Should Obama be treated as Bush was treated when it...

[healthmyths]

There was an old probably out of date concept known as the "water's edge".. that Obama lamented recently:
"And I think traditionally, the notion has been that America's political differences end at the water's edge,"
Obama To Romney: "America's Political Differences End At The Water's Edge" | RealClearPolitics

The definition by Daniel Webster (1782-1852), while encouraging men to enlist in 1814 (during the War of 1812), said it first:
“Even our party divisions, acrimonious as they are, cease at the water’s edge. They are lost in attachment to the national character, on the element where that character is made respectable. In protecting naval interests by naval means, you will arm yourselves with the whole power of national sentiment, and may command the whole abundance of the national resources.”
The Big Apple: ?Politics stops at the water?s edge?

So should we Obama critics adhere to Obama's lament... "water's edge"...specifically regarding US/Russia/Syria/Iran..et.al...these powder keg issues?

I have a real problem because Obama and these Democrats didn't have and problem in ignoring these beyond the "water's edge" statements...

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid(D) "The war is lost, the surge is not accomplishing anything "

U.S. Rep. John Murtha(D) "Our troops killed innocent civilians in cold blood,”

Senator Kerry (D) "American soldiers going into the homes of Iraqis in the dead of night, terrorizing kids and children."

Durbin (D) "must have been done by Nazis, Soviets"--action of Americans in the treatment of their prisoners.
Senator Obama said "troops are air-raiding villages and killing civilians,"

Obama's disdain also goes to Americans when he said...
“They get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people"

Really? Those words draw people together??

And when he called fellow Americans who happen to oppose him.."enemies"??

“If Latinos sit out the election instead of, ‘we’re going to punish our enemies and we’re going to reward our friends who stand with us on issues that are important to us’ — if they don’t see that kind of upsurge in voting in this election, then I think it’s going to be harder,” Obama had said."

So should we support Obama beyond the "Water's edge" EVEN though HE had disdain for the concept before he was president?

 

[BlindBoo]

Ah rolling these tired, incomplete, out of context phrases again huh?

When American was attacked on 9-11, I recall this scene.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vgqqm3AXUY0]Congress Sings God Bless America 9-11-01 (HD) - YouTube[/ame]

President Bush had nearly universal support here and abroad until it became clear that the administration's intent was to use the emotions of that day to morph the War against those who attacked us that day into the invasion and occupation of Iraq.

 

[healthmyths]

Ah rolling these tired, incomplete, out of context phrases again huh?

When American was attacked on 9-11, I recall this scene.

Congress Sings God Bless America 9-11-01 (HD) - YouTube

President Bush had nearly universal support here and abroad until it became clear that the administration's intent was to use the emotions of that day to morph the War against those who attacked us that day into the invasion and occupation of Iraq.

Calling American troops "Terrorists" , Nazis, Soviet was OUT of context?
Telling the terrorists that US military methodically and systematically ALL the TIME were "air raiding villages" and "killing civilians" is out of context???
You are really very naive NOT to think the terrorists LOVED to use these words as examples of what EVIL people the Americans were and how they DESERVED to be killed as little kids with bombs blew up when soldiers were passing out candy!

YOU agreed evidently with the TERRORISTS that US troops like Obama,Kerry,Durbin all had such a distaste for our US military...!

 

[jwoodie]

Of course not, he is our FBP.

 

[BlindBoo]

Ah rolling these tired, incomplete, out of context phrases again huh?

When American was attacked on 9-11, I recall this scene.

Congress Sings God Bless America 9-11-01 (HD) - YouTube

President Bush had nearly universal support here and abroad until it became clear that the administration's intent was to use the emotions of that day to morph the War against those who attacked us that day into the invasion and occupation of Iraq.

Calling American troops "Terrorists" , Nazis, Soviet was OUT of context?
Telling the terrorists that US military methodically and systematically ALL the TIME were "air raiding villages" and "killing civilians" is out of context???
You are really very naive NOT to think the terrorists LOVED to use these words as examples of what EVIL people the Americans were and how they DESERVED to be killed as little kids with bombs blew up when soldiers were passing out candy!

YOU agreed evidently with the TERRORISTS that US troops like Obama,Kerry,Durbin all had such a distaste for our US military...!

