Why Do Democrats Oppose Voter ID?

[Care4all]

voter registration requires proof of citizenship. If voter fraud is so rampant, what leads you to believe an ID card couldn't have and/or use the same fake information used to get a voter registration card ?

A state-issued ID card proves identity; it dosn't prove citizenship.
If you ever filled out an I-9, you'd know that.


Absent a valid state-issued photo ID, how does the state verify that the person at the poll is who he says he is?
Still waiting for your response.

your electric bill with your name and address, your paystub with your name and address etc or simply your signature, swearing you are who you say, with a felony charge if you are not.

As far as your identity goes, these don't prove a thing,
You know, that, right?

They sure do! How do you suppose this impersonator is going to get this person's latest electric bill or latest paystub to impersonate them?

 

[Mathbud1]

1) I think that forcing people to produce a picture ID will NOT eliminate voter fraud or even curtail it.

2) It will mostly serve to reduce the amount of voters who would normally vote democrat, thus giving me great pause as to the actual motivations central to this issue.

3) I believe that most dems have taken up this issue because they understand that it is being used as a tool by the right to shrink the dem voter base.

1) why do you think it will not eliminate or curtail voter fraud?

2) why would it mostly serve to reduce the number of voters who would normally vote democrat?

3) see 2.

 

[Mad_Cabbie]

M14, we double teamed it in the last thread, you think that ignorant bitch would realize we ain't gonna let her go on with her moronic rantings ...............
She has left our other threads, don't look for her to post any more of her moronic shit in this thread .................

Gee, you're mighty tough.

So ... how many posters you kilt here on thu innernetz?

I recon I got me at least a dozen -- CAP LOCKS BEING MY WEAPON OF CHOICE.

 

[Mad_Cabbie]

bbbbbbaaaaawwwaaaahhahahahahahaha

dumb and dumber has left the building ... right after they made fools of themselves.

adios muchacha's

What you talking about ******, no ones gone anywhere .....................

You will if you don't stay on topic or keep insulting people -- just sayin, cowboy!

 

[Siete]

1) I think that forcing people to produce a picture ID will NOT eliminate voter fraud or even curtail it.

2) It will mostly serve to reduce the amount of voters who would normally vote democrat, thus giving me great pause as to the actual motivations central to this issue.

3) I believe that most dems have taken up this issue because they understand that it is being used as a tool by the right to shrink the dem voter base.

1) why do you think it will not eliminate or curtail voter fraud?

2) why would it mostly serve to reduce the number of voters who would normally vote democrat?

3) see 2.

1. Partisan stupidity.

2, (see #, 1)

 

[M14 Shooter]

voter registration requires proof of citizenship. If voter fraud is so rampant, what leads you to believe an ID card couldn't have and/or use the same fake information used to get a voter registration card ?

A state-issued ID card proves identity; it dosn't prove citizenship.
If you ever filled out an I-9, you'd know that.


Absent a valid state-issued photo ID, how does the state verify that the person at the poll is who he says he is?
Still waiting for your response.

your electric bill with your name and address, your paystub with your name and address etc or simply your signature, swearing you are who you say, with a felony charge if you are not.

As far as your identity goes, these don't prove a thing,
You know, that, right?

They sure do! How do you suppose this impersonator is going to get this person's latest electric bill or latest pay stub to impersonate them?

Identity theft - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia
A pay stub does nothing to prove that you are the person whose name is on the stub. Nothing.
Will a pay stub get you on a airplane? Nope. Why? it proves nothing.
And so, why should have be acceptable for verification of identity for voting purposes?

 

[Siete]

voter registration requires proof of citizenship. If voter fraud is so rampant, what leads you to believe an ID card couldn't have and/or use the same fake information used to get a voter registration card ?

A state-issued ID card proves identity; it dosn't prove citizenship.
If you ever filled out an I-9, you'd know that.


Absent a valid state-issued photo ID, how does the state verify that the person at the poll is who he says he is?
Still waiting for your response.

your electric bill with your name and address, your paystub with your name and address etc or simply your signature, swearing you are who you say, with a felony charge if you are not.

As far as your identity goes, these don't prove a thing,
You know, that, right?

They sure do! How do you suppose this impersonator is going to get this person's latest electric bill or latest pay stub to impersonate them?

Identity theft - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia
A pay stub does nothing to prove that you are the person whose name is on the stub. Nothing.
Will a pay stub get you on a airplane? Nope. Why? it proves nothing.
And so, why should have be acceptable for verification of identity for voting purposes?

seriously? compare airline security where 100's of people could die to one idiot casting a vote ..

you never did say how stupid you really are.... still trying to figure it out?

