UPS To Order 10,000 Electric Vans, with Option To Order Additional 10,000

[petro]

Norway ain’t Anacostia or Malibu or Omaha or anywhere in the US.
Norway???

Funny thing. When my truck breaks (and it does sometimes) I fire up the trusty electric trike and go get parts. It's never the other way around. The Electric Trike is nicknamed "The Parts Getter". I also use it to go get parts for others. When I need to make a fast run to the Market, I fire it up with the press of one button. Parking is always close. The Bike Rack is right next to the front door. When I need to run to the VA to fill a prescription (like in the morning) just jump on it and go and park right next the main entrance instead of the north 40. Am I cold? No colder than if I take my auto since by the time I get my auto warm enough, I am already there and then I have to walk in the cold from the north 40 parking area to the front entrance. it's faster and I get there quicker with the electric trike. And what about cost of operation? My truck gets between 11 and 16mpg but for a short run like that in the cold I will burn a couple or three gallons at 2.50 a gallon. That's no less than 5 bucks for the same trip. What does my trusty electric trike cost to operate for that same run? It costs about 10 cents for 20 miles. So for a 4 mile trip, the total cost is . do the math.

I have my truck for hauling things. I have my trike to save money, lots of money. Funny, I am going to trade one of the two in in the next few days. Guess which one stays.

What generates the electricity for your trike? Does your trike haul what your truck does? If so, why do you have a truck?
You can get a truck that gets way better than 16 mpg.
If more oil is allowed to be extracted your gas price will go down.

You don't listen too well. Around here, we use Hydroelectric Power. Other places not far from here use Natural Gas. There are no Coal or oil fired Electric Plants within 250 miles. And the last of those are to be shut down this year.

As for hauling, on a day to day basis, yes, the Trike hauls what my truck does. Groceries or just me.

And you are right, there are better mileage trucks out there and I plan on getting one. But my trusty old Truck has been a great truck. There hasn't been a thing it couldn't haul or drag. The only way to get smooth ride out that log wagon is to load it down with 1500 lbs. I really don't have any complaints in the truck other than it's very, very large and doesn't get great fuel mileage. But if you do have a truck with it's capability, trust me, the new ones won't be doing any better or much better than 16mpg either. Yah, Yah, I know. You know a guy with a Brother who knows a guy that.......

Natural gas is fossil fuel and many places don’t have the hydroelectric option.

And out of the other "Fossil Fuels" NG puts out the least amount of pollutants. It's plentiful, cheap and it's the number one used. The option of using Coal or Oil Fired (including diesel) should never be considered for a primary power source. You keep looking for reasons to prevent electric vehicles. Well, you ain't doing a very good job of that. Starting in 2025, things are breaking wide open for electric vehicles.

I helped to get a law passed in Colorado that allowed the operation of the Low Speed Electric Bicycle. The Cops all came up with the ruling that if it had a motor it was a motor vehicle and should be treated exactly like a car. The problem is, a low speed electric bicycle cannot meet the legal specification of the NHTA auto regs. And the Federal Laws put the Low Speed Electric Bicycle under the Bicycle Laws in the Public Safety instead of the NHTA for motorized vehicles. I was the last person in this state to get ticketed on a Low Speed Electric Bicycle for operating it outside of the NHTA motor vehicle rules and regs. The Judge got quite a laugh at the Cops expense on that one. But I worked with a Republican (yes, I said republican) state senator and we got the laws in colorado to mirror the federal laws.

The problem is, there are hurdles that are there only to block the electrics from becoming useful. It's becoming less and less each day but it's still there. And the biggest thing is the education of the masses. And consider this section as part of that education.

You prove that electric vehicles come with a really high smug rating.
You are not educating anyone, just hyperventilating. Not for you to decide what anyone needs.

 

[gipper]

Funny thing. When my truck breaks (and it does sometimes) I fire up the trusty electric trike and go get parts. It's never the other way around. The Electric Trike is nicknamed "The Parts Getter". I also use it to go get parts for others. When I need to make a fast run to the Market, I fire it up with the press of one button. Parking is always close. The Bike Rack is right next to the front door. When I need to run to the VA to fill a prescription (like in the morning) just jump on it and go and park right next the main entrance instead of the north 40. Am I cold? No colder than if I take my auto since by the time I get my auto warm enough, I am already there and then I have to walk in the cold from the north 40 parking area to the front entrance. it's faster and I get there quicker with the electric trike. And what about cost of operation? My truck gets between 11 and 16mpg but for a short run like that in the cold I will burn a couple or three gallons at 2.50 a gallon. That's no less than 5 bucks for the same trip. What does my trusty electric trike cost to operate for that same run? It costs about 10 cents for 20 miles. So for a 4 mile trip, the total cost is . do the math.

I have my truck for hauling things. I have my trike to save money, lots of money. Funny, I am going to trade one of the two in in the next few days. Guess which one stays.

What generates the electricity for your trike? Does your trike haul what your truck does? If so, why do you have a truck?
You can get a truck that gets way better than 16 mpg.
If more oil is allowed to be extracted your gas price will go down.

You don't listen too well. Around here, we use Hydroelectric Power. Other places not far from here use Natural Gas. There are no Coal or oil fired Electric Plants within 250 miles. And the last of those are to be shut down this year.

As for hauling, on a day to day basis, yes, the Trike hauls what my truck does. Groceries or just me.

And you are right, there are better mileage trucks out there and I plan on getting one. But my trusty old Truck has been a great truck. There hasn't been a thing it couldn't haul or drag. The only way to get smooth ride out that log wagon is to load it down with 1500 lbs. I really don't have any complaints in the truck other than it's very, very large and doesn't get great fuel mileage. But if you do have a truck with it's capability, trust me, the new ones won't be doing any better or much better than 16mpg either. Yah, Yah, I know. You know a guy with a Brother who knows a guy that.......

Natural gas is fossil fuel and many places don’t have the hydroelectric option.

And out of the other "Fossil Fuels" NG puts out the least amount of pollutants. It's plentiful, cheap and it's the number one used. The option of using Coal or Oil Fired (including diesel) should never be considered for a primary power source. You keep looking for reasons to prevent electric vehicles. Well, you ain't doing a very good job of that. Starting in 2025, things are breaking wide open for electric vehicles.

I helped to get a law passed in Colorado that allowed the operation of the Low Speed Electric Bicycle. The Cops all came up with the ruling that if it had a motor it was a motor vehicle and should be treated exactly like a car. The problem is, a low speed electric bicycle cannot meet the legal specification of the NHTA auto regs. And the Federal Laws put the Low Speed Electric Bicycle under the Bicycle Laws in the Public Safety instead of the NHTA for motorized vehicles. I was the last person in this state to get ticketed on a Low Speed Electric Bicycle for operating it outside of the NHTA motor vehicle rules and regs. The Judge got quite a laugh at the Cops expense on that one. But I worked with a Republican (yes, I said republican) state senator and we got the laws in colorado to mirror the federal laws.

The problem is, there are hurdles that are there only to block the electrics from becoming useful. It's becoming less and less each day but it's still there. And the biggest thing is the education of the masses. And consider this section as part of that education.

You prove that electric vehicles come with a really high smug rating.
You are not educating anyone, just hyperventilating. Not for you to decide what anyone needs.

I wonder if I could get one as a motorhome. My DP only gets 7mpg.

 

[petro]

What generates the electricity for your trike? Does your trike haul what your truck does? If so, why do you have a truck?
You can get a truck that gets way better than 16 mpg.
If more oil is allowed to be extracted your gas price will go down.

You don't listen too well. Around here, we use Hydroelectric Power. Other places not far from here use Natural Gas. There are no Coal or oil fired Electric Plants within 250 miles. And the last of those are to be shut down this year.

As for hauling, on a day to day basis, yes, the Trike hauls what my truck does. Groceries or just me.

And you are right, there are better mileage trucks out there and I plan on getting one. But my trusty old Truck has been a great truck. There hasn't been a thing it couldn't haul or drag. The only way to get smooth ride out that log wagon is to load it down with 1500 lbs. I really don't have any complaints in the truck other than it's very, very large and doesn't get great fuel mileage. But if you do have a truck with it's capability, trust me, the new ones won't be doing any better or much better than 16mpg either. Yah, Yah, I know. You know a guy with a Brother who knows a guy that.......

Natural gas is fossil fuel and many places don’t have the hydroelectric option.

And out of the other "Fossil Fuels" NG puts out the least amount of pollutants. It's plentiful, cheap and it's the number one used. The option of using Coal or Oil Fired (including diesel) should never be considered for a primary power source. You keep looking for reasons to prevent electric vehicles. Well, you ain't doing a very good job of that. Starting in 2025, things are breaking wide open for electric vehicles.

