The Official Zimmerman Trial Verdict Thread

[testarosa]

Crazy Scot -

The lawyers have all gone to bed so I'll attempt a quick 'spanation of what I think happens next.

The State thinks it may want to call one rebuttal witness. It's an ATF agent who arrested GZ 8 years ago on assault charges. But the charges were reduced, GZ completed some anger management classes, and the charges were dropped. If they call him, then the defense can question him. They will probably not call him and will not present a rebuttal case. If no rebuttal by State, then no surrebuttal by defense. Done with testimony.

The lawyers are set to convene at 9AM tomorrow to discuss jury instructions. At 1PM the State will present their closing argument by Bernie. Friday morning the defense will present their closing by Mark O'Mara followed by a final rebuttal argument by John Guy for the State. Then the jury gets to deliberate.

Hope that helped answer your questions. Which, I'm sorry, I have now forgotten. Too long a day.......

Is Guy going to mount his inflatable again?

Well, tha's all he's got to mount. He sure didn't have a prosecution case. O'Mara gets the girls, walks off into the sunset.

Lol

You had one error in this post.

Stamina gets the girls, walks off into the sunset.

There I fixed.

 

[testarosa]

This bugs me. No offense. But how did GM misread anything?

Only if TM went home and nothing happened woubld that be the case.

The accusation that GZ is guilty of anything is just more bs propaganda

JMNSHO

He misread the situation in that Trayvon had every right to be there.

Interesting, after reading through the thread you admit you don't know the facts of the case.

And you're wrong. Just letting you know

Hit your That Was Easy button.

 

[Sunshine]

is guy going to mount his inflatable again?

well, tha's all he's got to mount. He sure didn't have a prosecution case. O'mara gets the girls, walks off into the sunset.

lol

you had one error in this post.

Stamina gets the girls, walks off into the sunset.

There i fixed.

lol.

Prosecution gets the dummy!

 

[tinydancer]

He was on drugs
Assholes did get away
He did run
He stopped following

What's the problem ?

Dersh' thinks there is reasonable doubt
Alan Dershowitz: New Forensic Evidence Is Consistent With George Zimmerman's Self Defense Claim

Alan Dershowitz thought OJ and Klaus von Bulow were "innocent".

Bullshit.

Dershowitz was the appellate lawyer advising OJ's defense team and he was von Bulow's lawyer to overturn his conviction.

It's what he does for a living.

 

[Sunshine]

Yeah well apparently they can't charge him with negligent involuntary manslaughter because they went for voluntary homicide. Nutz. The original investigator told them involuntary. The prosecution overshot. Now he goes free with the self defense argument based on the beating TM gave him.

Why neg this post, Sunshine? What is that 5 negs in a row on one thread? Must be a record.

What part of this post do you disagree with Sunshine? Man up. Grow a pair and disagree with the post in the open rather than resorting to hidden negs.

I disagree with your even posting it because you have made it clear for post after post that you are with the prosecution. Hypocrite. You are just riding the fence so you can claim that you were right regardless which side wins. We see through you. That's why you got the neg. And to see if you will EVER get one and not whine and piss your tutu.

 

[testarosa]

In closing is the state going to go with the tree beat Z up, he beat himself up, TM was trying to get away or all of the above.

 

[Rat in the Hat]

In closing is the state going to go with the tree beat Z up, he beat himself up, TM was trying to get away or all of the above.

Maybe they'll go with the "Tampon was beating up a doll when George stalked up and shot him in cold blood" theory.

 

[Ava]

In closing is the state going to go with the tree beat Z up, he beat himself up, TM was trying to get away or all of the above.

And that should be sufficient for a juror with a bias to have a doubt. Hung!

 

[Ernie S.]

Did anyone else see Fancy Grapes last night? She was going bat-shit crazy over the fact that George wouldn't testify, and was trying to convince her guests that he wanted to, but O'Mara forced him not to. None of them bought her fable.

Also interesting was the fact that 2 of her guests were lawyers for DeeDee. Why did she need to lawyer up with not 1, but 2 attorneys?

Perjury defense...
Hey Got up late. What's the hold up? Do we not get to see the jury instructions hearing?

