The tragedy of religious conservatism

[deaddude]

Problem with this is there are people who are right and people who are wrong. Ex. Someone may say that grass is purple. Thats going to be wrong. People can say 2+2=5. thats wrong. The fact is some people are right about some things and some people are wrong about some things. Religion doesnt change that.

Second, the Greateast killer in the history of the world is Communism. Communists have been responsible for more deaths in the last 100 years then in all the religious wars combined.

Besides, why is it that you guys cant tell the difference between someone to be claiming to do something in the name of God and people using religion to justify their evil? To say organized religion is somehow responsible for the actions of evil men who act contrary to their religious tenents is absurd.

With that said I think you had it right to a certain point

People can say the grass is purple, for some people the color scheme is inverted. Like color blindness, these people perceive colors differently than normal. Where you see the grass being green or yellow one of these might see it as purple. For that matter we have no proof that we are correct. The grass may very well be purple and the rest of us are seeing it wrong. We have consensus but the consensus is not always right. (But we all know that the grass is green)

The fact that Jesus said he was the way becomes inconsequential when you factor in that Jesus represented an omnipotent being who was perfectly capable of representing him self differently to cultures around the globe. Sure Jesus could be the way. At the same time God could have sent Krishna to the Hindus or Buddha to the Buddhists. In a sense God could have been marketing his teachings in ways that suited the particular culture. In short everybody could be right and everybody could be wrong.

You are both wrong about the greatest killers though. The greatest killers in the history of the world have theoretically been meteors. Damn things wiped out the dinosaurs, brought on an ice age, and a Civilization Ender supposedly hit the middle east a while back so yeah, greatest killer = meteors :

 

[dmp]

People can say the grass is purple, for some people the color scheme is inverted. Like color blindness, these people perceive colors differently than normal. Where you see the grass being green or yellow one of these might see it as purple. For that matter we have no proof that we are correct. The grass may very well be purple and the rest of us are seeing it wrong. We have consensus but the consensus is not always right. (But we all know that the grass is green)

The fact that Jesus said he was the way becomes inconsequential when you factor in that Jesus represented an omnipotent being who was perfectly capable of representing him self differently to cultures around the globe. Sure Jesus could be the way. At the same time God could have sent Krishna to the Hindus or Buddha to the Buddhists. In a sense God could have been marketing his teachings in ways that suited the particular culture. In short everybody could be right and everybody could be wrong.

You are both wrong about the greatest killers though. The greatest killers in the history of the world have theoretically been meteors. Damn things wiped out the dinosaurs, brought on an ice age, and a Civilization Ender supposedly hit the middle east a while back so yeah, greatest killer = meteors :

So would each of God's 'saviours' then need to die for the sins of mankind? How come no other 'rose again' after their death?

 

[wade]

What a total load. Try thinking with something higher up on your body than your sphincter.

You cannot argue with the obvious points of the orginal post, so instead you choose to pick it apart asking "define this" and "define that". You know what is being discussed but you cannot really refute it logically or empirically, so instead you choose to pick at nits.

You're the lame one Merlin. There is no call for such juvinile insults. You're just trying to drive away someone who's opinion is contrary to your own by being ugly.

Wade.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

You cannot argue with the obvious points of the orginal post, so instead you choose to pick it apart asking "define this" and "define that". You know what is being discussed but you cannot really refute it logically or empirically, so instead you choose to pick at nits.

You're the lame one Merlin. There is no call for such juvinile insults. You're just trying to drive away someone who's opinion is contrary to your own by being ugly.

Wade.

Religion has also provided a fundamental positive framework for society since time immemorial. You lefties just hate religion because "Thou shalt not covet" goes against your basic m.o. , fueling class warfare, and convincing people they're deserving, even if they scumbags. It's so simple to k you o.

 

[Avatar4321]

Religion has also provided a fundamental positive framework for society since time immemorial. You lefties just hate religion because "Thou shalt not covet" goes against your basic m.o. , fueling class warfare, and convincing people they're deserving, even if they scumbags. It's so simple to k you o.

Actually i think the one that hurts them the most is "Thou shalt not commit adultry" but then they arent too popular of the "thou shalt not kill" one either.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Actually i think the one that hurts them the most is "Thou shalt not commit adultry" but then they arent too popular of the "thou shalt not kill" one either.

Yeah. that murder one gets in the way of their genocide against the bourgeois. And thou shalt not steal pretty eliminates their governmental confiscation of all property. "reforms" I think they call them.

 

[acludem]

I live by the George Carlin set of three comandments:

1. Always be honest and faithful to the provider of thy nookie.

2. Try really, really hard not kill anyone.

3. Keep thy religion to thyself.

acludem

 

[wade]

Religion has also provided a fundamental positive framework for society since time immemorial. You lefties just hate religion because "Thou shalt not covet" goes against your basic m.o. , fueling class warfare, and convincing people they're deserving, even if they scumbags. It's so simple to k you o.