I helped to get a law passed in Colorado that allowed the operation of the Low Speed Electric Bicycle. The Cops all came up with the ruling that if it had a motor it was a motor vehicle and should be treated exactly like a car. The problem is, a low speed electric bicycle cannot meet the legal specification of the NHTA auto regs. And the Federal Laws put the Low Speed Electric Bicycle under the Bicycle Laws in the Public Safety instead of the NHTA for motorized vehicles. I was the last person in this state to get ticketed on a Low Speed Electric Bicycle for operating it outside of the NHTA motor vehicle rules and regs. The Judge got quite a laugh at the Cops expense on that one. But I worked with a Republican (yes, I said republican) state senator and we got the laws in colorado to mirror the federal laws.

The problem is, there are hurdles that are there only to block the electrics from becoming useful. It's becoming less and less each day but it's still there. And the biggest thing is the education of the masses. And consider this section as part of that education.

You prove that electric vehicles come with a really high smug rating.
You are not educating anyone, just hyperventilating. Not for you to decide what anyone needs.

I wonder if I could get one as a motorhome. My DP only gets 7mpg.

Nice.
But Greta may not approve.

 

[Harry Dresden]

you think they would buy from an American company....

Considering that UPS is serving many different countries, they have that option.

sure they do over there....for here they should buy American....

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

Like to see how they work out
Their old vans go hundreds of thousands of miles

I actually have no problem with trying alternative forms of power for transportation. Only make sense. Just don't mandate my toys and towing vehicle away.

Still waiting on the promised Mr. Fusion.
View attachment 303516

I don't look for any mandate quite like that for any number of years. But you have to admit, it's coming. One day, you may have to have a special license to operate a gasoline power vehicle where some company will be able to pollute more by sponsoring your choke and puke car or truck. Some company will figure out a way to capitalize on it, I am sure. You may have to buy an abandoned town in the middle of nowhere in Nevada or Arizona to operate it. Life could get very interesting for that classic 1969 Muscle Car.

The market is the only way fossil fuels will be supplanted. Beyond that, it will totally depend on totalitarianism. That’s what you’re promoting.

And if you have the choice between breathing and dying because a group of corporations spend billions of dollars lobbying to prevent better choices, then you get your wish. I choose to breath and use alternative energy sources. Even if it's done at the small level I currently do. I walk the walk.

Air is cleaner now than ever. You drive your cost-prohibitive flintstone mobile and I’ll drive my Ford Fiesta. Don’t force your lack of choice on me.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

Norway ain’t Anacostia or Malibu or Omaha or anywhere in the US.
Norway???

Funny thing. When my truck breaks (and it does sometimes) I fire up the trusty electric trike and go get parts. It's never the other way around. The Electric Trike is nicknamed "The Parts Getter". I also use it to go get parts for others. When I need to make a fast run to the Market, I fire it up with the press of one button. Parking is always close. The Bike Rack is right next to the front door. When I need to run to the VA to fill a prescription (like in the morning) just jump on it and go and park right next the main entrance instead of the north 40. Am I cold? No colder than if I take my auto since by the time I get my auto warm enough, I am already there and then I have to walk in the cold from the north 40 parking area to the front entrance. it's faster and I get there quicker with the electric trike. And what about cost of operation? My truck gets between 11 and 16mpg but for a short run like that in the cold I will burn a couple or three gallons at 2.50 a gallon. That's no less than 5 bucks for the same trip. What does my trusty electric trike cost to operate for that same run? It costs about 10 cents for 20 miles. So for a 4 mile trip, the total cost is . do the math.

I have my truck for hauling things. I have my trike to save money, lots of money. Funny, I am going to trade one of the two in in the next few days. Guess which one stays.

What generates the electricity for your trike? Does your trike haul what your truck does? If so, why do you have a truck?
You can get a truck that gets way better than 16 mpg.
If more oil is allowed to be extracted your gas price will go down.

You don't listen too well. Around here, we use Hydroelectric Power. Other places not far from here use Natural Gas. There are no Coal or oil fired Electric Plants within 250 miles. And the last of those are to be shut down this year.

As for hauling, on a day to day basis, yes, the Trike hauls what my truck does. Groceries or just me.

And you are right, there are better mileage trucks out there and I plan on getting one. But my trusty old Truck has been a great truck. There hasn't been a thing it couldn't haul or drag. The only way to get smooth ride out that log wagon is to load it down with 1500 lbs. I really don't have any complaints in the truck other than it's very, very large and doesn't get great fuel mileage. But if you do have a truck with it's capability, trust me, the new ones won't be doing any better or much better than 16mpg either. Yah, Yah, I know. You know a guy with a Brother who knows a guy that.......

Natural gas is fossil fuel and many places don’t have the hydroelectric option.

And out of the other "Fossil Fuels" NG puts out the least amount of pollutants. It's plentiful, cheap and it's the number one used. The option of using Coal or Oil Fired (including diesel) should never be considered for a primary power source. You keep looking for reasons to prevent electric vehicles. Well, you ain't doing a very good job of that. Starting in 2025, things are breaking wide open for electric vehicles.

I helped to get a law passed in Colorado that allowed the operation of the Low Speed Electric Bicycle. The Cops all came up with the ruling that if it had a motor it was a motor vehicle and should be treated exactly like a car. The problem is, a low speed electric bicycle cannot meet the legal specification of the NHTA auto regs. And the Federal Laws put the Low Speed Electric Bicycle under the Bicycle Laws in the Public Safety instead of the NHTA for motorized vehicles. I was the last person in this state to get ticketed on a Low Speed Electric Bicycle for operating it outside of the NHTA motor vehicle rules and regs. The Judge got quite a laugh at the Cops expense on that one. But I worked with a Republican (yes, I said republican) state senator and we got the laws in colorado to mirror the federal laws.

The problem is, there are hurdles that are there only to block the electrics from becoming useful. It's becoming less and less each day but it's still there. And the biggest thing is the education of the masses. And consider this section as part of that education.

Once your alternatives become more practical and cost effective I’m sure everyone will acquiesce. It’s called progress. Until then, don’t force your sheep propaganda into my life. That’s called fascism.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

Like to see how they work out
Their old vans go hundreds of thousands of miles

I actually have no problem with trying alternative forms of power for transportation. Only make sense. Just don't mandate my toys and towing vehicle away.

Still waiting on the promised Mr. Fusion.
View attachment 303516

I don't look for any mandate quite like that for any number of years. But you have to admit, it's coming. One day, you may have to have a special license to operate a gasoline power vehicle where some company will be able to pollute more by sponsoring your choke and puke car or truck. Some company will figure out a way to capitalize on it, I am sure. You may have to buy an abandoned town in the middle of nowhere in Nevada or Arizona to operate it. Life could get very interesting for that classic 1969 Muscle Car.

The market is the only way fossil fuels will be supplanted. Beyond that, it will totally depend on totalitarianism. That’s what you’re promoting.

And if you have the choice between breathing and dying because a group of corporations spend billions of dollars lobbying to prevent better choices, then you get your wish. I choose to breath and use alternative energy sources. Even if it's done at the small level I currently do. I walk the walk.

Air is cleaner now than ever. You drive your cost-prohibitive flintstone mobile and I’ll drive my Ford Fiesta. Don’t force your lack of choice on me.

I don't drive a cost-phohibitve flinstone mobile. I drive a 1988 Ford F-150 XL Camper Special. I took a good look at replacing it today, hit a bunch of car lots and came to a conclusion. My Truck will last for at least 30 years more the way I keep it up. It isn't rusting, it runs like a top. Pulls 16mpg since I replaced the EGR valve and costs the least in insurance with no monthly payments to own it. The ones under 20K to replace it all get about the same mileage or slightly more, have all kinds of bells and whistles I don't need and are 10 to 15 year throwaways. I put a price limit on the replacement costs and not a single car lot could come anywhere close to coming up with a suitable replacement vehicle. When I die, someone is going to get my truck. That appears the only way I will be able to get rid of it. The Truck is going to outlast me by quite a margin.

The Fueled Powered Cars and Trucks have just about reached their pinnacle and won't really get any better than they are right now. The only thing that has improved has been the bells and whistles. And I don't need all those bells and whistles. And I certainly won't pay for them. So, as you call it, I will continue to drive my Flintstone Mobile until the day I die. But I also will drive an electric for day to day driving.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Delivery giant UPS has ordered 10,000 electric trucks from Arrival, a technology company based in the UK. Some of the vehicles will be trialed in London and Paris later this year, building on a similar experiment that was run by the two companies in 2018. The pair then hope to deploy the trucks across Europe and North America over the next four years. If everything goes well, UPS has the option to buy another 10,000 vehicles.


UPS will use Arrival’s electric trucks in the US and Europe

The future looks bright.

Call me when they order Solar Power Van's and Trucks...

The cost to the environment to make the batteries for those Trucks and Van's that are electric will be as damaging...

