The Problem with Socialism

[Fenton Lum]

These goofs act like a Private citizen or Business can't pay for and put in their own roads. they think the Guberment came by their homes and laid their driveways for them in the middle of the night I guess. and when they need shoveled they must send the bill to the GUBERMENT. I wonder how that's worked for them?

good gawd these people don't vote I hope.

Citizens do put in their own roads. They VOTE to have highway departments.

Apparently her point went right over your head.

She doesn't have a point I wish to think about.

 

[Jack4jill]

Let more socialism or less socialism be up to the will of the People. That is how democracy is supposed to work.

That's what's wrong with democracy. My rights shouldn't be up to a majority vote, and the right to own property is one of them.

Your rights aren't up for a vote. Neither are the rights of those you say are less worthy than you, like gay people and transgender kids.

 

[Fenton Lum]

The problem is when socialism or capitalism gets to its extremes. Socialism as been around for about 10,000 years and it is simply the working together of society. Of course, you probably hate your police officer down the road or tax payer paved streets.

Capitalism also has a nasty history...So we abolish and do away with it?

Hate the police officer? Ferguson and Baltimore taught US about hating the Police. As per roads, if there is no factory, there is no need for roads. If there are no farms, there is no need for roads. If there are no shops, there are no need for roads. Do the factory, farm, and shop need the road? Absolutely. But, let's be smart about which is more important? Or, would we simply have many roads and bridges to nowhere? And that is where socialism extremities creep in. Bridges to nowhere so cronies and bureaucrats can get paid.

In the nineteenth century the factory owners built the roads to their factories.

Classic conservatism. Let's go back to the 19th century.

I wish we would. Some of you need to be reminded apparently.

 

[NYcarbineer]

• Q. What does ti take to be a socialist
• A. Christian Ethics

• Force is power, banks, insurance companies, cartels and wall street have both;
• Brokers take the assets of others to their benefit; vis a vis fiduciaries
• Theft is wrong, taxes paid to Caesar are not.

Using force to take another's property is antithetical to Christian ethics.

Abandoning materialism is central to Christianity.

That's fine and should be Voluntary. not FORCED on the people by Masters in the Government.

Of course, and Christianity is not being forced on people in the U.S. by the government.
Sharing is imposed by the person on whom Christianity is based. Yet, such a large amount of the population claims to be Christian that if it were true, government run public assistance would not be necessary. Unfortunately, assistance is necessary. There is no present system in place to do that except, lamentably, through government.

Liberals claim it's necessary, but they never offer any proof. Of course, you need a lot more when the government seduces teenage girls into getting pregnant by offering to pay all their bills when they do.

Tell the conservatives in this thread how you would fund the nation's military,

just to remind them who they're talking to.

 

[Jack4jill]

The problem is when socialism or capitalism gets to its extremes. Socialism as been around for about 10,000 years and it is simply the working together of society. Of course, you probably hate your police officer down the road or tax payer paved streets.

Capitalism also has a nasty history...So we abolish and do away with it?

Hate the police officer? Ferguson and Baltimore taught US about hating the Police. As per roads, if there is no factory, there is no need for roads. If there are no farms, there is no need for roads. If there are no shops, there are no need for roads. Do the factory, farm, and shop need the road? Absolutely. But, let's be smart about which is more important? Or, would we simply have many roads and bridges to nowhere? And that is where socialism extremities creep in. Bridges to nowhere so cronies and bureaucrats can get paid.

In the nineteenth century the factory owners built the roads to their factories.

Classic conservatism. Let's go back to the 19th century.

Yeah, it was such a paradise then.

Of course most here would already have died but great times.

 

[bripat9643]

Let more socialism or less socialism be up to the will of the People. That is how democracy is supposed to work.

That's what's wrong with democracy. My rights shouldn't be up to a majority vote, and the right to own property is one of them.

Your rights aren't up for a vote. Neither are the rights of those you say are less worthy than you, like gay people and transgender kids.

My rights are up for a vote every day. ACA was just one vast assault on my rights, and Congress voted on that.

 

[Jack4jill]

Using force to take another's property is antithetical to Christian ethics.

Abandoning materialism is central to Christianity.

That's fine and should be Voluntary. not FORCED on the people by Masters in the Government.

Of course, and Christianity is not being forced on people in the U.S. by the government.
Sharing is imposed by the person on whom Christianity is based. Yet, such a large amount of the population claims to be Christian that if it were true, government run public assistance would not be necessary. Unfortunately, assistance is necessary. There is no present system in place to do that except, lamentably, through government.