 

[Care4all]

1) I think that forcing people to produce a picture ID will NOT eliminate voter fraud or even curtail it.

2) It will mostly serve to reduce the amount of voters who would normally vote democrat, thus giving me great pause as to the actual motivations central to this issue.

3) I believe that most dems have taken up this issue because they understand that it is being used as a tool by the right to shrink the dem voter base.

1) why do you think it will not eliminate or curtail voter fraud?

2) why would it mostly serve to reduce the number of voters who would normally vote democrat?

3) see 2.

1) why do you think it will not eliminate or curtail voter fraud?

It's been explained a gazillion billion times in this thread and all of the others on the topic Mat

-Requiring a Gvt Issued Photo Id at the voting place does NOT STOP the fraud that is occurring....I believe I read there was a study that showed out of the last 1 billion recent votes cast, from previous elections, there 8 cases out of that BILLION where people tried to impersonate another person... voter ID does not stop the voter fraud that does occur...this is the LEAST thing that vote thieves would do....so WHY are you all insisting on this?

-One example would be, in Florida, the DMV starting in 1993 no longer was allowed to ask those getting driver's licenses if they were citizens or not... and many other States are just like this.... so the illegals HAVE state issued photo ID cards if they drive, and a number of other State issued Id's since 1993...they could be registered to vote too for all we know?....(but in Florida, those illegals are more than likely Cuban, and Cubans in general, vote with republicans vs the Mexicans with Democratic)

-this is a phony guise, that stops nothing, so why grow government more and lead to the road of us all needing some kind of National Id card to even walk down the street in the future...? (yes that is a conspiracy, but a slippery slope, none the less)

-The way to stop the most voter fraud, would be for the States to vet those applying to vote, those applying to REGISTER to vote and remove the illegals, the dead, the felons if felons can't vote in the State and all other categories of people that are not suppose to vote in each Sate under each State's Laws, AND NEVER APPROVE the person illegally or not allowed to vote in the FIRST PLACE.

The registration process is where it should be stopped. their names should never make the voting roster roll.

Also, we need to relook at the absentee process, to make this safer and less likely for voter fraud as well....though if the State's just did their freaking job, and remove those that they issued death certificates for OFF OF THE VOTER ROSTER, that would be a GOOD START!

a neighbor going to vote in your name or even a stranger going to the voting place to vote in your name is a risk MOST THIEVES would NOT TAKE....the person they are trying to impersonate could have voted already, the person they are trying to impersonate could be in line in front or in back of them, the poll worker could know this person, the poll worker could be related to this person, and on top of all of that, if the impersonator signs the roster in this other person's name it is a FELONY.... thus only 8 cases out of every BILLION VOTES....(over 10 years, nationwide)

2) why would it mostly serve to reduce the number of voters who would normally vote democrat?

Because poor people, tend to not have the money for a car, and don't have driver's licenses, and also seniors who do not drive as well, do not have valid State issued Gvt id's...

As Example:
In Pennsylvania, they determined that there were 250,000 legal registered voters, that did not have a State issued gvt photo id....

There are a whole group of citizens that are registered to vote, that just don't live in the fast lane like we do.... that we can not imagine are out there...but we are WRONG, they are out there, living without State gvt issued ID's and living without checking accounts and living without a lot of things that we see as normal and easy to have....but they are not easy to be had for these people or they just flat out refuse to participate in this materialistic world of ours, think the Alaskan "outback" so to say and even here, we have these citizens living in the Maine Woods...and look at all of the check cashing places around, these are people who do NOT HAVE CHECKING ACCTS....because they had no id to get one....though illegals in our country can get checking accounts with their own country ids...

these people tend to vote democratic...this is why the republican establishment has gone on this rampage of needing a State issued PHOTO ID....

The Republican strategists even so much as SAID SO Matt....

 

[Care4all]

voter registration requires proof of citizenship. If voter fraud is so rampant, what leads you to believe an ID card couldn't have and/or use the same fake information used to get a voter registration card ?

A state-issued ID card proves identity; it dosn't prove citizenship.
If you ever filled out an I-9, you'd know that.


Absent a valid state-issued photo ID, how does the state verify that the person at the poll is who he says he is?
Still waiting for your response.

your electric bill with your name and address, your paystub with your name and address etc or simply your signature, swearing you are who you say, with a felony charge if you are not.

As far as your identity goes, these don't prove a thing,
You know, that, right?

They sure do! How do you suppose this impersonator is going to get this person's latest electric bill or latest pay stub to impersonate them?

Identity theft - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia
A pay stub does nothing to prove that you are the person whose name is on the stub. Nothing.
Will a pay stub get you on a airplane? Nope. Why? it proves nothing.
And so, why should have be acceptable for verification of identity for voting purposes?