 

[testarosa]

In closing is the state going to go with the tree beat Z up, he beat himself up, TM was trying to get away or all of the above.

And that should be sufficient for a juror with a bias to have a doubt. Hung!

Good point. Keep on changing your story and your charges, because every one of those six women are probably all dum enough to buy one of the versions.

Or not.

 

[wavingrl]

In closing is the state going to go with the tree beat Z up, he beat himself up, TM was trying to get away or all of the above.

I know the defense wanted both sides to present on the same day--jury would end the day thinking about the prosecution's closing. The judge's preference prevailed.


The defense will be allowed to use the animation and then the state's rebuttal.

Just trying to organize my own mind--I think the question I started out with was will they be sequestered and deliberate throughout the weekend?

Not important.

Someone remarked yesterday that 70 people had been shot in Chicago last weekend/? and yet the focus is on this.

so many other things going on with the potential to critically affect life as we know it

nineteen firefighters lost their lives last week--

 

[Ernie S.]

well, tha's all he's got to mount. He sure didn't have a prosecution case. O'mara gets the girls, walks off into the sunset.

lol

you had one error in this post.

Stamina gets the girls, walks off into the sunset.

There i fixed.

lol.

Prosecution gets the dummy!

I hear John Guy has to marry the dummy.

 

[Sunshine]

In closing is the state going to go with the tree beat Z up, he beat himself up, TM was trying to get away or all of the above.

I know the defense wanted both sides to present on the same day--jury would end the day thinking about the prosecution's closing. The judge's preference prevailed.


The defense will be allowed to use the animation and then the state's rebuttal.

Just trying to organize my own mind--I think the question I started out with was will they be sequestered and deliberate throughout the weekend?

Not important.

Someone remarked yesterday that 70 people had been shot in Chicago last weekend/? and yet the focus is on this.

so many other things going on with the potential to critically affect life as we know it

nineteen firefighters lost their lives last week--

Far more deserving than a little fuck punk like Trayvon.

 

[MeBelle]

And besides everyone has an opinion at this point in the case and we all know each other's. I don't need to hear it 25 times to understand it is how the other person feels about it.

Sarah-This is the first time I've seen idb post in this thread.
idb claims he doesn't have a position.

He obviously doesn't want to talk to you about it, why keep begging him, so you can laugh at him when the jury comes back?

Sarah-You missed the ending of mine and idb 'chat' I presume.
We resolved whatever lack of communication we were having, without you having to stick up for him.

You know this isn't an actual win or loss for you people, you just picked a side and said why many, many, times.

I am very dismayed at this part of your post.

The majority of us came in here open minded.

The ones who did come in here with their minds made up were not participating in the spirit this thread was made for.

It was the same thing with foxfire getting so angry with me for not engaging her in an exchange. I already know where she is going to fall on this decision, I stayed through a lot of angry posts directed at me. All of you have been quite aggressive about it.

The ones that came in here with an open mind and the willingness to look at both sides were 'quite aggressive'?
Perhaps we were aggressive when it came to trying to keep this thread intact and keep posters focused on looking at the facts rather than spout opinions.

How can anyone have an opinion when all the facts aren't presented?

This thread was made to discuss the facts, evidence introduced, the actual case as we watched the trial, live stream, period!

This thread wasn't made to opine, whine, theorize, lay blame towards or conspire.
We were watching the trial unfold, or many of us tried to, yet this thread was getting constantly derailed, which is why this thread was locked for a day or so and why Luissa started the "Official Zimmerman Thread' in the politics forum. That was thread you were originally posting in.

I work everyday and like to discuss when I can but this gets old.

If it gets old for you sweety, I don't know what to tell you.

 

[Rat in the Hat]

Did anyone else see Fancy Grapes last night? She was going bat-shit crazy over the fact that George wouldn't testify, and was trying to convince her guests that he wanted to, but O'Mara forced him not to. None of them bought her fable.

Also interesting was the fact that 2 of her guests were lawyers for DeeDee. Why did she need to lawyer up with not 1, but 2 attorneys?

Perjury defense...
Hey Got up late. What's the hold up? Do we not get to see the jury instructions hearing?