 

[Daryl Hunt]

Funny thing. When my truck breaks (and it does sometimes) I fire up the trusty electric trike and go get parts. It's never the other way around. The Electric Trike is nicknamed "The Parts Getter". I also use it to go get parts for others. When I need to make a fast run to the Market, I fire it up with the press of one button. Parking is always close. The Bike Rack is right next to the front door. When I need to run to the VA to fill a prescription (like in the morning) just jump on it and go and park right next the main entrance instead of the north 40. Am I cold? No colder than if I take my auto since by the time I get my auto warm enough, I am already there and then I have to walk in the cold from the north 40 parking area to the front entrance. it's faster and I get there quicker with the electric trike. And what about cost of operation? My truck gets between 11 and 16mpg but for a short run like that in the cold I will burn a couple or three gallons at 2.50 a gallon. That's no less than 5 bucks for the same trip. What does my trusty electric trike cost to operate for that same run? It costs about 10 cents for 20 miles. So for a 4 mile trip, the total cost is . do the math.

I have my truck for hauling things. I have my trike to save money, lots of money. Funny, I am going to trade one of the two in in the next few days. Guess which one stays.

What generates the electricity for your trike? Does your trike haul what your truck does? If so, why do you have a truck?
You can get a truck that gets way better than 16 mpg.
If more oil is allowed to be extracted your gas price will go down.

You don't listen too well. Around here, we use Hydroelectric Power. Other places not far from here use Natural Gas. There are no Coal or oil fired Electric Plants within 250 miles. And the last of those are to be shut down this year.

As for hauling, on a day to day basis, yes, the Trike hauls what my truck does. Groceries or just me.

And you are right, there are better mileage trucks out there and I plan on getting one. But my trusty old Truck has been a great truck. There hasn't been a thing it couldn't haul or drag. The only way to get smooth ride out that log wagon is to load it down with 1500 lbs. I really don't have any complaints in the truck other than it's very, very large and doesn't get great fuel mileage. But if you do have a truck with it's capability, trust me, the new ones won't be doing any better or much better than 16mpg either. Yah, Yah, I know. You know a guy with a Brother who knows a guy that.......

Natural gas is fossil fuel and many places don’t have the hydroelectric option.

And out of the other "Fossil Fuels" NG puts out the least amount of pollutants. It's plentiful, cheap and it's the number one used. The option of using Coal or Oil Fired (including diesel) should never be considered for a primary power source. You keep looking for reasons to prevent electric vehicles. Well, you ain't doing a very good job of that. Starting in 2025, things are breaking wide open for electric vehicles.

I helped to get a law passed in Colorado that allowed the operation of the Low Speed Electric Bicycle. The Cops all came up with the ruling that if it had a motor it was a motor vehicle and should be treated exactly like a car. The problem is, a low speed electric bicycle cannot meet the legal specification of the NHTA auto regs. And the Federal Laws put the Low Speed Electric Bicycle under the Bicycle Laws in the Public Safety instead of the NHTA for motorized vehicles. I was the last person in this state to get ticketed on a Low Speed Electric Bicycle for operating it outside of the NHTA motor vehicle rules and regs. The Judge got quite a laugh at the Cops expense on that one. But I worked with a Republican (yes, I said republican) state senator and we got the laws in colorado to mirror the federal laws.

The problem is, there are hurdles that are there only to block the electrics from becoming useful. It's becoming less and less each day but it's still there. And the biggest thing is the education of the masses. And consider this section as part of that education.

Once your alternatives become more practical and cost effective I’m sure everyone will acquiesce. It’s called progress. Until then, don’t force your sheep propaganda into my life. That’s called fascism.

Then I suggest you stop forcing yours on me. As it stands right now, my Truck would not pass the laws that are on the books for new vehicle construction. And why? Does it pollute more, No. Does it get worse fuel mileage from a comparable new vehicle, no. Is it less safe in an accident, no. The last thing you want to do with your tiny fiesta is to ram it into my Truck. I get bent sheet metal and you get buried in your shoeboxmobile. Mine is repairable and yours gets last rights along with your last rights. And I don't have to be a contortionist to get in and out of it. Get to be my age and that becomes a huge plus.

You Rightwingers already tried to block my electrics but we fought back in the courts. I am the last person in the State of Colorado to receive a ticket for operating a Low Speed Electric Bicycle. The Judge almost fell out of his chair laughing at that one. Then I worked with a "Republican" State Senator to get the Colorado Law changed to read what the Federal Law reads. BTW, for the court, I didn't use a Lawyer. I represented myself and just presented the Section 15 and 16 of the Federal Public Safety Laws. The Prosecutor presented the NHTA and the Colorado Motor Vehicle Laws which the Cops were using to bully the public with. He ruled that, well, get out of my court comes to mind. Dismissed. Then we got the laws changed at the state level through legislation. The Argument that "If it has a motor, it is a motor vehicle" was thrown out and the Cops had to be reeducated.

Then the States that won't allow companies like Tesla to be part of a multi dealership. They can exist as long as they are free standing dealership. The Oil Companies and Auto Manufacturers spend billions on that one buying politicians.

Now we have the states trying to charge thousands of dollars a year to register and operate an electric car on the hiways because the cars don't use the gas that is taxed. 1500 bucks a year just to register a car annually? Give me a break. There are other ways to get those taxes. That's another case of YOU trying to prevent ME from operating the vehicle of my choice even though that vehicle meets (and in most cases) exceeds all requirements for operation. Even China isn't doing that. They are understanding that clean air is more important than a bunch of Obstructionist against new technology. And China really needs all the help it can get to clean up their air.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

Delivery giant UPS has ordered 10,000 electric trucks from Arrival, a technology company based in the UK. Some of the vehicles will be trialed in London and Paris later this year, building on a similar experiment that was run by the two companies in 2018. The pair then hope to deploy the trucks across Europe and North America over the next four years. If everything goes well, UPS has the option to buy another 10,000 vehicles.


UPS will use Arrival’s electric trucks in the US and Europe

The future looks bright.

Call me when they order Solar Power Van's and Trucks...

The cost to the environment to make the batteries for those Trucks and Van's that are electric will be as damaging...

The cost for the Environment, if you operate your electric for one month is 4 times worse than that of a Gas rig. But at the end of 5 years, the Electric ends up being 5 times better than the gas rig. And it keeps getting better each year for the electric but stays about the same for the Gas Rig.

Wet Cell Powered Electrics were far inferior to the Gas rig in every way.

Then came the NiMH batteries. The gap started to close. But the Gas Rig still won.

Then came the LIPO and the difference was equal for a 5 year operating period

Now we use LiPo4 batteries and in the 5 year period, the Electric wins hands down.

But in range, the Gas Powered car still wins. But here is the kicker. One of the reasons Tesla purchased (they call it merged) Maxwell Batteries is that Maxwell has a Solid State Battery in the testing phase that is 5 times lighter, 5 times the power output, fully charges in a matter of minutes, doesn't require a heat or cooling for operation, is designed to be flat, no more than about 2 inches thick and costs a fraction of the cost to make. Projected release in cars date in in 2025. This will also include kits to convert your Fiesta to electric as well. That means that the Tesla S with it's 300 useable mile range will not have a 1500 mile range using the same space and weight of batteries. And if you need to recharge it, a Tesla Charging Station will be able to recharge it in about 90 seconds. Or you can elect to use a smaller battery and get more room. For the Heavy Trucks, the weight V Power ratio becomes highly useable. Tesla is running around tracks today with that battery. And that new Factory in Nevada and in Germany will be producing it. This scares the living hell out of the Oil Companies and the conventional Automakers. The only reason we don't have it right now is that it takes bout 5 years to go from the test track to full production.

In 2025, the Gas Rig loses all the way around with the Electric being able to go further, be lighter and even cheaper for the same comparable vehicle. At some point, some cities are going to just stop the use of all gas powered cars, period, in order to help clean up their air. Norway is headed there and even some towns and cities in Texas are head there as well. If you don't like it there, move.

 

[RoshawnMarkwees]

What generates the electricity for your trike? Does your trike haul what your truck does? If so, why do you have a truck?
You can get a truck that gets way better than 16 mpg.
If more oil is allowed to be extracted your gas price will go down.

You don't listen too well. Around here, we use Hydroelectric Power. Other places not far from here use Natural Gas. There are no Coal or oil fired Electric Plants within 250 miles. And the last of those are to be shut down this year.

As for hauling, on a day to day basis, yes, the Trike hauls what my truck does. Groceries or just me.

And you are right, there are better mileage trucks out there and I plan on getting one. But my trusty old Truck has been a great truck. There hasn't been a thing it couldn't haul or drag. The only way to get smooth ride out that log wagon is to load it down with 1500 lbs. I really don't have any complaints in the truck other than it's very, very large and doesn't get great fuel mileage. But if you do have a truck with it's capability, trust me, the new ones won't be doing any better or much better than 16mpg either. Yah, Yah, I know. You know a guy with a Brother who knows a guy that.......

Natural gas is fossil fuel and many places don’t have the hydroelectric option.

And out of the other "Fossil Fuels" NG puts out the least amount of pollutants. It's plentiful, cheap and it's the number one used. The option of using Coal or Oil Fired (including diesel) should never be considered for a primary power source. You keep looking for reasons to prevent electric vehicles. Well, you ain't doing a very good job of that. Starting in 2025, things are breaking wide open for electric vehicles.

I helped to get a law passed in Colorado that allowed the operation of the Low Speed Electric Bicycle. The Cops all came up with the ruling that if it had a motor it was a motor vehicle and should be treated exactly like a car. The problem is, a low speed electric bicycle cannot meet the legal specification of the NHTA auto regs. And the Federal Laws put the Low Speed Electric Bicycle under the Bicycle Laws in the Public Safety instead of the NHTA for motorized vehicles. I was the last person in this state to get ticketed on a Low Speed Electric Bicycle for operating it outside of the NHTA motor vehicle rules and regs. The Judge got quite a laugh at the Cops expense on that one. But I worked with a Republican (yes, I said republican) state senator and we got the laws in colorado to mirror the federal laws.

The problem is, there are hurdles that are there only to block the electrics from becoming useful. It's becoming less and less each day but it's still there. And the biggest thing is the education of the masses. And consider this section as part of that education.

Once your alternatives become more practical and cost effective I’m sure everyone will acquiesce. It’s called progress. Until then, don’t force your sheep propaganda into my life. That’s called fascism.

Then I suggest you stop forcing yours on me. As it stands right now, my Truck would not pass the laws that are on the books for new vehicle construction. And why? Does it pollute more, No. Does it get worse fuel mileage from a comparable new vehicle, no. Is it less safe in an accident, no. The last thing you want to do with your tiny fiesta is to ram it into my Truck. I get bent sheet metal and you get buried in your shoeboxmobile. Mine is repairable and yours gets last rights along with your last rights. And I don't have to be a contortionist to get in and out of it. Get to be my age and that becomes a huge plus.

You Rightwingers already tried to block my electrics but we fought back in the courts. I am the last person in the State of Colorado to receive a ticket for operating a Low Speed Electric Bicycle. The Judge almost fell out of his chair laughing at that one. Then I worked with a "Republican" State Senator to get the Colorado Law changed to read what the Federal Law reads. BTW, for the court, I didn't use a Lawyer. I represented myself and just presented the Section 15 and 16 of the Federal Public Safety Laws. The Prosecutor presented the NHTA and the Colorado Motor Vehicle Laws which the Cops were using to bully the public with. He ruled that, well, get out of my court comes to mind. Dismissed. Then we got the laws changed at the state level through legislation. The Argument that "If it has a motor, it is a motor vehicle" was thrown out and the Cops had to be reeducated.

Then the States that won't allow companies like Tesla to be part of a multi dealership. They can exist as long as they are free standing dealership. The Oil Companies and Auto Manufacturers spend billions on that one buying politicians.

Now we have the states trying to charge thousands of dollars a year to register and operate an electric car on the hiways because the cars don't use the gas that is taxed. 1500 bucks a year just to register a car annually? Give me a break. There are other ways to get those taxes. That's another case of YOU trying to prevent ME from operating the vehicle of my choice even though that vehicle meets (and in most cases) exceeds all requirements for operation. Even China isn't doing that. They are understanding that clean air is more important than a bunch of Obstructionist against new technology. And China really needs all the help it can get to clean up their air.

I’m no right winger and you need to allow the market to determine the result, not a fascist decree or vogue political scam. You’re an extremist.

 

[22lcidw]

Delivery giant UPS has ordered 10,000 electric trucks from Arrival, a technology company based in the UK. Some of the vehicles will be trialed in London and Paris later this year, building on a similar experiment that was run by the two companies in 2018. The pair then hope to deploy the trucks across Europe and North America over the next four years. If everything goes well, UPS has the option to buy another 10,000 vehicles.


UPS will use Arrival’s electric trucks in the US and Europe

The future looks bright.

Call me when they order Solar Power Van's and Trucks...

The cost to the environment to make the batteries for those Trucks and Van's that are electric will be as damaging...

The cost for the Environment, if you operate your electric for one month is 4 times worse than that of a Gas rig. But at the end of 5 years, the Electric ends up being 5 times better than the gas rig. And it keeps getting better each year for the electric but stays about the same for the Gas Rig.

Wet Cell Powered Electrics were far inferior to the Gas rig in every way.

Then came the NiMH batteries. The gap started to close. But the Gas Rig still won.

Then came the LIPO and the difference was equal for a 5 year operating period

Now we use LiPo4 batteries and in the 5 year period, the Electric wins hands down.

But in range, the Gas Powered car still wins. But here is the kicker. One of the reasons Tesla purchased (they call it merged) Maxwell Batteries is that Maxwell has a Solid State Battery in the testing phase that is 5 times lighter, 5 times the power output, fully charges in a matter of minutes, doesn't require a heat or cooling for operation, is designed to be flat, no more than about 2 inches thick and costs a fraction of the cost to make. Projected release in cars date in in 2025. This will also include kits to convert your Fiesta to electric as well. That means that the Tesla S with it's 300 useable mile range will not have a 1500 mile range using the same space and weight of batteries. And if you need to recharge it, a Tesla Charging Station will be able to recharge it in about 90 seconds. Or you can elect to use a smaller battery and get more room. For the Heavy Trucks, the weight V Power ratio becomes highly useable. Tesla is running around tracks today with that battery. And that new Factory in Nevada and in Germany will be producing it. This scares the living hell out of the Oil Companies and the conventional Automakers. The only reason we don't have it right now is that it takes bout 5 years to go from the test track to full production.

In 2025, the Gas Rig loses all the way around with the Electric being able to go further, be lighter and even cheaper for the same comparable vehicle. At some point, some cities are going to just stop the use of all gas powered cars, period, in order to help clean up their air. Norway is headed there and even some towns and cities in Texas are head there as well. If you don't like it there, move.

You can't even get any diesel powered vehicles and construction equipment to maximum law in producing fumes and emissions.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

You don't listen too well. Around here, we use Hydroelectric Power. Other places not far from here use Natural Gas. There are no Coal or oil fired Electric Plants within 250 miles. And the last of those are to be shut down this year.

As for hauling, on a day to day basis, yes, the Trike hauls what my truck does. Groceries or just me.

And you are right, there are better mileage trucks out there and I plan on getting one. But my trusty old Truck has been a great truck. There hasn't been a thing it couldn't haul or drag. The only way to get smooth ride out that log wagon is to load it down with 1500 lbs. I really don't have any complaints in the truck other than it's very, very large and doesn't get great fuel mileage. But if you do have a truck with it's capability, trust me, the new ones won't be doing any better or much better than 16mpg either. Yah, Yah, I know. You know a guy with a Brother who knows a guy that.......

Natural gas is fossil fuel and many places don’t have the hydroelectric option.

And out of the other "Fossil Fuels" NG puts out the least amount of pollutants. It's plentiful, cheap and it's the number one used. The option of using Coal or Oil Fired (including diesel) should never be considered for a primary power source. You keep looking for reasons to prevent electric vehicles. Well, you ain't doing a very good job of that. Starting in 2025, things are breaking wide open for electric vehicles.

I helped to get a law passed in Colorado that allowed the operation of the Low Speed Electric Bicycle. The Cops all came up with the ruling that if it had a motor it was a motor vehicle and should be treated exactly like a car. The problem is, a low speed electric bicycle cannot meet the legal specification of the NHTA auto regs. And the Federal Laws put the Low Speed Electric Bicycle under the Bicycle Laws in the Public Safety instead of the NHTA for motorized vehicles. I was the last person in this state to get ticketed on a Low Speed Electric Bicycle for operating it outside of the NHTA motor vehicle rules and regs. The Judge got quite a laugh at the Cops expense on that one. But I worked with a Republican (yes, I said republican) state senator and we got the laws in colorado to mirror the federal laws.

The problem is, there are hurdles that are there only to block the electrics from becoming useful. It's becoming less and less each day but it's still there. And the biggest thing is the education of the masses. And consider this section as part of that education.

Once your alternatives become more practical and cost effective I’m sure everyone will acquiesce. It’s called progress. Until then, don’t force your sheep propaganda into my life. That’s called fascism.

Then I suggest you stop forcing yours on me. As it stands right now, my Truck would not pass the laws that are on the books for new vehicle construction. And why? Does it pollute more, No. Does it get worse fuel mileage from a comparable new vehicle, no. Is it less safe in an accident, no. The last thing you want to do with your tiny fiesta is to ram it into my Truck. I get bent sheet metal and you get buried in your shoeboxmobile. Mine is repairable and yours gets last rights along with your last rights. And I don't have to be a contortionist to get in and out of it. Get to be my age and that becomes a huge plus.

You Rightwingers already tried to block my electrics but we fought back in the courts. I am the last person in the State of Colorado to receive a ticket for operating a Low Speed Electric Bicycle. The Judge almost fell out of his chair laughing at that one. Then I worked with a "Republican" State Senator to get the Colorado Law changed to read what the Federal Law reads. BTW, for the court, I didn't use a Lawyer. I represented myself and just presented the Section 15 and 16 of the Federal Public Safety Laws. The Prosecutor presented the NHTA and the Colorado Motor Vehicle Laws which the Cops were using to bully the public with. He ruled that, well, get out of my court comes to mind. Dismissed. Then we got the laws changed at the state level through legislation. The Argument that "If it has a motor, it is a motor vehicle" was thrown out and the Cops had to be reeducated.

Then the States that won't allow companies like Tesla to be part of a multi dealership. They can exist as long as they are free standing dealership. The Oil Companies and Auto Manufacturers spend billions on that one buying politicians.

Now we have the states trying to charge thousands of dollars a year to register and operate an electric car on the hiways because the cars don't use the gas that is taxed. 1500 bucks a year just to register a car annually? Give me a break. There are other ways to get those taxes. That's another case of YOU trying to prevent ME from operating the vehicle of my choice even though that vehicle meets (and in most cases) exceeds all requirements for operation. Even China isn't doing that. They are understanding that clean air is more important than a bunch of Obstructionist against new technology. And China really needs all the help it can get to clean up their air.

I’m no right winger and you need to allow the market to determine the result, not a fascist decree or vogue political scam. You’re an extremist.

Oh, I see. I see what's coming out in the next 5 years and see it as something good. It's coming without or without my support or permission. Meanwhile, you want to block it. That ship has already sailed.

 

[Daryl Hunt]

Delivery giant UPS has ordered 10,000 electric trucks from Arrival, a technology company based in the UK. Some of the vehicles will be trialed in London and Paris later this year, building on a similar experiment that was run by the two companies in 2018. The pair then hope to deploy the trucks across Europe and North America over the next four years. If everything goes well, UPS has the option to buy another 10,000 vehicles.


UPS will use Arrival’s electric trucks in the US and Europe

The future looks bright.

Call me when they order Solar Power Van's and Trucks...

The cost to the environment to make the batteries for those Trucks and Van's that are electric will be as damaging...

The cost for the Environment, if you operate your electric for one month is 4 times worse than that of a Gas rig. But at the end of 5 years, the Electric ends up being 5 times better than the gas rig. And it keeps getting better each year for the electric but stays about the same for the Gas Rig.

Wet Cell Powered Electrics were far inferior to the Gas rig in every way.

Then came the NiMH batteries. The gap started to close. But the Gas Rig still won.

Then came the LIPO and the difference was equal for a 5 year operating period

Now we use LiPo4 batteries and in the 5 year period, the Electric wins hands down.

But in range, the Gas Powered car still wins. But here is the kicker. One of the reasons Tesla purchased (they call it merged) Maxwell Batteries is that Maxwell has a Solid State Battery in the testing phase that is 5 times lighter, 5 times the power output, fully charges in a matter of minutes, doesn't require a heat or cooling for operation, is designed to be flat, no more than about 2 inches thick and costs a fraction of the cost to make. Projected release in cars date in in 2025. This will also include kits to convert your Fiesta to electric as well. That means that the Tesla S with it's 300 useable mile range will not have a 1500 mile range using the same space and weight of batteries. And if you need to recharge it, a Tesla Charging Station will be able to recharge it in about 90 seconds. Or you can elect to use a smaller battery and get more room. For the Heavy Trucks, the weight V Power ratio becomes highly useable. Tesla is running around tracks today with that battery. And that new Factory in Nevada and in Germany will be producing it. This scares the living hell out of the Oil Companies and the conventional Automakers. The only reason we don't have it right now is that it takes bout 5 years to go from the test track to full production.

In 2025, the Gas Rig loses all the way around with the Electric being able to go further, be lighter and even cheaper for the same comparable vehicle. At some point, some cities are going to just stop the use of all gas powered cars, period, in order to help clean up their air. Norway is headed there and even some towns and cities in Texas are head there as well. If you don't like it there, move.

You can't even get any diesel powered vehicles and construction equipment to maximum law in producing fumes and emissions.

Nope. Diesel is dirty. When we weren't worried about things like Cancer, breathing diseases and clean air, the
Diesel looked like the savor. Today, we know better.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Delivery giant UPS has ordered 10,000 electric trucks from Arrival, a technology company based in the UK. Some of the vehicles will be trialed in London and Paris later this year, building on a similar experiment that was run by the two companies in 2018. The pair then hope to deploy the trucks across Europe and North America over the next four years. If everything goes well, UPS has the option to buy another 10,000 vehicles.


UPS will use Arrival’s electric trucks in the US and Europe

The future looks bright.

Call me when they order Solar Power Van's and Trucks...

The cost to the environment to make the batteries for those Trucks and Van's that are electric will be as damaging...

The cost for the Environment, if you operate your electric for one month is 4 times worse than that of a Gas rig. But at the end of 5 years, the Electric ends up being 5 times better than the gas rig. And it keeps getting better each year for the electric but stays about the same for the Gas Rig.

Wet Cell Powered Electrics were far inferior to the Gas rig in every way.

Then came the NiMH batteries. The gap started to close. But the Gas Rig still won.

Then came the LIPO and the difference was equal for a 5 year operating period

Now we use LiPo4 batteries and in the 5 year period, the Electric wins hands down.

But in range, the Gas Powered car still wins. But here is the kicker. One of the reasons Tesla purchased (they call it merged) Maxwell Batteries is that Maxwell has a Solid State Battery in the testing phase that is 5 times lighter, 5 times the power output, fully charges in a matter of minutes, doesn't require a heat or cooling for operation, is designed to be flat, no more than about 2 inches thick and costs a fraction of the cost to make. Projected release in cars date in in 2025. This will also include kits to convert your Fiesta to electric as well. That means that the Tesla S with it's 300 useable mile range will not have a 1500 mile range using the same space and weight of batteries. And if you need to recharge it, a Tesla Charging Station will be able to recharge it in about 90 seconds. Or you can elect to use a smaller battery and get more room. For the Heavy Trucks, the weight V Power ratio becomes highly useable. Tesla is running around tracks today with that battery. And that new Factory in Nevada and in Germany will be producing it. This scares the living hell out of the Oil Companies and the conventional Automakers. The only reason we don't have it right now is that it takes bout 5 years to go from the test track to full production.

In 2025, the Gas Rig loses all the way around with the Electric being able to go further, be lighter and even cheaper for the same comparable vehicle. At some point, some cities are going to just stop the use of all gas powered cars, period, in order to help clean up their air. Norway is headed there and even some towns and cities in Texas are head there as well. If you don't like it there, move.

I will live wherever I want and you asshole have no right to tell me to move!

You did not address the environmental cost of making thos batteries, disposing of them and the cost to the consumer to replace them and I wonder why?

Simple, if you have to discuss that then it destroys your emissions argument.

Nickel mining: the hidden environmental cost of electric cars

Also the environmental cost to produce the electricity no matter Solar, Wind or Nucler or even COAL is never discussed while those like you lecture how electric cars are the future and I wonder why?

Simple, you love hiding facts...

 

[Daryl Hunt]

Delivery giant UPS has ordered 10,000 electric trucks from Arrival, a technology company based in the UK. Some of the vehicles will be trialed in London and Paris later this year, building on a similar experiment that was run by the two companies in 2018. The pair then hope to deploy the trucks across Europe and North America over the next four years. If everything goes well, UPS has the option to buy another 10,000 vehicles.


UPS will use Arrival’s electric trucks in the US and Europe

The future looks bright.

Call me when they order Solar Power Van's and Trucks...

The cost to the environment to make the batteries for those Trucks and Van's that are electric will be as damaging...

The cost for the Environment, if you operate your electric for one month is 4 times worse than that of a Gas rig. But at the end of 5 years, the Electric ends up being 5 times better than the gas rig. And it keeps getting better each year for the electric but stays about the same for the Gas Rig.

Wet Cell Powered Electrics were far inferior to the Gas rig in every way.

Then came the NiMH batteries. The gap started to close. But the Gas Rig still won.

Then came the LIPO and the difference was equal for a 5 year operating period

Now we use LiPo4 batteries and in the 5 year period, the Electric wins hands down.

