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P F Tinmore, et al,
Interesting.
(COMMENT-Thumbnail)P F Tinmore, et al,
Maybe it is the other way around.
(COMMENT)
The sovereign control of the territory was never in the hands of the Palestinians. It was in the hands of the Allied Command, acquired from the Ottoman Empire.
Is military control the same as sovereign control, or is that called occupation?
The Allied Command took control as a result of the Partitioning of the Ottoman Empire, after the Occupation of Istanbul. The Treaty of Lausanne replaced the Treaty of Sèvres, setting new borders and creating several mandates.
- British Mandate of Mesopotamia
- French Mandate of Syria and Lebanon
- British Mandate of Palestine
The Council of the League of Nations: said:Whereas the Principal Allied Powers have agreed, for the purpose of giving effect to the provisions of Article 22 of the Covenant of the League of Nations, to entrust to a Mandatory selected by the said Powers the administration of the territory of Palestine, which formerly belonged to the Turkish Empire, within such boundaries as may be fixed by them;
ARTICLE 1.
The Mandatory shall have full powers of legislation and of administration, save as they may be limited by the terms of this mandate.SOURCE: The Avalon Project : The Palestine Mandate
The Allied Powers established the control. It is why, as an example, the Passports were UK. This is not an unusual arrangement. Most Mandates are similar.
A mandatory has full powers.
Most Respectfully,
R
Because they didn't withdraw from Gaza!It's not " Palestinian land" you C**K- SUCKER so shove your posts up your ass!!! The Arabs didn't want the 67 Borders then; Israel doesn't have to accept them now ! BTW, C**K- SUCKER why did Hamas initiate more Rocket attacks after Israel withdrew From Gaza???
It's not "jew land" jerkoff, so shove that little speech up your ass!
It's not " Palestinian land" you C**K- SUCKER so shove your posts up your ass!!! The Arabs didn't want the 67 Borders then; Israel doesn't have to accept them now ! BTW, C**K- SUCKER why did Hamas initiate more Rocket attacks after Israel withdrew From Gaza???
God owns the land!
Notice how the Masturbating PRO- Palestinian refuses to acknowledge the Arabs refusal of " Borders" prior to 67 and still denies that Israel has the right to exist? That is exactly how the Arabs feel today.
Two more reasons why Israel will NEVER go back to the Borders that the Arabs themselves have NEVER accepted and there will NEVER be " Right of Return"
It's not " Palestinian land" you C**K- SUCKER so shove your posts up your ass!!! The Arabs didn't want the 67 Borders then; Israel doesn't have to accept them now ! BTW, C**K- SUCKER why did Hamas initiate more Rocket attacks after Israel withdrew From Gaza???
God owns the land!
Notice how the Masturbating PRO- Palestinian refuses to acknowledge the Arabs refusal of " Borders" prior to 67 and still denies that Israel has the right to exist? That is exactly how the Arabs feel today.
Two more reasons why Israel will NEVER go back to the Borders that the Arabs themselves have NEVER accepted and there will NEVER be " Right of Return"
Palestine already had borders. What did they reject?
(COMMENT)Indeed they did establish control, but their mandate, according to the LoN covenant, was to abide by the wishes of the people. The people were to have sovereignty.
Mandate said:"Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country;
SOURCE: Mandate for Palestine text/League of Nations decision confirming the Principal Allied Powers' agreement on the territory of Palestine (12 August 1922)
(COMMENT)The most obvious exercise of their sovereignty was their right to accept or reject the partition plan. If they did not have sovereignty it would have been a done deal and they would have no say.
(COMMENT)Palestine already had borders. What did they reject?
Reference: Arabs Reject UN Partition Plan
The 1947 UN Partition Plan for Palestine was accepted by the Zionist community leaders. However, the Arabs rejected this plan on the grounds that this decision violates the rights of Palestinian Arabs present in majority in the country; they were supported by the Arab League in their rejection. Calling the UN plan as an international betrayal, some Arabs contemplated the partition as unfair, as more land was allotted to the Jews. In Arabs view, the sole reason why the Jewish statehood issue originated in the first place was because the British permitted a considerable area to the Zionists without any regard for Palestinians will.
