[POLL] - Liberals, how much is a "fair share?" - Taxes

[BillyZane]

Yeah, it's conservatives who blather on endlessly about "fair", and pass reams of ridiculously intrusive laws about what people can eat and drink and what kind of light bulbs and toilets they can buy.

Don't look now, Delusion Boy (If you're a girl, I don't care, just FYI), but Santa and the Easter Bunny just ran through whatever misty dimension you're inhabiting right now.

People who like to do stupid things need to be cared for. Did you raise any kids?

Throwing away resources getting more scarce every day is no more affordable than Bush was.

The country sees clearly now that we just cannot afford conservatism. Not then, not now, not ever.

Blither, blither, blither. "Conservatives want to impose what they think is best on people . . . but leftists just want to Mommy everyone because they need it. What do you mean, I just sounded like a complete, nonsensical moron?!"

You are soooo done, little leftist. Move along.

I think he meant to say that America can't afford to not be conservative. Well, real conservatives anyway. Not the fake crap that so many claim is conservative today.

 

[ShawnChris13]

It seems like conservatism oscillates between two poles.

That everybody is a criminal, or nobody is.

We have laws to define which behaviors are criminal, and which aren't. We have enforcement to impose the prescribed penalty on those who break our laws.

Some people never do, so the laws have no impact on them. That's a decision that they make every day.

Some do often and seem oblivious to the high cost on their lives.

That's how personal responsibility works.

All laws restrict behavior that allows the criminal to impose his will on his victims.

ADA restricts, by consequences, people who can afford to pay for their own health care, from dumping their bills on others. It allows those who business does or cannot pay enough to afford health care, to afford responsibility.

All, apparently, not the world that Republicans support.

The ACA generates revenue for government with increased taxes and more revenue for the medical field by forcing everyone to pay in. It burdens the middle class with more cost and using their money to help executives get bonuses.

 

[PMZ]

If my kids fuck up then me and my family are responsible for them.
Not you and others.

I agree. Then they grow up.

Wait. Define grow up. Because apparently that means 27.

One of the many differences between today and your day is the amount of education that is table stakes for responsible living. Every day here we read of people who are not up to that current standard.

It's a problem that our education system is desperately avoiding, and they are way ahead of many parents in finding solutions.

Other countries are ahead of us in that, the most critical factor in economic success.

We've got some catching up to do.

 

[Gadawg73]

People who like to do stupid things need to be cared for. Did you raise any kids?

Throwing away resources getting more scarce every day is no more affordable than Bush was.

The country sees clearly now that we just cannot afford conservatism. Not then, not now, not ever.

If my kids fuck up then me and my family are responsible for them.
Not you and others.

I agree. Then they grow up.

And family is still responsible for them.
Not you and your family and others.

 

[Gadawg73]

I agree. Then they grow up.

Wait. Define grow up. Because apparently that means 27.

One of the many differences between today and your day is the amount of education that is table stakes for responsible living. Every day here we read of people who are not up to that current standard.

It's a problem that our education system is desperately avoiding, and they are way ahead of many parents in finding solutions.

Other countries are ahead of us in that, the most critical factor in economic success.

We've got some catching up to do.

"other countries"
I have traveled the world. We are better off here than most everywhere else except Dubai and other commodity rich countries.
I have worked for law firms and with attorneys, prosecutors, law enforcement, medical examiners, bankers, corporations and well educated folks all my life.
Most all of them are far, far educated beyond their intelligence. I have 2 degrees and in many instances I am educated beyond my intelligence so I defer to someone with EXPERIENCE.
For everything there is there is always someone else smarter than you in the world at it.
Other countries are ahead of us in math and science because we graduate over 50% of college graduates that can not find work in their liberal arts course of study.
Not knocking a liberal arts degree.
The problem is the colleges and universities ARE FULL.
And HVAC, plumbing, IT, auto repair, marine repair, aircraft repair and 100s of other skilled jobs go UNFILLED.
Other countries do not do it the way we do. They do not fill their colleges and universities and support it with tax payer dollars to graduate people with useless degrees.

 

[Cecilie1200]

People who like to do stupid things need to be cared for. Did you raise any kids?

Throwing away resources getting more scarce every day is no more affordable than Bush was.

The country sees clearly now that we just cannot afford conservatism. Not then, not now, not ever.

Blither, blither, blither. "Conservatives want to impose what they think is best on people . . . but leftists just want to Mommy everyone because they need it. What do you mean, I just sounded like a complete, nonsensical moron?!"

You are soooo done, little leftist. Move along.

I think he meant to say that America can't afford to not be conservative. Well, real conservatives anyway. Not the fake crap that so many claim is conservative today.

Oh, no, he meant to say exactly what he said. He tends to say a lot of utter bullshit unsupported by reality.

 

[ShawnChris13]

I agree. Then they grow up.

Wait. Define grow up. Because apparently that means 27.

