We Were Right to Drop the Bomb

[harmonica]

Yep. Just kick in the door, and the whole house of cards would have come tumbling down, right?

Have the Soviets EVER done a significant amphibious landing?

The thing was, the Soviets didn't even have to kick down the door. the Japanese SURRENDERED just because they entered the war.

The way they mopped up the Kwantung Army, which was better armed than Japanese home army, is a pretty good indication of how poorly they'd have faired.

That was the thing. The Russians were in Korea in AUGUST 1945. We weren't even going to be ready for an invasion of the southernmost island until November, 1945.

they only surrendered after the Nagasaki bombing 9 Aug
Russia declared war on 8 Aug

 

[Likkmee]

Since the test was a success, how about one for crapital hell in full session ? Now THAT would be cool !

 

[JoeB131]

they only surrendered after the Nagasaki bombing 9 Aug
Russia declared war on 8 Aug

Right. BUt looking at the documents, the fact Russia had entered the war was the bigger deal.

1) It meant they could not count on the USSR to broker a peace.
2) It opened up several new fronts they were unprepared to fight on. (Manchuria, Korea, China, Sahkalin.)
3) It opened up the possibility that Japan might be partitioned like Germany. (With word already getting back of massive rapes of German women by Russian soldiers)

On the American side, the entry of the USSR also changed position. Up until that time, the main sticking point was the status of the Emperor. The US Dropped it's insistence on his abdication.

 

[there4eyeM]

Again, if a bomb absolutely positively had, imperatively, to be dropped in August, 1945, what capital would have been the most deserving?

 

[HenryBHough]

FDR started World War II.

Truman finished it.

See, there are some intelligent Democrats though Truman couldn't be one today.
Too intelligent. Too much in love with America.

 

[harmonica]

they only surrendered after the Nagasaki bombing 9 Aug
Russia declared war on 8 Aug

Right. BUt looking at the documents, the fact Russia had entered the war was the bigger deal.

1) It meant they could not count on the USSR to broker a peace.
2) It opened up several new fronts they were unprepared to fight on. (Manchuria, Korea, China, Sahkalin.)
3) It opened up the possibility that Japan might be partitioned like Germany. (With word already getting back of massive rapes of German women by Russian soldiers)

On the American side, the entry of the USSR also changed position. Up until that time, the main sticking point was the status of the Emperor. The US Dropped it's insistence on his abdication.

but the less fanatical Germans did not surrender until the Russians were in Berlin

upon surrendering, the Emperor,-- which cast the deciding vote--, mentions the bombs--not the Russians..unless you can link otherwise

''The enemy has begun to employ a new and most cruel bomb, the power of which to do damage is indeed incalculable, taking the toll of many innocent lives,'' the emperor said

A Leader Who Took Japan to War, to Surrender, and Finally to Peace

 

[eagle1462010]

Yes the bomb should have been dropped...........The casualties taking Japan would have been massive.....extremely massive for the Japanese.............

.I can't agree on the bomb itself.............it is something I wish was never invented.........It is a weapon that will quite possibly destroy the earth.

 

[harmonica]

..let me say again for all to read--the Emperor, who cast the deciding vote, mentions the A bombs as the reason for surrendering
the vote was tied

''The enemy has begun to employ a new and most cruel bomb, the power of which to do damage is indeed incalculable, taking the toll of many innocent lives,'' the emperor said

A Leader Who Took Japan to War, to Surrender, and Finally to Peace

this is the walk off home run

 

[HenryBHough]

Truman can be faulted, though, for having stopped too soon.

 

[Unkotare]

............It is a weapon that will quite possibly destroy the earth.

The planet? Um, no.

 

[Unkotare]

.............The casualties taking Japan would have been massive.....extremely massive for the Japanese..................

Speculation.

 

[JoeB131]

but the less fanatical Germans did not surrender until the Russians were in Berlin

Um, the germans were Nazis... they were about as fanatical as you can get.

upon surrendering, the Emperor,-- which cast the deciding vote--, mentions the bombs--not the Russians..unless you can link otherwise

Again, you kind of have to understand Japanese culture... of course they are going to tell us how mighty we are before surrendering to us.

But the reality- the USSR entering the war tipped the scales.

 

[harmonica]

but the less fanatical Germans did not surrender until the Russians were in Berlin

Um, the germans were Nazis... they were about as fanatical as you can get.

upon surrendering, the Emperor,-- which cast the deciding vote--, mentions the bombs--not the Russians..unless you can link otherwise

Again, you kind of have to understand Japanese culture... of course they are going to tell us how mighty we are before surrendering to us.

But the reality- the USSR entering the war tipped the scales.

hahahahhahahahaaha---talk about twisting the truth---
wrong
you--ALSO-have no knowledge of military history
the Germans did not have kamikaze as a culture
out of about 20,000 troops on Iwo Jima, only about 300 surrendered
many Japanese committed suicide/banzai charges/etc
NO --the Japanese were more fanatical

 

[harmonica]

but the less fanatical Germans did not surrender until the Russians were in Berlin

Um, the germans were Nazis... they were about as fanatical as you can get.

upon surrendering, the Emperor,-- which cast the deciding vote--, mentions the bombs--not the Russians..unless you can link otherwise

Again, you kind of have to understand Japanese culture... of course they are going to tell us how mighty we are before surrendering to us.

