Soft Heads In Senate Gun Control Hearing

[idb]

These politicians KNOW that assault weapons are used in only 2.5% of all murders. That's not important, the fact that they are used in 100% of the revolutions that removes tyrants from power is the figure they ARE AFRAID OF. It hit's too close to home. A government that fears it's people is a Democracy, When people fear it's government it's a tyranny. Who fears who now days?

We both fear each other now. They know we are sufficiently armed, but we know that they are superiorly armed.

Overall, the people would win a war against the Federal Government after years of bloody struggle and tens of millions dead, tens of more millions of civilians dying from disease and starvation as the economy goes to shit.

The problem is how weak we would be to foreign invasion, after such a war took place.

So the problem for people who are willing to die for their freedom is two-fold. If we don't resist the federal government, they will become tyrants. If we do resist the federal government, the chaos and disorder would weaken us to foreign invasion, allowing new tyrants to take over. The question is, could we continue to fight and repel the new tyrants after second era of war and struggle? Is it even worth trying to resist and just give into the hybrid Communism/Fascism world government and just a hope a giant meteor hits the Earth in the future, or a solar flare wipes out the energy grid, in order to overthrow them later?

I've often wondered..."Who are 'they'"?

Does the gummint keep an army for the specific purpose of attacking the American people in a shed somewhere?
What would they be hoping to achieve? What would set off the attack?

 

[The2ndAmendment]

Are you saying that freedom is not worth the cost any longer? I'm sure the Founding Fathers heard the same kind of talk. Freedom is worth WHATEVER it cost.

For you and me, it is worth the cost. In fact, when a revolution starts, I'm going to be the first one to die. I'm going to dress in traditional 18th Century Calvary attire, with nothing but a cheap bulletproof vest underneath, grab my family's heirloom saber, get my horse, and charge valiantly, but uselessly into the firing line that is oppressing the people who are peacefully protesting.

However, for many other who do think like us, they will not help, they will cave in and choose to be enslaved. Even the ones that do fight, they will not be there for the 2nd revolution against foreign powers, because they'll either be dead, or too discouraged and full of hopelessness.

 

[nodoginnafight]

And -you- have proven me correct.

And you made that assumption before hand.
Ever hear the term self-fulfilling prophecy? Know how that works?

I can only barely begin to describe how boring you are - espcially ironic, given that all you're doing is proving me right.

Do you have anything to offer the pro-gun side in echange for their cooperation in enacting the limits you want, or not?

IF a universal background check and sales database legislation is passed we will offer you the ability to stay out of jail if you comply.

We don't owe you anything more.

Do you have anything to offer 92% of Americans in return for NOT passing legislation that they favor?

 

[idb]

And -you- have proven me correct.

If I -represented- the anti-gun side, and you've already stated that I/we have nothing to offer, where's the starting point for discussion?

You could TRY to prove me wrong by offering something.
Your repeated failure to do so only bolsters my position that you, indeed, have nothing.

Why?
I assume that you're an honest and thoughtful person.
You've already made it clear that you can't be swayed in your opinions.
There's no point in making an offer.

I will say this though.
Public opinion is showing concern with gun violence and a wish for more regulation of access to guns.
If gun owners take your position and refuse to be involved, they will allow the discussions to be dominated by one side.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

I've often wondered..."Who are 'they'"?

Any Redcoat and Loyalist who thinks like you do.

 

[M14 Shooter]

And you made that assumption before hand.
Ever hear the term self-fulfilling prophecy? Know how that works?

I can only barely begin to describe how boring you are - espcially ironic, given that all you're doing is proving me right.

Do you have anything to offer the pro-gun side in echange for their cooperation in enacting the limits you want, or not?

IF a universal background check and sales database legislation is passed we will offer you the ability to stay out of jail if you comply.
We don't owe you anything more.

I rest my case.
Thank you for proving my assertion, that you have nothing to offer the pro-gun side in exchange for their cooperation in passing the restrictions you want, illustrating beyond any doubt that there is no reason they should give a up single inch.

 

[M14 Shooter]

If I -represented- the anti-gun side, and you've already stated that I/we have nothing to offer, where's the starting point for discussion?

You could TRY to prove me wrong by offering something.
Your repeated failure to do so only bolsters my position that you, indeed, have nothing.

Why?
I assume that you're an honest and thoughtful person.
You've already made it clear that you can't be swayed in your opinions.
There's no point in making an offer.

And so, my statements stands:
There's no reason the pro-gun side should give an inch, because the anti-gun side is, as demonstrated, unwilling to compromise.

 

[OKTexas]

The Left is going to keep pushing this so that they can get what they really what... For now at least..


100% background checks and gun registration.

That won't happen in the next 2 years, the GOP house will never pass it.

 

[idb]

You could TRY to prove me wrong by offering something.
Your repeated failure to do so only bolsters my position that you, indeed, have nothing.

Why?
I assume that you're an honest and thoughtful person.
You've already made it clear that you can't be swayed in your opinions.
There's no point in making an offer.

And so, my statements stands:
There's no reason the pro-gun side should give an inch, because the anti-gun side is, as demonstrated, unwilling to compromise.