Here is Kerry's full quote. He simply did not call our soldiers terrorist. (The echo-chamber told you he did.)

"there is no reason ... that young American soldiers need to be going into the homes of Iraqis in the dead of night, terrorizing kids and children, you know, women, breaking sort of the customs of the -- of -- the historical customs, religious customs. ... Iraqis should be doing that."

Furthermore your quote from then candidate Obama was not only out of context but it was completely inaccurate.

"We've got to get the job done there and that requires us to have enough troops so that we're not just air-raiding villages and killing civilians, which is causing enormous problems there,"

Where is the "methodically and systematically ALL the TIME" phrase you might ask? It's not there because he never said it.

 

[Surfer]

No. He should get a free pass from the world just like he is getting from most of the media.
I can remember people calling Bush a murderer, killer, terrorist, monster and every other hideous name in the book. I was ashamed for them. And now Obama is doing the same thing only no one seems to notice or care.
Gas prices have tripled since the election. Unemployment is horrible (30% in some CA cities). Housing prices are still in the toilet as record numbers of foreclosures and short sales saturate the market. A record-high number of Americans are on handouts. Most of them are able-bodied/minded but too lazy to work. We are paying criminal aliens to steal our jobs and for their medical, dental, housing, education etc.
Record numbers of Americans are depressed, on anti-depressants and fearful about their futures. A new report says 76% live paycheck-to-paycheck.
I think Obama is an awful president.

 

[jwoodie]

Bush didn't win the Nobel Peace Prize...

 

[BlindBoo]

No. He should get a free pass from the world just like he is getting from most of the media.
I can remember people calling Bush a murderer, killer, terrorist, monster and every other hideous name in the book. I was ashamed for them. And now Obama is doing the same thing only no one seems to notice or care.
Gas prices have tripled since the election. Unemployment is horrible (30% in some CA cities). Housing prices are still in the toilet as record numbers of foreclosures and short sales saturate the market. A record-high number of Americans are on handouts. Most of them are able-bodied/minded but too lazy to work. We are paying criminal aliens to steal our jobs and for their medical, dental, housing, education etc.
Record numbers of Americans are depressed, on anti-depressants and fearful about their futures. A new report says 76% live paycheck-to-paycheck.
I think Obama is an awful president.

You can always tell someone is either being disingenuous or doesn't know any better when they try and use the old "Gas Prices tripled under......" meme. Here is a list of weekly gas prices since 79. Look at the prices in the weeks before Oct 2008 and then after Oct. 2008. Any thing happen at that time that would cut Gas prices in half? Trying to blame the incoming president for settling of prices back up to the historical norms without taking the economic calamity that was happening into consideration is typical on these boards.

http://www.randomuseless.info/gasprice/gasprice.txt

 

[FJO]

Bush didn't win the Nobel Peace Prize...

Obama did not EARN the Nobel Peace Prize.

 

[g5000]

For me, the "water's edge" statement means we should present a unified front to the rest of the world. We may bicker internally, but stand united when dealing with the rest of the world.

This is a strategy which works for parenting, as well.

However, really bad foreign policy, for which the Executive is responsible, will fracture that solid resolve. And it should. If a President starts a war for wrong reasons, it would be insane to stand with him to defend such a catastrophe before the whole world.

In 2008, the world was pretty pissed at us over Iraq. And the world greeted Obama with open arms because they believed we were sending a unified message of contrition, signaling we had snapped back to our senses.


The funny thing is, I have a million problems with Obama domestically. But foreign policy-wise, he has done almost everything as correctly as it can be done. I have few complaints in that arena.

It is mind-boggling to observe that when Obama travels abroad to do what Presidents are obliged to do under the Constitution, the more profound of our retards can be found crying over the hotel bill. Talk about missing the forest for the trees!!!

 

[g5000]

It has to be surreal to be the President abroad these days.

I mean, you travel to Europe to meet with other world leaders to discuss the Iranian nuclear weapons program. This is a situation which could cause a nuclear arms race in a part of the world that is chock full of unstable hotheads. Every word you say, every move you make, you are aware that a single misstep could result in the entire Middle East going up in smoke. The negotiations are strained, difficult, and incredibly imporant.

