:

So Much Slime So Little Time Part I

Minutes of ILGA plenum called as a result of Jesse Helms raising a stink over the pedoes in the Gay Rights organizations, and voting on whether to ban them. Now really, who actually needs to hold votes on such a thing, much less having such groups on your organizational chart in the first place? ...

http://www.qrd.org/qrd/orgs/ILGA/1994/paedophilia.membership.plenary-minutes-06.30.94

ILGA
16th Annual World conference
Minutes
Paedophilia Membership Plenary
30 June 1994
Chairs Suzy Byrne, Bassy
Minutes Philip Collins
Start Time 09:45
1. Household Matters
Nominations for Co-Secretary Generals close at 13:00 Friday 1 July 1994.
Nominations can be made on the board in the registration area.
Will delegates please collect material from their boxes regularly.
2. New members
The following groups were welcomed as full members of ILGA.
Bermuda Human Rights Alliance
Brazil Grupo Lesbian de Bahia
Canada Concordia Queer Collective
Croatia AIDS Info
Guatemala Association Gay/Lesbian Guatemateca
Italy Triangulo Silenzioso
Nicaragua Colectivo 'Nostras"
Nicaragua Fundacion Xochiquetzal
Puerto Rico Coalicion Puertoriguena de Lesbianas y Homosexuals
UK Countdown on Spanner
Indonesia Ipoos Gaya Betawi
3. Motion to Expell
3.1 Proposal
Jenny Wilson (JW) of the Financial Secretariat, spoke to the motion:
"The Secretariat's Committee moves that NAMBLA, Vereniging Martijn and
Project Truth/Free Will be expelled from ILGA membership."
JW gave some background to the motion:
- Moves had been made since 1988, by many individual organisations, to
address the paedophile issue. This had come to a head with the UN recognition
problem.
- UN observer status was very important as it gave ILGA a voice to perform
its international work much better. It would also make recognition by the
European Community and Council of Europe much easier to get.
- The motion is not a US issue, it is a worldwide one. The support of the
Australian government and other allies depend on its success.
- If ILGA is to continue to grow and become a truly international
organisation the motion should be supported.

... and more. Check out the results of the vote ...

So, yes, it's a political platform. The more media savvy homosexual activists realized the bad press they were getting, and now the narrative is all about how pedoes were never part of the 'movement'; a big lie.

 

[LoneLaugher]

Pedophilia, according to the author, is a recognized mental illness. Homosexuality is not.

Pretty simple.

Actually they are similar, and the reasons one is and the other isn't are political, not due to science.

And.....that would be bullshit.

 

[Picaro]

Pedophilia, according to the author, is a recognized mental illness. Homosexuality is not.

Pretty simple.

Actually they are similar, and the reasons one is and the other isn't are political, not due to science.

And.....that would be bullshit.

Actually it isn't. The APA in the 1970s changed the classification due to political pressure, not because of any scientific evidence justifying the change. Even today psychiatry and psychology 'professionals' censor anything that doesn't fit a political agenda.

Foreword
The California Association of Marriage and Family Therapists (CAMFT) published a special issue of their bi-monthly journal “The Therapist” dedicated to the subject of same-sex marriage. Guest authors were asked to contribute articles, half of the writers in support and half opposed to same-sex marriage. A stated goal of the issue was to determine whether the organization should adopt a formal position on the matter.


Subsequent to publication of the May/June 2009 special issue (Volume 21, Issue 3), homosexual activists within and without the organization pressured CAMFT to not only apologize, but also expunge from their organizational archives those articles that voiced opposition to same-sex marriage. CAMFT capitulated to those demands. The Director of CAMFT apologized for publishing articles critical of same-sex marriage and all the "offending" articles were censored from the CAMFT website archives. So much for intellectual debate and freedom of opinion.

Dr. Trayce Hansen s Writings

 

[Picaro]

Let's be clear.. Even Psychology Today understands that if you want to define what leads to pedophilia --- you look for previous acts of child abuse. The author can't think straight if she thinks that "non-child abusers" need ANY KIND of protection..

Please read...

THAT my bud --- is the definition of "Pre-Pedophile"... And when Psychology Today wants to spot the signs of Child Abusers --- they know enough to POLL pedophiles for the answers..

I did read that article and it suffers from the limiation I already noted, it only studies those people who have offended. Even the title gives it away "How Can We Spot a Child Molester?"

A pedophile is to a child molester like a sober alcoholic is to a soused alcoholic. Even that doesn't work so well because a sober alcoholic was presumably a drinker at some point. Better is a virgin homosexual to a sexually active homosexual. The virgin knows that he likes looking at sweaty construction workers but never acts on it. These people exist but we have no clue about them. That's a problem. How can they control themselves without acting?

The research you quote was developed from interviews with offenders:

When researchers Reuben Lang and Roy Frenzel interviewed 52 incest and 50 pedophilic offenders, they found that the average age of child molesters is thirty-four. Updated stats indicate that 25% are over 40.
​

Again, back to the title "How Can We Spot a Child Molester?"

Pedoes also have extremely high recidivism rates, and are almost guaranteed to continue their compulsions after being released from prison after being caught. Once caught, they should be kept locked up for life, either in prisons or mental asylums.

 

[Rikurzhen]

Let's be clear.. Even Psychology Today understands that if you want to define what leads to pedophilia --- you look for previous acts of child abuse. The author can't think straight if she thinks that "non-child abusers" need ANY KIND of protection..

