Should There Be An "Opt-Out" Clause With The New ACA To Make Right Winger's Happy?

[dblack]

How about an opt IN. If you want obamacare....want to take advantage of it..... PAY for it.

That's the point of the ACA. The freeloaders need to stop mooching off of others and get their own healthcare insurance, and if they keep pissing about growing up as it's against their "freedom", then they can agree to the "opt out" clause as stated above.

Yes. Ignorance is truth, War is strength, etc... heard it all before. And now the people who want to remain responsible for their own healthcare, rather than submit to mandated dependency and a lifetime of perpetual debt to the insurance industry - these people are the "freeloaders".

 

[Stephanie]

Ever since the affordable care act was passed, the right wingers have been going into a complete rampage over having to actually grow up and get health insurance, instead of just freeloading off the rest of the hard working americans.

Now to shut them up and for them to keep their "freedom", should there be an opt-out clause? By signing an opt out wavier, this would mean an up front payment for all medical services. If they require expensive treatment, this will all be need to be paid up front (cash, no credit or loans would be applicable) and the same with a 911 call or emergency.

They would have to "carry their papers" such as a bank statement with a debit card or credit card (no checks) to cover the likely $600 ambulance ride, plus $1,000 to walk in the door of an ER. From there the care would be only administered by how much funds they have available. Run out, then you get a wheel chair ride to the curb, no matter how sick. Sound fair?

There’s no making conservatives happy, they love being miserable.

well hell yeah, we all can't be as pleased about being hosed down by Obama as you ObamaBots, when he PROMISED he wouldn't raise taxes on anyone who made less than 250,000 then proceed to raise the largest cigarette taxes of any President, and then we get OBAMATAX

 

[Wacky Quacky]

Just like Mitt recognized in MA, you cannot allow people to opt out when you are putting such expenses onto the for profit health care industry. Simply you are forcing them to take the sick which lowers their profits. This will cause their investors to look for better deals decreasing their value. By not allowing the health care companies to drop their biggest expenses, sick people, you are hitting them hard. You either have to eliminate for profit health insurance for something else, or you have to give them some government assistance, and force customers to use them.

The reason single payer care can work is everyone pays into it through taxes. in this case instead of the government you are putting a for profit company as where we put all of our money. I personally would rather pay to the government than a for profit money grubbing death panel, but whatever way we chose we have to pay or it fails. Opting out is the syustenm we had before obamacare. if you did not want to deal with the horrors of health insurance you opted out of paying. this caused a lot of the problems as health insurance companies sought to maximize profits for their investors which meant screwing over the people putting money in.

I really hate the liberal buzz phrase, "for profit". Why the hell do you think people start business? FOR PROFIT! Otherwise they wouldn't even bother.

 

[syrenn]

I suspect you have credible detailed facts to back that up?

yeah.. its called how you work a ponzi scheme...... obamacare is nothing different.

Do you know what a Ponzi scheme is?

Social Security Online - HISTORY, Ponzi Schemes vs. Social Security

Do you?

 

[dblack]

They would have to "carry their papers" such as a bank statement with a debit card or credit card (no checks) to cover the likely $600 ambulance ride, plus $1,000 to walk in the door of an ER. From there the care would be only administered by how much funds they have available. Run out, then you get a wheel chair ride to the curb, no matter how sick. Sound fair?

Rather than indulge your Nazi wet dreams, why not just leave it up to hospitals and doctors? Let them decide who they treat, and how they deal with the bills. If they're like you, and they want be stingy hardasses, they can do that. Some of us will avoid those kinds of assholes, but it would right up your alley, so I'm sure they'd still find a few patients. The rest of us can maintain a sane world where people make their own judgments on who to help and who to turn away.

 

[Stephanie]

Just like Mitt recognized in MA, you cannot allow people to opt out when you are putting such expenses onto the for profit health care industry. Simply you are forcing them to take the sick which lowers their profits. This will cause their investors to look for better deals decreasing their value. By not allowing the health care companies to drop their biggest expenses, sick people, you are hitting them hard. You either have to eliminate for profit health insurance for something else, or you have to give them some government assistance, and force customers to use them.

