Who does or does not support Israel?

[Marc39]

Shogun, even if Israel gave back all the "Land" Hamas, every other country wanting to Eliminate Israel and the Jews would continue to do so.

It's not about Land, it's about Killing and Wiping off Israel.


They already failed twice if i might add..

I said nothing about "giving back the land". I said sharing Palisrael under a united nation for both jews and palis. Now, if you want to think it's not about the land go ahead and figure out why no zionist jew will ever go for the same kind of ethnic equality THERE as they enjoy HERE in the US.

it's too bad that your concept of israel hinges on preserving a jewish dominance. If only white southerners had your zeal.

Dopey, the concept of 25 Arab countries hinges on preserving Arab dominance.
Also, dopey, the concept of 57 Muslim countries hinges on preserving Islamic dominance.
And, dopey, the concept of a Greek country hinges on preserving Greek Orthodox dominance.
Further, dopey, the concept of an Italian country hinges on preserving Catholic dominance.

I could name dozens of other countries, dopey. Get my point, dopey?

You're not too bright, eh, stoner? Too bad you weren't aborted, you mental invalid.

 

[Shogun]

Shogun, even if Israel gave back all the "Land" Hamas, every other country wanting to Eliminate Israel and the Jews would continue to do so.

It's not about Land, it's about Killing and Wiping off Israel.


They already failed twice if i might add..

I said nothing about "giving back the land". I said sharing Palisrael under a united nation for both jews and palis. Now, if you want to think it's not about the land go ahead and figure out why no zionist jew will ever go for the same kind of ethnic equality THERE as they enjoy HERE in the US.

it's too bad that your concept of israel hinges on preserving a jewish dominance. If only white southerners had your zeal.

Dopey, the concept of 25 Arab countries hinges on preserving Arab dominance.
Also, dopey, the concept of 57 Muslim countries hinges on preserving Islamic dominance.
And, dopey, the concept of a Greek country hinges on preserving Greek Orthodox dominance.
Further, dopey, the concept of an Italian country hinges on preserving Catholic dominance.

I could name dozens of other countries, dopey. Get my point, dopey?

You're not too bright, eh, stoner? Too bad you weren't aborted, you mental invalid.

I take it that this is your full testimony as to what kind of a dumb son of a bitch you are?

got it.

now, when you get done washing the sand and dirt from hour hands go on outside and enjoy a nation that doesn't treat your jewish ass like you want to treat non-jews in israel. If you can't fathom my point then just say so. Trying to sound deeper than you aren't is just sad.

 

[Shogun]

Further, dopey, the concept of an Italian country hinges on preserving Catholic dominance.





you are so fucking stupid. This sentence really highlights your stupidity. seriously.

 

[Marc39]

I said nothing about "giving back the land". I said sharing Palisrael under a united nation for both jews and palis. Now, if you want to think it's not about the land go ahead and figure out why no zionist jew will ever go for the same kind of ethnic equality THERE as they enjoy HERE in the US.

it's too bad that your concept of israel hinges on preserving a jewish dominance. If only white southerners had your zeal.

Dopey, the concept of 25 Arab countries hinges on preserving Arab dominance.
Also, dopey, the concept of 57 Muslim countries hinges on preserving Islamic dominance.
And, dopey, the concept of a Greek country hinges on preserving Greek Orthodox dominance.
Further, dopey, the concept of an Italian country hinges on preserving Catholic dominance.

I could name dozens of other countries, dopey. Get my point, dopey?

You're not too bright, eh, stoner? Too bad you weren't aborted, you mental invalid.

I take it that this is your full testimony as to what kind of a dumb son of a bitch you are?

got it.

now, when you get done washing the sand and dirt from hour hands go on outside and enjoy a nation that doesn't treat your jewish ass like you want to treat non-jews in israel. If you can't fathom my point then just say so. Trying to sound deeper than you aren't is just sad.