Please read...

THAT my bud --- is the definition of "Pre-Pedophile"... And when Psychology Today wants to spot the signs of Child Abusers --- they know enough to POLL pedophiles for the answers..

I did read that article and it suffers from the limiation I already noted, it only studies those people who have offended. Even the title gives it away "How Can We Spot a Child Molester?"

A pedophile is to a child molester like a sober alcoholic is to a soused alcoholic. Even that doesn't work so well because a sober alcoholic was presumably a drinker at some point. Better is a virgin homosexual to a sexually active homosexual. The virgin knows that he likes looking at sweaty construction workers but never acts on it. These people exist but we have no clue about them. That's a problem. How can they control themselves without acting?

The research you quote was developed from interviews with offenders:

When researchers Reuben Lang and Roy Frenzel interviewed 52 incest and 50 pedophilic offenders, they found that the average age of child molesters is thirty-four. Updated stats indicate that 25% are over 40.
​

Again, back to the title "How Can We Spot a Child Molester?"

Pedoes also have extremely high recidivism rates, and are almost guaranteed to continue their compulsions after being released from prison after being caught. Once caught, they should kept locked up for life, either in prisons or mental asylums.

A pedophile doesn't have any recidivism rate, a child sex abuser does. As for what should be done about then, let that be part of the criminal sentence, not a mental health order cloaked in secrecy.

 

[CherryPanda]

The more deviant behavior is recognized as acceptable, the easier and faster the next fluctuation is accepted.
And I'm afraid that nowadays our society has got to a point where it is losing orientation about acceptable things.

 

[Picaro]

The more deviant behavior is recognized as acceptable, the easier and faster the next fluctuation is accepted.
And I'm afraid that nowadays our society has got to a point where it is losing orientation about acceptable things.

It's the politics of mindless self-indulgence carried to absurdities.

 

[saveliberty]

Apparently the liberals just refuse to pay attention. I can understand, because they don't want to pay for anything.

This is not a treatable condition, it is a bomb waiting to go off period. I'm sure the mental health profession will gladly take money from anyone to "help". The only medical cure might be castration. How many liberals are willing to try that?

 

[Delta4Embassy]

Pedophilia, according to the author, is a recognized mental illness. Homosexuality is not.

Pretty simple.

Actually they are similar, and the reasons one is and the other isn't are political, not due to science.

And.....that would be bullshit.

Actually it isn't. The APA in the 1970s changed the classification due to political pressure, not because of any scientific evidence justifying the change. Even today psychiatry and psychology 'professionals' censor anything that doesn't fit a political agenda.

Foreword
The California Association of Marriage and Family Therapists (CAMFT) published a special issue of their bi-monthly journal “The Therapist” dedicated to the subject of same-sex marriage. Guest authors were asked to contribute articles, half of the writers in support and half opposed to same-sex marriage. A stated goal of the issue was to determine whether the organization should adopt a formal position on the matter.


Subsequent to publication of the May/June 2009 special issue (Volume 21, Issue 3), homosexual activists within and without the organization pressured CAMFT to not only apologize, but also expunge from their organizational archives those articles that voiced opposition to same-sex marriage. CAMFT capitulated to those demands. The Director of CAMFT apologized for publishing articles critical of same-sex marriage and all the "offending" articles were censored from the CAMFT website archives. So much for intellectual debate and freedom of opinion.

Dr. Trayce Hansen s Writings

In point of fact, everything the APA ever decides is political and teh result of popular voting. The science that elads to how people vote is scientific, but the decisions to recategorize things is democratic thus political.

Pedophilia was recategorized as a sexual orientation because the consesnus among researchers was since no treatment to curb it seems to work it must not be a mental illness but rather a sexual orientation. Just as is in the news right now with gay 'treatments' which don't work and only cause harm, the thinking was since pedophilia treatments don't work either it's an orientation, not a treatable-illness.

Pessimism About Pedophilia - Harvard Health Publications

"Pedophilia is a sexual orientation and unlikely to change. Treatment aims to enable someone to resist acting on his sexual urges."

 

[Asclepias]

Apparently the liberals just refuse to pay attention. I can understand, because they don't want to pay for anything.

This is not a treatable condition, it is a bomb waiting to go off period. I'm sure the mental health profession will gladly take money from anyone to "help". The only medical cure might be castration. How many liberals are willing to try that?

I am considered a liberal. It doesnt matter if its treatable or not. If it can be cured then good stuff. Either way the point is that they are harming children. Any activity that harms children should be a crime and the public should be aware of the persons presence.

 

[koshergrl]

Explain how you can treat a pedophile, but not a homosexual.

Pedophilia, according to the author, is a recognized mental illness. Homosexuality is not.

Pretty simple.

There's why people are upset doofus, time was homosexuality WAS categorized as a mental illness. The mentally ill fought to get that changed, and succeeded, what makes you think they wouldn't try the same with Pedophilia?

They already tried it.

See my siggy. The APA tried to get pedophilia classified as a sexual ORIENTATION. They regularly have continuing education seminars run by people who want a higher level of *acceptance* for pedophiles.

"The American Psychiatric Association (APA) has backtracked on its designation of pedophilia as a “sexual orientation,” following backlash from conservative family organizations. In May the APA, which according to its website represents more than 33,000 psychiatrists in the United States and elsewhere, released the fifth edition of its Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5), in which pedophilia is described as a sexual “orientation.”

Psychiatric Group Backtracks on Pedophilia Classification