But the reality- the USSR entering the war tipped the scales.

so your evidence is something the Emperor DIDN'T say..........???!!!????
your evidence is what you THINK the Emperor was THINKING...?????!!!!!!
hahahahahah
and hahahahhahahaha
I can make up ANYTHING also:
hitler thought microwaves were great
Stalin really LOVED the Emperor and his shoes

 

[JoeB131]

you--ALSO-have no knowledge of military history
the Germans did not have kamikaze as a culture
out of about 20,000 troops on Iwo Jima, only about 300 surrendered
many Japanese committed suicide/banzai charges/etc
NO --the Japanese were more fanatical

No, they really weren't... The Nazis were the ones who tried to racially purify Europe based on a nutty philosophy.

so your evidence is something the Emperor DIDN'T say..........???!!!????
your evidence is what you THINK the Emperor was THINKING...?????!!!!!!

No, it's more the military reality on the ground.. They were now facing hundreds of battle hardened Soviet Divisions on their northern and western fronts.

Hokkadio (the Nothern most Island in the Japanese chain) had all of two infantry divisions to defend it. Most of what Japan had left was deployed South to fend off the Americans.

 

[harmonica]

you--ALSO-have no knowledge of military history
the Germans did not have kamikaze as a culture
out of about 20,000 troops on Iwo Jima, only about 300 surrendered
many Japanese committed suicide/banzai charges/etc
NO --the Japanese were more fanatical

No, they really weren't... The Nazis were the ones who tried to racially purify Europe based on a nutty philosophy.

so your evidence is something the Emperor DIDN'T say..........???!!!????
your evidence is what you THINK the Emperor was THINKING...?????!!!!!!

No, it's more the military reality on the ground.. They were now facing hundreds of battle hardened Soviet Divisions on their northern and western fronts.

Hokkadio (the Nothern most Island in the Japanese chain) had all of two infantry divisions to defend it. Most of what Japan had left was deployed South to fend off the Americans.

exactly---your evidence is what someone DIDN'T say
boy, you would make a great lawyer

 

[harmonica]

you--ALSO-have no knowledge of military history
the Germans did not have kamikaze as a culture
out of about 20,000 troops on Iwo Jima, only about 300 surrendered
many Japanese committed suicide/banzai charges/etc
NO --the Japanese were more fanatical

No, they really weren't... The Nazis were the ones who tried to racially purify Europe based on a nutty philosophy.

so your evidence is something the Emperor DIDN'T say..........???!!!????
your evidence is what you THINK the Emperor was THINKING...?????!!!!!!

No, it's more the military reality on the ground.. They were now facing hundreds of battle hardened Soviet Divisions on their northern and western fronts.

Hokkadio (the Nothern most Island in the Japanese chain) had all of two infantry divisions to defend it. Most of what Japan had left was deployed South to fend off the Americans.

and the Japanese attacked the US!--that had ''10 times'' the military power/etc!!
duh

 

[JoeB131]

exactly---your evidence is what someone DIDN'T say
boy, you would make a great lawyer

It doesn't matter what people say... it matters what the political and military realities on the ground were.

The reality was, once the USSR was in it, as Truman said in his diary, "Fini Japs". Everyone knew it. The Japanese knew it, the Americans knew it, the Russians knew it.

Then it just became who could get the most out of the surrender agreement. The Japanese got to keep their territorial integrity and their Emperor.

and the Japanese attacked the US!--that had ''10 times'' the military power/etc!!
duh

Not really. The Japanese had 10 Battleships to our 15 (8 of which were damaged at Pearl Harbor, and others were in the Atlantic.)

they had more carriers than we had (13 to our 7)

There strategy was to bog the Americans down until we tired of war, and then negotiate a favorable peace. Where they miscalculated was how great American outrage was after Pearl Harbor.

 

[there4eyeM]

Outrage didn't count for much. Output outdid the enemy.

 

[harmonica]

exactly---your evidence is what someone DIDN'T say
boy, you would make a great lawyer

It doesn't matter what people say... it matters what the political and military realities on the ground were.

The reality was, once the USSR was in it, as Truman said in his diary, "Fini Japs". Everyone knew it. The Japanese knew it, the Americans knew it, the Russians knew it.

Then it just became who could get the most out of the surrender agreement. The Japanese got to keep their territorial integrity and their Emperor.

and the Japanese attacked the US!--that had ''10 times'' the military power/etc!!
duh

Not really. The Japanese had 10 Battleships to our 15 (8 of which were damaged at Pearl Harbor, and others were in the Atlantic.)

they had more carriers than we had (13 to our 7)

There strategy was to bog the Americans down until we tired of war, and then negotiate a favorable peace. Where they miscalculated was how great American outrage was after Pearl Harbor.

so when OJ said he didn't do it, he really means he DID do it...???!!!

you people just scratch the surface with your knowledge of WW2
10 times is in QUOTES

Nearly twice the population of Japan.

Seventeen time's Japan's national income.

Five times more steel production.

Seven times more coal production.

Eighty (80) times the automobile production.

The net effect of all these factors meant that even in the depths of the Depression, American war-making potential was still around seven times larger than Japan's, and had the 'slack' been taken out in 1939, it was closer to nine or ten times as great!

Grim Economic Realities
etc etc
....you are like a lot of members--you back up your ''facts [ hahahah ] with lots of links/information/etc