The reason single payer care can work is everyone pays into it through taxes. in this case instead of the government you are putting a for profit company as where we put all of our money. I personally would rather pay to the government than a for profit money grubbing death panel, but whatever way we chose we have to pay or it fails. Opting out is the syustenm we had before obamacare. if you did not want to deal with the horrors of health insurance you opted out of paying. this caused a lot of the problems as health insurance companies sought to maximize profits for their investors which meant screwing over the people putting money in.

I really hate the liberal buzz phrase, "for profit". Why the hell do you think people start business? FOR PROFIT! Otherwise they wouldn't even bother.

that's the brainwashing...and it's scary it's working

 

[uscitizen]

Ahh but the question has become one of is for profit healtchare pricing itself out of the market?
How much longer can we afford double digit health care annual cost increases?

 

[g5000]

Ever since the affordable care act was passed, the right wingers have been going into a complete rampage over having to actually grow up and get health insurance, instead of just freeloading off the rest of the hard working americans.

Now to shut them up and for them to keep their "freedom", should there be an opt-out clause? By signing an opt out wavier, this would mean an up front payment for all medical services. If they require expensive treatment, this will all be need to be paid up front (cash, no credit or loans would be applicable) and the same with a 911 call or emergency.

They would have to "carry their papers" such as a bank statement with a debit card or credit card (no checks) to cover the likely $600 ambulance ride, plus $1,000 to walk in the door of an ER. From there the care would be only administered by how much funds they have available. Run out, then you get a wheel chair ride to the curb, no matter how sick. Sound fair?

The Insurance Mandate Shell Game

The mandate is not for making the voluntarily uninsured pay for their own medical care when they need it years from now.

The mandate is for the purpose of paying for the cost of high school dropouts being added today.

No amount of lies will cover up the fact that adding millions of people to the government dole will be extremely expensive. The Democrats want you to believe it will somehow be free.

Of course it won't be. Only a true blue moron would believe it is free.

It will add billions of dollars a year to every state's budget starting in 2019. The fuse on that bomb is that long because the Democrats pay for all the high school dropouts Medicaid with federal dollars for the first few years before yanking that money away. Classic Democratic dependency creation.

In 2019, when the federal money goes away, the states are going to be between a rock and hard place, exactly where Obama wants them. The ACA will have added millions of high school dropouts to the Medicaid rolls, paid for with federal dollars. That goes on for five years. That's the dependency creation. Then the federal money goes away. So the states will either have to eliminate all those new high school dropouts they added for the previous five years and face riots in the streets, or they will have to raise taxes on everyone else.

And where will Obama be in 2019?

Yeah. Ain't that quite a trick?

Good luck with that.

There is no study out there which proves the meme that adding people to the dole will lower costs due to preventative care. In fact, the latest and greatest and most comprehensive study proves it is extremely costly.

Remember, this was supposed to be about bending down the cost of health care. We were told over and over and over that the status quo was just going to keep driving up the cost of health care. Remember all that shit about per capita spending?

Funny, we don't hear that any more. And that is because the one thing the ACA was supposed to accomplish, it won't accomplish.

The cost of health care is going to continue to rise.

So the Democrats have nothing to go on except, "it's the right thing to do."

It's the right thing to force a mandate and extra state taxes on people to pay for other people's fuckups. All those high school dropouts and all those single mothers. That's the thinking at work here. Don't kid yourself.

Fact: One third of all involuntarily uninsured are high school dropouts.
Fact: One third of all black children are in single parent families.

When the fuck are you assholes going to solve the actual problems instead of making the rest of us pay for them?

The (Poor) State of Black Families

 

[Black_Label]

Ever since the affordable care act was passed, the right wingers have been going into a complete rampage over having to actually grow up and get health insurance, instead of just freeloading off the rest of the hard working americans.

Now to shut them up and for them to keep their "freedom", should there be an opt-out clause? By signing an opt out wavier, this would mean an up front payment for all medical services. If they require expensive treatment, this will all be need to be paid up front (cash, no credit or loans would be applicable) and the same with a 911 call or emergency.

