The First Amendment: Not A Shield from the Consequences

[TemplarKormac]

Lets face it. The First Amendment guarantees your right to free speech. What it does not protect you from are the consequences of that speech, as Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling both found out. Don't get me wrong, you have every right to say what you want to, but if you're going to say inflammatory or controversial things, you should be prepared for a tidal wave of dissent. I am a staunch conservative libertarian, as well as a Constitutionalist. But even I know when to keep my mouth shut. The First Amendment isn't a shield for someone to hide behind when they say or do something incredibly moronic or stupid.

For example, Dallas Mavericks Owner Mark Cuban said in effect after the punishment of Donald Sterling by the NBA, "In this country, people are allowed to be morons." They are. But as I said before, this country and the First Amendment do not protect someone from the consequences of being one. Be reminded, however, that as far as I am concerned, Sterling deserved every bit of the punishment he received from the NBA yesterday. The same can be said for Cliven Bundy. Bundy's issue is a bit more... complicated and murky than Sterling's was. What he said was boneheaded, but he had the right to say what he said. He was and is not immune to the consequences, but in this humble writer's opinion, he was advocating for the progression of African Americans. He blew the follow-through though.

You can't carry a bag of gold without feeling the weight. Thus, you cannot say whatever you want and not suffer the consequences. I know full well how that went as a child. There was no cussin' in my house, if I did, I was greeted with a belt or a switch to my backside. Never forget that for every action, there is an equal or opposite reaction. To my conservative friends: The First Amendment isn't a "get out of jail free" card. You can't simply say something idiotic and not expect to be harangued for it. To my liberal friends: The First Amendment protects their speech nonetheless. Just because these men are racist, doesn't mean they should be stripped of the right to express themselves.

The First Amendment isn't meant to shield anyone from their stupidity. However, it remains the backbone of discourse in America, and is still one of the most hallowed rights an American can possess.

 

[WinterBorn]

Lets face it. The First Amendment guarantees your right to free speech. What it does not protect you from are the consequences of that speech, as Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling both found out. Don't get me wrong, you have every right to say what you want to, but if you're going to say inflammatory or controversial things, you should be prepared for a tidal wave of dissent. I am a staunch conservative libertarian, as well as a Constitutionalist. But even I know when to keep my mouth shut. The First Amendment isn't a shield for someone to hide behind when they say or do something incredibly moronic or stupid.

For example, Dallas Mavericks Owner Mark Cuban said in effect after the punishment of Donald Sterling by the NBA, "In this country, people are allowed to be morons." They are. But as I said before, this country and the First Amendment do not protect someone from the consequences of being one. Be reminded, however, that as far as I am concerned, Sterling deserved every bit of the punishment he received from the NBA yesterday. The same can be said for Cliven Bundy. Bundy's issue is a bit more... complicated and murky than Sterling's was. What he said was boneheaded, but he had the right to say what he said. He was and is not immune to the consequences, but in this humble writer's opinion, he was advocating for the progression of African Americans. He blew the follow-through though.

You can't carry a bag of gold without feeling the weight. Thus, you cannot say whatever you want and not suffer the consequences. I know full well how that went as a child. There was no cussin' in my house, if I did, I was greeted with a belt or a switch to my backside. Never forget that for every action, there is an equal or opposite reaction. To my conservative friends: The First Amendment isn't a "get out of jail free" card. You can't simply say something idiotic and not expect to be harangued for it. To my liberal friends: The First Amendment protects their speech nonetheless. Just because these men are racist, doesn't mean they should be stripped of the right to express themselves.

The First Amendment isn't meant to shield anyone from their stupidity. However, it remains the backbone of discourse in America, and is still one of the most hallowed rights an American can possess.

And if Sterling had made his comments in public, I could see him being punished.

But to have private conversations recorded and broadcast, is a different matter.

 

[occupied]

The 1st protects government dissent but cuts off at incitement to riot or rebellion, that's all. There is another rule that predates America, a contract is a contract and practically everyone in media and entertainment has signed one that severely curtails their right to be a stupid shithead in their speech. They can say whatever they want but they had better check for cameras and microphones first.