In 1949 the Israeli-Arab war was ceased after signing of agreements, however, the country that was once known as Palestine was now occupied by three powers; Israel, Jordan and Egypt, leaving the UN Partition Plan unfulfilled.
P F Tinmore, et al,
I think you have this wrong, yet again.
(COMMENT)Indeed they did establish control, but their mandate, according to the LoN covenant, was to abide by the wishes of the people. The people were to have sovereignty.
Wrong way.
Sovereignty is not addressed in the Mandate for either the Jewish People or the Arab Palestinian.Mandate said:"Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country;
SOURCE: Mandate for Palestine text/League of Nations decision confirming the Principal Allied Powers' agreement on the territory of Palestine (12 August 1922)
The Mandate prohibited any Palestine territory shall be ceded or leased to, or in any way placed under the control of, the Government of any foreign Power. The Mandate required a judicial system be established in Palestine and was to assure foreigners, as well as natives Palestinians, a complete guarantee of their rights.
Reference: Mandate for Palestine text/League of Nations decision confirming the Principal Allied Powers' agreement on the territory of Palestine (12 August 1922)
(COMMENT)
This is not a correct interpretation. The UK, as the Mandatory, was granted all legislation and of administration of Palestine, in total. The Mandate did not offer the Palestinian a choice for statehood. That opportunity came with GA Resolution 181 (III).
(COMMENT)Palestine already had borders. What did they reject?
Palestine, as a state, did not have borders. Palestine as a Mandate had borders. It was Partitioned. Trans-Jordan first was cut away from the Mandate (77%) to create a constitutional monarchy on 25 May 1946. GA Resolution 181 (III) outlined the recommended distribution of the remaining 23% of the Mandate. This was rejected by both the Arab League and the Palestinian High Committee.
Reference: Arabs Reject UN Partition Plan
The 1947 UN Partition Plan for Palestine was accepted by the Zionist community leaders. However, the Arabs rejected this plan on the grounds that this decision violates the rights of Palestinian Arabs present in majority in the country; they were supported by the Arab League in their rejection. Calling the UN plan as an international betrayal, some Arabs contemplated the partition as unfair, as more land was allotted to the Jews. In Arabs view, the sole reason why the Jewish statehood issue originated in the first place was because the British permitted a considerable area to the Zionists without any regard for Palestinians will.
In 1949 the Israeli-Arab war was ceased after signing of agreements, however, the country that was once known as Palestine was now occupied by three powers; Israel, Jordan and Egypt, leaving the UN Partition Plan unfulfilled.
Most Respectfully,
R
P F Tinmore, et al,
I think you have this wrong, yet again.
(COMMENT)Indeed they did establish control, but their mandate, according to the LoN covenant, was to abide by the wishes of the people. The people were to have sovereignty.
Wrong way.
Sovereignty is not addressed in the Mandate for either the Jewish People or the Arab Palestinian.Mandate said:"Whereas recognition has thereby been given to the historical connection of the Jewish people with Palestine and to the grounds for reconstituting their national home in that country;
SOURCE: Mandate for Palestine text/League of Nations decision confirming the Principal Allied Powers' agreement on the territory of Palestine (12 August 1922)
The Mandate prohibited any Palestine territory shall be ceded or leased to, or in any way placed under the control of, the Government of any foreign Power. The Mandate required a judicial system be established in Palestine and was to assure foreigners, as well as natives Palestinians, a complete guarantee of their rights.
Reference: Mandate for Palestine text/League of Nations decision confirming the Principal Allied Powers' agreement on the territory of Palestine (12 August 1922)
(COMMENT)
This is not a correct interpretation. The UK, as the Mandatory, was granted all legislation and of administration of Palestine, in total. The Mandate did not offer the Palestinian a choice for statehood. That opportunity came with GA Resolution 181 (III).
(COMMENT)Palestine already had borders. What did they reject?
Palestine, as a state, did not have borders. Palestine as a Mandate had borders. It was Partitioned. Trans-Jordan first was cut away from the Mandate (77%) to create a constitutional monarchy on 25 May 1946. GA Resolution 181 (III) outlined the recommended distribution of the remaining 23% of the Mandate. This was rejected by both the Arab League and the Palestinian High Committee.
