The US Flag Is Now School Contraband

[jillian]

if it bothered you so much, i must have done something right.

loon.

i can't stand pretend patriots who haven't a cluse what we're supposed to be about.

I assure you jillian my patriotism is not some "some absurd homogeneous non-existant pretend 'patriotic' movie version of the U.S. " it is very real! It is my right as a citizen to carry or display the American flag anywhere in our country I dam well please and I will do so proudly. That is a right that I will not give up under any circumstances and will gladly take a bullet for. I refuse to believe that to feel that way is "absurd" and I also believe that 90% of the people that I serve with feel the same way. Quite frankly I find it apalling that anyone would try to argue that. There are many issues that I am willing to compromise and listen to alternative views but this one is so basic and so essential.

my intent was not to in any way question YOUR patriotism. I hope you understand that. I have nothing but respect for people who put themselves on the line for us. My point was that in this country, whether one likes it or not, unpopular views are protected. We can say ugly things... think ugly things... act in ways that I, myself, would not act. We can burn the flag. I don't approve of that and would never do such a thing, but I am grateful that I live someplace where we protect the right to speech. On a personal level, I think a flag is a symbol and I don't believe in protecting symbols at the expense of the thing they're supposed to represent...

That said, the article makes it clear that this particular school is having racial issues. They are doing their best to try to tamp down those issues. And whether I agree with the way they tried to control things or not, I don't think they did anything wrong telling ALL the children that they couldn't go waving flags.

And I know that the reaction would be very different if it was the mexican flag that were banned.

 

[Ken84]

if it bothered you so much, i must have done something right.

loon.

i can't stand pretend patriots who haven't a cluse what we're supposed to be about.

I assure you jillian my patriotism is not some "some absurd homogeneous non-existant pretend 'patriotic' movie version of the U.S. " it is very real! It is my right as a citizen to carry or display the American flag anywhere in our country I dam well please and I will do so proudly. That is a right that I will not give up under any circumstances and will gladly take a bullet for. I refuse to believe that to feel that way is "absurd" and I also believe that 90% of the people that I serve with feel the same way. Quite frankly I find it apalling that anyone would try to argue that. There are many issues that I am willing to compromise and listen to alternative views but this one is so basic and so essential.

my intent was not to in any way question YOUR patriotism. I hope you understand that. I have nothing but respect for people who put themselves on the line for us. My point was that in this country, whether one likes it or not, unpopular views are protected. We can say ugly things... think ugly things... act in ways that I, myself, would not act. We can burn the flag. I don't approve of that and would never do such a thing, but I am grateful that I live someplace where we protect the right to speech. On a personal level, I think a flag is a symbol and I don't believe in protecting symbols at the expense of the thing they're supposed to represent...

That said, the article makes it clear that this particular school is having racial issues. They are doing their best to try to tamp down those issues. And whether I agree with the way they tried to control things or not, I don't think they did anything wrong telling ALL the children that they couldn't go waving flags.

And I know that the reaction would be very different if it was the mexican flag that were banned.

Just to be clear; So you are okay with violating one of our very basic rights in the name of taking care of racial issues? It seems there are plenty of alternative actions that could have been taken.

 

[Annie]

The school district reversed its decision:

Turlock Journal - Denair student can fly American flag once again

Denair student can fly American flag once again

Denair Middle School eighthgrader Cody Alicea sits on his bike proudly displaying the American flag that has stirred up nationwide controversy.

MAEGAN MARTENS / The Journal
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By Maegan Martens
Education Reporter

POSTED Nov. 12, 2010 10:43 p.m.


Two months ago when 13-year-old Cody Alicea decided to unfurl an American flag and let it flutter in the wind behind his bike, he had no idea he would unleash a touchstone of conversation that would have tongues wagging across the nation. He just thought he was getting into the spirit for an upcoming school trip to Washington, D.C.

Alicea’s display of American pride was cut short when he was asked to remove the American flag from his bike on Monday by a Denair Middle School campus supervisor because it might be creating “racial tension” and there were concerns for his safety.

“A school employee said some students have been complaining about my flag and I needed to take it down,” Alicea said. “So I took it down. I was kind of mad and upset because I have been flying it for two months and all of a sudden its Veterans week and it’s a problem.”

The Denair Unified School District backed up the campus supervisor’s decision, in part because they had previously made other students stop displaying the flag of Mexico on Cinco de Mayo.

However, after an outcry was raised locally and from afar, the district reversed that call on Friday, once again allowing Alicea to fly Old Glory...

 

[jillian]

I assure you jillian my patriotism is not some "some absurd homogeneous non-existant pretend 'patriotic' movie version of the U.S. " it is very real! It is my right as a citizen to carry or display the American flag anywhere in our country I dam well please and I will do so proudly. That is a right that I will not give up under any circumstances and will gladly take a bullet for. I refuse to believe that to feel that way is "absurd" and I also believe that 90% of the people that I serve with feel the same way. Quite frankly I find it apalling that anyone would try to argue that. There are many issues that I am willing to compromise and listen to alternative views but this one is so basic and so essential.

my intent was not to in any way question YOUR patriotism. I hope you understand that. I have nothing but respect for people who put themselves on the line for us. My point was that in this country, whether one likes it or not, unpopular views are protected. We can say ugly things... think ugly things... act in ways that I, myself, would not act. We can burn the flag. I don't approve of that and would never do such a thing, but I am grateful that I live someplace where we protect the right to speech. On a personal level, I think a flag is a symbol and I don't believe in protecting symbols at the expense of the thing they're supposed to represent...

That said, the article makes it clear that this particular school is having racial issues. They are doing their best to try to tamp down those issues. And whether I agree with the way they tried to control things or not, I don't think they did anything wrong telling ALL the children that they couldn't go waving flags.

And I know that the reaction would be very different if it was the mexican flag that were banned.

Just to be clear; So you are okay with violating one of our very basic rights in the name of taking care of racial issues? It seems there are plenty of alternative actions that could have been taken.

as it happens, it was pointed out that it's moot right now since the school board reversed its decision. so it's apparently more hysteria over nothing. but honestly? you don't have the same rights at school that you have elsewhere.

it's part of being at school... and yes, i'm ok with it if they're flying flags as if they were gang colors.... but only b/c they're in school.

in real life no one has the right not to be offended

 

[Ken84]

Like you said this is a mute point now and I will let it go with this. Personally, I believe school age kids are at the most impressionable age of their life and hence that is when we should be instilling American values and patriotism; as well as respect for others. There is quite simply no reason why school officials and more importantly parents should not be demanding the kind of respect for fellow students that would create and enviroment where kids could carry the flag without causing mayhem. Like you said earlier however we are imperfect people. Good discussion though

 

[jillian]

Lets break this down to a single point. Would you Jillian agree that it is every American citizens right to carry or display the Flag anywhere any time?

oh.. i didn't see this question.

my answer is, yes... in real life you have the right to display any flag you wish. whether you should is another story,

but when you are in school... maybe not.

 

[jillian]

Like you said this is a mute point now and I will let it go with this. Personally, I believe school age kids are at the most impressionable age of their life and hence that is when we should be instilling American values and patriotism; as well as respect for others. There is quite simply no reason why school officials and more importantly parents should not be demanding the kind of respect for fellow students that would create and enviroment where kids could carry the flag without causing mayhem. Like you said earlier however we are imperfect people. Good discussion though

While I agree with you to an extent, I think it is a question of what values we prioritize. The value I would prioritize is being welcoming to all people, regardless of ethnicity, since that is the value I believe this country was built on. It was the reason my grandparents came here to escape repression. The first step in creating an environment in which any kid can carry the flag without causing mayhem is in teaching them not to hate any group of people and not to use the flag as something exclusionary...

and yes, good conversation. thank you for your courtesty.

 

[Twofox]

Lets break this down to a single point. Would you Jillian agree that it is every American citizens right to carry or display the Flag anywhere any time?

oh.. i didn't see this question.

my answer is, yes... in real life you have the right to display any flag you wish. whether you should is another story,

but when you are in school... maybe not.

So,.,... school isn't real life? What are you trying to say? That kids have no right to display the flag of their country? The battle flag of their country? Maybe the kids father is deployed, would that change anything for you?

So in your eyes, equal under the law only when convienient?

 

[Tank]

 

[Tank]

 

[Bullfighter]

it's not about it being racist. it's about them having racial tensions at the school and trying to keep them tamped down. i think they went overboard. but honestly? i think flying a flag from one's bike is silly and you have to ask why the kid is doing it.

Here's your flag so the little darlings won't get upset.

 

[Bullfighter]

Like you said this is a mute point now and I will let it go with this. Personally, I believe school age kids are at the most impressionable age of their life and hence that is when we should be instilling American values and patriotism; as well as respect for others. There is quite simply no reason why school officials and more importantly parents should not be demanding the kind of respect for fellow students that would create and enviroment where kids could carry the flag without causing mayhem. Like you said earlier however we are imperfect people. Good discussion though

While I agree with you to an extent, I think it is a question of what values we prioritize. The value I would prioritize is being welcoming to all people, regardless of ethnicity, since that is the value I believe this country was built on. It was the reason my grandparents came here to escape repression. The first step in creating an environment in which any kid can carry the flag without causing mayhem is in teaching them not to hate any group of people and not to use the flag as something exclusionary...

and yes, good conversation. thank you for your courtesty.

Mexicans plant their flags to show they are trying to take over the United States. That sends a message back to Mexico that Americans aren't willing to fight for their own country. And you help to spread that message.

 

[Bullfighter]

Thanks. I needed that so I can focus my gun sights.

 

[Wicked Jester]

Always remember my friends, when reading through threads like these, that it was LEFTIES who were burning flags, spitting on our troops and making their lives living hells back in the sixties and early seventies....NEVER lose sight of the fact that they are no different now then they were back then....Anything they claim should always be considered suspect.

 

[Bullfighter]

always remember my friends, when reading through threads like these, that it was lefties who were burning flags, spitting on our troops and making their lives living hells back in the sixties and early seventies....never lose sight of the fact that they are no different now then they were back then.

"yankee go home!"

 

[hboats]

if it bothered you so much, i must have done something right.

loon.

i can't stand pretend patriots who haven't a cluse what we're supposed to be about.

I assure you jillian my patriotism is not some "some absurd homogeneous non-existant pretend 'patriotic' movie version of the U.S. " it is very real! It is my right as a citizen to carry or display the American flag anywhere in our country I dam well please and I will do so proudly. That is a right that I will not give up under any circumstances and will gladly take a bullet for. I refuse to believe that to feel that way is "absurd" and I also believe that 90% of the people that I serve with feel the same way. Quite frankly I find it apalling that anyone would try to argue that. There are many issues that I am willing to compromise and listen to alternative views but this one is so basic and so essential.

my intent was not to in any way question YOUR patriotism. I hope you understand that. I have nothing but respect for people who put themselves on the line for us. My point was that in this country, whether one likes it or not, unpopular views are protected. We can say ugly things... think ugly things... act in ways that I, myself, would not act. We can burn the flag. I don't approve of that and would never do such a thing, but I am grateful that I live someplace where we protect the right to speech. On a personal level, I think a flag is a symbol and I don't believe in protecting symbols at the expense of the thing they're supposed to represent...

That said, the article makes it clear that this particular school is having racial issues. They are doing their best to try to tamp down those issues. And whether I agree with the way they tried to control things or not, I don't think they did anything wrong telling ALL the children that they couldn't go waving flags.

And I know that the reaction would be very different if it was the mexican flag that were banned.

The article also made it clear that the family of this young man didn't want anything more to come of this. They were quoted as saying that they didn't want to make it a big issue. But you and some others on this thread still had the audacity to try to make that family look like racists and attention seekers.

The fact is, the school was wrong to ask this boy to take the flag off of his bike. And then they compounded their wrong by trying to make ANY flag against the rules at school. When push came to shove, they backed down.

Rick

 

[Shadow]

well, it's their usual 'we're more american than you are' fake patriot thing.

there's clearly a lot more going on here. but it's not like that matters to the pretend patriots

You sicken me

While you sicken the rest of us.

Speak for yourself...

 

[Bullfighter]

Like you said this is a mute point now and I will let it go with this. Personally, I believe school age kids are at the most impressionable age of their life and hence that is when we should be instilling American values and patriotism; as well as respect for others. There is quite simply no reason why school officials and more importantly parents should not be demanding the kind of respect for fellow students that would create and enviroment where kids could carry the flag without causing mayhem. Like you said earlier however we are imperfect people. Good discussion though

While I agree with you to an extent, I think it is a question of what values we prioritize. The value I would prioritize is being welcoming to all people, regardless of ethnicity, since that is the value I believe this country was built on. It was the reason my grandparents came here to escape repression. The first step in creating an environment in which any kid can carry the flag without causing mayhem is in teaching them not to hate any group of people and not to use the flag as something exclusionary...

and yes, good conversation. thank you for your courtesty.

Over the last 65 years, many people had come forward and talked about how close they were in location to Hitler at one of his speeches and "if only I had a gun!" Trouble was, no one had the courage to take matters into their own hands and pull the trigger. That is the same problem today.

 

[islam4ever]

American flags are only good for one thing.

 

[Wicked Jester]

American flags are only good for one thing.

Yeah, flying proudly in your loony faces!


Oh, and, FUCK ALLAH!

ALLAH'S A PUSSY!......Bring that sack o' shit to my house and i'll show ya'!.....In fact, bring that Mohammed pussy along also!......After beatin' the shit out of those sorry sacks o' shit with the soles of my dog shit encrusted shoes, I'll shove a pig leg down their throats and force those Kabob suckin' motherfuckers to fuck each other up their asses, and then use their dirty, nasty beards for toilet paper. And there isn't a damn thing you, or any of your fellow dirty, smelly, unbathed goat herders are going to do about it!

Allah's a faggot!