They would have to "carry their papers" such as a bank statement with a debit card or credit card (no checks) to cover the likely $600 ambulance ride, plus $1,000 to walk in the door of an ER. From there the care would be only administered by how much funds they have available. Run out, then you get a wheel chair ride to the curb, no matter how sick. Sound fair?

Why would they need to pay up front if they have insurance? Or are you suggesting that your opt out system would make insurance companies forcibly drop everyone who doesn't opt in? You're not making much sense with your hyperbole situation.

However, even then I would only support it if I could also opt out of social security, Medicare, Medicaid, and any other government programs that are supposedly for my own good.

Those that currently have insurance are not affected by the ACA. This is for those that currently do not have insurance, and refuse to get it.

 

[Political Junky]

Ever since the affordable care act was passed, the right wingers have been going into a complete rampage over having to actually grow up and get health insurance, instead of just freeloading off the rest of the hard working americans.

Now to shut them up and for them to keep their "freedom", should there be an opt-out clause? By signing an opt out wavier, this would mean an up front payment for all medical services. If they require expensive treatment, this will all be need to be paid up front (cash, no credit or loans would be applicable) and the same with a 911 call or emergency.

They would have to "carry their papers" such as a bank statement with a debit card or credit card (no checks) to cover the likely $600 ambulance ride, plus $1,000 to walk in the door of an ER. From there the care would be only administered by how much funds they have available. Run out, then you get a wheel chair ride to the curb, no matter how sick. Sound fair?

Yep then if they opt out get sick and have no insurance they can just die.

Exactly.

 

[Lakhota]

yeah.. its called how you work a ponzi scheme...... obamacare is nothing different.

Do you know what a Ponzi scheme is?

Social Security Online - HISTORY, Ponzi Schemes vs. Social Security

Do you?

Yes, I do.

A Venn Diagram for Rick Perry: Social Security Is Not a Ponzi Scheme | Mother Jones

 

[Charles_Main]

Ever since the affordable care act was passed, the right wingers have been going into a complete rampage over having to actually grow up and get health insurance, instead of just freeloading off the rest of the hard working americans.

Now to shut them up and for them to keep their "freedom", should there be an opt-out clause? By signing an opt out wavier, this would mean an up front payment for all medical services. If they require expensive treatment, this will all be need to be paid up front (cash, no credit or loans would be applicable) and the same with a 911 call or emergency.

They would have to "carry their papers" such as a bank statement with a debit card or credit card (no checks) to cover the likely $600 ambulance ride, plus $1,000 to walk in the door of an ER. From there the care would be only administered by how much funds they have available. Run out, then you get a wheel chair ride to the curb, no matter how sick. Sound fair?

There already is dip Shit, According to the SCOTUS the States do not have to Participate in the MC expansion, that was a Huge part of the Bill. Now, Seeing how the Bill only helps the States pay for this massive Expansion to something they already can not afford for the first couple of years. Each state now has a Choice, Do we Massively Expand Access to MC, and therefore our Costs, Knowing that the Federal Dollars only last a couple years, and after that Each State will be Forced to Raise Taxes or Make Huge Budget Cuts to continue funding it.

So I foresee many States Opting out of the MC Expansion, Which will mean the ACA will fail to Cover as Much, or as Many people as we were Told.

The Bill is Compromised, and Flawed, It was from the Start. But now in light of the Ruling Regarding the MC expansion, and he Exchange Opt Outs, It is even more Flawed.

 

[g5000]

Ahh but the question has become one of is for profit healtchare pricing itself out of the market?
How much longer can we afford double digit health care annual cost increases?

The ACA does nothing to bend the cost curve down.

It was about getting votes and power, and nothing more.

 

[Wacky Quacky]

Ahh but the question has become one of is for profit healtchare pricing itself out of the market?
How much longer can we afford double digit health care annual cost increases?

Take that up with doctors, nurses, and the hospital board. Insurance is a necessary evil because health care costs so much, not the other way around.

 

[Black_Label]

I don't see why you right wingers are deflecting and going nuts, it's pretty simple.

If you currently have health care = you are not effected.