How is this imaginary impersonator going to get your most recent pay stub or electric bill?

We don't need any ID at all here in Maine to vote and have NEVER HAD A CASE where someone came to the polls to vote in someone else's name...

 

[M14 Shooter]

It's been explained a gazillion billion times in this thread and all of the others on the topic Mat
-Requiring a Gvt Issued Photo Id at the voting place does NOT STOP the fraud that is occurring.

If voter ID is required, how do I vote in your place?

 

[M14 Shooter]

A state-issued ID card proves identity; it dosn't prove citizenship.
If you ever filled out an I-9, you'd know that.


Absent a valid state-issued photo ID, how does the state verify that the person at the poll is who he says he is?
Still waiting for your response.

your electric bill with your name and address, your paystub with your name and address etc or simply your signature, swearing you are who you say, with a felony charge if you are not.

As far as your identity goes, these don't prove a thing,
You know, that, right?

They sure do! How do you suppose this impersonator is going to get this person's latest electric bill or latest pay stub to impersonate them?

Identity theft - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia
A pay stub does nothing to prove that you are the person whose name is on the stub. Nothing.
Will a pay stub get you on a airplane? Nope. Why? it proves nothing.
And so, why should have be acceptable for verification of identity for voting purposes?

How is this imaginary impersonator going to get your most recent pay stub or electric bill?

You ask this as if I have not already addressed it.
Identity theft - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Glad you gave up o the pay stub idea.

So, again:
Absent a valid state-issued photo ID, how does the state verify that the person at the poll is who he says he is?

 

[DrDoomNGloom]

1) I think that forcing people to produce a picture ID will NOT eliminate voter fraud or even curtail it.

2) It will mostly serve to reduce the amount of voters who would normally vote democrat, thus giving me great pause as to the actual motivations central to this issue.

3) I believe that most dems have taken up this issue because they understand that it is being used as a tool by the right to shrink the dem voter base.

1) why do you think it will not eliminate or curtail voter fraud?

2) why would it mostly serve to reduce the number of voters who would normally vote democrat?

3) see 2.

1) why do you think it will not eliminate or curtail voter fraud?

It's been explained a gazillion billion times in this thread and all of the others on the topic Mat

-Requiring a Gvt Issued Photo Id at the voting place does NOT STOP the fraud that is occurring....I believe I read there was a study that showed out of the last 1 billion recent votes cast, from previous elections, there 8 cases out of that BILLION where people tried to impersonate another person... voter ID does not stop the voter fraud that does occur...this is the LEAST thing that vote thieves would do....so WHY are you all insisting on this?

-One example would be, in Florida, the DMV starting in 1993 no longer was allowed to ask those getting driver's licenses if they were citizens or not... and many other States are just like this.... so the illegals HAVE state issued photo ID cards if they drive, and a number of other State issued Id's since 1993...they could be registered to vote too for all we know?....(but in Florida, those illegals are more than likely Cuban, and Cubans in general, vote with republicans vs the Mexicans with Democratic)

-this is a phony guise, that stops nothing, so why grow government more and lead to the road of us all needing some kind of National Id card to even walk down the street in the future...? (yes that is a conspiracy, but a slippery slope, none the less)

-The way to stop the most voter fraud, would be for the States to vet those applying to vote, those applying to REGISTER to vote and remove the illegals, the dead, the felons if felons can't vote in the State and all other categories of people that are not suppose to vote in each Sate under each State's Laws, AND NEVER APPROVE the person illegally or not allowed to vote in the FIRST PLACE.

The registration process is where it should be stopped. their names should never make the voting roster roll.

Also, we need to relook at the absentee process, to make this safer and less likely for voter fraud as well....though if the State's just did their freaking job, and remove those that they issued death certificates for OFF OF THE VOTER ROSTER, that would be a GOOD START!

a neighbor going to vote in your name or even a stranger going to the voting place to vote in your name is a risk MOST THIEVES would NOT TAKE....the person they are trying to impersonate could have voted already, the person they are trying to impersonate could be in line in front or in back of them, the poll worker could know this person, the poll worker could be related to this person, and on top of all of that, if the impersonator signs the roster in this other person's name it is a FELONY.... thus only 8 cases out of every BILLION VOTES....(over 10 years, nationwide)

2) why would it mostly serve to reduce the number of voters who would normally vote democrat?

Because poor people, tend to not have the money for a car, and don't have driver's licenses, and also seniors who do not drive as well, do not have valid State issued Gvt id's...