But when you turn on Fox News, what do you see? Nothing about the business at hand, but bitching over what hotel you stayed in!!!

This is profound retardation. This is IQs diving toward the single digits, folks. This is going to the water's edge and taking a shit.

 

[healthmyths]

Ah rolling these tired, incomplete, out of context phrases again huh?

When American was attacked on 9-11, I recall this scene.

Congress Sings God Bless America 9-11-01 (HD) - YouTube

President Bush had nearly universal support here and abroad until it became clear that the administration's intent was to use the emotions of that day to morph the War against those who attacked us that day into the invasion and occupation of Iraq.

Calling American troops "Terrorists" , Nazis, Soviet was OUT of context?
Telling the terrorists that US military methodically and systematically ALL the TIME were "air raiding villages" and "killing civilians" is out of context???
You are really very naive NOT to think the terrorists LOVED to use these words as examples of what EVIL people the Americans were and how they DESERVED to be killed as little kids with bombs blew up when soldiers were passing out candy!

YOU agreed evidently with the TERRORISTS that US troops like Obama,Kerry,Durbin all had such a distaste for our US military...!

Here is Kerry's full quote. He simply did not call our soldiers terrorist. (The echo-chamber told you he did.)

"there is no reason ... that young American soldiers need to be going into the homes of Iraqis in the dead of night, terrorizing kids and children, you know, women, breaking sort of the customs of the -- of -- the historical customs, religious customs. ... Iraqis should be doing that."

Furthermore your quote from then candidate Obama was not only out of context but it was completely inaccurate.

"We've got to get the job done there and that requires us to have enough troops so that we're not just air-raiding villages and killing civilians, which is causing enormous problems there,"

Where is the "methodically and systematically ALL the TIME" phrase you might ask? It's not there because he never said it.

So if someone is TERRORIZING KIDS AND CHILDREN...that is not a TERRORIST??? Sorry but if you use the word to make our troops look like the bad guys, then I can make you be a BAD guy by saying Kerry called our troops "TERRORIST" because he said they "terrorizing kids..."!

There was NO where it was said "methodically and systematically..ALL THE TIME" by Obama!
I said any one who wants to use these words stupidly used by OBAMA would make them totally OUT OF CONTEXT!!!
The point was these idiots would USE these words to advance their political agenda! That was their purpose!

People like you and the above that love to bash our military used words that the bad guys LOVED to repeat!


FACT Here is a Harvard Study... read it and understand the power of words!!!

THE "EMBOLDENMENT EFFECT"
"Are insurgents in Iraq emboldened by voices in the news media expressing dissent or calling for troop withdrawals from Iraq?
The short answer is YES!!! according to Radha Iyengar, a Robert Wood Johnson Scholar in health policy research at Harvard and Jonathan Monten of the Belfer Center at the university's Kennedy School of Government.

STUDY ABSTRACT
Are insurgents affected by information on US casualty sensitivity?
Using data on attacks and variation in access to international news across Iraqi provinces, we identify an “emboldenment” effect by comparing the rate of insurgent
attacks in areas with higher and lower access to information about U.S news after public statements critical of the war.
We find in periods after a spike in war-critical statements, insurgent attacks increases by 5-10 percent.

The results suggest that insurgent groups respond rationally to expected probability of US withdrawal.
On a related note, the New York Times reports that the media aren't paying as much attention to Iraq as they used to:
Media attention on Iraq began to wane after the first months of fighting, but as recently as the middle of last year, it was still the most-covered topic.
Since then, Iraq coverage by major American news sources has plummeted to about one-fifth of what it was last summer, according to the Project for Excellence in Journalism.
If the Harvard study is right, we may be looking at a virtuous circle: Less violence means less media coverage, which in turn means less violence, says the Wall Street Journal.
Perhaps one day we'll wake up to discover that America won the war in Iraq months earlier, but no one noticed because the reporters were all busy with other things.
Victory in Iraq Day, November 22, 2008

 

[BlindBoo]

Calling American troops "Terrorists" , Nazis, Soviet was OUT of context?
Telling the terrorists that US military methodically and systematically ALL the TIME were "air raiding villages" and "killing civilians" is out of context???
You are really very naive NOT to think the terrorists LOVED to use these words as examples of what EVIL people the Americans were and how they DESERVED to be killed as little kids with bombs blew up when soldiers were passing out candy!

