Serious Question.

[rdean]

Liberal Daily Beast Columnist Kirsten Powers Gets An Unwelcome Health Care Surprise In The Mail - YouTube





so the question was why didn't obama keep his promise, leave Powers alone, and just put the 30 million un insured into medicaid?

Oh please. Remember the Bush Tax Cuts and the GOP promise they would create jobs and instead, created trillions in deficit?

Remember the Freedom Agenda in the Middle East and how we threw away trillions on Iraq? And we have to pay trillions more for Americans maimed in Iraq?

It was the insurance companies that decided to end substandard policies and replace them with competitive policies. Obama didn't understand that Republicans want to keep garbage. But I understood it. After all, they play in pigshit.

 

[boedicca]

There was no visible means of extorting profits from the taxpayers using Medicaid.

No profits for big insurance means no campaign cash.

True. What scares me is the very real possibility that insurance companies will start going bankrupt. Insurance companies are losing money from the millions of cancellations that were forced upon them because of obamacare. Add to that those that have signed or will sign on with pre-existing medical conditions, and you have the recipe for disaster. When the claims start coming in, all bets are off.

That's going to be the next Bail Out. The demographics of those who actually enroll in ObamaCare is going to send the finances into a death spiral. The poor will be put on Medicaid (no premiums), and the ones who pay will mostly be old and sick people who are money losers for the insurance companies.

 

[AVG-JOE]

I don't understand it.

No one does....

Incorrect. The agenda wasn't to cover the uninsured, it was a government takeover of the health care industry for the benefit of Big Government and its Cronies.

Not it's cronies so much as it's financial backers in the Medical Industrial Complex.

 

[daveman]

Helping people was never the intention.

Crashing the system is.

ACA is but a single step to the nationalization of the entire health-care industry.

Then everyone -- EVERYONE -- will be under government's boot.

It won't even come close to working until every single solitary American is paying FEDERAL INCOME tax. I don't think the liberals want that.

It's not intended to work. It's intended to fail spectacularly so people will DEMAND single-payer.

 

[JakeStarkey]

The feds will absorb the services and not bail out the insurance industry.

 

[rdean]

Helping people was never the intention.

Crashing the system is.

ACA is but a single step to the nationalization of the entire health-care industry.

Then everyone -- EVERYONE -- will be under government's boot.

Even more scary is going bankupt over medical bills.

 

[HelenaHandbag]

Why didn't the democrats just put the 30 million uninsured (and I'm not certain that is an accurate number)
....

46 million.

Census Bureau:

"The percentage of people without health insurance in 2009 was not statistically different from 2007 at 15.4 percent.

The number of uninsured increased to 46.3 million in 2009, from 45.7 million in 2007."

Highlights: 2009 - U.S Census Bureau

How many of that number were illegals?

How many qualified for Medicare or Medicaid, but hadn't applied?

How many were self-insured and could pay their own way, nearly no matter what medical malady befell them?

 

[boedicca]

Not it's cronies, so much as it's financial backers in the Medical Industrial Complex.

Uh. I think those are the same thing.

 

[daveman]

Oh please. Remember the Bush Tax Cuts and the GOP promise they would create jobs and instead, created trillions in deficit?

Remember the Freedom Agenda in the Middle East and how we threw away trillions on Iraq? And we have to pay trillions more for Americans maimed in Iraq?

It was the insurance companies that decided to end substandard policies and replace them with competitive policies. Obama didn't understand that Republicans want to keep garbage. But I understood it. After all, they play in pigshit.

You just can't help but lie, can you? It's hard-wired in. Water is wet, stuff falls down, rderp lies.

Yee-Haw, The Rednecks have a home. | Richard Hamm's Photojournalism Site

This year there was even a redneck wedding filmed by CMT for the show “My Big Redneck Wedding.” All in all this was a fun event. As much as I pic, the people were very nice, well until later in the day when the Natural Light and PBR had been flowing like water for several hours. For those who see these pics and want to go and shoot this next year I give you one warning. Watch out for fat kids during the mud pit belly flop contest. When they go belly first into that mud, they really do part the red sea.