Sucks having me make you look like the mental midget you truly are, eh? Show us that bogus map of Palestine, moron, which never actually existed as a country in history. LOL

 

[Marc39]

Further, dopey, the concept of an Italian country hinges on preserving Catholic dominance.





you are so fucking stupid. This sentence really highlights your stupidity. seriously.

FAIL. I own you. You're my bitch.

 

[Shogun]

Further, dopey, the concept of an Italian country hinges on preserving Catholic dominance.





you are so fucking stupid. This sentence really highlights your stupidity. seriously.

FAIL. I own you. You're my bitch.

no, you really don't. and, that you seem to think that it's CATHOLICISM which defines the Italian national identity pretty much proves how knee-slapping hilarious it is that you think so.

 

[Marc39]

Further, dopey, the concept of an Italian country hinges on preserving Catholic dominance.





you are so fucking stupid. This sentence really highlights your stupidity. seriously.

FAIL. I own you. You're my bitch.

no, you really don't. and, that you seem to think that it's CATHOLICISM which defines the Italian national identity pretty much proves how knee-slapping hilarious it is that you think so.

Catholicism does define Italy, fool. By law, every public building must display a Crucifix. Catholicism must be taught in public school. The Vatican dominates public policymaking in Italy.

Now, you know, idiot. But, then, again, you also believe Palestine is acountry, right, genius?

 

[Samson]

A. The equation that Israel is the only one the profits from the Israel-US relationship is wrong.

B. With which one of the countries that want us obliterated from the map should Israel form a regional alliance?

A. I never said the US didn't benefit from the existing alliance.

I said the benefit isn't worth the cost.

B. Since I'm in the USA, I don't care if, or when, Israel forms regional alliances with anyone. Sounds like something the Israelis need to work out, though.

what i meant with the B. point was to respond to what you said:" As long as Israel is allied with the USA, they have no incentive to develop and expand more meaningful alliances with regional partners." the thing is, israel has no regional partners with which they can make alliances with, regardless of US support. is that america's problem. well, if the US wants to maintain a global leadership role, than it has to have alliances with local partners in global regions. in the mid-east, the ally is israel.

I disagree.

The ONLY ally in the mid-east is not Israel

We own Iraq.

 

[Marc39]

Israel is the only US ally in the Middle East.

To suggest Iraq is an ally is beyond pathetically uninformed.

 

[maineman]

I disagree.

The ONLY ally in the mid-east is not Israel

We own Iraq.

as long as we have an occupying army within their borders, I suppose you can call Iraq an "ally"...but as soon as our combat troops depart, Iraq will be a MUCH closer ally to Iran than to us. without a doubt

 

[Samson]

I disagree.

The ONLY ally in the mid-east is not Israel

We own Iraq.

as long as we have an occupying army within their borders, I suppose you can call Iraq an "ally"...but as soon as our combat troops depart, Iraq will be a MUCH closer ally to Iran than to us. without a doubt

Opinion, based on..........?

History Disagrees: The USA has never invaded and occupied another nation without them becomming our ally.

Key phrase here is "as soon as our combat troop depart."

 

[P F Tinmore]

I disagree.

The ONLY ally in the mid-east is not Israel

We own Iraq.

as long as we have an occupying army within their borders, I suppose you can call Iraq an "ally"...but as soon as our combat troops depart, Iraq will be a MUCH closer ally to Iran than to us. without a doubt

Iraq could have been a strong ally to the US but retard Bush blew that out of the water.

 

[P F Tinmore]

I disagree.

The ONLY ally in the mid-east is not Israel

We own Iraq.

as long as we have an occupying army within their borders, I suppose you can call Iraq an "ally"...but as soon as our combat troops depart, Iraq will be a MUCH closer ally to Iran than to us. without a doubt

Opinion, based on..........?

History Disagrees: The USA has never invaded and occupied another nation without them becomming our ally.

Key phrase here is "as soon as our combat troop depart."

Does that mean they will be our ally as long as we are there to pound them into submission?

 

[toomuchtime_]

I do NOT support Israel as an ally.

I think the USA needs to revise their list of allies Post Cold War.

The alliance with Israel is a Cold War Anachronism that serves no purpose other than to continue to involve the USA in regional conflicts about which there is nothing to be gained, and much to be lost. As long as Israel is allied with the USA, they have no incentive to develop and expand more meaningful alliances with regional partners.

In Short:

Israel needs to Grow The Fuck Up.

The US has never become involved in a conflict because of its alliance with Israel and there is no likelihood it will in the future. The US did become involved in two horrendous wars because of its alliances with the UK, France, etc. that cost us huge amounts of money and over 400,000 American lives and the US did become involved in a bloody conflict in Iraq because of its alliances with Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and the UAE that has cost hundreds of billions of dollars so far with no end in sight and has cost the lives of thousands of American soldiers. The US alliance with South Korea has cost tens of thousands of American lives and along with our alliance with Japan may yet involve us in a nuclear exchange with North Korea and perhaps a conflict with China. While the Soviet Union has collapsed, our commitment to defend our western European allies and our allies in eastern Europe may yet involve us in a conflict with a resurgent and increasingly aggressive Russia with potentially horrendous consequences.

By contrast, the US alliance with Israel is low maintenance. The US has never had to fight in any of Israel's conflicts; in fact, by twice defeating Soviet client states in Egypt and Syria, Israel relieved the US of the necessity of having to insert troops in the ME to prevent a Soviet advance towards the Gulf, and these Israeli victories set the stage for the US to lock Soviet influence out of the ME from North Africa to the Gulf with the Egypt-Israel peace treaty. No other US ally made as great a contribution to the US winning the Cold War as Israel did. In fact, by stopping the Soviet advance towards the Gulf, Israel arguably made a greater contribution to the sovereignty, safety and independence of Jordan and the Gulf nations than any other country in the world other than the US.

But you're saying, even if Israel was an enormously important ally before the collapse of the USSR, is there any reason why we shouldn't dump them now that the Cold War seems to be over? Indeed, we could ask the same question about nearly all of our allies. Why should we risk even a non military conflict with China over Taiwan? Why should we risk the lives of American soldiers, and perhaps American civilians and cities, to protect South Korea? And why take this risk to protect Japan? Surely, Japan is rich enough and technologically advanced enough to protect themselves against North Korea and maybe even China without putting US lives at risk. And the same is true of our commitment to defend westarn and eastern European allies; surely the western Europeans are rich enough and technologically advanced enough to be able to provide for their own defense without enormous US expenditures for deployments of men and material and the risk to American lives it entails. And the list goes on and on.

I won't try to justify all of these alliances that not only cost us lots of money but put American lives at risk also, but in the case of our alliance with Israel, we get a clear and important benefit, and we get it at a bargain price - no US lives put at risk and mo massive deployments of men or material. What we get in return for our annual military aid to Israel - which costs us much less than our deployments in South Korea or elsewhere in the Pacific and much, much less than our deployments in Europe in support of those allies - is stability in the ME where the US has vital interests, the Suez Canal in the west and the Gulf oil fields in the east.

While it may sound strange, our alliance with Israel and the alliance with Egypt it led to are the principal stabilizing forces in the ME. The ME strategy Jimmy Carter committed us to in the Egypt-Israel peace treaty is that the US will provide sufficient military aid to each country so that beyond their needs to defend themselves against other potential adversaries, each would be so powerful when compared to the other that neither would have to fear attack from the other, and in a part of the world where so many radical destabilizing forces are barely held in check, this strategy has worked almost perfectly in keeping the peace and relieved the US from the necessity of having to deploy troops to protect its vital interests in the area.

 

[JakeStarkey]

I disagree.

The ONLY ally in the mid-east is not Israel

We own Iraq.

as long as we have an occupying army within their borders, I suppose you can call Iraq an "ally"...but as soon as our combat troops depart, Iraq will be a MUCH closer ally to Iran than to us. without a doubt

Opinion, based on..........?