One of the many differences between today and your day is the amount of education that is table stakes for responsible living. Every day here we read of people who are not up to that current standard.

It's a problem that our education system is desperately avoiding, and they are way ahead of many parents in finding solutions.

Other countries are ahead of us in that, the most critical factor in economic success.

We've got some catching up to do.

Today and my day? I'm in my twenties bro. It's still very much my day. The education system has been the spawning grounds for the left since it's inception. The left has only itself to blame with its failure to dissolve teachers unions and poor curriculum.

 

[bripat9643]

I keep hearing liberals say day after day, "the rich need to pay their fair share!"

But when asked how much the "fair share" actually is, they have no idea and never come out with a specific number. Others just beat around the bush and talk about periods in our history when top marginal tax rates were in the 90% range (even though nobody ever paid that rate), but say that's not really what they want. Maybe out of fear they'll get called communists.

Anyways, I thought I'd put an end to the confusion once and for all with this poll.

Liberals, what should be the "fair share" the rich have to pay in taxes?

Conservatives, feel free to chime in as well.

There is, and never will be, anything fair about our tax system. It needs a complete overhaul.

I would prefer a nice neat national sales tax, 10% at the retail level. You buy it you pay taxes on it. I would exempt food,utilities,housing costs and tax every other purchase.

If you buy a vehicle/ship/plane out of the country and bring it into the US you pay the tax when you license it same as currently if you buy a vehicle out of state.

No deductions, no loop holes, no exemptions beyond the 3 listed. Simple and done.

I know the popular whine is that that tax hurts the poor more than the rich, but I say too bad. It's just like dining out, if you can't afford the tip, stick to McDonalds, same thing here, if you can't afford the 10% tax, don't buy it.

As an added bonus , the iRS would need to be about 1/5th of it's current size.



What is "fair" about a system that lets people collect a "refund" that is larger than the amount they paid in taxes?

What is "fair" about a system that allows rich people to spend tens of thousands of dollars to someone who's entire job is to make sure their clients pay as little in taxes on their millions in income as possible?

Nothing, that's what.

"Fair" is in the same category as Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, and the Tooth Fairy, but conservatives never give up wanting to impose what's best for them, on others.

Since we don't give a damn about fairness, then why bother with Obamacare? Who cares if some people don't have insurance when we can just all adopt that "tough shit" attitude of yours?

 

[bripat9643]

Was this supposed to convey some kind of comprehensible thought?

You need a copy of Asshole from RosettaStone in order to understand this fool.

Clearly what I post is way above your pay grade.

What you post is grade level reading for the intellectually challenged.

 

[bripat9643]

More insight into the massive intellect behind conservatism.

If I were equipped as you, I would seriously consider having others think for me too.

Blither, blither, blither. You can keep trying to fling insults at me, vainly hoping to someday come out even, but it's never going to happen. Watching you get farther and farther behind is frankly not even entertaining any more. It's just vaguely depressing.

Exactly in what field are you ahead of me?

For one thing, she can write a coherent sentence.

 

[Delta4Embassy]

Anything but the same rate for everyone is obviously unjust. Dunno what the sweet spot is but 10-15% sounds about right.

 

[Gadawg73]

The left confuses fiscal conservatism with the bastardization of conservatism by the right wing religious kooks.
Anyone that opposes fiscal conservatism in government is ignorant, self serving and does not care about what they leave for their kids and grandkids.

 

[Gadawg73]

Is it fair that I drove old cars for 30 years to be able to have something and pay off my house?
My relative drives 2 brand new cars, a $65,000 one and a $50,000 one. He lives in a $450,000 home with a high mortgage. He has a beach condo worth $400,000 with a large mortgage on it. Their credit cards are maxed out. He and his wife work when they want to and barely get by, mainly by an inheritance.
I drive old cars, one with 299,000 miles on it, paid off my 3BR, 2BA house in 1992. I have NO car payment and no Florida condo. I saved my money for 21 years and have a few hundred grand in the bank and more in stocks.
My relatives' kids qualify for Pell grants for their kids for college because they are deemed more in need than me!
All because they are irresponsible with their money buying high ticket items and a big mortgage and I am not and have money in the bank.
Under the Federal guidelines you are allowed to own a second home and it does not hurt your formula for the means test.
That is the world of means test benefits for the "poor and needy" for at least 40% of the money doled out.
And the liberal claims this system is "fair".

 

[RKMBrown]

It seems like conservatism oscillates between two poles.

That everybody is a criminal, or nobody is.

We have laws to define which behaviors are criminal, and which aren't. We have enforcement to impose the prescribed penalty on those who break our laws.

Some people never do, so the laws have no impact on them. That's a decision that they make every day.

Some do often and seem oblivious to the high cost on their lives.

That's how personal responsibility works.

All laws restrict behavior that allows the criminal to impose his will on his victims.