Reference: Arabs Reject UN Partition Plan
The 1947 UN Partition Plan for Palestine was accepted by the Zionist community leaders. However, the Arabs rejected this plan on the grounds that this decision violates the rights of Palestinian Arabs present in majority in the country; they were supported by the Arab League in their rejection. Calling the UN plan as an international betrayal, some Arabs contemplated the partition as unfair, as more land was allotted to the Jews. In Arabs view, the sole reason why the Jewish statehood issue originated in the first place was because the British permitted a considerable area to the Zionists without any regard for Palestinians will.
In 1949 the Israeli-Arab war was ceased after signing of agreements, however, the country that was once known as Palestine was now occupied by three powers; Israel, Jordan and Egypt, leaving the UN Partition Plan unfulfilled.
Most Respectfully,
R
Palestine, as a state, did not have borders. Palestine as a Mandate had borders.
(COMMENT)Not true. Palestine still had its borders after the end of the mandate.
Principles said:The parties to a dispute have the duty, in the event of failure to reach a solution by any one of the above peaceful means, to continue to seek a settlement of the dispute by other peaceful means agreed upon by them.
SOURCE: UNHCR | Refworld | Declaration of Principles of International Law Concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation Among States in Accordance with the Charter of the United Nations
P F Tinmore, et al,
The former region, known as Palestine "had" a designation for historical purposes, but not international borders. They were long since superseded by mandates, wars and treaties.
(COMMENT)Not true. Palestine still had its borders after the end of the mandate.
You have to subtract Israel and Jordan. What remained is what is left. We call it today, the Occupied Territories. The rest is all covered by international treaty with recognized boundaries.
What ever you think is Palestine from before May 1948, has changed. I know this runs counter to they standard Palestinian propaganda; but Israel was duly constituted, just as Jordan, Syria and Lebanon were. And the Declaration on Principles of International Law Concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States in Accordance with the Charter of the United Nations say:
Principles said:The parties to a dispute have the duty, in the event of failure to reach a solution by any one of the above peaceful means, to continue to seek a settlement of the dispute by other peaceful means agreed upon by them.
SOURCE: UNHCR | Refworld | Declaration of Principles of International Law Concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation Among States in Accordance with the Charter of the United Nations
This also runs counter to the Palestinian idea that they have a right to initiate armed anti-occupation activity.
This becomes particularly true if the Palestinians think they have a State. For them, it is a Catch-22 because of the way they have built their argument.
Most Respectfully,
R
What ever you think is Palestine from before May 1948, has changed.
Notice how the Masturbating PRO- Palestinian refuses to acknowledge the Arabs refusal of " Borders" prior to 67 and still denies that Israel has the right to exist? That is exactly how the Arabs feel today.
Two more reasons why Israel will NEVER go back to the Borders that the Arabs themselves have NEVER accepted and there will NEVER be " Right of Return"
Palestine already had borders. What did they reject?
In order to understand Tinmore---one has to understand the
islamic education regarding the GLORIOUS AGE OF ISLAMIC
CONQUEST It is like this--->>>
In all the lands in which arabs and other muslims invaded --
muslims never pillaged or raped or imposed. On seeing
muslims---women cried out "I WANT YOU TO SCREW
ME" Whilst others cried out "I SEE THE BEAUTY OF
ISLAAAM" and others "I want to live under islamic rule
as a 'dhimmi' because allahuakbarrrrr"
thus did so many people become muslims---and those
who attained DHIMMI status were ecstatic with joy and
those hundreds of millions dead-----are dead because they
were evil and ATTACKED ISLAM
I learned history from pakistanis and indian muslims----
the true owners of the MOGHUL EMPIRE who someday
will "drink hindu blood" (because hindus are evil
and seek to destroy islam)
The borders of the MOGHUL EMPIRE have never been
repudiated by the holy UMMAH----thus India does not
exist
It's not a lie!ANOTHER PRO- PALESTINIAN LIE!! They withdrew and IMMEDIATELY more Rockets started to fly into Israel !!!!
(COMMENT)P F Tinmore, et al,
The former region, known as Palestine "had" a designation for historical purposes, but not international borders. They were long since superseded by mandates, wars and treaties.
(COMMENT)Not true. Palestine still had its borders after the end of the mandate.
You have to subtract Israel and Jordan. What remained is what is left. We call it today, the Occupied Territories. The rest is all covered by international treaty with recognized boundaries.
What ever you think is Palestine from before May 1948, has changed. I know this runs counter to they standard Palestinian propaganda; but Israel was duly constituted, just as Jordan, Syria and Lebanon were. And the Declaration on Principles of International Law Concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States in Accordance with the Charter of the United Nations say:
This also runs counter to the Palestinian idea that they have a right to initiate armed anti-occupation activity.
This becomes particularly true if the Palestinians think they have a State. For them, it is a Catch-22 because of the way they have built their argument.
Most Respectfully,
R
What ever you think is Palestine from before May 1948, has changed.
The only time borders can change is when both sides of the border agree to a change.
When did the Palestinians agree to a change? What are the newly defined borders?
P F Tinmore, et al,
It was "never" their decision to change and never in their power to maintain or change.
(COMMENT)P F Tinmore, et al,
The former region, known as Palestine "had" a designation for historical purposes, but not international borders. They were long since superseded by mandates, wars and treaties.
(COMMENT)
You have to subtract Israel and Jordan. What remained is what is left. We call it today, the Occupied Territories. The rest is all covered by international treaty with recognized boundaries.
What ever you think is Palestine from before May 1948, has changed. I know this runs counter to they standard Palestinian propaganda; but Israel was duly constituted, just as Jordan, Syria and Lebanon were. And the Declaration on Principles of International Law Concerning Friendly Relations and Co-operation among States in Accordance with the Charter of the United Nations say:
This also runs counter to the Palestinian idea that they have a right to initiate armed anti-occupation activity.
This becomes particularly true if the Palestinians think they have a State. For them, it is a Catch-22 because of the way they have built their argument.
Most Respectfully,
R
What ever you think is Palestine from before May 1948, has changed.
The only time borders can change is when both sides of the border agree to a change.
When did the Palestinians agree to a change? What are the newly defined borders?
Palestinian never, until recently, was anything but an administrative designation, and the Palestinians were never anything but a regional ethnic culture. It was territory that was always under the sovereignty of another power.
Most Respectfully,
R
Over 200 UN resolutions say you're wrong!Palestinian never, until recently, was anything but an administrative designation, and the Palestinians were never anything but a regional ethnic culture. It was territory that was always under the sovereignty of another power.
Most Respectfully,
R
Point is the land never "belonged" to the Arabs, and Jordan is Palestine.P F Tinmore, et al,
It was "never" their decision to change and never in their power to maintain or change.
(COMMENT)The only time borders can change is when both sides of the border agree to a change.
When did the Palestinians agree to a change? What are the newly defined borders?
Palestinian never, until recently, was anything but an administrative designation, and the Palestinians were never anything but a regional ethnic culture. It was territory that was always under the sovereignty of another power.
Most Respectfully,
R
As were Lebanon, Syria, Jordan...
Do you have a point?
(COMMENT)P F Tinmore, et al,
It was "never" their decision to change and never in their power to maintain or change.
(COMMENT)The only time borders can change is when both sides of the border agree to a change.
When did the Palestinians agree to a change? What are the newly defined borders?
Palestinian never, until recently, was anything but an administrative designation, and the Palestinians were never anything but a regional ethnic culture. It was territory that was always under the sovereignty of another power.
Most Respectfully,
R
As were Lebanon, Syria, Jordan...
Do you have a point?
P F Tinmore, et al,
Yes!
(COMMENT)P F Tinmore, et al,
It was "never" their decision to change and never in their power to maintain or change.
(COMMENT)
Palestinian never, until recently, was anything but an administrative designation, and the Palestinians were never anything but a regional ethnic culture. It was territory that was always under the sovereignty of another power.
Most Respectfully,
R
As were Lebanon, Syria, Jordan...
Do you have a point?
Exactly the point.
Lebanon and Syria were created out of the French Mandate; inventions of the Allied Powers through the UN Process.
Jordan was created almost entirely out of the British Mandate; an invention of the Allied Powers and the UN Process.
But the recommendation for the creation of Palestine was rejected by the Palestinian High Council and the Arab League. So it wasn't created.
However, Israel proceeded with the recommendation through the UN Process. Through the outcome of conflict, initiated by the Arab League, its control expanded.
Most Respectfully,
R
But the recommendation for the creation of Palestine was rejected by the Palestinian High Council
It's not " Palestinian land" you C**K- SUCKER so shove your posts up your ass!!! The Arabs didn't want the 67 Borders then; Israel doesn't have to accept them now ! BTW, C**K- SUCKER why did Hamas initiate more Rocket attacks after Israel withdrew From Gaza???
God owns the land!
Only intelligent thing you've ever posted. You're right, God owns the land, He gave it, along with much of the land now occupied by filthy muslims arab nations, to the Jews, it's their land, the muslim scum need to vacate, end of story. Now piss off.
Liar and rejecter of the words of Jesus Christ the Messiah, Jesus tells us the meek shall inherit the land and He tore down the walls that divided Jew from Gentile! Inheritance speaks of what a man has in a life, they do not take land with them to the grave. And Jesus says the meek inherits the land. Meekness is within an individual and it is not belonging to one ethnic group or another and it is based on turning to God for strength versus self. And it is within the reach of Jew and Gentile to possess.
(COMMENT)But the recommendation for the creation of Palestine was rejected by the Palestinian High Council and the Arab League. So it wasn't created.
No it wasn't.
UN Doc “The Question of Palestine and the United Nations” Chapter 2 said:The plan also set out the steps to be taken prior to independence. It dealt with the questions of citizenship, transit, the economic union and a declaration to be made by the provisional government of each proposed State regarding access to holy places and religious and minority rights. By resolution 181 (II), the Assembly also set up the United Nations Palestine Commission to carry out its recommendations and requested the Security Council to take the necessary measures to implement the plan of partition.
The Jewish Agency accepted the resolution despite its dissatisfaction over such matters as Jewish emigration from Europe and the territorial limits set on the proposed Jewish State. The plan was not accepted by the Palestinian Arabs and Arab States on the ground that it violated the provisions of the United Nations Charter, which granted people the right to decide their own destiny. They said that the Assembly had endorsed the plan under circumstances unworthy of the United Nations and that the Arabs of Palestine would oppose any scheme that provided for the dissection, segregation or partition of their country, or which gave special and preferential rights and status to a minority.
SOURCE: http://unispal.un.org/pdfs/DPI2499.pdf
Palestine Facts (palestinefacts.org/) said:Arab rejection of partition in 1947 reflected a crisis of leadership in a community whose identity as Palestinians was not yet fully crystallized. Indeed, at the start of the British mandate, the Arabs of Palestine were profoundly ambivalent about the appropriate focus of their political loyalties--should they identify with the overall Arab nation, consider themselves Southern Syrians, or call themselves Palestinians in conformity to boundaries artificially drawn by imperial powers?
SOURCE: Arabs Reject UN Partition Plan
Why the UN Partition Plan Wasn't Implemented said:The major cause for the 1937 partition proposal, namely that Arab and Jewish interests could not be reconciled, was aggravated in 1947, after both parties rejected the 1946 recommendation by an Anglo-American committee to establish a bi-national state in Palestine under UN trusteeship. While the Jewish community accepted the 1937 and 1947 partition plans, the Palestinian Arab leadership, dominated by the Husseini family, rejected both plans categorically. Indeed, most Palestinians turned down the 1937 design, even though it designated only 20 percent of Palestine to the proposed Jewish state. Furthermore, the Palestinian leadership even rejected the 1939 British White Paper, which had promised them an independent state within ten years while limiting Jewish immigration and turning the Jews into a minority in an Arab Palestinian state.
SOURCE: Palestine-Israel Journal: <b>Why the UN Partition Plan Wasn't Implemented </b>
Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas said on Friday in an interview with Channel 2 said:That the Arab world erred in rejecting the United Nations' 1947 plan to partition Palestine into a Palestinian and a Jewish state.
The Palestinian and Arab refusal to accept a UN plan to partition the then-British-controlled mandate of Palestine sparked widespread fighting, then Arab military intervention after Israel declared independence the following year. The Arabs lost the war.
"It was our mistake. It was an Arab mistake as a whole," Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas told Channel 2 TV in a rare interview to the Israeli media. "But do they (the Israelis) punish us for this mistake for 64 years?"
SOURCE: Abbas: Arab world was wrong to reject 1947 Partition Plan - Israel News | Haaretz Daily Newspaper