As Example:
In Pennsylvania, they determined that there were 250,000 legal registered voters, that did not have a State issued gvt photo id....

There are a whole group of citizens that are registered to vote, that just don't live in the fast lane like we do.... that we can not imagine are out there...but we are WRONG, they are out there, living without State gvt issued ID's and living without checking accounts and living without a lot of things that we see as normal and easy to have....but they are not easy to be had for these people or they just flat out refuse to participate in this materialistic world of ours, think the Alaskan "outback" so to say and even here, we have these citizens living in the Maine Woods...and look at all of the check cashing places around, these are people who do NOT HAVE CHECKING ACCTS....because they had no id to get one....though illegals in our country can get checking accounts with their own country ids...

these people tend to vote democratic...this is why the republican establishment has gone on this rampage of needing a State issued PHOTO ID....

The Republican strategists even so much as SAID SO Matt....

I am going out on a limb here in saying you don't have a fucking clue about Florida Drivers license requirements ..............
Why do yo folks keep telling these easily debunked lies??

Drivers License Identification Requirements
You are Here: Florida DMV Home » Drivers License Identification Requirements


Identification Requirements
As of Jan 1, 2010 The State of Florida has implemented strict ID Requirements for a New Drivers Licesne or Identication Card.

Renewing Your Florida Drivers License
If you are renewing a current Florida Drivers License you may renew your license online or via mail one time. After you have used these convenience methods once you must visit a Florida DMV office and provide the required ID - see below

New Drivers License or ID
If you are applying for a new Florida Drivers License, ID Card, or have legally changed your name you MUST PROVIDE the DOCUMENTS listed below

Document requirments include: Primary Identification, Proof of Social Security Number, 2 Proofs of Residential Address

First Time Drivers
If you have never had a drivers license before you will be required to complete the DATA course.

Find Your Requirements
US Citizens
Immigrants
Non Immigrants
Canadians

US Citizens
Florida law requires identification, proof of date of birth, proof of residential address, and proof of social security number (if issued, Chapter 322, Florida Statutes, requires the Department see proof of social security number for the issuance of driver license and identification cards) from all customers before a driver license or identification card can be issued.

The name assigned to the social security number must match the name that will appear on the Florida driver license or identification card. If you have recently changed your name, update your records with the Social Security Administration before you apply for your license or identification card.

Each U.S. citizen renewing or applying for a new driver license or identification card in person after January 1, 2010 must submit:


Primary Identification
An Original or Certified of One of the Following Primary Identication Documents

• Certified United States birth certificate, including territories and District of Columbia
• Valid United States Passport or Passport Card
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad
• Certificate of Naturalization, Form N-550 or Form N-570
• Certificate of Citizenship, Form N-560 or Form N-561

Note: When necessary, marriage certificates, court orders, or divorce decrees must be provided to tie the name on the primary identification to the name the customer would like to place on the driver license or identification card.



Proof of Social Security Number

• Social Security Card
• W-2 form
• Pay check
• SSA-1099
• Any 1099

If you Do NOT have a Social Security Number:
If you do not have a social security number, you must bring a letter from the Social Security Administration indicating that you were never issued one. In addition, you will need to present at least one proof of ID from the following list:

• A driver license from the District of Columbia, U.S. Territories, or one of our 50 states.
• School record stating date of birth, which must contain the registrar’s signature.
• Transcript of the birth record filed with a public officer charged with the duty of recording certificates.
• Baptism certificate, which shows date of birth and the place of baptism.
• Family Bible record or birth announcement in a baby book
• An insurance policy on the customer’s life which has been in force for at least two years and has the month, day and year of birth.
• United States military or military dependent identification card.
• An identification card from the District of Columbia, U.S. Territories, or one of our 50 states.
• Florida license record or identification card record.
• Selective Service Registration (Draft Card).
• Florida Vehicle Registration certificate (HSMV 83399, owner’s copy) obtained from the tax collector’s office where the customer’s vehicle was registered, Florida, or out-of-state registration certificate, if name and date of birth are shown.
• Receipt copy of your last Florida driver license issuance.
• Immigration form I-571.
• Federal form DD-214 (military record).
• Marriage certificate.
• Court order, which includes legal name.
• A Florida voter registration card, which was issued at least 3 months previously.
• Parent consent form of minor, signed by the parent or legal guardian
• Government issued out-of-country passport, driver license, or identification card
• Concealed Weapons Permit

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2 Proofs of Residential Address
Gather TWO of the following documents showing your residential address: (internet printouts or faxes of these documents are acceptable)