 

[zeke]

Lets face it. The First Amendment guarantees your right to free speech. What it does not protect you from are the consequences of that speech, as Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling both found out. Don't get me wrong, you have every right to say what you want to, but if you're going to say inflammatory or controversial things, you should be prepared for a tidal wave of dissent. I am a staunch conservative libertarian, as well as a Constitutionalist. But even I know when to keep my mouth shut. The First Amendment isn't a shield for someone to hide behind when they say or do something incredibly moronic or stupid.

For example, Dallas Mavericks Owner Mark Cuban said in effect after the punishment of Donald Sterling by the NBA, "In this country, people are allowed to be morons." They are. But as I said before, this country and the First Amendment do not protect someone from the consequences of being one. Be reminded, however, that as far as I am concerned, Sterling deserved every bit of the punishment he received from the NBA yesterday. The same can be said for Cliven Bundy. Bundy's issue is a bit more... complicated and murky than Sterling's was. What he said was boneheaded, but he had the right to say what he said. He was and is not immune to the consequences, but in this humble writer's opinion, he was advocating for the progression of African Americans. He blew the follow-through though.

You can't carry a bag of gold without feeling the weight. Thus, you cannot say whatever you want and not suffer the consequences. I know full well how that went as a child. There was no cussin' in my house, if I did, I was greeted with a belt or a switch to my backside. Never forget that for every action, there is an equal or opposite reaction. To my conservative friends: The First Amendment isn't a "get out of jail free" card. You can't simply say something idiotic and not expect to be harangued for it. To my liberal friends: The First Amendment protects their speech nonetheless. Just because these men are racist, doesn't mean they should be stripped of the right to express themselves.

The First Amendment isn't meant to shield anyone from their stupidity. However, it remains the backbone of discourse in America, and is still one of the most hallowed rights an American can possess.

And if Sterling had made his comments in public, I could see him being punished.

But to have private conversations recorded and broadcast, is a different matter.

So being a bigoted asshole in a high profile position is fine......as long as you are private about it.

I listened to part of the conversation. This dude was being set up and was to stupid to realize what was happening.

So we ended up with a bigoted asshole in a high profile position who was so fucking stupid that he ran his mouth without thinking about what was happening.

And here you are defending; stupid, bigots, and assholes. Why?

 

[Mac1958]

.

Issuing consequences is a choice.

Some choose to punish.

They could also choose to take advantage of every opportunity to leverage offensive speech to open a mature, civil, constructive dialogue on the topic, out in a public forum.

But no, there are many narcissists out there who are too full of themselves and intellectually lazy to put forth that kind of effort.

And they're not concerned about being constructive.

.

 

[TemplarKormac]

And if Sterling had made his comments in public, I could see him being punished.

But to have private conversations recorded and broadcast, is a different matter.

As a friend of mine put it to me earlier:

"You run a risk when you speak."

Yes, I agree his privacy was violated. But it sure doesn't change what he said. He signed a contract with the NBA. His attitudes towards African Americans breached two parts of the NBA Constitution. Article 24 (l) and 35 A (d). So inasmuch, he breached his agreement with NBA.

http://mediacentral.nba.com/media/mediacentral/NBA-Constitution-and-By-Laws.pdf

 

[rightwinger]

Lets face it. The First Amendment guarantees your right to free speech. What it does not protect you from are the consequences of that speech, as Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling both found out. Don't get me wrong, you have every right to say what you want to, but if you're going to say inflammatory or controversial things, you should be prepared for a tidal wave of dissent. I am a staunch conservative libertarian, as well as a Constitutionalist. But even I know when to keep my mouth shut. The First Amendment isn't a shield for someone to hide behind when they say or do something incredibly moronic or stupid.

For example, Dallas Mavericks Owner Mark Cuban said in effect after the punishment of Donald Sterling by the NBA, "In this country, people are allowed to be morons." They are. But as I said before, this country and the First Amendment do not protect someone from the consequences of being one. Be reminded, however, that as far as I am concerned, Sterling deserved every bit of the punishment he received from the NBA yesterday. The same can be said for Cliven Bundy. Bundy's issue is a bit more... complicated and murky than Sterling's was. What he said was boneheaded, but he had the right to say what he said. He was and is not immune to the consequences, but in this humble writer's opinion, he was advocating for the progression of African Americans. He blew the follow-through though.

You can't carry a bag of gold without feeling the weight. Thus, you cannot say whatever you want and not suffer the consequences. I know full well how that went as a child. There was no cussin' in my house, if I did, I was greeted with a belt or a switch to my backside. Never forget that for every action, there is an equal or opposite reaction. To my conservative friends: The First Amendment isn't a "get out of jail free" card. You can't simply say something idiotic and not expect to be harangued for it. To my liberal friends: The First Amendment protects their speech nonetheless. Just because these men are racist, doesn't mean they should be stripped of the right to express themselves.

The First Amendment isn't meant to shield anyone from their stupidity. However, it remains the backbone of discourse in America, and is still one of the most hallowed rights an American can possess.

And if Sterling had made his comments in public, I could see him being punished.

But to have private conversations recorded and broadcast, is a different matter.

Doesn't matter

They are still his thoughts and his words

Your actions have consequences, even if you think they are "off the record"

Sterling humiliated his sport and paid a price for it

 

[Mr. H.]

Lets face it. The First Amendment guarantees your right to free speech. What it does not protect you from are the consequences of that speech, as Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling both found out. Don't get me wrong, you have every right to say what you want to, but if you're going to say inflammatory or controversial things, you should be prepared for a tidal wave of dissent. I am a staunch conservative libertarian, as well as a Constitutionalist. But even I know when to keep my mouth shut. The First Amendment isn't a shield for someone to hide behind when they say or do something incredibly moronic or stupid.

For example, Dallas Mavericks Owner Mark Cuban said in effect after the punishment of Donald Sterling by the NBA, "In this country, people are allowed to be morons." They are. But as I said before, this country and the First Amendment do not protect someone from the consequences of being one. Be reminded, however, that as far as I am concerned, Sterling deserved every bit of the punishment he received from the NBA yesterday. The same can be said for Cliven Bundy. Bundy's issue is a bit more... complicated and murky than Sterling's was. What he said was boneheaded, but he had the right to say what he said. He was and is not immune to the consequences, but in this humble writer's opinion, he was advocating for the progression of African Americans. He blew the follow-through though.

You can't carry a bag of gold without feeling the weight. Thus, you cannot say whatever you want and not suffer the consequences. I know full well how that went as a child. There was no cussin' in my house, if I did, I was greeted with a belt or a switch to my backside. Never forget that for every action, there is an equal or opposite reaction. To my conservative friends: The First Amendment isn't a "get out of jail free" card. You can't simply say something idiotic and not expect to be harangued for it. To my liberal friends: The First Amendment protects their speech nonetheless. Just because these men are racist, doesn't mean they should be stripped of the right to express themselves.

The First Amendment isn't meant to shield anyone from their stupidity. However, it remains the backbone of discourse in America, and is still one of the most hallowed rights an American can possess.

And if Sterling had made his comments in public, I could see him being punished.

But to have private conversations recorded and broadcast, is a different matter.

Doesn't matter

They are still his thoughts and his words

Your actions have consequences, even if you think they are "off the record"

Sterling humiliated his sport and paid a price for it

As were Romney's "47%" comments.

Such private actions have consequences as determined by the public.

 

[hangover]

Free speech is now only money. The fascists have declared that even speech said in private is punishable.

 

[rightwinger]

Free speech is now only money. The fascists have declared that even speech said in private is punishable.

Why shouldn't it be?

 

[TemplarKormac]

Free speech is now only money. The fascists have declared that even speech said in private is punishable.

That's like saying a tree shouldn't make a sound when it falls in the woods and nobody's around to hear it. The tree still makes a sound when it comes crashing to the ground.

 

[hangover]

Free speech is now only money. The fascists have declared that even speech said in private is punishable.

Why shouldn't it be?

So you're really ready for the government to put video cameras in every room of your house. Wow! 1984 big brother is your kind of government. Hitler must be your hero.

 

[dilloduck]

Lets face it. The First Amendment guarantees your right to free speech. What it does not protect you from are the consequences of that speech, as Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling both found out. Don't get me wrong, you have every right to say what you want to, but if you're going to say inflammatory or controversial things, you should be prepared for a tidal wave of dissent. I am a staunch conservative libertarian, as well as a Constitutionalist. But even I know when to keep my mouth shut. The First Amendment isn't a shield for someone to hide behind when they say or do something incredibly moronic or stupid.