​

Immediately after that is the photograph you posted.

Just another lie from rderp, pathological liar.

 

[Jughead]

There was no visible means of extorting profits from the taxpayers using Medicaid.

No profits for big insurance means no campaign cash.

True. What scares me is the very real possibility that insurance companies will start going bankrupt. Insurance companies are losing money from the millions of cancellations that were forced upon them because of obamacare. Add to that those that have signed or will sign on with pre-existing medical conditions, and you have the recipe for disaster. When the claims start coming in, all bets are off.

That's going to be the next Bail Out. The demographics of those who actually enroll in ObamaCare is going to send the finances into a death spiral. The poor will be put on Medicaid (no premiums), and the ones who pay will mostly be old and sick people who are money losers for the insurance companies.

Absolutely. Damage has already been done, however the only option here is to repeal obamacare . I see no other alternative.

 

[MeBelle]

You raise a great question:

Why not use a single-payer option, like Medicare or Medicaid instead of the cluster-fuck that is The Affordable Care Act?

​

This is why:
ON JUNE 18, 2009

The Health Care debate has been heating up in the last few days. This week, the CBO estimated that Democrats plan to cover health care will cost, at the low end, $1.6 Trillion…or more than 50% more than Obama has stated.

Another CBO report said that if they implement the Public option, and slowly roll it in, that 15 million of the 45 million people now without insurance could be covered; at a cost of $1 trillion. $1 trillion for a 1/3 solution? Not much of a bargain for a public option that is supposed to ‘reduce costs’. And the public is starting to notice.

So when Democrats talk about the ‘Public option’ on medical care, what are they talking about?

Let us simplify it: they are talking about making Medicare universally available. They want a similar program to cover people from birth to death.

Here is the problem: Medicare has no answers to the major problems with our health care system either.

Medicare: The Preamble to the Public Option

Lots of links in the link.
Interesting read.

 

[MeBelle]

Interesting discussion from 2009, before the ACA passed:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/healthcare-insurance-govt-healthcare/92005-can-public-option-work.html



It's not like the great question WillowTree raises in this thread wasn't on the table.

WYGD?​

Here's another one!

http://www.usmessageboard.com/healt...lead-to-single-payer-government-run-care.html

Medicare part D, GW's silver platter gift to the pharmaceutical lobby, will break the back of not only Medicare but the general budget if it is not addressed soon.

I'm usually not a doom & gloom kind of guy, but Part D will break this country as boomers age if it is not addressed and addressed soon.

How'd that work out @ AVG-JOE ?

Survey: Medicare Prescription Drug Benefit Earns High Marks 10 Years After Enactment - MarketWatch

 

[MeBelle]

Even more scary is going bankupt over medical bills.

Nobody cares about those measly < 1 Million people!

This year, an estimated 1.5 million Americans will declare bankruptcy. Many people may chalk up that misfortune to overspending or a lavish lifestyle, but a new study suggests that more than 60 percent of people who go bankrupt are actually capsized by medical bills.

Bankruptcies due to medical bills increased by nearly 50 percent in a six-year period, from 46 percent in 2001 to 62 percent in 2007, and most of those who filed for bankruptcy were middle-class, well-educated homeowners, according to a report that will be published in the August issue of The American Journal of Medicine.

Medical bills prompt more than 60 percent of U.S. bankruptcies - CNN.com

Woolhandler and her colleagues surveyed a random sample of 2,314 people who filed for bankruptcy in early 2007, looked at their court records, and then interviewed more than 1,000 of them.