• Deed, mortgage, monthly mortgage statement, mortgage payment booklet or residential rental/lease agreement
• Florida Voter Registration Card
• Florida Vehicle Registration or Title
• Florida Boat Registration or Title (if living on a boat/houseboat)
• A statement from a parent, step-parent or legal guardian of an applicant. The parent or guardian must reside at the same residence address, accompany the applicant and present "Proof of Residence Address"
• A utility hook up or work order dated within 60 days of the application
• Automobile Payment Booklet
• Selective Service Card
• Medical or health card with address listed
• Current homeowner’s insurance policy or bill
• Current automobile insurance policy or bill
• Educational institution transcript forms for the current school year
• Unexpired professional license issued by a government agency in the U.S.
• W-2 form or 1099 form
• Form DS2019, Certificate of Eligibility for Exchange Visitor (J-1) status
• A letter from a homeless shelter, transitional service provider, or a half-way house verifying that the customer resides at the shelter address
• Utility bills, not more than two months old
• Mail from financial institutions; including checking, savings, or investment account statements, not more than two months old
• Mail from Federal, State, County or City government agencies (including city and county agencies)
• Transients – Sexual Offender/Predator/Career Offender: - FDLE Registration form completed by local sheriff’s department

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Immigrants
Immigrants that apply for a Florida drivers license or ID card must provide the Proof of Social Security Number and 2 Proofs of Residential address desribed above.

As an Immigrant you must provide one original or certified copy of the following Identification documents:

• Valid Alien Registration receipt card, (Green card, Form I-551)
• I-551 stamp in passport or on I-94
• Immigration Judges Order, with the customer's A-number, granting asylum
• I-797, with the customer's A-number, stating the customer has been granted asylum
• I-797 or another form from the Bureau of Citizenship and Immigration Services, with the customer's A-number, stating the customer's application for Refugee status is approved

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Non Immigrants
Non Immigrants that apply for a Florida drivers license or ID card must provide the Proof of Social Security Number and 2 Proofs of Residential address desribed above.

As a Non Immigrant you must provide one original or certified copy of the following Identification documents:

• Employment authorization card issued by the United States Department of Homeland Security (Form I688B or I-766); or
• Proof of nonimmigrant classification provided by United States Department of Homeland Security (Form I-94, not expired, with required supporting attachment(s).

If in doubt regarding required documents, please bring all of your US BCIS documentation with you.). I-94s must be accompanied by a Passport. Certain classifications require additional documentation. Some examples are:
F-1 and M-1 classification must also be accompanied by an I-20.
I J-1 or J-2 designation must be accompanied by an DS2019.
Refugee, asylee and parolee classifications must be accompanied by additional documentation.

• I-571 Travel Document/Refugee Travel Permit**
• I-512 Parole Letter Accepted**
• IJO- Asylum or Cancellation of Removal - Immigration Judges Order granting Asylum or Cancellation of Removal.**

** These documents will only be accepted with a supporting document, including but not limited to a Passport, Florida Driver License or Identification Card, Driver License from any other state, Employment Authorization Card, Employer Identification, Identification from home country, Identification from school or college, Social Security Card (Chapter 322, Florida Statutes, requires the Department to see proof of social security number for the issuance of driver license and identification cards) or other US BCIS document.

Notes:
All required and supporting documents MUST be original or certified.
Documents must be valid for more than 30 days from the date of issuance.
Non-U.S. citizens applying for an original driver license will be issued a 30-day, no photo, paper temporary permit and a receipt. Non-U.S. citizens applying for an identification card will be issued a receipt.
All records are transmitted to our database in Tallahassee, where the information will be examined and run against FDLE, FBI and US BCIS databases.
Upon identity and legal status verification, a driver license or identification card will be issued within 30 days from Tallahassee, mailed to the address on the driver record. The license or identification card will be issued for the period of time specified on the US BCIS document, up to a maximum of one year.
If a problem is detected, a denial of issuance letter will be mailed to the

Once again pick another state and tell the same lie, the more states make the requirements more stringent to combat undocumented aliens from procuring them for such purposes.
Any Mexican can rent a mobile home / apartment / house and have service turned on both gas and electric, but this no more guarantees they have the right to vote in our election process's ..................

 

[Mathbud1]

1) I think that forcing people to produce a picture ID will NOT eliminate voter fraud or even curtail it.

2) It will mostly serve to reduce the amount of voters who would normally vote democrat, thus giving me great pause as to the actual motivations central to this issue.

3) I believe that most dems have taken up this issue because they understand that it is being used as a tool by the right to shrink the dem voter base.

1) why do you think it will not eliminate or curtail voter fraud?

2) why would it mostly serve to reduce the number of voters who would normally vote democrat?

3) see 2.

1) why do you think it will not eliminate or curtail voter fraud?