ADA restricts, by consequences, people who can afford to pay for their own health care, from dumping their bills on others. It allows those who business does or cannot pay enough to afford health care, to afford responsibility.

All, apparently, not the world that Republicans support.

You are nothing but a tiny little retarded ass hole.

 

[PMZ]

I enjoy the reaction of conservatives to the utter failure of their dogma in practice.

Zero learning. Maximum blaming of "other" conservatives.

So, I guess that we have to add to the long list of groups that conservatives hate, other conservatives.

And they are truly surprised at the extent of their political failure! Surprised!

That's bizarre beyond belief.

 

[PMZ]

Is it fair that I drove old cars for 30 years to be able to have something and pay off my house?
My relative drives 2 brand new cars, a $65,000 one and a $50,000 one. He lives in a $450,000 home with a high mortgage. He has a beach condo worth $400,000 with a large mortgage on it. Their credit cards are maxed out. He and his wife work when they want to and barely get by, mainly by an inheritance.
I drive old cars, one with 299,000 miles on it, paid off my 3BR, 2BA house in 1992. I have NO car payment and no Florida condo. I saved my money for 21 years and have a few hundred grand in the bank and more in stocks.
My relatives' kids qualify for Pell grants for their kids for college because they are deemed more in need than me!
All because they are irresponsible with their money buying high ticket items and a big mortgage and I am not and have money in the bank.
Under the Federal guidelines you are allowed to own a second home and it does not hurt your formula for the means test.
That is the world of means test benefits for the "poor and needy" for at least 40% of the money doled out.
And the liberal claims this system is "fair".

It sounds like you are living a life that you hate.

I've tried to do the opposite. The secret is to spend your time doing what you enjoy accomplishing, learn every day, don't sweat the small stuff. Materialism is absolutely no different than drugs. Addictive, frustrating, a false world, expensive, a cruel, cruel master.

Look at the repressed rage expressed here daily by goods addicts.

Life's too short to spend even a minute in a futile race to nowhere.

 

[Gadawg73]

A single American can make up to $46,000 a year and qualify for a subsidy for their health insurance premium.
Just plain wrong to borrow money and pass that on to our kids and grandkids to pay so someone can get a break on their health insurance today when they make $46,000 a year with no spouse or children.
40% or more of all these means test programs hand out cash and/or subsidies to people that pass the means test set by government but are not truly needy.

 

[Gadawg73]

Is it fair that I drove old cars for 30 years to be able to have something and pay off my house?
My relative drives 2 brand new cars, a $65,000 one and a $50,000 one. He lives in a $450,000 home with a high mortgage. He has a beach condo worth $400,000 with a large mortgage on it. Their credit cards are maxed out. He and his wife work when they want to and barely get by, mainly by an inheritance.
I drive old cars, one with 299,000 miles on it, paid off my 3BR, 2BA house in 1992. I have NO car payment and no Florida condo. I saved my money for 21 years and have a few hundred grand in the bank and more in stocks.
My relatives' kids qualify for Pell grants for their kids for college because they are deemed more in need than me!
All because they are irresponsible with their money buying high ticket items and a big mortgage and I am not and have money in the bank.
Under the Federal guidelines you are allowed to own a second home and it does not hurt your formula for the means test.
That is the world of means test benefits for the "poor and needy" for at least 40% of the money doled out.
And the liberal claims this system is "fair".

It sounds like you are living a life that you hate.

I've tried to do the opposite. The secret is to spend your time doing what you enjoy accomplishing, learn every day, don't sweat the small stuff. Materialism is absolutely no different than drugs. Addictive, frustrating, a false world, expensive, a cruel, cruel master.

Look at the repressed rage expressed here daily by goods addicts.

Life's too short to spend even a minute in a futile race to nowhere.

No sir, there is no other life I would have lived.
You changed the subject like all liberals do.
I would change your ability and power in supporting government to legally steal my money to give it to you or your friends.
What is a "goods addict"? Who determines what one should have and not have? You? Government?

 

[Gadawg73]

I enjoy the reaction of conservatives to the utter failure of their dogma in practice.

Zero learning. Maximum blaming of "other" conservatives.

So, I guess that we have to add to the long list of groups that conservatives hate, other conservatives.

And they are truly surprised at the extent of their political failure! Surprised!

That's bizarre beyond belief.

How have I failed being a fiscal conservative?
My net worth with cash, stocks and property is 2 million.
And I have never made over 100K in one year in my life.
Fiscal conservatism is GOOD for everyone.

 

[PMZ]

A single American can make up to $46,000 a year and qualify for a subsidy for their health insurance premium.
Just plain wrong to borrow money and pass that on to our kids and grandkids to pay so someone can get a break on their health insurance today when they make $46,000 a year with no spouse or children.
40% or more of all these means test programs hand out cash and/or subsidies to people that pass the means test set by government but are not truly needy.

It sounds like you are a big fan of richer rich and poorer poor like India and China. The poor there really know their place.