But in range, the Gas Powered car still wins. But here is the kicker. One of the reasons Tesla purchased (they call it merged) Maxwell Batteries is that Maxwell has a Solid State Battery in the testing phase that is 5 times lighter, 5 times the power output, fully charges in a matter of minutes, doesn't require a heat or cooling for operation, is designed to be flat, no more than about 2 inches thick and costs a fraction of the cost to make. Projected release in cars date in in 2025. This will also include kits to convert your Fiesta to electric as well. That means that the Tesla S with it's 300 useable mile range will not have a 1500 mile range using the same space and weight of batteries. And if you need to recharge it, a Tesla Charging Station will be able to recharge it in about 90 seconds. Or you can elect to use a smaller battery and get more room. For the Heavy Trucks, the weight V Power ratio becomes highly useable. Tesla is running around tracks today with that battery. And that new Factory in Nevada and in Germany will be producing it. This scares the living hell out of the Oil Companies and the conventional Automakers. The only reason we don't have it right now is that it takes bout 5 years to go from the test track to full production.

In 2025, the Gas Rig loses all the way around with the Electric being able to go further, be lighter and even cheaper for the same comparable vehicle. At some point, some cities are going to just stop the use of all gas powered cars, period, in order to help clean up their air. Norway is headed there and even some towns and cities in Texas are head there as well. If you don't like it there, move.

I will live wherever I want and you asshole have no right to tell me to move!

You did not address the environmental cost of making thos batteries, disposing of them and the cost to the consumer to replace them and I wonder why?

Simple, if you have to discuss that then it destroys your emissions argument.

Nickel mining: the hidden environmental cost of electric cars

Also the environmental cost to produce the electricity no matter Solar, Wind or Nucler or even COAL is never discussed while those like you lecture how electric cars are the future and I wonder why?

Simple, you love hiding facts...

So you attribute Nickel as bad for the Electric Cars. Well, then we also need to add a ton of other things it's used for as well.

The largest use of Nickel is Ferronickle which is used for all Stainless steel. And while you are at it, if you want to get rid of nickle, you will have to get rid of MOST metal composites. Adding Nickle enables the base metal to hand a broader band of temperatures. That means, it's also used in Aluminum that is used in Aircraft, and you guessed it, the aluminum parts for Cars and Trucks for engines. Nickel is used in almost every metal application that is in your life. The use in Batteries is such a small percentage in comparison it doesn't even move the needle.

In the lithium Phosphate Battery, there is very little Lithium used. It's mostly a gel form of Alcohol and carbon. The reason that the US doesn't have a decent recycling system like Europe does is that the US is slow, very slow. Europe recycles their Lipo batteries. So when you say that all the things in an Electric Car's battery is bad then you have to include almost everything around you the same way. BTW, Nickel is used with Aluminum for the cathodes. And Lithium is mixed in a very small amount into the Alcholol gel and carbon mix. solution.

The largest chemicals or minerals in a Lipo battery is the Alcohol gel and the Carbon. Class dismissed.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Delivery giant UPS has ordered 10,000 electric trucks from Arrival, a technology company based in the UK. Some of the vehicles will be trialed in London and Paris later this year, building on a similar experiment that was run by the two companies in 2018. The pair then hope to deploy the trucks across Europe and North America over the next four years. If everything goes well, UPS has the option to buy another 10,000 vehicles.


UPS will use Arrival’s electric trucks in the US and Europe

The future looks bright.

Call me when they order Solar Power Van's and Trucks...

The cost to the environment to make the batteries for those Trucks and Van's that are electric will be as damaging...

The cost for the Environment, if you operate your electric for one month is 4 times worse than that of a Gas rig. But at the end of 5 years, the Electric ends up being 5 times better than the gas rig. And it keeps getting better each year for the electric but stays about the same for the Gas Rig.

Wet Cell Powered Electrics were far inferior to the Gas rig in every way.

Then came the NiMH batteries. The gap started to close. But the Gas Rig still won.

Then came the LIPO and the difference was equal for a 5 year operating period

Now we use LiPo4 batteries and in the 5 year period, the Electric wins hands down.

But in range, the Gas Powered car still wins. But here is the kicker. One of the reasons Tesla purchased (they call it merged) Maxwell Batteries is that Maxwell has a Solid State Battery in the testing phase that is 5 times lighter, 5 times the power output, fully charges in a matter of minutes, doesn't require a heat or cooling for operation, is designed to be flat, no more than about 2 inches thick and costs a fraction of the cost to make. Projected release in cars date in in 2025. This will also include kits to convert your Fiesta to electric as well. That means that the Tesla S with it's 300 useable mile range will not have a 1500 mile range using the same space and weight of batteries. And if you need to recharge it, a Tesla Charging Station will be able to recharge it in about 90 seconds. Or you can elect to use a smaller battery and get more room. For the Heavy Trucks, the weight V Power ratio becomes highly useable. Tesla is running around tracks today with that battery. And that new Factory in Nevada and in Germany will be producing it. This scares the living hell out of the Oil Companies and the conventional Automakers. The only reason we don't have it right now is that it takes bout 5 years to go from the test track to full production.

In 2025, the Gas Rig loses all the way around with the Electric being able to go further, be lighter and even cheaper for the same comparable vehicle. At some point, some cities are going to just stop the use of all gas powered cars, period, in order to help clean up their air. Norway is headed there and even some towns and cities in Texas are head there as well. If you don't like it there, move.

I will live wherever I want and you asshole have no right to tell me to move!

You did not address the environmental cost of making thos batteries, disposing of them and the cost to the consumer to replace them and I wonder why?

Simple, if you have to discuss that then it destroys your emissions argument.

Nickel mining: the hidden environmental cost of electric cars

Also the environmental cost to produce the electricity no matter Solar, Wind or Nucler or even COAL is never discussed while those like you lecture how electric cars are the future and I wonder why?

Simple, you love hiding facts...

So you attribute Nickel as bad for the Electric Cars. Well, then we also need to add a ton of other things it's used for as well.

The largest use of Nickel is Ferronickle which is used for all Stainless steel. And while you are at it, if you want to get rid of nickle, you will have to get rid of MOST metal composites. Adding Nickle enables the base metal to hand a broader band of temperatures. That means, it's also used in Aluminum that is used in Aircraft, and you guessed it, the aluminum parts for Cars and Trucks for engines. Nickel is used in almost every metal application that is in your life. The use in Batteries is such a small percentage in comparison it doesn't even move the needle.

In the lithium Phosphate Battery, there is very little Lithium used. It's mostly a gel form of Alcohol and carbon. The reason that the US doesn't have a decent recycling system like Europe does is that the US is slow, very slow. Europe recycles their Lipo batteries. So when you say that all the things in an Electric Car's battery is bad then you have to include almost everything around you the same way. BTW, Nickel is used with Aluminum for the cathodes. And Lithium is mixed in a very small amount into the Alcholol gel and carbon mix. solution.

The largest chemicals or minerals in a Lipo battery is the Alcohol gel and the Carbon. Class dismissed.

End of discussion?

So you admit that what you are claiming to be better for the environment has not been better for the environment and now will go on the attack and say the discussion is over by dismissing class...

Got it and now let me lecture you and the reality is you are lying and hiding the environmental damage to lie to the public like you have many times before.

Fact is electric cars cause environmental damage and the cost to fix those cars when a battery dies is not cheap on the consumer.

So right now you have fossiel fuel damage along with damage from making those battery operated cars going on at the same time while also not even taking into consideration the damage Solar, Wind, Nuclear and Coal power plants are causing to the planet!

Boy, you want to dismiss your class while demanding no one question your impact of damage to our environment and how sad!

 

[Daryl Hunt]

Delivery giant UPS has ordered 10,000 electric trucks from Arrival, a technology company based in the UK. Some of the vehicles will be trialed in London and Paris later this year, building on a similar experiment that was run by the two companies in 2018. The pair then hope to deploy the trucks across Europe and North America over the next four years. If everything goes well, UPS has the option to buy another 10,000 vehicles.


UPS will use Arrival’s electric trucks in the US and Europe

The future looks bright.

Call me when they order Solar Power Van's and Trucks...

The cost to the environment to make the batteries for those Trucks and Van's that are electric will be as damaging...

The cost for the Environment, if you operate your electric for one month is 4 times worse than that of a Gas rig. But at the end of 5 years, the Electric ends up being 5 times better than the gas rig. And it keeps getting better each year for the electric but stays about the same for the Gas Rig.

Wet Cell Powered Electrics were far inferior to the Gas rig in every way.

Then came the NiMH batteries. The gap started to close. But the Gas Rig still won.

Then came the LIPO and the difference was equal for a 5 year operating period

Now we use LiPo4 batteries and in the 5 year period, the Electric wins hands down.

But in range, the Gas Powered car still wins. But here is the kicker. One of the reasons Tesla purchased (they call it merged) Maxwell Batteries is that Maxwell has a Solid State Battery in the testing phase that is 5 times lighter, 5 times the power output, fully charges in a matter of minutes, doesn't require a heat or cooling for operation, is designed to be flat, no more than about 2 inches thick and costs a fraction of the cost to make. Projected release in cars date in in 2025. This will also include kits to convert your Fiesta to electric as well. That means that the Tesla S with it's 300 useable mile range will not have a 1500 mile range using the same space and weight of batteries. And if you need to recharge it, a Tesla Charging Station will be able to recharge it in about 90 seconds. Or you can elect to use a smaller battery and get more room. For the Heavy Trucks, the weight V Power ratio becomes highly useable. Tesla is running around tracks today with that battery. And that new Factory in Nevada and in Germany will be producing it. This scares the living hell out of the Oil Companies and the conventional Automakers. The only reason we don't have it right now is that it takes bout 5 years to go from the test track to full production.

In 2025, the Gas Rig loses all the way around with the Electric being able to go further, be lighter and even cheaper for the same comparable vehicle. At some point, some cities are going to just stop the use of all gas powered cars, period, in order to help clean up their air. Norway is headed there and even some towns and cities in Texas are head there as well. If you don't like it there, move.

I will live wherever I want and you asshole have no right to tell me to move!

You did not address the environmental cost of making thos batteries, disposing of them and the cost to the consumer to replace them and I wonder why?

Simple, if you have to discuss that then it destroys your emissions argument.

Nickel mining: the hidden environmental cost of electric cars

Also the environmental cost to produce the electricity no matter Solar, Wind or Nucler or even COAL is never discussed while those like you lecture how electric cars are the future and I wonder why?

Simple, you love hiding facts...

So you attribute Nickel as bad for the Electric Cars. Well, then we also need to add a ton of other things it's used for as well.

The largest use of Nickel is Ferronickle which is used for all Stainless steel. And while you are at it, if you want to get rid of nickle, you will have to get rid of MOST metal composites. Adding Nickle enables the base metal to hand a broader band of temperatures. That means, it's also used in Aluminum that is used in Aircraft, and you guessed it, the aluminum parts for Cars and Trucks for engines. Nickel is used in almost every metal application that is in your life. The use in Batteries is such a small percentage in comparison it doesn't even move the needle.

In the lithium Phosphate Battery, there is very little Lithium used. It's mostly a gel form of Alcohol and carbon. The reason that the US doesn't have a decent recycling system like Europe does is that the US is slow, very slow. Europe recycles their Lipo batteries. So when you say that all the things in an Electric Car's battery is bad then you have to include almost everything around you the same way. BTW, Nickel is used with Aluminum for the cathodes. And Lithium is mixed in a very small amount into the Alcholol gel and carbon mix. solution.

The largest chemicals or minerals in a Lipo battery is the Alcohol gel and the Carbon. Class dismissed.

End of discussion?

So you admit that what you are claiming to be better for the environment has not been better for the environment and now will go on the attack and say the discussion is over by dismissing class...

Got it and now let me lecture you and the reality is you are lying and hiding the environmental damage to lie to the public like you have many times before.

Fact is electric cars cause environmental damage and the cost to fix those cars when a battery dies is not cheap on the consumer.

So right now you have fossiel fuel damage along with damage from making those battery operated cars going on at the same time while also not even taking into consideration the damage Solar, Wind, Nuclear and Coal power plants are causing to the planet!

Boy, you want to dismiss your class while demanding no one question your impact of damage to our environment and how sad!

My, My, what an unruly misinformed class.

Fact is, construction of ALL cars contribute to the environment in a negative way. It just so happens that the batteries in the Electric are larger and contribute more. That's a given. The fact is, if you are going to operate an electric car for only a month and then do the test then it's 5 times more pollutant than the gas powered car when you factor in the manufacture of the Batteries.

Ah, then you run your gas and electric for 5 years. Guess what, the Electric is now 5 times less impact on the environment every year past that first month. The Gas rig loses that one big time when you factor in the manufacture and day to day operation for a 5 year period.

As for damage from Coal. Considering there are very few coal fired electric generation plants left in the US then I suggest you get on someone's ass to get those few shut down and replaced with Natural Gas that is much more efficient, costs less and much, much cleaner.

Wind and Solar are doing just fine. Sure, a few birds bite the big one but not very many. There are ways to use sonics to discourage our foul friends from coming near a big Wind Mill. And Solar for large scale electric generation is usually done in areas where there is absolutely nothing there. For instance, Southern Colorado pipes in power from New Mexico and over 20% of it is wind and solar. The rest is natural gas. They used to buy their power from a Colorado Company that was using about 30% Coal and the rest was Natural Gas. They had a hell of a time breaking that contract but finally did and buy the cheaper NM power.

Let's turn the page, class. Around here, ALL of our electric Power comes from Hydroelectric. The last Coal Fired Plant is to be closed down this year. That also means the coal mines close down as well. As the states south and west of us become more energy independent that leaves more Hydroelectric Power from our Dams for us to use. We used to supply as far as Los Angeles but they are slowly firing up other methods including their own Hydro Plants along with, you guessed it, Wind and Solar in areas that is totally worthless, empty and void.

It's Friday, Class (actually, it's Saturday now) so go home for the weekend, study your books real well because we are going to have a test come monday. Be careful, we still have that dunce hat that you can wear in the corner on the high stool. Class dismissed.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

Call me when they order Solar Power Van's and Trucks...

The cost to the environment to make the batteries for those Trucks and Van's that are electric will be as damaging...

The cost for the Environment, if you operate your electric for one month is 4 times worse than that of a Gas rig. But at the end of 5 years, the Electric ends up being 5 times better than the gas rig. And it keeps getting better each year for the electric but stays about the same for the Gas Rig.

Wet Cell Powered Electrics were far inferior to the Gas rig in every way.

Then came the NiMH batteries. The gap started to close. But the Gas Rig still won.

Then came the LIPO and the difference was equal for a 5 year operating period

Now we use LiPo4 batteries and in the 5 year period, the Electric wins hands down.

But in range, the Gas Powered car still wins. But here is the kicker. One of the reasons Tesla purchased (they call it merged) Maxwell Batteries is that Maxwell has a Solid State Battery in the testing phase that is 5 times lighter, 5 times the power output, fully charges in a matter of minutes, doesn't require a heat or cooling for operation, is designed to be flat, no more than about 2 inches thick and costs a fraction of the cost to make. Projected release in cars date in in 2025. This will also include kits to convert your Fiesta to electric as well. That means that the Tesla S with it's 300 useable mile range will not have a 1500 mile range using the same space and weight of batteries. And if you need to recharge it, a Tesla Charging Station will be able to recharge it in about 90 seconds. Or you can elect to use a smaller battery and get more room. For the Heavy Trucks, the weight V Power ratio becomes highly useable. Tesla is running around tracks today with that battery. And that new Factory in Nevada and in Germany will be producing it. This scares the living hell out of the Oil Companies and the conventional Automakers. The only reason we don't have it right now is that it takes bout 5 years to go from the test track to full production.

In 2025, the Gas Rig loses all the way around with the Electric being able to go further, be lighter and even cheaper for the same comparable vehicle. At some point, some cities are going to just stop the use of all gas powered cars, period, in order to help clean up their air. Norway is headed there and even some towns and cities in Texas are head there as well. If you don't like it there, move.

I will live wherever I want and you asshole have no right to tell me to move!

You did not address the environmental cost of making thos batteries, disposing of them and the cost to the consumer to replace them and I wonder why?

Simple, if you have to discuss that then it destroys your emissions argument.

Nickel mining: the hidden environmental cost of electric cars

Also the environmental cost to produce the electricity no matter Solar, Wind or Nucler or even COAL is never discussed while those like you lecture how electric cars are the future and I wonder why?

Simple, you love hiding facts...

So you attribute Nickel as bad for the Electric Cars. Well, then we also need to add a ton of other things it's used for as well.

The largest use of Nickel is Ferronickle which is used for all Stainless steel. And while you are at it, if you want to get rid of nickle, you will have to get rid of MOST metal composites. Adding Nickle enables the base metal to hand a broader band of temperatures. That means, it's also used in Aluminum that is used in Aircraft, and you guessed it, the aluminum parts for Cars and Trucks for engines. Nickel is used in almost every metal application that is in your life. The use in Batteries is such a small percentage in comparison it doesn't even move the needle.

In the lithium Phosphate Battery, there is very little Lithium used. It's mostly a gel form of Alcohol and carbon. The reason that the US doesn't have a decent recycling system like Europe does is that the US is slow, very slow. Europe recycles their Lipo batteries. So when you say that all the things in an Electric Car's battery is bad then you have to include almost everything around you the same way. BTW, Nickel is used with Aluminum for the cathodes. And Lithium is mixed in a very small amount into the Alcholol gel and carbon mix. solution.

The largest chemicals or minerals in a Lipo battery is the Alcohol gel and the Carbon. Class dismissed.

End of discussion?

So you admit that what you are claiming to be better for the environment has not been better for the environment and now will go on the attack and say the discussion is over by dismissing class...

Got it and now let me lecture you and the reality is you are lying and hiding the environmental damage to lie to the public like you have many times before.

Fact is electric cars cause environmental damage and the cost to fix those cars when a battery dies is not cheap on the consumer.

So right now you have fossiel fuel damage along with damage from making those battery operated cars going on at the same time while also not even taking into consideration the damage Solar, Wind, Nuclear and Coal power plants are causing to the planet!

Boy, you want to dismiss your class while demanding no one question your impact of damage to our environment and how sad!

My, My, what an unruly misinformed class.

Fact is, construction of ALL cars contribute to the environment in a negative way. It just so happens that the batteries in the Electric are larger and contribute more. That's a given. The fact is, if you are going to operate an electric car for only a month and then do the test then it's 5 times more pollutant than the gas powered car when you factor in the manufacture of the Batteries.

Ah, then you run your gas and electric for 5 years. Guess what, the Electric is now 5 times less impact on the environment every year past that first month. The Gas rig loses that one big time when you factor in the manufacture and day to day operation for a 5 year period.

As for damage from Coal. Considering there are very few coal fired electric generation plants left in the US then I suggest you get on someone's ass to get those few shut down and replaced with Natural Gas that is much more efficient, costs less and much, much cleaner.

Wind and Solar are doing just fine. Sure, a few birds bite the big one but not very many. There are ways to use sonics to discourage our foul friends from coming near a big Wind Mill. And Solar for large scale electric generation is usually done in areas where there is absolutely nothing there. For instance, Southern Colorado pipes in power from New Mexico and over 20% of it is wind and solar. The rest is natural gas. They used to buy their power from a Colorado Company that was using about 30% Coal and the rest was Natural Gas. They had a hell of a time breaking that contract but finally did and buy the cheaper NM power.

Let's turn the page, class. Around here, ALL of our electric Power comes from Hydroelectric. The last Coal Fired Plant is to be closed down this year. That also means the coal mines close down as well. As the states south and west of us become more energy independent that leaves more Hydroelectric Power from our Dams for us to use. We used to supply as far as Los Angeles but they are slowly firing up other methods including their own Hydro Plants along with, you guessed it, Wind and Solar in areas that is totally worthless, empty and void.

It's Friday, Class (actually, it's Saturday now) so go home for the weekend, study your books real well because we are going to have a test come monday. Be careful, we still have that dunce hat that you can wear in the corner on the high stool. Class dismissed.

So now you want to dismiss class by saying all cars cause damage, so what and that is true and you have yet to discuss the true cost on the environment when discussing that.

Also now you opened another discussion when it come to the damage cause by Hydro-electric Plants and the impact it had on our environment, so can you explain to your so called class why you believe that damage is worthy and should not be looked at?

 

[Daryl Hunt]

The cost for the Environment, if you operate your electric for one month is 4 times worse than that of a Gas rig. But at the end of 5 years, the Electric ends up being 5 times better than the gas rig. And it keeps getting better each year for the electric but stays about the same for the Gas Rig.

Wet Cell Powered Electrics were far inferior to the Gas rig in every way.

Then came the NiMH batteries. The gap started to close. But the Gas Rig still won.

Then came the LIPO and the difference was equal for a 5 year operating period

Now we use LiPo4 batteries and in the 5 year period, the Electric wins hands down.

But in range, the Gas Powered car still wins. But here is the kicker. One of the reasons Tesla purchased (they call it merged) Maxwell Batteries is that Maxwell has a Solid State Battery in the testing phase that is 5 times lighter, 5 times the power output, fully charges in a matter of minutes, doesn't require a heat or cooling for operation, is designed to be flat, no more than about 2 inches thick and costs a fraction of the cost to make. Projected release in cars date in in 2025. This will also include kits to convert your Fiesta to electric as well. That means that the Tesla S with it's 300 useable mile range will not have a 1500 mile range using the same space and weight of batteries. And if you need to recharge it, a Tesla Charging Station will be able to recharge it in about 90 seconds. Or you can elect to use a smaller battery and get more room. For the Heavy Trucks, the weight V Power ratio becomes highly useable. Tesla is running around tracks today with that battery. And that new Factory in Nevada and in Germany will be producing it. This scares the living hell out of the Oil Companies and the conventional Automakers. The only reason we don't have it right now is that it takes bout 5 years to go from the test track to full production.

In 2025, the Gas Rig loses all the way around with the Electric being able to go further, be lighter and even cheaper for the same comparable vehicle. At some point, some cities are going to just stop the use of all gas powered cars, period, in order to help clean up their air. Norway is headed there and even some towns and cities in Texas are head there as well. If you don't like it there, move.

I will live wherever I want and you asshole have no right to tell me to move!

You did not address the environmental cost of making thos batteries, disposing of them and the cost to the consumer to replace them and I wonder why?

Simple, if you have to discuss that then it destroys your emissions argument.

Nickel mining: the hidden environmental cost of electric cars

Also the environmental cost to produce the electricity no matter Solar, Wind or Nucler or even COAL is never discussed while those like you lecture how electric cars are the future and I wonder why?

Simple, you love hiding facts...

So you attribute Nickel as bad for the Electric Cars. Well, then we also need to add a ton of other things it's used for as well.

The largest use of Nickel is Ferronickle which is used for all Stainless steel. And while you are at it, if you want to get rid of nickle, you will have to get rid of MOST metal composites. Adding Nickle enables the base metal to hand a broader band of temperatures. That means, it's also used in Aluminum that is used in Aircraft, and you guessed it, the aluminum parts for Cars and Trucks for engines. Nickel is used in almost every metal application that is in your life. The use in Batteries is such a small percentage in comparison it doesn't even move the needle.

In the lithium Phosphate Battery, there is very little Lithium used. It's mostly a gel form of Alcohol and carbon. The reason that the US doesn't have a decent recycling system like Europe does is that the US is slow, very slow. Europe recycles their Lipo batteries. So when you say that all the things in an Electric Car's battery is bad then you have to include almost everything around you the same way. BTW, Nickel is used with Aluminum for the cathodes. And Lithium is mixed in a very small amount into the Alcholol gel and carbon mix. solution.

The largest chemicals or minerals in a Lipo battery is the Alcohol gel and the Carbon. Class dismissed.

End of discussion?

So you admit that what you are claiming to be better for the environment has not been better for the environment and now will go on the attack and say the discussion is over by dismissing class...

Got it and now let me lecture you and the reality is you are lying and hiding the environmental damage to lie to the public like you have many times before.

Fact is electric cars cause environmental damage and the cost to fix those cars when a battery dies is not cheap on the consumer.

So right now you have fossiel fuel damage along with damage from making those battery operated cars going on at the same time while also not even taking into consideration the damage Solar, Wind, Nuclear and Coal power plants are causing to the planet!

Boy, you want to dismiss your class while demanding no one question your impact of damage to our environment and how sad!

My, My, what an unruly misinformed class.

Fact is, construction of ALL cars contribute to the environment in a negative way. It just so happens that the batteries in the Electric are larger and contribute more. That's a given. The fact is, if you are going to operate an electric car for only a month and then do the test then it's 5 times more pollutant than the gas powered car when you factor in the manufacture of the Batteries.

Ah, then you run your gas and electric for 5 years. Guess what, the Electric is now 5 times less impact on the environment every year past that first month. The Gas rig loses that one big time when you factor in the manufacture and day to day operation for a 5 year period.

As for damage from Coal. Considering there are very few coal fired electric generation plants left in the US then I suggest you get on someone's ass to get those few shut down and replaced with Natural Gas that is much more efficient, costs less and much, much cleaner.

Wind and Solar are doing just fine. Sure, a few birds bite the big one but not very many. There are ways to use sonics to discourage our foul friends from coming near a big Wind Mill. And Solar for large scale electric generation is usually done in areas where there is absolutely nothing there. For instance, Southern Colorado pipes in power from New Mexico and over 20% of it is wind and solar. The rest is natural gas. They used to buy their power from a Colorado Company that was using about 30% Coal and the rest was Natural Gas. They had a hell of a time breaking that contract but finally did and buy the cheaper NM power.

Let's turn the page, class. Around here, ALL of our electric Power comes from Hydroelectric. The last Coal Fired Plant is to be closed down this year. That also means the coal mines close down as well. As the states south and west of us become more energy independent that leaves more Hydroelectric Power from our Dams for us to use. We used to supply as far as Los Angeles but they are slowly firing up other methods including their own Hydro Plants along with, you guessed it, Wind and Solar in areas that is totally worthless, empty and void.

It's Friday, Class (actually, it's Saturday now) so go home for the weekend, study your books real well because we are going to have a test come monday. Be careful, we still have that dunce hat that you can wear in the corner on the high stool. Class dismissed.

So now you want to dismiss class by saying all cars cause damage, so what and that is true and you have yet to discuss the true cost on the environment when discussing that.

Also now you opened another discussion when it come to the damage cause by Hydro-electric Plants and the impact it had on our environment, so can you explain to your so called class why you believe that damage is worthy and should not be looked at?

Wait until Monday. Class has been dismissed and you need to hit that textbook. I suggest you review chapter 6.