It's been explained a gazillion billion times in this thread and all of the others on the topic Mat

-Requiring a Gvt Issued Photo Id at the voting place does NOT STOP the fraud that is occurring....I believe I read there was a study that showed out of the last 1 billion recent votes cast, from previous elections, there 8 cases out of that BILLION where people tried to impersonate another person... voter ID does not stop the voter fraud that does occur...this is the LEAST thing that vote thieves would do....so WHY are you all insisting on this?

-One example would be, in Florida, the DMV starting in 1993 no longer was allowed to ask those getting driver's licenses if they were citizens or not... and many other States are just like this.... so the illegals HAVE state issued photo ID cards if they drive, and a number of other State issued Id's since 1993...they could be registered to vote too for all we know?....(but in Florida, those illegals are more than likely Cuban, and Cubans in general, vote with republicans vs the Mexicans with Democratic)

-this is a phony guise, that stops nothing, so why grow government more and lead to the road of us all needing some kind of National Id card to even walk down the street in the future...? (yes that is a conspiracy, but a slippery slope, none the less)

-The way to stop the most voter fraud, would be for the States to vet those applying to vote, those applying to REGISTER to vote and remove the illegals, the dead, the felons if felons can't vote in the State and all other categories of people that are not suppose to vote in each Sate under each State's Laws, AND NEVER APPROVE the person illegally or not allowed to vote in the FIRST PLACE.

The registration process is where it should be stopped. their names should never make the voting roster roll.

Also, we need to relook at the absentee process, to make this safer and less likely for voter fraud as well....though if the State's just did their freaking job, and remove those that they issued death certificates for OFF OF THE VOTER ROSTER, that would be a GOOD START!

a neighbor going to vote in your name or even a stranger going to the voting place to vote in your name is a risk MOST THIEVES would NOT TAKE....the person they are trying to impersonate could have voted already, the person they are trying to impersonate could be in line in front or in back of them, the poll worker could know this person, the poll worker could be related to this person, and on top of all of that, if the impersonator signs the roster in this other person's name it is a FELONY.... thus only 8 cases out of every BILLION VOTES....(over 10 years, nationwide)

2) why would it mostly serve to reduce the number of voters who would normally vote democrat?

Because poor people, tend to not have the money for a car, and don't have driver's licenses, and also seniors who do not drive as well, do not have valid State issued Gvt id's...

As Example:
In Pennsylvania, they determined that there were 250,000 legal registered voters, that did not have a State issued gvt photo id....

There are a whole group of citizens that are registered to vote, that just don't live in the fast lane like we do.... that we can not imagine are out there...but we are WRONG, they are out there, living without State gvt issued ID's and living without checking accounts and living without a lot of things that we see as normal and easy to have....but they are not easy to be had for these people or they just flat out refuse to participate in this materialistic world of ours, think the Alaskan "outback" so to say and even here, we have these citizens living in the Maine Woods...and look at all of the check cashing places around, these are people who do NOT HAVE CHECKING ACCTS....because they had no id to get one....though illegals in our country can get checking accounts with their own country ids...

these people tend to vote democratic...this is why the republican establishment has gone on this rampage of needing a State issued PHOTO ID....

The Republican strategists even so much as SAID SO Matt....

No need to get apoplectic. I was merely asking for clarification.

I have not followed the debate closely thus far.

Myself, I am not convinced yet that voter id will help, or that voter id will hurt. I haven't read anything really convincing about it.

Most people just give anecdotes.

 

[Conservative65]

2) It will mostly serve to reduce the amount of voters who would normally vote democrat, thus giving me great pause as to the actual motivations central to this issue.

To offset that false belief, my State, after passing voter ID laws, identified the approximately 165,000 people within the State that didn't have an ID meeting the new requirements then offered a ride/free ID to them. TWENTY-FIVE (25) took the offer.

What state would that be?

I'll let the source authenticate what I said. DMV 25 residents get free photo ID ride from SC - FOX Carolina 21

 

[Care4all]

1) I think that forcing people to produce a picture ID will NOT eliminate voter fraud or even curtail it.

2) It will mostly serve to reduce the amount of voters who would normally vote democrat, thus giving me great pause as to the actual motivations central to this issue.

3) I believe that most dems have taken up this issue because they understand that it is being used as a tool by the right to shrink the dem voter base.

1) why do you think it will not eliminate or curtail voter fraud?

2) why would it mostly serve to reduce the number of voters who would normally vote democrat?

3) see 2.

1) why do you think it will not eliminate or curtail voter fraud?