Both sides asked for more time to work on the jury instructions. Judge Mope gave them a 30 minute recess. They should be back in a few minutes.

 

[RKMBrown]

Yeah well apparently they can't charge him with negligent involuntary manslaughter because they went for voluntary homicide. Nutz. The original investigator told them involuntary. The prosecution overshot. Now he goes free with the self defense argument based on the beating TM gave him.

Why neg this post, Sunshine? What is that 5 negs in a row on one thread? Must be a record.

What part of this post do you disagree with Sunshine? Man up. Grow a pair and disagree with the post in the open rather than resorting to hidden negs.

I disagree with your even posting it because you have made it clear for post after post that you are with the prosecution. Hypocrite. You are just riding the fence so you can claim that you were right regardless which side wins. We see through you. That's why you got the neg. And to see if you will EVER get one and not whine.

>>> you have made it clear for post after post that you are with the prosecution

When you use words like "clear" it becomes obvious that you have no facts to back up your claim. I was never "with the prosecution." I made my opinion based on the facts presented and my own life experiences. As the facts presented changed so did my opinion.

>>> Hypocrite. You are just riding the fence so you can claim that you were right regardless which side wins.

The world is not as "black" and "white" as you think it is Sunshine. While I understand why some like you use such views to put up a defensive barrier based on personal experiences, I can tell you that not all black kids that smoke weed are vile evil thugs out looking for a nurse to stab. That said.. you really don't know me yet. Isn't the point of a trial to make sure the right side wins? If you are only willing to choose one side or the other irregardless of the facts, doesn't that make you wrong 50% of the time?

>>> We see through you.
You say that like you think I have something to hide.

>>> That's why you got the neg.
Thanks for the response.

>>> And to see if you will EVER get one and not whine.
I won't respond to your hidden neg, if you post your argument/disagreement in the open. I just don't like the hidden aspect of the neg. It seems like a disingenuous act.

 

[The Rabbi]

Yes, you believe the guy who shot dead a minor. You believe that Martin first runs away and then runs back. You believe that Martin who had no history of violence just attacked Zimmerman and was going to beat him to death on the street. So basically your going to believe the adult with the gun who shot dead the minor regardless of anything else. So it seems clear that people are picking sides based on political reasons only.

From the right I think many people are supporting Zimmerman because he is a concealed carry guy. If he gets in trouble it makes them all look bad. After all they talk all the time about how much safer it is when everyone carries guns. But this seems to be a good case where having a gun ends in disaster. I also think some on the right look at Martin and have just decided he wasn't good so it's ok what happened. I think it's a bit of racism.

From the left people do support Martin because he was black. There are those who try to find racism in everything to stay relevant. But others do want to prove that carrying a gun is not safe. So if Zimmerman goes to jail they can claim a win for gun control.

I think this is a tragedy. Zimmerman probably had the right intentions and things went bad. Martin wasn't doing anything wrong, but is now dead. No winners in this one.

I believe what the evidence suggests. The evidence suggests that ZImmerman's story is, generally speaking, the true account of what happened. I see little to no evidence to suggest the opposite. I dont care what color or what political persuasion anyone is. I care about facts and the law.

You have no reason to believe what you do other than "Zimmerman shot a child to death." It is clear that is not the case. Martin was hardly a child. He was over 6 feet tall. Zimmerman was reasonably in fear of his life, as evidenced by his injuries and the neighbor's testimony. It is established in court that Martin was on top of Zimmerman. That makes Zimmerman's act an act of self defense and the killing a justifiable killing.
If you have some evidence other than "Zimmerman is a cop wannabe" or "Zimmerman shot an unarmed man" then bring it. OTherwise stfu and get out of this discussion.

Yes as long as we have a statement from the killer I guess all is settled. We should probably just always take the word of the killer and not waste time with trials. You are very wise.

So again I guess you ignore that Martin had no history of violent crime and blindly believe his first violent crime was going to be beating Zimmerman to death on the street.

Martin was 17, so that makes him a minor. Zimmerman is an adult. Zimmerman did shoot Martin dead. These are facts.

From what I have read who was on top is in question. We also don't know for sure who was screaming for help.