YOU agreed evidently with the TERRORISTS that US troops like Obama,Kerry,Durbin all had such a distaste for our US military...!

Here is Kerry's full quote. He simply did not call our soldiers terrorist. (The echo-chamber told you he did.)

"there is no reason ... that young American soldiers need to be going into the homes of Iraqis in the dead of night, terrorizing kids and children, you know, women, breaking sort of the customs of the -- of -- the historical customs, religious customs. ... Iraqis should be doing that."

Furthermore your quote from then candidate Obama was not only out of context but it was completely inaccurate.

"We've got to get the job done there and that requires us to have enough troops so that we're not just air-raiding villages and killing civilians, which is causing enormous problems there,"

Where is the "methodically and systematically ALL the TIME" phrase you might ask? It's not there because he never said it.

So if someone is TERRORIZING KIDS AND CHILDREN...that is not a TERRORIST??? Sorry but if you use the word to make our troops look like the bad guys, then I can make you be a BAD guy by saying Kerry called our troops "TERRORIST" because he said they "terrorizing kids..."!

There was NO where it was said "methodically and systematically..ALL THE TIME" by Obama!
I said any one who wants to use these words stupidly used by OBAMA would make them totally OUT OF CONTEXT!!!
The point was these idiots would USE these words to advance their political agenda! That was their purpose!

People like you and the above that love to bash our military used words that the bad guys LOVED to repeat!


FACT Here is a Harvard Study... read it and understand the power of words!!!

THE "EMBOLDENMENT EFFECT"
"Are insurgents in Iraq emboldened by voices in the news media expressing dissent or calling for troop withdrawals from Iraq?
The short answer is YES!!! according to Radha Iyengar, a Robert Wood Johnson Scholar in health policy research at Harvard and Jonathan Monten of the Belfer Center at the university's Kennedy School of Government.

STUDY ABSTRACT
Are insurgents affected by information on US casualty sensitivity?
Using data on attacks and variation in access to international news across Iraqi provinces, we identify an “emboldenment” effect by comparing the rate of insurgent
attacks in areas with higher and lower access to information about U.S news after public statements critical of the war.
We find in periods after a spike in war-critical statements, insurgent attacks increases by 5-10 percent.

The results suggest that insurgent groups respond rationally to expected probability of US withdrawal.
On a related note, the New York Times reports that the media aren't paying as much attention to Iraq as they used to:
Media attention on Iraq began to wane after the first months of fighting, but as recently as the middle of last year, it was still the most-covered topic.
Since then, Iraq coverage by major American news sources has plummeted to about one-fifth of what it was last summer, according to the Project for Excellence in Journalism.
If the Harvard study is right, we may be looking at a virtuous circle: Less violence means less media coverage, which in turn means less violence, says the Wall Street Journal.
Perhaps one day we'll wake up to discover that America won the war in Iraq months earlier, but no one noticed because the reporters were all busy with other things.
Victory in Iraq Day, November 22, 2008

Then you're simply using the English language to perpetuate a lie.

Yes I think the terrorist we've faced for decades are embolden by the schism the Republicans create every time we have a democrat president.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

For me, the "water's edge" statement means we should present a unified front to the rest of the world. We may bicker internally, but stand united when dealing with the rest of the world.

This is a strategy which works for parenting, as well.

However, really bad foreign policy, for which the Executive is responsible, will fracture that solid resolve. And it should. If a President starts a war for wrong reasons, it would be insane to stand with him to defend such a catastrophe before the whole world.

In 2008, the world was pretty pissed at us over Iraq. And the world greeted Obama with open arms because they believed we were sending a unified message of contrition, signaling we had snapped back to our senses.


The funny thing is, I have a million problems with Obama domestically. But foreign policy-wise, he has done almost everything as correctly as it can be done. I have few complaints in that arena.

It is mind-boggling to observe that when Obama travels abroad to do what Presidents are obliged to do under the Constitution, the more profound of our retards can be found crying over the hotel bill. Talk about missing the forest for the trees!!!

Few complaints in the arena of foreign policy?
How could you possibly think he has done well?
Please list those accomplishments that he has been the leading cause of...