It's been explained a gazillion billion times in this thread and all of the others on the topic Mat

-Requiring a Gvt Issued Photo Id at the voting place does NOT STOP the fraud that is occurring....I believe I read there was a study that showed out of the last 1 billion recent votes cast, from previous elections, there 8 cases out of that BILLION where people tried to impersonate another person... voter ID does not stop the voter fraud that does occur...this is the LEAST thing that vote thieves would do....so WHY are you all insisting on this?

-One example would be, in Florida, the DMV starting in 1993 no longer was allowed to ask those getting driver's licenses if they were citizens or not... and many other States are just like this.... so the illegals HAVE state issued photo ID cards if they drive, and a number of other State issued Id's since 1993...they could be registered to vote too for all we know?....(but in Florida, those illegals are more than likely Cuban, and Cubans in general, vote with republicans vs the Mexicans with Democratic)

-this is a phony guise, that stops nothing, so why grow government more and lead to the road of us all needing some kind of National Id card to even walk down the street in the future...? (yes that is a conspiracy, but a slippery slope, none the less)

-The way to stop the most voter fraud, would be for the States to vet those applying to vote, those applying to REGISTER to vote and remove the illegals, the dead, the felons if felons can't vote in the State and all other categories of people that are not suppose to vote in each Sate under each State's Laws, AND NEVER APPROVE the person illegally or not allowed to vote in the FIRST PLACE.

The registration process is where it should be stopped. their names should never make the voting roster roll.

Also, we need to relook at the absentee process, to make this safer and less likely for voter fraud as well....though if the State's just did their freaking job, and remove those that they issued death certificates for OFF OF THE VOTER ROSTER, that would be a GOOD START!

a neighbor going to vote in your name or even a stranger going to the voting place to vote in your name is a risk MOST THIEVES would NOT TAKE....the person they are trying to impersonate could have voted already, the person they are trying to impersonate could be in line in front or in back of them, the poll worker could know this person, the poll worker could be related to this person, and on top of all of that, if the impersonator signs the roster in this other person's name it is a FELONY.... thus only 8 cases out of every BILLION VOTES....(over 10 years, nationwide)

2) why would it mostly serve to reduce the number of voters who would normally vote democrat?

Because poor people, tend to not have the money for a car, and don't have driver's licenses, and also seniors who do not drive as well, do not have valid State issued Gvt id's...

As Example:
In Pennsylvania, they determined that there were 250,000 legal registered voters, that did not have a State issued gvt photo id....

There are a whole group of citizens that are registered to vote, that just don't live in the fast lane like we do.... that we can not imagine are out there...but we are WRONG, they are out there, living without State gvt issued ID's and living without checking accounts and living without a lot of things that we see as normal and easy to have....but they are not easy to be had for these people or they just flat out refuse to participate in this materialistic world of ours, think the Alaskan "outback" so to say and even here, we have these citizens living in the Maine Woods...and look at all of the check cashing places around, these are people who do NOT HAVE CHECKING ACCTS....because they had no id to get one....though illegals in our country can get checking accounts with their own country ids...

these people tend to vote democratic...this is why the republican establishment has gone on this rampage of needing a State issued PHOTO ID....

The Republican strategists even so much as SAID SO Matt....

I am going out on a limb here in saying you don't have a fucking clue about Florida Drivers license requirements ..............
Why do yo folks keep telling these easily debunked lies??

Drivers License Identification Requirements
You are Here: Florida DMV Home » Drivers License Identification Requirements


Identification Requirements
As of Jan 1, 2010 The State of Florida has implemented strict ID Requirements for a New Drivers Licesne or Identication Card.

Renewing Your Florida Drivers License
If you are renewing a current Florida Drivers License you may renew your license online or via mail one time. After you have used these convenience methods once you must visit a Florida DMV office and provide the required ID - see below

New Drivers License or ID
If you are applying for a new Florida Drivers License, ID Card, or have legally changed your name you MUST PROVIDE the DOCUMENTS listed below

Document requirments include: Primary Identification, Proof of Social Security Number, 2 Proofs of Residential Address

First Time Drivers
If you have never had a drivers license before you will be required to complete the DATA course.

Find Your Requirements
US Citizens
Immigrants
Non Immigrants
Canadians

US Citizens
Florida law requires identification, proof of date of birth, proof of residential address, and proof of social security number (if issued, Chapter 322, Florida Statutes, requires the Department see proof of social security number for the issuance of driver license and identification cards) from all customers before a driver license or identification card can be issued.

The name assigned to the social security number must match the name that will appear on the Florida driver license or identification card. If you have recently changed your name, update your records with the Social Security Administration before you apply for your license or identification card.