History Disagrees: The USA has never invaded and occupied another nation without them becomming our ally.

Key phrase here is "as soon as our combat troop depart."

Except the exceptions: Mexico, Cuba, and what else, hmmm? Iraq and Iran are going to become very tight buddies, and to think only the idiocy of Bush and Cheney could have pulled that off. Nevertheless, I won't give the GOP up. It's history is too wonderful to let the recent aberrations and perversions committed in its name become its standard pattern.

 

[Winston Smith]

A. I never said the US didn't benefit from the existing alliance.

I said the benefit isn't worth the cost.

B. Since I'm in the USA, I don't care if, or when, Israel forms regional alliances with anyone. Sounds like something the Israelis need to work out, though.

what i meant with the B. point was to respond to what you said:" As long as Israel is allied with the USA, they have no incentive to develop and expand more meaningful alliances with regional partners." the thing is, israel has no regional partners with which they can make alliances with, regardless of US support. is that america's problem. well, if the US wants to maintain a global leadership role, than it has to have alliances with local partners in global regions. in the mid-east, the ally is israel.

I disagree.

The ONLY ally in the mid-east is not Israel

We own Iraq.

the only way to really know if iraq is a US ally, is its behvior after american troops leave the country.

besides, i didn't mean to say that Israel is the only regional partner in the mid-east (egypt, for example is also one), but that Israel is the main US ally in the area, and the only one where the US realtions are seen in a positive light.

 

[mdn2000]

Israel is the only US ally in the Middle East.

To suggest Iraq is an ally is beyond pathetically uninformed.

This is a great example of a bigot, sometimes a bigot is on the right side but in the case of bigots the truth they spew never makes up for the damage the bigotry does.

 

[Marc39]

Israel is the only US ally in the Middle East.

To suggest Iraq is an ally is beyond pathetically uninformed.

This is a great example of a bigot, sometimes a bigot is on the right side but in the case of bigots the truth they spew never makes up for the damage the bigotry does.

You're an insipid, incoherent broken record. Yes, it sucks that I humiliate you in debate. I'm much smarter. Deal with it.

 

[mdn2000]

Israel is the only US ally in the Middle East.

To suggest Iraq is an ally is beyond pathetically uninformed.

This is a great example of a bigot, sometimes a bigot is on the right side but in the case of bigots the truth they spew never makes up for the damage the bigotry does.

You're an insipid, incoherent broken record. Yes, it sucks that I humiliate you in debate. I'm much smarter. Deal with it.

Unless you call name calling a debate we have yet to debate, do you mean where you apparently did not read what I wrote and in response you stated

"the USA congress made Jerusalem", "the USA congress made Jerusalem", "the USA congress made Jerusalem", "the USA congress made Jerusalem",

That is not debate, that is gibberish, that is incoherent, not debate, of course it could be debate to a moron, if so I concede, you win.

 

[Samson]

what i meant with the B. point was to respond to what you said:" As long as Israel is allied with the USA, they have no incentive to develop and expand more meaningful alliances with regional partners." the thing is, israel has no regional partners with which they can make alliances with, regardless of US support. is that america's problem. well, if the US wants to maintain a global leadership role, than it has to have alliances with local partners in global regions. in the mid-east, the ally is israel.

I disagree.

The ONLY ally in the mid-east is not Israel

We own Iraq.

the only way to really know if iraq is a US ally, is its behvior after american troops leave the country.

besides, i didn't mean to say that Israel is the only regional partner in the mid-east (egypt, for example is also one), but that Israel is the main US ally in the area, and the only one where the US realtions are seen in a positive light.

There are few "allies" of the USA where the alliance is completely seen in a completely "positive light," including Israel.

However, I'd agree that the US could be viewed in a "more positive light" in the Mid-East.

The first step towards this would be making Israel's military defense and economic aid less of a US priority.

Much has been invested in Iraq.

I favor shifting US resources going to Israel to go to Iraq to maintain that investment.