For example, Dallas Mavericks Owner Mark Cuban said in effect after the punishment of Donald Sterling by the NBA, "In this country, people are allowed to be morons." They are. But as I said before, this country and the First Amendment do not protect someone from the consequences of being one. Be reminded, however, that as far as I am concerned, Sterling deserved every bit of the punishment he received from the NBA yesterday. The same can be said for Cliven Bundy. Bundy's issue is a bit more... complicated and murky than Sterling's was. What he said was boneheaded, but he had the right to say what he said. He was and is not immune to the consequences, but in this humble writer's opinion, he was advocating for the progression of African Americans. He blew the follow-through though.

You can't carry a bag of gold without feeling the weight. Thus, you cannot say whatever you want and not suffer the consequences. I know full well how that went as a child. There was no cussin' in my house, if I did, I was greeted with a belt or a switch to my backside. Never forget that for every action, there is an equal or opposite reaction. To my conservative friends: The First Amendment isn't a "get out of jail free" card. You can't simply say something idiotic and not expect to be harangued for it. To my liberal friends: The First Amendment protects their speech nonetheless. Just because these men are racist, doesn't mean they should be stripped of the right to express themselves.

The First Amendment isn't meant to shield anyone from their stupidity. However, it remains the backbone of discourse in America, and is still one of the most hallowed rights an American can possess.

And if Sterling had made his comments in public, I could see him being punished.

But to have private conversations recorded and broadcast, is a different matter.

So being a bigoted asshole in a high profile position is fine......as long as you are private about it.

I listened to part of the conversation. This dude was being set up and was to stupid to realize what was happening.

So we ended up with a bigoted asshole in a high profile position who was so fucking stupid that he ran his mouth without thinking about what was happening.

And here you are defending; stupid, bigots, and assholes. Why?

Because it reminds him of our President and Attorney General maybe

 

[Darkwind]

Lets face it. The First Amendment guarantees your right to free speech. What it does not protect you from are the consequences of that speech, as Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling both found out. Don't get me wrong, you have every right to say what you want to, but if you're going to say inflammatory or controversial things, you should be prepared for a tidal wave of dissent. I am a staunch conservative libertarian, as well as a Constitutionalist. But even I know when to keep my mouth shut. The First Amendment isn't a shield for someone to hide behind when they say or do something incredibly moronic or stupid.

For example, Dallas Mavericks Owner Mark Cuban said in effect after the punishment of Donald Sterling by the NBA, "In this country, people are allowed to be morons." They are. But as I said before, this country and the First Amendment do not protect someone from the consequences of being one. Be reminded, however, that as far as I am concerned, Sterling deserved every bit of the punishment he received from the NBA yesterday. The same can be said for Cliven Bundy. Bundy's issue is a bit more... complicated and murky than Sterling's was. What he said was boneheaded, but he had the right to say what he said. He was and is not immune to the consequences, but in this humble writer's opinion, he was advocating for the progression of African Americans. He blew the follow-through though.

You can't carry a bag of gold without feeling the weight. Thus, you cannot say whatever you want and not suffer the consequences. I know full well how that went as a child. There was no cussin' in my house, if I did, I was greeted with a belt or a switch to my backside. Never forget that for every action, there is an equal or opposite reaction. To my conservative friends: The First Amendment isn't a "get out of jail free" card. You can't simply say something idiotic and not expect to be harangued for it. To my liberal friends: The First Amendment protects their speech nonetheless. Just because these men are racist, doesn't mean they should be stripped of the right to express themselves.

The First Amendment isn't meant to shield anyone from their stupidity. However, it remains the backbone of discourse in America, and is still one of the most hallowed rights an American can possess.

Tell Me, what is the difference between dissent and active attacks on property and income?

You see, there was a time when people would just ostracize someone for having the crassness of airing a racist attitude.

Now, they actively go after your property, your wealth, your income.

So tell Me. When people are so afraid of the consequences that they will never exercise free speech, how can we say that we have free speech?

The Jews were free to exercise their faith in Nazi Germany. They just had to accept the 'consequences' of that faith, right?

 

[occupied]

Free speech is now only money. The fascists have declared that even speech said in private is punishable.