Each U.S. citizen renewing or applying for a new driver license or identification card in person after January 1, 2010 must submit:


Primary Identification
An Original or Certified of One of the Following Primary Identication Documents

• Certified United States birth certificate, including territories and District of Columbia
• Valid United States Passport or Passport Card
• Consular Report of Birth Abroad
• Certificate of Naturalization, Form N-550 or Form N-570
• Certificate of Citizenship, Form N-560 or Form N-561

Note: When necessary, marriage certificates, court orders, or divorce decrees must be provided to tie the name on the primary identification to the name the customer would like to place on the driver license or identification card.



Proof of Social Security Number

• Social Security Card
• W-2 form
• Pay check
• SSA-1099
• Any 1099

If you Do NOT have a Social Security Number:
If you do not have a social security number, you must bring a letter from the Social Security Administration indicating that you were never issued one. In addition, you will need to present at least one proof of ID from the following list:

• A driver license from the District of Columbia, U.S. Territories, or one of our 50 states.
• School record stating date of birth, which must contain the registrar’s signature.
• Transcript of the birth record filed with a public officer charged with the duty of recording certificates.
• Baptism certificate, which shows date of birth and the place of baptism.
• Family Bible record or birth announcement in a baby book
• An insurance policy on the customer’s life which has been in force for at least two years and has the month, day and year of birth.
• United States military or military dependent identification card.
• An identification card from the District of Columbia, U.S. Territories, or one of our 50 states.
• Florida license record or identification card record.
• Selective Service Registration (Draft Card).
• Florida Vehicle Registration certificate (HSMV 83399, owner’s copy) obtained from the tax collector’s office where the customer’s vehicle was registered, Florida, or out-of-state registration certificate, if name and date of birth are shown.
• Receipt copy of your last Florida driver license issuance.
• Immigration form I-571.
• Federal form DD-214 (military record).
• Marriage certificate.
• Court order, which includes legal name.
• A Florida voter registration card, which was issued at least 3 months previously.
• Parent consent form of minor, signed by the parent or legal guardian
• Government issued out-of-country passport, driver license, or identification card
• Concealed Weapons Permit

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2 Proofs of Residential Address
Gather TWO of the following documents showing your residential address: (internet printouts or faxes of these documents are acceptable)

• Deed, mortgage, monthly mortgage statement, mortgage payment booklet or residential rental/lease agreement
• Florida Voter Registration Card
• Florida Vehicle Registration or Title
• Florida Boat Registration or Title (if living on a boat/houseboat)
• A statement from a parent, step-parent or legal guardian of an applicant. The parent or guardian must reside at the same residence address, accompany the applicant and present "Proof of Residence Address"
• A utility hook up or work order dated within 60 days of the application
• Automobile Payment Booklet
• Selective Service Card
• Medical or health card with address listed
• Current homeowner’s insurance policy or bill
• Current automobile insurance policy or bill
• Educational institution transcript forms for the current school year
• Unexpired professional license issued by a government agency in the U.S.
• W-2 form or 1099 form
• Form DS2019, Certificate of Eligibility for Exchange Visitor (J-1) status
• A letter from a homeless shelter, transitional service provider, or a half-way house verifying that the customer resides at the shelter address
• Utility bills, not more than two months old
• Mail from financial institutions; including checking, savings, or investment account statements, not more than two months old
• Mail from Federal, State, County or City government agencies (including city and county agencies)
• Transients – Sexual Offender/Predator/Career Offender: - FDLE Registration form completed by local sheriff’s department

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Immigrants
Immigrants that apply for a Florida drivers license or ID card must provide the Proof of Social Security Number and 2 Proofs of Residential address desribed above.

As an Immigrant you must provide one original or certified copy of the following Identification documents:

• Valid Alien Registration receipt card, (Green card, Form I-551)
• I-551 stamp in passport or on I-94
• Immigration Judges Order, with the customer's A-number, granting asylum
• I-797, with the customer's A-number, stating the customer has been granted asylum
• I-797 or another form from the Bureau of Citizenship and Immigration Services, with the customer's A-number, stating the customer's application for Refugee status is approved

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Non Immigrants
Non Immigrants that apply for a Florida drivers license or ID card must provide the Proof of Social Security Number and 2 Proofs of Residential address desribed above.

As a Non Immigrant you must provide one original or certified copy of the following Identification documents:

• Employment authorization card issued by the United States Department of Homeland Security (Form I688B or I-766); or
• Proof of nonimmigrant classification provided by United States Department of Homeland Security (Form I-94, not expired, with required supporting attachment(s).

If in doubt regarding required documents, please bring all of your US BCIS documentation with you.). I-94s must be accompanied by a Passport. Certain classifications require additional documentation. