Tucker Carlson

[Chillicothe]

So why were the rioters not charged with insurrection?

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
First, I don't work for the DOJ. Nor am I a lawyer.
So, my opinion is of a non-professional,...merely an observer.

And what I think I have read or heard on the telly is that the requirements for proving 'insurrection' are higher than, say, proving assault & battery on a uniformed federal police officer.
Most especially, when said assault is on multiple videos with the perpetrator clearly identifiable.

In short, that gaggle of society's losers in their MAGA hats committed multiple crimes....and the DOJ chose the easiest crimes to charge....and which were the easiest to prove. Think of it as----'low hanging fruit'.

So, "insurreciton" and "insurrecitonist".....are now common phrasing in our vernacular. A colloquial term that has become embedded in our speech and, indeed, in our understanding of what happened with the seditious attacks on our legislators in the Capitol of the United States on January 6th.

And we should all be OK with that.
After all...if a conviction for "insurrection" gets you 10yrs max in prison, but an assault with a dangerous weapon on a federal officer can get one 15yrs, with a minimum of 3.5 in lock-up...shouldn't we be content that justice is being served?

And combine that with which charge is easiest, quickest, and most assured of a conviction because it is much easier to prove?

Well hell, who really needs to convict these insurrectionist of insurrection if criminal assault will do? Why spend the money, time, and effort if a familiar on-hand hammer works better than a pricier one?

I'm quite cool with them getting 15yrs instead of 10yrs. You too?

 

[Batcat]

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
First, I don't work for the DOJ. Nor am I a lawyer.
So, my opinion is of a non-professional,...merely an observer.

And what I think I have read or heard on the telly is that the requirements for proving 'insurrection' are higher than, say, proving assault & battery on a uniformed federal police officer.
Most especially, when said assault is on multiple videos with the perpetrator clearly identifiable.

In short, that gaggle of society's losers in their MAGA hats committed multiple crimes....and the DOJ chose the easiest crimes to charge....and which were the easiest to prove. Think of it as----'low hanging fruit'.

So, "insurreciton" and "insurrecitonist".....are now common phrasing in our vernacular. A colloquial term that has become embedded in our speech and, indeed, in our understanding of what happened with the seditious attacks on our legislators in the Capitol of the United States on January 6th.

And we should all be OK with that.
After all...if a conviction for "insurrection" gets you 10yrs max in prison, but an assault with a dangerous weapon on a federal officer can get one 15yrs, with a minimum of 3.5 in lock-up...shouldn't we be content that justice is being served?

And combine that with which charge is easiest, quickest, and most assured of a conviction because it is much easier to prove?

Well hell, who really needs to convict these insurrectionist of insurrection if criminal assault will do? Why spend the money, time, and effort if a familiar on-hand hammer works better than a pricier one?

I'm quite cool with them getting 15yrs instead of 10yrs. You too?

So in other words the rioters were charged with appropriate crimes for what they actually did. The prosecutors could not make insurrection charges stick.

So why were the George Floyd rioters not similarly charged?

I personally support peaceful demonstrations but not violent riots. So the people who damaged the Capitol Building should be appropriately charged and sentenced. But so should the BLM rioters who set buildings on fire and injured police.

That also applies to those who rioted at the White House and send the President and family to a secure room for their safety.

You say,

After all...if a conviction for "insurrection" gets you 10yrs max in prison, but an assault with a dangerous weapon on a federal officer can get one 15yrs, with a minimum of 3.5 in lock-up...shouldn't we be content that justice is being served?

Plenty of cops were attacked by people with dangerous weapons during the BLM and White House riots but I haven’t heard of many prosecutions for those crimes. If so we must have different rules of law in our nation. Not one but many and mostly based on the political views of the rioters. Rioters against Trump or for BLM - good. Rioters for Trump - bad.

I personally want all rioters treated the same. As I said I am for peaceful demonstrations like MLK.

50 Secret Service agents injured in White House riots as Donald Trump is taken to 'terror attack' bunker

MORE than 50 Secret Service agents have been injured during ugly clashes outside the White House on a sixth night of violence sparked by the death of George Floyd. The attacks came after President …

www.thesun.co.uk

BLM's 'Mostly Peaceful' Riots Cost 1000x More in Damage Than Jan. 6 Capitol Unrest

While the leftist media coverage focuses on the Jan. 6 Capitol incursion, their coverage neglects BLM's frequent, more expensive riots.

www.westernjournal.com

 

[Batcat]

Then your deity must be a liberal.

My deity has no political persuasion.

 

[Batcat]

In a lot of riots the rioters show disdain for the police. Seldom if ever do they shout a specific officer's name.


So they were just shouting the VP's name with no inkling of what he was doing or his role on that day?


Oh my god...how much kool aid have you drank.

Why would any rioter know the name of a police officer he was facing? Often the police are in riot gear which would make it difficult to know who they were.

Plus the rioters wanted Pence to sent electoral votes back to state legislatures so of course they knew his name.

 

[candycorn]

Why would any rioter know the name of a police officer he was facing? Often the police are in riot gear which would make it difficult to know who they were.

You’re the one drawing the equivalence. Clearly they are not

Plus the rioters wanted Pence to sent electoral votes back to state legislatures so of course they knew his name.

What the restraints?

 

[Lesh]

The nine people who died as a result of that horrific day — including the four officers who died by suicide after the attack — weren’t so lucky. Neither was I. At the West Front of the Capitol, I was attempting to hold a tactical police line along with about 60 members of my team, as we were taught at the academy, to keep the invaders at bay. We were savagely beaten and easily overpowered. I later learned that the mob was estimated to be 10,000 strong.

It was like a medieval battleground. With our lives in peril, I would have been justified in using lethal force. But I didn’t want to spark a massacre. Over the course of the five-hour struggle, my hands were bloodied from being smashed by a stolen police baton. My right foot and left shoulder were so damaged that I needed multiple surgeries to repair them. My head was hit with such force with a pipe that I no doubt would have sustained brain damage if not for my helmet.

I have spent a year and a half in physical therapy for chronic pain that I have been told will never go away. My young son almost lost his father, and my wife had to quit medical school because of the stress and demands of my ongoing recovery.

I Was Betrayed by President Trump

And the Trumpers call that “fake news”?

 

[Chillicothe]

So in other words the rioters were charged with appropriate crimes for what they actually did. The prosecutors could not make insurrection charges stick.

Umm, no. You seemingly have misinterpreted what I posted. Perhaps I wasn't clear.

Lemme mansplain to you once again: The DOJ had hundreds and hundreds of cases to get adjudicated (near 1,000, last count I saw). Any responsible person supervising anything....will prioritize actions vis-a-vis available resources. Think of that as the essence of management responsibility.

So, faced with hundreds of accused perpetrators....some the DOJ clearly believed were guilty of insurrection, but also had those same ones on video smacking down a cop, well, with insurrection carrying a 10yr penalty, while the assault on the cop gets 'em 15 --- and is much easier to explain to laymen juries, and simpler and more direct to prove because it is right there on multiple videos.

Well, duh!!

Management 101.
---------------------------------------------------------------

But so should the BLM rioters who set buildings on fire and injured police.

Should they be punished? Yupper.
Next topic.
-----------------------------------------------

Plenty of cops were attacked by people with dangerous weapons during the BLM and White House riots but I haven’t heard of many prosecutions for those crimes.

Have you researched any of it?
I'm thinking ---No.
Go to google and check it out.
10,000 to 20,000 were arrested (reports vary as it was all 'local' law enforcement actions).

Rioters against Trump or for BLM - good. Rioters for Trump - bad.

That is silly. And you know it.
C'mon....this is a site for adult discourse.
Not for mere juvenile bumper-sticker level epigrams.
Such thinking informs the forum more about you than it does about BLM or J6 rioters.

 

[Batcat]

Umm, no. You seemingly have misinterpreted what I posted. Perhaps I wasn't clear.

Lemme mansplain to you once again: The DOJ had hundreds and hundreds of cases to get adjudicated (near 1,000, last count I saw). Any responsible person supervising anything....will prioritize actions vis-a-vis available resources. Think of that as the essence of management responsibility.

So, faced with hundreds of accused perpetrators....some the DOJ clearly believed were guilty of insurrection, but also had those same ones on video smacking down a cop, well, with insurrection carrying a 10yr penalty, while the assault on the cop gets 'em 15 --- and is much easier to explain to laymen juries, and simpler and more direct to prove because it is right there on multiple videos.

Well, duh!!

Management 101.
---------------------------------------------------------------

Should they be punished? Yupper.
Next topic.
-----------------------------------------------



Have you researched any of it?
I'm thinking ---No.
Go to google and check it out.
10,000 to 20,000 were arrested (reports vary as it was all 'local' law enforcement actions).




That is silly. And you know it.
C'mon....this is a site for adult discourse.
Not for mere juvenile bumper-sticker level epigrams.
Such thinking informs the forum more about you than it does about BLM or J6 rioters.

Discourse to you apparently only happens when people agree with you. I have my opinion and you of course have yours.

I think you would agree that a true insurrection involves planning.

Exclusive: FBI finds scant evidence U.S. Capitol attack was coordinated - sources

The FBI has found scant evidence that the Jan. 6 attack on the U.S. Capitol was the result of an organized plot to overturn the presidential election result, according to four current and former law enforcement officials.

www.reuters.com

WASHINGTON, Aug 20 (Reuters) - The FBI has found scant evidence that the Jan. 6 attack on the U.S. Capitol was the result of an organized plot to overturn the presidential election result, according to four current and former law enforcement officials.

Though federal officials have arrested more than 570 alleged participants, the FBI at this point believes the violence was not centrally coordinated by far-right groups or prominent supporters of then-President Donald Trump, according to the sources, who have been either directly involved in or briefed regularly on the wide-ranging investigations.

"Ninety to ninety-five percent of these are one-off cases," said a former senior law enforcement official with knowledge of the investigation. "Then you have five percent, maybe, of these militia groups that were more closely organized. But there was no grand scheme with Roger Stone and Alex Jones and all of these people to storm the Capitol and take hostages."

************

I realize how important it is for Democrats to call Jan 6th an insurrection but the reality is that it was just a riot. Rioters who attacked police or vandalized should be prosecuted but then so should the BLM rioters who pillaged, looted and burned cities.

One rule of law should apply to all rioters. MLK led peaceful demonstrations and his results were downright impressive. Violence is counterproductive.

Most charges against George Floyd protesters dropped, analysis shows

Some prosecutors and law enforcement observers say departments carried out mass arrests as crowd control tactic

www.theguardian.com

The vast majority of citations and charges against George Floyd protesters were ultimately dropped, dismissed or otherwise not filed, according to a Guardian analysis of law enforcement records and media reports in a dozen jurisdictions around the nation.

***snip***

In most of a dozen jurisdictions examined, at least 90% of cases were dropped or dismissed. In some cities, like Dallas and Philadelphia, as many as 95% of citations were dropped or not prosecuted.

 

[Chillicothe]

But there was no grand scheme with Roger Stone and Alex Jones and all of these people to storm the Capitol and take hostages."

----------------------------------------------------------

Notably, the linked article the poster uses as authority was penned only months after the seditious attack.....and well before more thorough and complete investigations and interviews of witnesses and participants could be accomplished.

What the scheme was....by the conspirators own words....was to disrupt the scheduled Electoral Count in order to acquire an injunction ala' Justice Alito to legally stop the count in order to insist that the 1887 Electoral Count Act was unconstitutional and the count really should follow the 12th Amendment protocols, which threw the count back to the states....with 27 of the states at that time under Republican control.

That 'disruption' could have occurred by Pence simply saying he didn't believe the election was legitimate and refuse to certify; or failing that, it could occur by the intimidation of militia disrupters.

With Pence informing Trump by phone that he would NOT halt the process ......the only avenue left to Trump and his co-conspirators ---Rudy, Powell, Eastman, Clark, Gohmert, et al, was to disrupt the count with the intentionally incited and angered MAGA Mob.

And we all saw what happened. Those militia tip-o-the-spear disrupters sparked a violent mass movement of people, all but for the handful of militia accelerators, merely Trump's Duped & Snookered. The TDS'rs, the intentionally angered and incited mob, that was led directly and violently against the thin blue line of police officers.

And then.....and then....the world saw the Trump supporters beat the crap out of the officers, break through the police line, and smash through doors and windows of the Capitol of the United States, violently trying to get to Pence, trying to get to Pelosi, trying to get to any legislator.

But, as noted in prior posts ---- Nancy Pelosi was alert to the attempt to get Alito to issue an injunction after any halt to the EC ballot counting. She moved expeditiously immediately after the Capitol had been cleared of the seditionist militias and the TDS'rs.

She assembled the legislators and ensured that the count proceeded per the protocols and the intentions of the 1887 Electoral Count act.

Nancy is an American hero for her actions. America was lucky to have such an alert, responsible and decisive leader on that day.

 

[Batcat]

----------------------------------------------------------

Notably, the linked article the poster uses as authority was penned only months after the seditious attack.....and well before more thorough and complete investigations and interviews of witnesses and participants could be accomplished.

What the scheme was....by the conspirators own words....was to disrupt the scheduled Electoral Count in order to acquire an injunction ala' Justice Alito to legally stop the count in order to insist that the 1887 Electoral Count Act was unconstitutional and the count really should follow the 12th Amendment protocols, which threw the count back to the states....with 27 of the states at that time under Republican control.

That 'disruption' could have occurred by Pence simply saying he didn't believe the election was legitimate and refuse to certify; or failing that, it could occur by the intimidation of militia disrupters.

With Pence informing Trump by phone that he would NOT halt the process ......the only avenue left to Trump and his co-conspirators ---Rudy, Powell, Eastman, Clark, Gohmert, et al, was to disrupt the count with the intentionally incited and angered MAGA Mob.

And we all saw what happened. Those militia tip-o-the-spear disrupters sparked a violent mass movement of people, all but for the handful of militia accelerators, merely Trump's Duped & Snookered. The TDS'rs, the intentionally angered and incited mob, that was led directly and violently against the thin blue line of police officers.

And then.....and then....the world saw the Trump supporters beat the crap out of the officers, break through the police line, and smash through doors and windows of the Capitol of the United States, violently trying to get to Pence, trying to get to Pelosi, trying to get to any legislator.

But, as noted in prior posts ---- Nancy Pelosi was alert to the attempt to get Alito to issue an injunction after any halt to the EC ballot counting. She moved expeditiously immediately after the Capitol had been cleared of the seditionist militias and the TDS'rs.

She assembled the legislators and ensured that the count proceeded per the protocols and the intentions of the 1887 Electoral Count act.

Nancy is an American hero for her actions. America was lucky to have such an alert, responsible and decisive leader on that day.

Here’s a more up to date article (Feb 16, 2023) that discusses charges against Jan 6th rioters. I glanced through the charges and the great majority seem to be appropriate for a riot but not for an insurrection as important ad Pearl Harbor or 9/11

At least 476 rioters have pleaded guilty for their role in the Capitol insurrection so far. This table shows them all.

More than 1,000 people have been charged with crimes over the Capitol riot on January 6, 2021, and 476 have pleaded guilty over two years later.

www.insider.com

The following article dated Jan 5, 2023, lists two people charged with sedition. Other people were charged with lesser crimes more appropriate to rioters once again.

Jan. 6 Insurrection 2 Years Later: How Many Arrested, Convicted And What Price Donald Trump May Still Pay

There have been almost 1,000 arrests made in connection with the insurrection and over 300 sentences.

www.forbes.com

***snip***


HOW MANY WERE CONVICTED OF SEDITION
Stewart Rhodes, the founder of right-wing militia group Oath Keepers and Kelly Meggs, the leader of the organization’s Florida chapter were both convicted of seditious conspiracy (the agreement between two or more people to overthrow the government) in November 2022 due to their roles in the insurrection. Three other leaders and members of the organization were charged with other federal offenses and were acquitted of the sedition charges. This marks the first time in over two decades that the Justice Department has found someone guilty of sedition; less than 12 people have been convicted of this crime.

^^^snip***

HOW MANY PEOPLE WERE CHARGED​

978. According to a Department of Justice database, there have been about 978 people charged and arrested with multiple crimes related to the attack. The median age of the defendants is 39, with over 86% identifying as male and the majority coming from Texas, Florida, Pennsylvania, New York and California, accordingto George Washington University's Project on Extremism.

WHAT HAVE THEY BEEN CHARGED WITH​

Some of the charges include obstruction of law enforcement during civil disorder, entering and remaining in a restricted building or grounds, engaging in physical violence in a restricted building or grounds and forcibly assaulting, resisting, opposing, impeding federal officers. There have been rioters arrested in “nearly all 50 states,” and over 260 of them have been charged with more serious crimes relating to assaulting or impeding law enforcement, according to the DOJ.

***********

I watched the selective violent footage of the riot on TV but not the boring tourist style part of the riot. Of course live TV would concentrate on the violence as violence leads.

I will admit I didn’t watch much of the Democrat committee hearings as in my opinion it was a kangaroo committee composed of Trump haters and RINOs.

I predict that 30 years from now when students are taught American History they may hear about Pearl Harbor and (/11 but Jan 6th will be a foot note.

*******

As far as my opinion of Nancy Pelosi she is just another corrupt Democrat. One of many. Unfortunately Congress is also full of corrupt Republicans. Perhaps that is why Trump was so hated in the D.C. Swamp.

Critics Slamming Nancy Pelosi Over 'Corrupt' Electric Car Stock Deal

Nancy Pelosi has disclosed that her husband invested big time in Tesla just before Joe Biden announced he wanted all federal vehicles to be electric models.

www.westernjournal.com

Nancy Pelosi on Corruption: She Should Know. | National Review

Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi’s home district includes San Francisco.Star-Kist Tuna’s headquarters are in San Francisco, Pelosi’s home district. Star-Kist is owned by Del Monte Foods and is a m…

www.nationalreview.com

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi: As Corrupt as Al Capone

By Frosty Wooldridge At 80 years of age, suffering from onset dementia, and one of the richest House of Representative members, Nancy Pelosi’s ‘forever career’ in Washington DC spans three decades beyond comprehension. Her wealth surpasses $124 million dollars. Her power to impeach any...

newswithviews.com

 

[FranklinRoosevelt_FTW]

You deserve to be lied to.

This is why Carlson lies. Because he knows you beg to be lied to.

How do you come to such a conclusion Carlson is not lying to anyone. People change their opinions on politicians over time. We have a horrible economy right now we did not under Donald Trump.

You live in Ukraine right?

 

[Chillicothe]

I predict that 30 years from now when students are taught American History they may hear about Pearl Harbor and (/11 but Jan 6th will be a foot note.

I predict that Pearl Harbor and 9/11 will be discussed. I predict that January 6th will be discussed.
ALL...are important in America today, and to our history.
And will remain so.
------------------------------------------------------------------

Perhaps that is why Trump was so hated in the D.C. Swamp.

Ah, no.
Don Trump was not trusted, and thought to be incompetent. We know that in detail, from Don Trump's very own highly paid house-pollster, Tony Fabrizio. Fabrizio went out and polled Republicans right after the 2020 election. They told him.
It wasn't fraudulent votes that brought down Don Trump. It was that too many Republicans thought he wasn't trustworthy. Too many Republicans thought he was incompetent.
Those are Fabrizio's findings. Look it up. Politico has the entire 27-page report by Fabrizio. Trust me.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We have a horrible economy right now ........

No we don't. We have a pretty good economy. Inflation is fretting us....as it is the entire world. But jobs are plentiful (horrible economies don't have high employment, low unemployment); housing prices are strong, demand is strong (horrible economies don't have either); profits are strong throughout most sectors, some are even at record levels --oil & gas, railroads, building materials, to name just a few (horrible economies don't have that).

ps....Agricultural commodities are strongly profitable too. (thank you very much, Vladimir).

We regret Franklin, if your own personal economy is poor.
We hope you can find more success in the future.
Good luck.

But, truth be told poster Franklin, you sound less like FDR than you do Chicken Little.

IMHO

 

[Batcat]

I predict that Pearl Harbor and 9/11 will be discussed. I predict that January 6th will be discussed.
ALL...are important in America today, and to our history.
And will remain so.
------------------------------------------------------------------


Ah, no.
Don Trump was not trusted, and thought to be incompetent. We know that in detail, from Don Trump's very own highly paid house-pollster, Tony Fabrizio. Fabrizio went out and polled Republicans right after the 2020 election. They told him.
It wasn't fraudulent votes that brought down Don Trump. It was that too many Republicans thought he wasn't trustworthy. Too many Republicans thought he was incompetent.
Those are Fabrizio's findings. Look it up. Politico has the entire 27-page report by Fabrizio. Trust me.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


No we don't. We have a pretty good economy. Inflation is fretting us....as it is the entire world. But jobs are plentiful (horrible economies don't have high employment, low unemployment); housing prices are strong, demand is strong (horrible economies don't have either); profits are strong throughout most sectors, some are even at record levels --oil & gas, railroads, building materials, to name just a few (horrible economies don't have that).

ps....Agricultural commodities are strongly profitable too. (thank you very much, Vladimir).

We regret Franklin, if your own personal economy is poor.
We hope you can find more success in the future.
Good luck.

But, truth be told poster Franklin, you sound less like FDR than you do Chicken Little.

IMHO

I predict that Pearl Harbor and 9/11 will be discussed. I predict that January 6th will be discussed.
ALL...are important in America today, and to our history.
And will remain so.
------------------------------------------------------------------


Ah, no.
Don Trump was not trusted, and thought to be incompetent. We know that in detail, from Don Trump's very own highly paid house-pollster, Tony Fabrizio. Fabrizio went out and polled Republicans right after the 2020 election. They told him.
It wasn't fraudulent votes that brought down Don Trump. It was that too many Republicans thought he wasn't trustworthy. Too many Republicans thought he was incompetent.
Those are Fabrizio's findings. Look it up. Politico has the entire 27-page report by Fabrizio. Trust me.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


No we don't. We have a pretty good economy. Inflation is fretting us....as it is the entire world. But jobs are plentiful (horrible economies don't have high employment, low unemployment); housing prices are strong, demand is strong (horrible economies don't have either); profits are strong throughout most sectors, some are even at record levels --oil & gas, railroads, building materials, to name just a few (horrible economies don't have that).

ps....Agricultural commodities are strongly profitable too. (thank you very much, Vladimir).

We regret Franklin, if your own personal economy is poor.
We hope you can find more success in the future.
Good luck.

But, truth be told poster Franklin, you sound less like FDR than you do Chicken Little.

IMHO

Trump was far from incompetent. Joe Biden is the most incompetent modern President. Plus he is corrupt and sold his influence to make his family rich.

Biden shows why Trump was a better president - Washington Examiner

Once a lying, dog-faced pony soldier, always a lying, dog-faced pony soldier. During his campaign against President Donald Trump, candidate Joe Biden positioned himself as the anti-Trump: competent, compassionate, cool, calm, and collected. Democrats and their accomplices in the media rushed to...

www.washingtonexaminer.com

Biden shows why Trump was a better president - Washington Examiner

Once a lying, dog-faced pony soldier, always a lying, dog-faced pony soldier. During his campaign against President Donald Trump, candidate Joe Biden positioned himself as the anti-Trump: competent, compassionate, cool, calm, and collected. Democrats and their accomplices in the media rushed to...

www.washingtonexaminer.com

But since Joe Biden is a Democrat he will never face prosecution for his crimes because Democrats are totally above the rule of law.

 

[Chillicothe]

Plus he is corrupt and sold his influence to make his family rich.

Ah, OK, but......
....but will poster Batcat be able to prove either of those allegations?

If so, well, now is a good time to do it.

Give the forum some vetting some credible sourcing on your allegations.

Thanx, in advance.

 

[BackAgain]

meanwhile, why did the cops in the Capitol that day give that guided tour to Shaman-boi?

 

[Delldude]

And the Trumpers call that “fake news”?

So four committed suicide, four were Trumpers who died of medical issues, and Sicknick died of natural causes.
The four who committed suicide, any info on their mental states prior to J6?

 

[Lesh]

meanwhile, why did the cops in the Capitol that day give that guided tour to Shaman-boi?

Fear

 

[Delldude]

Fear

Regardless........................shows your favorite J6 TV production lied about total chaos inside the capitol building.........

 

[Lesh]

Regardless........................shows your favorite J6 TV production lied about total chaos inside the capitol building.........

Uhhh...what?

 

[Delldude]

Uhhh...what?

Carlson proved that narrative, supplied by your favorite TV production, was a lie.