What we know is that Martin was coming back from the store and had every right to be there. Zimmerman followed him and a confrontation took place. Martin the minor ends up shot. Now I certainly don't know what happened, but I'm not going to believe everything the killer says blindly. That would just be dumb.

I believe things until I have a reason not to believe them. If you have no forensic or eye witness evidence to counter Zimmerman's testimony, and it is not contradicted by anything else, then there is no reason not to believe it.
Unless of course you're a brain dead hack with an agenda that says we must support inner city Negroes no matter what.

 

[wavingrl]

In closing is the state going to go with the tree beat Z up, he beat himself up, TM was trying to get away or all of the above.

I know the defense wanted both sides to present on the same day--jury would end the day thinking about the prosecution's closing. The judge's preference prevailed.


The defense will be allowed to use the animation and then the state's rebuttal.

Just trying to organize my own mind--I think the question I started out with was will they be sequestered and deliberate throughout the weekend?

Not important.

Someone remarked yesterday that 70 people had been shot in Chicago last weekend/? and yet the focus is on this.

so many other things going on with the potential to critically affect life as we know it

nineteen firefighters lost their lives last week--

Far more deserving than a little fuck punk like Trayvon.

It puts things into perspective. In an instant your life is gone in a wall of fire.

Those families are grieving, too. Many families are grieving.

if there have to be riots --then there will have to be riots. CT school killing, Tsarnaev brothers in Boston--better ways to deal with tragedy. I need to shut up. so I will.

 

[wavingrl]

In closing is the state going to go with the tree beat Z up, he beat himself up, TM was trying to get away or all of the above.

I know the defense wanted both sides to present on the same day--jury would end the day thinking about the prosecution's closing. The judge's preference prevailed.


The defense will be allowed to use the animation and then the state's rebuttal.

Just trying to organize my own mind--I think the question I started out with was will they be sequestered and deliberate throughout the weekend?

Not important.

Someone remarked yesterday that 70 people had been shot in Chicago last weekend/? and yet the focus is on this.

so many other things going on with the potential to critically affect life as we know it

nineteen firefighters lost their lives last week--

As to the weekend the sheriff has a security schedule so everytime there's an on the fly trial change they have to scramble to rearrange. Court is closed on the weekend and weekend deliberations havent been done in years since a crotchety judge made everyone and a jury come in and deliberate over a weekend. Ultimately its up to the judge to inconvenience everyone in the world or not.

ok--they probably need to chill.

 

[The Rabbi]

ok, you said "Zimmerman was not "following him around." That is a mischaracterization. " So yes you did say that.

As I stated. Martin may have just jogged around the corner out of sight and then started walking. We have all seen Zimmerman, he is not so obese he can't run a block. We're not talking about a 10 mile run here. Zimmerman could have run the block and caught up to him around the corner. You actually think it is more likely that Zimmerman sprinted away just to sprint back and attack Martin? Really? While I guess it is possible, why sprint away in the first place?

What is it about this case that it brings out the brain dead?

You said Zimmerman was following Martin around. That implies an extended period of pursuit. There was no such thing. Which is why I said you mischaracterized it.
Zimmerman followed Martin initially. Then Martin saw him and ran away.

According to your version Martin ran around the corner (of what??) and stopped. He was so..what?,,that he did not hear the obese Zimmerman puffing towards him. Zimmerman confronted him around the corner of whatever it was and then..what? Slammed his own head against the ground and then shot Martin?
Your version is bizarre and not based on anything except bias and misinformation.
But even if it were accurate, the only question is whether Zimmerman was legitimately in fear for his life when he shot. And the answer is still yes.

What is it about this case that it brings out the brain dead?

It's either guns or race. I believe that it's both but mostly guns.

You are right there. It is about the idea that self defense is somehow "dirty" and morally repulsive. This reaches back to an early Christian virtue of turning the other cheek and preferring martyrdom. So if Zimmerman had been unarmed and Trayvon gave him permanent injuries or killed him, it would be totally un newsworthy. That's just life, get over it.
But because the case is unusual in a "white" man fighting back against an aggressive black man and killing him it becomes something different. The killer must, by virtue of being a killer, be somehow deranged, vindictive, racist, extremist or something other than the loving husband and community minded person he actually is.