Liberals claim it's necessary, but they never offer any proof. Of course, you need a lot more when the government seduces teenage girls into getting pregnant by offering to pay all their bills when they do.

Tell the conservatives in this thread how you would fund the nation's military,

just to remind them who they're talking to.

They going to go door to door selling cookies, like the Girl Scouts. Taxes are optional for all in his world.

 

[bripat9643]

The problem is when socialism or capitalism gets to its extremes. Socialism as been around for about 10,000 years and it is simply the working together of society. Of course, you probably hate your police officer down the road or tax payer paved streets.

Capitalism also has a nasty history...So we abolish and do away with it?

Hate the police officer? Ferguson and Baltimore taught US about hating the Police. As per roads, if there is no factory, there is no need for roads. If there are no farms, there is no need for roads. If there are no shops, there are no need for roads. Do the factory, farm, and shop need the road? Absolutely. But, let's be smart about which is more important? Or, would we simply have many roads and bridges to nowhere? And that is where socialism extremities creep in. Bridges to nowhere so cronies and bureaucrats can get paid.

In the nineteenth century the factory owners built the roads to their factories.

Classic conservatism. Let's go back to the 19th century.

Yeah, it was such a paradise then.

Of course most here would already have died but great times.

We want the government we had in the 19th Century. That isn't synonymous with abandoning all scientific and technical progress that has occurred since then. But spouting cheap slogans is so much easier than posting truth.

 

[NYcarbineer]

• Q. What does ti take to be a socialist
• A. Christian Ethics

• Force is power, banks, insurance companies, cartels and wall street have both;
• Brokers take the assets of others to their benefit; vis a vis fiduciaries
• Theft is wrong, taxes paid to Caesar are not.

Using force to take another's property is antithetical to Christian ethics.

Abandoning materialism is central to Christianity.

That's fine and should be Voluntary. not FORCED on the people by Masters in the Government.

A government run by voluntary donations? LOL, goodbye massive military.

No, the military only consumes about 3% of our GDP. I think people would be more than willing to contribute that much of their income to a national defense.

lol, you cannot be serious.

 

[Wry Catcher]

Bripat9643, maybe you ought to move to Pitcairn Island, it has few people and its founders were iconoclasts like you. They want people to come to their shores and even offer free land where you could build a house. The Island has the Internet and you could continue to bloviate away. A ship arrives four times a year, so no one would intrude on your hermitage, and the other 50 or so people would find you to be their resident curmudgeon, and allow you your individual solitude - no collective experience need bother you.

Here's the 411

Pitcairn Island Immigration

 

[NYcarbineer]

The problem is when socialism or capitalism gets to its extremes. Socialism as been around for about 10,000 years and it is simply the working together of society. Of course, you probably hate your police officer down the road or tax payer paved streets.

Capitalism also has a nasty history...So we abolish and do away with it?

Hate the police officer? Ferguson and Baltimore taught US about hating the Police. As per roads, if there is no factory, there is no need for roads. If there are no farms, there is no need for roads. If there are no shops, there are no need for roads. Do the factory, farm, and shop need the road? Absolutely. But, let's be smart about which is more important? Or, would we simply have many roads and bridges to nowhere? And that is where socialism extremities creep in. Bridges to nowhere so cronies and bureaucrats can get paid.

In the nineteenth century the factory owners built the roads to their factories.

Classic conservatism. Let's go back to the 19th century.

Yeah, it was such a paradise then.

Of course most here would already have died but great times.

We want the government we had in the 19th Century. That isn't synonymous with abandoning all scientific and technical progress that has occurred since then. But spouting cheap slogans is so much easier than posting truth.

You are on record wanting NO mandatory taxation.

 

[Jack4jill]

Let more socialism or less socialism be up to the will of the People. That is how democracy is supposed to work.

That's what's wrong with democracy. My rights shouldn't be up to a majority vote, and the right to own property is one of them.

Your rights aren't up for a vote. Neither are the rights of those you say are less worthy than you, like gay people and transgender kids.

My rights are up for a vote every day. ACA was just one vast assault on my rights, and Congress voted on that.

Your right to get sick and force us to pay for your sick ass isn't a right.

You can get coverage by society, or coverage by a plan you choose. No coverage is not an option, that comes out of my pocket and you are already on my tab.