Then the 'pro-gun side' will have regulation measures imposed on them without their input.
Oh well.

In actual fact, what you label the 'anti-gun side' - those that favour some form of regulation - will have a large number of gun-owners.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

That won't happen in the next 2 years, the GOP house will never pass it.

Are you sure about that?

 

[M14 Shooter]

Why?
I assume that you're an honest and thoughtful person.
You've already made it clear that you can't be swayed in your opinions.
There's no point in making an offer.

And so, my statements stands:
There's no reason the pro-gun side should give an inch, because the anti-gun side is, as demonstrated, unwilling to compromise.

Then the 'pro-gun side' will have regulation measures imposed on them without their input...

Which does not change the fact that you expect acquiescense, not compromise.

 

[OKTexas]

And you made that assumption before hand.
Ever hear the term self-fulfilling prophecy? Know how that works?

I can only barely begin to describe how boring you are - espcially ironic, given that all you're doing is proving me right.

Do you have anything to offer the pro-gun side in echange for their cooperation in enacting the limits you want, or not?

IF a universal background check and sales database legislation is passed we will offer you the ability to stay out of jail if you comply.

We don't owe you anything more.

Do you have anything to offer 92% of Americans in return for NOT passing legislation that they favor?

The 92% you keep quoting are in favor of background checks, nothing more.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

The 92% you keep quoting are in favor of background checks, nothing more.

Then after the next mass shooting takes place, the Dems will say that backround checks aren't enough, and that confiscation is the only option (Like Governor Andrew Cuomo just said).

And 92% will agree with them once again.

 

[OKTexas]

That won't happen in the next 2 years, the GOP house will never pass it.

Are you sure about that?

Short answer, yes. Do you ever wonder how many people on this board actually communicate with their members of congress? I would bet a very small number, I've told mine I would like to see NICS made available to private citizens to do background checks on private sales, with no records keeping requirements. What have you told yours?

 

[idb]

And so, my statements stands:
There's no reason the pro-gun side should give an inch, because the anti-gun side is, as demonstrated, unwilling to compromise.

Then the 'pro-gun side' will have regulation measures imposed on them without their input...

Which does not change the fact that you expect acquiescense, not compromise.

That isn't a fact.
I expect nothing.
Is this another gun-nut conspiracy theory?

 

[M14 Shooter]

Then the 'pro-gun side' will have regulation measures imposed on them without their input...

Which does not change the fact that you expect acquiescense, not compromise.

That isn't a fact. I expect nothing.

This is -obviously- not true.

 

[idb]

Which does not change the fact that you expect acquiescense, not compromise.

That isn't a fact. I expect nothing.

This is -obviously- not true.

I was right...another conspiracy theory.
You should be digging, not typing - you probably don't have much time left before he comes.

 

[M14 Shooter]

That isn't a fact. I expect nothing.

This is -obviously- not true.

I was right...another conspiracy theory.

There's no theory here, only fact: the anti-gun side isn't interested in compromise.

 

[g5000]

Register gun buyers, not guns.

You prove your eligibility to vote during the registration process, and then you are allowed to vote whenever and for whoever you wish, and it is none of the government's business how you vote.

You prove your eligibility to buy guns during the registration process, and then you are allowed to buy a gun whenever you wish, and it is none of the government's business what you buy.

When you vote, you tell the nice old lady your name and address and she looks you up on the eligible voter's list. Then she lets you vote. Your vote is secret. If you are a Mexican citizen, you won't be on the list.

When you buy a gun, you tell the nice dude your name and address and he looks you up on the eligible gun buyer's list. If you made the list, he sells you a weapon. Your purchase is secret.

If you are on either list and aren't supposed to be, that's the government's fault. The government wants to control stuff, then they should be responsible for it being done correctly, not the citizens who are exercising their rights.

The only problem with that is that when you decide to sell that gun, do you have access to that list? Do you have a responsibility to guarantee that the person you are selling to is eligible or is the responsibility completely on the person buying the gun?

How do you do that now?

The government doesn't know HOW you voted, but they know you did vote. So why not let's allow a sales database and mandatory background checks so the law enforcement agencies can know who bought a gun if that gun is later involved in a crime?

I have absolutely no problem with a minimal paper trail so we can find our way to folks who are selling guns illegally. It doesn't interfere with anyone's right to own a gun at all.

If I want to sell a gun to you, private seller to private buyer, how would I do a background check on you?

Freedom is not painless. I do not want Big Brother having an inventory of my property, whether it is guns or computer printers or whatever, when I have not committed a crime.

 

[The2ndAmendment]

I have a serious question about these "Private sales."

How the F**K can the government enforce these laws on private sales?

Think of it this way, it a kid at school buys chewing gum from his friend for a dollar, or even free, and there was a law regulating the "private sale" of chewing gum, how the hell would the government:

1) Know that there was private sale of bubble gum?

2) Know to come and enforce those regulations DURING THE TIME the private sale is taking place? You think those kids are going to call the government and tell them they are having a private sale of bubble gum?

The only way they will know is if the kid chokes from the bubble gum, and survives the choking in order to tell authorities that he privately bought bubble gum, assuming he's enough of a rat to out his friend.