Hmmm... You mean like the 200+ year delay in getting an effective water pump because the Catholic Church decided that there was no such thing as a vacume and persecuted anyone who proposed there was?

You mean like the several hundred year delay in getting any kind of modern medicine in Europe because the church decreed how medicine would work and persecuted those who would seak alternatives to treatments that did not work?

You mean the Crusades? Or the Jew's successful genocidal war against the Ketemites?

Just what "positive framework" are you refering to RWA? Substantiate it! Give us some links!

Wade.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Hmmm... You mean like the 200+ year delay in getting an effective water pump because the Catholic Church decided that there was no such thing as a vacume and persecuted anyone who proposed there was?

You mean like the several hundred year delay in getting any kind of modern medicine in Europe because the church decreed how medicine would work and persecuted those who would seak alternatives to treatments that did not work?

You mean the Crusades? Or the Jew's successful genocidal war against the Ketemites?

Just what "positive framework" are you refering to RWA? Substantiate it! Give us some links!

Wade.

Basic day to day observance of a code of conduct, a social contract. I don't need a link for this. Your crusade against religion is MORE bloody and backward.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

I live by the George Carlin set of three comandments:

1. Always be honest and faithful to the provider of thy nookie.

2. Try really, really hard not kill anyone.

3. Keep thy religion to thyself.

acludem

Cool. THought suppression and religious intolerance. Just like a lefty.

 

[wade]

Basic day to day observance of a code of conduct, a social contract. I don't need a link for this. Your crusade against religion is MORE bloody and backward.

Ahh but I can show you instance after instance where it failed to provide a "code of conduct" of any positive meaning, and where the social contract was a perverted one.

But you have made the argument - what's the matter can't you defend your position?

Your full of RWA! You can't!

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Ahh but I can show you instance after instance where it failed to provide a "code of conduct" of any positive meaning, and where the social contract was a perverted one.

But you have made the argument - what's the matter can't you defend your position?

Your full of RWA! You can't!

The fact is, wade, there is no control group of humanity which has had no religion. Your study is inherently flawed. You spew junk science.

 

[wade]

Actually RWA, I have no problem with religion, as long as it is at the community level. There are many christian groups and other faiths that are perfectly fine.

It's the Catholics, Jews, Moslims, and other large scale religions that I have a problem with. These have shown time and again that they do more harm than good.

Wade.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Actually RWA, I have no problem with religion, as long as it is at the community level. There are many christian groups and other faiths that are perfectly fine.

It's the Catholics, Jews, Moslims, and other large scale religions that I have a problem with. These have shown time and again that they do more harm than good.

Wade.

Hmm, religion at the communiy level ? curious.

Yet those are the most successful ones. I guess their practitioners did ok. Considering that all major peoples have exhibited a fairly organized religion, I guess that means your just whistling dixie from your sphinctoid.

 

[wade]

Look again. The Catholic faith is in decline, where the multitude of christian demoninations which operate at the community level are on the rise.

People are learning that too much power in the hands of too few who claim to be somehow closer to God than everyone else is a bad thing.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Look again. The Catholic faith is in decline, where the multitude of christian demoninations which operate at the community level are on the rise.

People are learning that too much power in the hands of too few who claim to be somehow closer to God than everyone else is a bad thing.

Christian denominations which operate at the community level are still religions.

People are also learning that the empty totalitarian promises of those who claim to serve the people are really doing no such thing. And they're also learning that those who castigate religion in the name of a better world, are the practitioners of the death cult of socialism/communism.

 

[wade]

Christian denominations which operate at the community level are still religions.

People are also learning that the empty totalitarian promises of those who claim to serve the people are really doing no such thing. And they're also learning that those who castigate religion in the name of a better world, are the practitioners of the death cult of socialism/communism.

Stop trying to change the topic. The topic is religion and religious conservatism.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Stop trying to change the topic. The topic is religion and religious conservatism.

Yeah. and christianity which operates at the community level is still religion, and can be conservative.

You had also brought what people are learning into the mix. They are also learning what the anti religious agenda is really all about, destroying memes which compete with state totalitarianism. I'm quite on topic. You're still off base.

 

[wade]

And as I said, I have no problem with community based religion. I don't care if it's conservative or liberal. Where I have a problem with it is when it gets to national or international levels of political power. In almost every case, these can be shown to have done more harm than good.

Wade.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

And as I said, I have no problem with community based religion. I don't care if it's conservative or liberal. Where I have a problem with it is when it gets to national or international levels of political power. In almost every case, these can be shown to have done more harm than good.

Wade.

Religious organization structure is not the topic, actually. In any case, I still disagree.