Why shouldn't it be?

So you're really ready for the government to put video cameras in every room of your house. Wow! 1984 big brother is your kind of government. Hitler must be your hero.

What does the government have to do with any of the NBA scandal? The guy is being punished because he let a damaging recording hit the media, it's breech of contract not some horrible Orwellian plot.

 

[dilloduck]

Lets face it. The First Amendment guarantees your right to free speech. What it does not protect you from are the consequences of that speech, as Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling both found out. Don't get me wrong, you have every right to say what you want to, but if you're going to say inflammatory or controversial things, you should be prepared for a tidal wave of dissent. I am a staunch conservative libertarian, as well as a Constitutionalist. But even I know when to keep my mouth shut. The First Amendment isn't a shield for someone to hide behind when they say or do something incredibly moronic or stupid.

For example, Dallas Mavericks Owner Mark Cuban said in effect after the punishment of Donald Sterling by the NBA, "In this country, people are allowed to be morons." They are. But as I said before, this country and the First Amendment do not protect someone from the consequences of being one. Be reminded, however, that as far as I am concerned, Sterling deserved every bit of the punishment he received from the NBA yesterday. The same can be said for Cliven Bundy. Bundy's issue is a bit more... complicated and murky than Sterling's was. What he said was boneheaded, but he had the right to say what he said. He was and is not immune to the consequences, but in this humble writer's opinion, he was advocating for the progression of African Americans. He blew the follow-through though.

You can't carry a bag of gold without feeling the weight. Thus, you cannot say whatever you want and not suffer the consequences. I know full well how that went as a child. There was no cussin' in my house, if I did, I was greeted with a belt or a switch to my backside. Never forget that for every action, there is an equal or opposite reaction. To my conservative friends: The First Amendment isn't a "get out of jail free" card. You can't simply say something idiotic and not expect to be harangued for it. To my liberal friends: The First Amendment protects their speech nonetheless. Just because these men are racist, doesn't mean they should be stripped of the right to express themselves.

The First Amendment isn't meant to shield anyone from their stupidity. However, it remains the backbone of discourse in America, and is still one of the most hallowed rights an American can possess.

And if Sterling had made his comments in public, I could see him being punished.

But to have private conversations recorded and broadcast, is a different matter.

Doesn't matter

They are still his thoughts and his words

Your actions have consequences, even if you think they are "off the record"

Sterling humiliated his sport and paid a price for it

The league nailed the rich white guy and the media loves it----now how about an expose of the fine upstanding players in this league.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Lets face it. The First Amendment guarantees your right to free speech. What it does not protect you from are the consequences of that speech, as Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling both found out. Don't get me wrong, you have every right to say what you want to, but if you're going to say inflammatory or controversial things, you should be prepared for a tidal wave of dissent. I am a staunch conservative libertarian, as well as a Constitutionalist. But even I know when to keep my mouth shut. The First Amendment isn't a shield for someone to hide behind when they say or do something incredibly moronic or stupid.

For example, Dallas Mavericks Owner Mark Cuban said in effect after the punishment of Donald Sterling by the NBA, "In this country, people are allowed to be morons." They are. But as I said before, this country and the First Amendment do not protect someone from the consequences of being one. Be reminded, however, that as far as I am concerned, Sterling deserved every bit of the punishment he received from the NBA yesterday. The same can be said for Cliven Bundy. Bundy's issue is a bit more... complicated and murky than Sterling's was. What he said was boneheaded, but he had the right to say what he said. He was and is not immune to the consequences, but in this humble writer's opinion, he was advocating for the progression of African Americans. He blew the follow-through though.

You can't carry a bag of gold without feeling the weight. Thus, you cannot say whatever you want and not suffer the consequences. I know full well how that went as a child. There was no cussin' in my house, if I did, I was greeted with a belt or a switch to my backside. Never forget that for every action, there is an equal or opposite reaction. To my conservative friends: The First Amendment isn't a "get out of jail free" card. You can't simply say something idiotic and not expect to be harangued for it. To my liberal friends: The First Amendment protects their speech nonetheless. Just because these men are racist, doesn't mean they should be stripped of the right to express themselves.