If you currently don't have heathcare, but you will under the ACA = you are not effected.

If you currently don't have healthcare, and feel you "need to stick it to da libs" you can opt out with the conditions in the OP.

 

[Wacky Quacky]

Ever since the affordable care act was passed, the right wingers have been going into a complete rampage over having to actually grow up and get health insurance, instead of just freeloading off the rest of the hard working americans.

Now to shut them up and for them to keep their "freedom", should there be an opt-out clause? By signing an opt out wavier, this would mean an up front payment for all medical services. If they require expensive treatment, this will all be need to be paid up front (cash, no credit or loans would be applicable) and the same with a 911 call or emergency.

They would have to "carry their papers" such as a bank statement with a debit card or credit card (no checks) to cover the likely $600 ambulance ride, plus $1,000 to walk in the door of an ER. From there the care would be only administered by how much funds they have available. Run out, then you get a wheel chair ride to the curb, no matter how sick. Sound fair?

Why would they need to pay up front if they have insurance? Or are you suggesting that your opt out system would make insurance companies forcibly drop everyone who doesn't opt in? You're not making much sense with your hyperbole situation.

However, even then I would only support it if I could also opt out of social security, Medicare, Medicaid, and any other government programs that are supposedly for my own good.

Those that currently have insurance are not affected by the ACA. This is for those that currently do not have insurance, and refuse to get it.

Ah, now I see where you're going with this. I think it would be up to the doctors to work out an arrangement.

 

[g5000]

I don't see why you right wingers are deflecting and going nuts, it's pretty simple.

If you currently have health care = you are not effected.

If you currently don't have heathcare, but you will under the ACA = you are not effected.

If you currently don't have healthcare, and feel you "need to stick it to da libs" you can opt out with the conditions in the OP.

We will all be affected (not "effected") when our state taxes skyrocket because of the ACA providing free healthcare to high school dropouts and immigrants.

The only deflection going on are attempts like yours to put up a lot of smoke and mirrors to hide this reality.

That's why you need to force everyone else into the pool. To pay for all the freeloaders.

The voluntarily uninsured, by definition, are people who can afford health insurance but choose not to. It is their money you need now to pay for the freeloader high school dropouts and illegal aliens or the whole ACA collapses on itself.

THAT is why there is a mandate.

 

[uscitizen]

Ahh but the question has become one of is for profit healtchare pricing itself out of the market?
How much longer can we afford double digit health care annual cost increases?

The ACA does nothing to bend the cost curve down.

It was about getting votes and power, and nothing more.

it is hopefully the first step in converting to single payor socialized health care.

 

[syrenn]

Do you know what a Ponzi scheme is?

Social Security Online - HISTORY, Ponzi Schemes vs. Social Security

Do you?

Yes, I do.

A Venn Diagram for Rick Perry: Social Security Is Not a Ponzi Scheme | Mother Jones

.

obamacare is a ponzi scheme..... deal with it.

 

[Greenbeard]

Ever since the affordable care act was passed, the right wingers have been going into a complete rampage over having to actually grow up and get health insurance, instead of just freeloading off the rest of the hard working americans.

Now to shut them up and for them to keep their "freedom", should there be an opt-out clause? By signing an opt out wavier, this would mean an up front payment for all medical services. If they require expensive treatment, this will all be need to be paid up front (cash, no credit or loans would be applicable) and the same with a 911 call or emergency.

They would have to "carry their papers" such as a bank statement with a debit card or credit card (no checks) to cover the likely $600 ambulance ride, plus $1,000 to walk in the door of an ER. From there the care would be only administered by how much funds they have available. Run out, then you get a wheel chair ride to the curb, no matter how sick. Sound fair?

Why would they need to pay up front if they have insurance? Or are you suggesting that your opt out system would make insurance companies forcibly drop everyone who doesn't opt in? You're not making much sense with your hyperbole situation.

...having insurance is opting in. What he seems to be suggesting here is that by choosing to go uninsured without penalty, you should cede the right to receive any uncompensated care, even the care ERs are required by EMTALA to provide you in emergency situations.

Seems a bit untenable in modern times.