 

[bripat9643]

Abandoning materialism is central to Christianity.

That's fine and should be Voluntary. not FORCED on the people by Masters in the Government.

Of course, and Christianity is not being forced on people in the U.S. by the government.
Sharing is imposed by the person on whom Christianity is based. Yet, such a large amount of the population claims to be Christian that if it were true, government run public assistance would not be necessary. Unfortunately, assistance is necessary. There is no present system in place to do that except, lamentably, through government.

Liberals claim it's necessary, but they never offer any proof. Of course, you need a lot more when the government seduces teenage girls into getting pregnant by offering to pay all their bills when they do.

Tell the conservatives in this thread how you would fund the nation's military,

just to remind them who they're talking to.

They going to go door to door selling cookies, like the Girl Scouts. Taxes are optional for all in his world.

I envisage telethons that ask people to make an automatic monthly contribution to the national defense. When people are allowed to keep 100% of their income, a 3% contribution won't be the slightest burden.

 

[bripat9643]

Hate the police officer? Ferguson and Baltimore taught US about hating the Police. As per roads, if there is no factory, there is no need for roads. If there are no farms, there is no need for roads. If there are no shops, there are no need for roads. Do the factory, farm, and shop need the road? Absolutely. But, let's be smart about which is more important? Or, would we simply have many roads and bridges to nowhere? And that is where socialism extremities creep in. Bridges to nowhere so cronies and bureaucrats can get paid.

In the nineteenth century the factory owners built the roads to their factories.

Classic conservatism. Let's go back to the 19th century.

Yeah, it was such a paradise then.

Of course most here would already have died but great times.

We want the government we had in the 19th Century. That isn't synonymous with abandoning all scientific and technical progress that has occurred since then. But spouting cheap slogans is so much easier than posting truth.

You are on record wanting NO mandatory taxation.

The word "mandatory" is redundant when put before the word "taxation."

So how does getting rid of taxation make the telephone and the light bulb disappear?

 

[bripat9643]

Let more socialism or less socialism be up to the will of the People. That is how democracy is supposed to work.

That's what's wrong with democracy. My rights shouldn't be up to a majority vote, and the right to own property is one of them.

Your rights aren't up for a vote. Neither are the rights of those you say are less worthy than you, like gay people and transgender kids.

My rights are up for a vote every day. ACA was just one vast assault on my rights, and Congress voted on that.

Your right to get sick and force us to pay for your sick ass isn't a right.

You can get coverage by society, or coverage by a plan you choose. No coverage is not an option, that comes out of my pocket and you are already on my tab.

No coverage is an option. It may mean no treatment, but that's your decision.

 

[Jack4jill]

That's fine and should be Voluntary. not FORCED on the people by Masters in the Government.

Of course, and Christianity is not being forced on people in the U.S. by the government.
Sharing is imposed by the person on whom Christianity is based. Yet, such a large amount of the population claims to be Christian that if it were true, government run public assistance would not be necessary. Unfortunately, assistance is necessary. There is no present system in place to do that except, lamentably, through government.

Liberals claim it's necessary, but they never offer any proof. Of course, you need a lot more when the government seduces teenage girls into getting pregnant by offering to pay all their bills when they do.

Tell the conservatives in this thread how you would fund the nation's military,

just to remind them who they're talking to.

They going to go door to door selling cookies, like the Girl Scouts. Taxes are optional for all in his world.

I envisage telethons that ask people to make an automatic monthly contribution to the national defense. When people are allowed to keep 100% of their income, a 3% contribution won't be the slightest burden.

And the military will soon discover what everyone else knows, the checks don't come in.

Taxes solve the Free Rider problem, like the ACA.

 

[bripat9643]

Using force to take another's property is antithetical to Christian ethics.

Abandoning materialism is central to Christianity.

That's fine and should be Voluntary. not FORCED on the people by Masters in the Government.

A government run by voluntary donations? LOL, goodbye massive military.

No, the military only consumes about 3% of our GDP. I think people would be more than willing to contribute that much of their income to a national defense.

lol, you cannot be serious.

I'm dead serious.

