The marines at Normandy

[Quasar44]

Can we agree these were the bravest and toughest
men to ever exist

I honestly could not imagine storming a beach facing machine guns and mortars

 

[fncceo]

Can we agree these were the bravest and toughest
men to ever exist

I honestly could not imagine storming a beach facing machine guns and mortars

There were no US Marines units landing at The Normandy Invasion on D-Day.

It was an Army / Navy show.

 

[Quasar44]

There were no US Marines units landing at The Normandy Invasion on D-Day.

It was an Army / Navy show.

Were these an elite army unit

 

[The Duke]

Can we agree these were the bravest and toughest
men to ever exist

I honestly could not imagine storming a beach facing machine guns and mortars

It was bad. I've seen the after effects of it. Bad enough to make a big 6-foot something full grown man cry like a baby screaming for it to stop. He had nightmares if he fell asleep for the rest of his life. If he fell asleep he was right back there; often.

 

[fncceo]

Were these an elite army unit

US Landing troops consisted of three regular infantry divsions (1st, 4th, and 29th) as well as two airborne divisions (101st and 82nd), who could be considered elite, and dozens of specialty units of the Army and Navy.

 

[The Duke]

Were these an elite army unit

No. Regular army infantry.

 

[Quasar44]

No. Regular army infantry.

What would happen if I just escaped out the base in England
Is that a big deal

I am not a coward but storming a beach is not for me

 

[Quasar44]

I saw SPR opening scene again and it is terrifying

 

[The Duke]

What would happen if I just escaped out the base in England
Is that a big deal

I am not a coward but storming a beach is not for me

They shot deserters in those days.

 

[Stryder50]

Can we agree these were the bravest and toughest
men to ever exist

I honestly could not imagine storming a beach facing machine guns and mortars

Your title is screwy.
US Marines didn't do any of the beach landings at Normandy, or other parts of the ETO and MTO.
US Marines did do a lot of beach landings in the Pacific Theater.
British Commandos were Brit Marines IIRC.

 

[Stryder50]

No. Regular army infantry.

Actually the US Rangers were considered elite.
For that matter, same with airborne/paratroops IIRC.

 

[The Duke]

Actually the US Rangers were considered elite.
For that matter, same with airborne/paratroops IIRC.

Rangers were dropped inland after the main invasion.
They didn't have Rangers storming the beach.
Army had to take out the AA guns in order to drop Rangers.

 

[Stryder50]

Rangers were dropped inland after the main invasion.
They didn't have Rangers storming the beach.
Army had to take out the AA guns in order to drop Rangers.

Actually the Rangers did hit the "beach" in landing craft, but had to climb cliffs to silence German artillery covering the beaches.

Rudder's Rangers and the Boys of Pointe du Hoc: The U.S. Army Rang​

Normandy - WWII RANGERS​

U.S. Rangers at D-Day - History​

~~~~~~~~
Airborne, US 82 and 101 Divisions and British 1st Para Division were "dropped' at night a few hours before dawn to secure areas to the rear of the beaches.

 

[The Duke]

Actually the Rangers did hit the "beach" in landing craft, but had to climb cliffs to silence German artillery covering the beaches.

Rudder's Rangers and the Boys of Pointe du Hoc: The U.S. Army Rang​

Normandy - WWII RANGERS​

U.S. Rangers at D-Day - History​

~~~~~~~~
Airborne, US 82 and 101 Divisions and British 1st Para Division were "dropped' at night a few hours before dawn to secure areas to the rear of the beaches.

Looks like I was wrong about that.

 

[The Duke]

Actually the Rangers did hit the "beach" in landing craft, but had to climb cliffs to silence German artillery covering the beaches.

Rudder's Rangers and the Boys of Pointe du Hoc: The U.S. Army Rang​

Normandy - WWII RANGERS​

U.S. Rangers at D-Day - History​

~~~~~~~~
Airborne, US 82 and 101 Divisions and British 1st Para Division were "dropped' at night a few hours before dawn to secure areas to the rear of the beaches.

It makes no sense to have Airborne Rangers storming the beach like regular infantry. Wtf would the parachute training be for, then? Anyway, thanks, that's a good read.

 

[Quasar44]

The R are bad azz

 

[toobfreak]

They shot deserters in those days.

As they should have.

 

[Stryder50]

It makes no sense to have Airborne Rangers storming the beach like regular infantry. Wtf would the parachute training be for, then? Anyway, thanks, that's a good read.

Well, back then the Rangers weren't trained in airborne techniques and tactics. That came along later during the Cold War and "Vietnam", Etc. They were trained to be very physically fit, do cliff scaling, and have high elan and resourcefulness as elite and special attack forces.

As shown during WW2, airborne dropped by parachutes and even landed by gliders had a tendency to scatter about the intended landing zone. Bad enough when done in daylight, but even further about and 'afield' when done at night. Hence Normandy plans had them dropping a few miles inland, in hope of blocking routes for German reinforcements seeking to go to the beaches to help the defenders/counter attack the landing forces.

 

[Stryder50]

As they should have.

Rarely did the USA or UK shoot deserters in the field. Heck, often in the confusion of battle it was hard to tell whom was "running away" or following orders to withdraw/retreat.

Now in the case of the Russians/USSR, that's a rather different story, and such was all too common.

 

[Stryder50]

This thread has jumped around a bit with regard to World War Two in Europe, so I'll try to inject some basics for consideration without getting to long and in depth.

First let's look at Russia/USSR ~ the "Eastern Front".

Prior astounding success of "Blitzkrieg" against Poland and France, along with seeming adequate containment of Britain/UK led Hitler and many of his General Staff to think they could defeat Russia/USSR in a few months with "Blitzkrieg". As it was, Russia was adept at slow retreat and trading land/space for time to recover it's manpower and material/weapon resources while giving the German's a costly gain. Winter 1941 hit sooner than usual and the Germans were not expecting or prepared to deal with such, their troops not having clothing and equipment to deal with harsh "General Winter" in defense of Russia.

As it was, German forces made it through that first Winter and made even greater gains of land and Russian turf in 1942, but still not enough to defeat Russia.

Had it been just Germany against Russia, Germany might have prevailed. But Allied (mostly USA) Lend-Lease helped to barely tip the scales/odds to Russia's favor. With the Ukraine and most of Western Russia, where that nation's main food supply was grown, now in German hands and/or site of back-n-forth battles, Russia was facing serious threats of starvation by end of 1942 and thru 1943. This is where USA Lend-Lease in form of food (wheat and 'spam') was a major saver to Russia, keeping the nation and it's armies feed during those first critical years (and beyond actually).

Other aspects of mostly USA Lend-Lease to Russia are what would amount to about 80+% of motor transport ~ jeeps, trucks- 4x4 & 6x6, half-tracks along with significant amounts of railroad locomotives, flat and box-cars, and steel rails. Also about 20% of aircraft, fighter and light~medium bombers, and about 10+% of AFV~tanks. Another overlooked and under-appreciated item was about 80-90% of radio equipment. Also a significant amount of medical/first-aid supplies.

To the Western Allies ~ USA and UK/Commonwealth ~ keeping Russia in the fight and tying up about 80% of the German army/divisions and significant parts of their air force was essential to giving a chance for success in the Western part of the European (ETO) war/campaigns.

With Russia involved and gaining an edge against the Germans, the War was looking winable within a few years. Russia out of the war and it could go for decades, if not be lost all together. Allied Lend-Lease was the factor to help tip the scales to Allied favor against Nazi Germany.