The First Amendment isn't meant to shield anyone from their stupidity. However, it remains the backbone of discourse in America, and is still one of the most hallowed rights an American can possess.

And if Sterling had made his comments in public, I could see him being punished.

But to have private conversations recorded and broadcast, is a different matter.

Actually not.

It doesn’t make any difference that his comments were made public or he thought he was having a private conversation; his comments were indeed made public and the NBA was fully justified in sanctioning him as it did.

 

[CaféAuLait]

Why shouldn't it be?

So you're really ready for the government to put video cameras in every room of your house. Wow! 1984 big brother is your kind of government. Hitler must be your hero.

What does the government have to do with any of the NBA scandal? The guy is being punished because he let a damaging recording hit the media, it's breech of contract not some horrible Orwellian plot.

I just read a article from CNN which compared it to just that. lol Strange.

In the novel "1984," George Orwell wrote of the Telescreen, a device that beamed information into the home but that also spied on people constantly. Even if we were to stop the NSA in its tracks, would we still now live in a world where the Telescreen watches us? Only instead of an oppressive government installing it in our apartments, it is conveniently placed in the hands of our dear friends.

The Sterling story is not that we found a bigot and dragged him to the gallows in the middle of the marketplace of ideas. The Sterling story is about how there is no more privacy. We live in a world where you can share your intimate photos with your lover, and they will wind up on a "revenge porn" website.

We live in a world where our intimate conversations will be recorded and blasted to billions of listeners. We live in a world where, say a gold digger can spy on her sugar daddy, and the world says that the creepy old guy is the bad guy.

Opinion: What happened to Sterling was morally wrong - CNN.com

 

[Darkwind]

Lets face it. The First Amendment guarantees your right to free speech. What it does not protect you from are the consequences of that speech, as Cliven Bundy and Donald Sterling both found out. Don't get me wrong, you have every right to say what you want to, but if you're going to say inflammatory or controversial things, you should be prepared for a tidal wave of dissent. I am a staunch conservative libertarian, as well as a Constitutionalist. But even I know when to keep my mouth shut. The First Amendment isn't a shield for someone to hide behind when they say or do something incredibly moronic or stupid.

For example, Dallas Mavericks Owner Mark Cuban said in effect after the punishment of Donald Sterling by the NBA, "In this country, people are allowed to be morons." They are. But as I said before, this country and the First Amendment do not protect someone from the consequences of being one. Be reminded, however, that as far as I am concerned, Sterling deserved every bit of the punishment he received from the NBA yesterday. The same can be said for Cliven Bundy. Bundy's issue is a bit more... complicated and murky than Sterling's was. What he said was boneheaded, but he had the right to say what he said. He was and is not immune to the consequences, but in this humble writer's opinion, he was advocating for the progression of African Americans. He blew the follow-through though.

You can't carry a bag of gold without feeling the weight. Thus, you cannot say whatever you want and not suffer the consequences. I know full well how that went as a child. There was no cussin' in my house, if I did, I was greeted with a belt or a switch to my backside. Never forget that for every action, there is an equal or opposite reaction. To my conservative friends: The First Amendment isn't a "get out of jail free" card. You can't simply say something idiotic and not expect to be harangued for it. To my liberal friends: The First Amendment protects their speech nonetheless. Just because these men are racist, doesn't mean they should be stripped of the right to express themselves.

The First Amendment isn't meant to shield anyone from their stupidity. However, it remains the backbone of discourse in America, and is still one of the most hallowed rights an American can possess.

And if Sterling had made his comments in public, I could see him being punished.

But to have private conversations recorded and broadcast, is a different matter.

Actually not.

It doesn’t make any difference that his comments were made public or he thought he was having a private conversation; his comments were indeed made public and the NBA was fully justified in sanctioning him as it did.

He has a good case for illegal wiretap though. It is against the law in most states to record someone without their consent.

 

[Katzndogz]

It's not a breach of contract. There isn't a contract written that covers the most private moments within someone's own home.

How far does this go? If you say something to a girlfriend or husband can the bank declare your purchase contract void and repossess your car?

Sterling is an owner he does not have a contract that precludes holding unpopular opinions voiced to an intimate? We have actual criminals as sports figures.

The next step is full scale investigations before buying property and racial loyalty oaths when privileged to buy.