 

[Fenton Lum]

I'm doing well, thanks for the concern; I’m referring more to the cannibalization of American society at large. Until we evolve away from what you advocate we will continue to borrow to maintain a level of empire and consumption this society can no longer afford, wages will continue to fall for the workers the “job creators” exploit, poverty will continue to spread, permanent war of empire will continue unabated, privatized prison system mass incarceration will continue and spread in our post industrial society, human beings will continue to be commoditized regardless of “which” political party wins, and the public will continue to get 90% of what they see and hear (and believe in when it comes to people like you) from a half dozen corporations spewing a false perceptual reality while judicial fiat continues to be leveraged to strip citizens of basic constitutional rights. The system will do to us whatever we allow and all we would have to do is stop participating and cooperating.

Quote where I made those points or be proven as a lying asshole. I don't need to misrepresent others' views. YOU DO!

The more the unsubstantial people get squeezed, the more they have to focus on gettng by the daily grind. The republican party went batshit crazy over my lifetime and the democratic party morphed into the republican party I grew up with and a lot of that happened in my opinion during the previous Clinton's administration. All the democratic party has to do is act as if they're a bit "left" of the republican party, which brings us back to the lesser of the two evils, and that's for the most part on social issues. It's all pretty bipartisan when it comes to corporate societal wealth extraction.

So you think the country has moved to the right. So you're a liar, an unclever one and that, and incredibly stupid. We have gay marriage, the government leaning on private citizens to bake cakes against their will, bigger government, more regulations, industries like coal being dumped on, mandated by central government health insurance and on and on.

You live in an alternative universe and can only support it with lies and smears.

Then apparently all your voting republican/"conservative" didn't amount to much did it, and your "two" party system is a ruse. I can't help anyone who still actually believes that if you can only vote enough members of either party in the mess will right itself. But you keep on working on that if you think it will help.

 

[bripat9643]

Of course, and Christianity is not being forced on people in the U.S. by the government.
Sharing is imposed by the person on whom Christianity is based. Yet, such a large amount of the population claims to be Christian that if it were true, government run public assistance would not be necessary. Unfortunately, assistance is necessary. There is no present system in place to do that except, lamentably, through government.

Liberals claim it's necessary, but they never offer any proof. Of course, you need a lot more when the government seduces teenage girls into getting pregnant by offering to pay all their bills when they do.

Tell the conservatives in this thread how you would fund the nation's military,

just to remind them who they're talking to.

They going to go door to door selling cookies, like the Girl Scouts. Taxes are optional for all in his world.

I envisage telethons that ask people to make an automatic monthly contribution to the national defense. When people are allowed to keep 100% of their income, a 3% contribution won't be the slightest burden.

And the military will soon discover what everyone else knows, the checks don't come in.

Taxes solve the Free Rider problem, like the ACA.

That may be the case, but other solutions have been proposed.

 

[bripat9643]

I'm doing well, thanks for the concern; I’m referring more to the cannibalization of American society at large. Until we evolve away from what you advocate we will continue to borrow to maintain a level of empire and consumption this society can no longer afford, wages will continue to fall for the workers the “job creators” exploit, poverty will continue to spread, permanent war of empire will continue unabated, privatized prison system mass incarceration will continue and spread in our post industrial society, human beings will continue to be commoditized regardless of “which” political party wins, and the public will continue to get 90% of what they see and hear (and believe in when it comes to people like you) from a half dozen corporations spewing a false perceptual reality while judicial fiat continues to be leveraged to strip citizens of basic constitutional rights. The system will do to us whatever we allow and all we would have to do is stop participating and cooperating.

Quote where I made those points or be proven as a lying asshole. I don't need to misrepresent others' views. YOU DO!

The more the unsubstantial people get squeezed, the more they have to focus on gettng by the daily grind. The republican party went batshit crazy over my lifetime and the democratic party morphed into the republican party I grew up with and a lot of that happened in my opinion during the previous Clinton's administration. All the democratic party has to do is act as if they're a bit "left" of the republican party, which brings us back to the lesser of the two evils, and that's for the most part on social issues. It's all pretty bipartisan when it comes to corporate societal wealth extraction.

So you think the country has moved to the right. So you're a liar, an unclever one and that, and incredibly stupid. We have gay marriage, the government leaning on private citizens to bake cakes against their will, bigger government, more regulations, industries like coal being dumped on, mandated by central government health insurance and on and on.

You live in an alternative universe and can only support it with lies and smears.

Then apparently all your voting republican/"conservative" didn't amount to much did it, and your "two" party system is a ruse. I can't help anyone who still actually believes that if you can only vote enough members of either party in the mess will right itself. But you keep on working on that if you think it will help.

So what's your solution?