They concluded that 62.1 percent of the bankruptcies were medically related because the individuals either had more than $5,000 (or 10 percent of their pretax income) in medical bills, mortgaged their home to pay for medical bills, or lost significant income due to an illness. On average, medically bankrupt families had $17,943 in out-of-pocket expenses, including $26,971 for those who lacked insurance and $17,749 who had insurance at some point.

~~~~

Those numbers seem so familiar...

 

[AVG-JOE]

Interesting discussion from 2009, before the ACA passed:

http://www.usmessageboard.com/healthcare-insurance-govt-healthcare/92005-can-public-option-work.html



It's not like the great question WillowTree raises in this thread wasn't on the table.

WYGD?​

Here's another one!

http://www.usmessageboard.com/healt...lead-to-single-payer-government-run-care.html

Medicare part D, GW's silver platter gift to the pharmaceutical lobby, will break the back of not only Medicare but the general budget if it is not addressed soon.

I'm usually not a doom & gloom kind of guy, but Part D will break this country as boomers age if it is not addressed and addressed soon.

How'd that work out @ AVG-JOE ?

Survey: Medicare Prescription Drug Benefit Earns High Marks 10 Years After Enactment - MarketWatch

It may earn high marks for delivery but the jury is still out regarding co$ts. I can tell you from professional experience that, because of private insurance involvement, Part D is the most difficult part of Medicare to deal with, and most people qualify for a government subsidy to pay for it.

Silver-platter gift to big pharma, paid for with borrowed tax money.

 

[MeBelle]

It may earn high marks for delivery but the jury is still out regarding co$ts. I can tell you from professional experience that, because of private insurance involvement, Part D is the most difficult part of Medicare to deal with, and most people qualify for a government subsidy to pay for it.

Silver-platter gift to big pharma, paid for with borrowed tax money.

Are either of these accurate?

2014 Medicare Part D Plan Changes - iMedicare


2014 Brings Changes
Another reason Johnson encourages participants to review their coverage is changes are coming in 2014. These changes include:
• The initial deductible will decrease by $15.
• The initial coverage limit will decrease from $2,970 to $2,850
• The out-of-pocket threshold will decrease from $4,750 to $4,550.
• During the coverage gap, beneficiaries will continue to receive a 52.5 percent discount on brand name drugs and a maximum of 72 percent co-pay on generic drugs.
Medicare Part D: Check Your Coverage - Yankton Press & Dakotan: Healthlines

 

[AVG-JOE]

Bottom line: Who pays, consumer or tax payer? Or in the current case, future tax payers, because it's all borrowed money.



If I could buy in to Medicare NOW*, while I'm young and not in need of services or drugs, then the answer to the above question when I'm old and using the coverage would be me, the consumer.

*better if I could have bought in back in my 20's, but we gotta take what we can get.




The scam of health insurance is paying a private bureaucracy monthly premiums from our 20's through half of our 60's, while we're young, healthy and not needing much in the way of services, only to be told to send the bill to the taxpayers via Medicare when we hit our late 60's, start feeling our age, and start gong to the Doc more regularly.

 

[AVG-JOE]

Is it just me, or is it weird that the conservative is arguing the 'value' of government subsidized coverage for drugs and the liberal is looking out for the taxpayer?

 

[editec]

The scam of health insurance is paying a private bureaucracy monthly premiums from our 20's through half of our 60's, while we're young, healthy and not needing much in the way of services, only to be told to send the bill to the taxpayers via Medicare when we hit our late 60's, start feeling our age, and start gong to the Doc more regularly.

Bingo!​

 

[HelenaHandbag]

Bottom line: Who pays, consumer or tax payer? Or in the current case, future tax payers, because it's all borrowed money.



If I could buy in to Medicare NOW*, while I'm young and not in need of services or drugs, then the answer to the above question when I'm old and using the coverage would be me, the consumer.

*better if I could have bought in back in my 20's, but we gotta take what we can get.




The scam of health insurance is paying a private bureaucracy monthly premiums from our 20's through half of our 60's, while we're young, healthy and not needing much in the way of services, only to be told to send the bill to the taxpayers via Medicare when we hit our late 60's, start feeling our age, and start gong to the Doc more regularly.

Sounds like as good an argument for doing away with Medicare as any I have heard.

 

[AVG-JOE]

Do you REALLY think that the private bureauracies are going to keep us on their dime during the 'golden years'?

​

Why do you think the insurance industry allowed Medicare to be formed in the first place?

​

The other option is for government to force the private bureaucracies to cover us for life, and I'm certainly not going to hold my breath.

`​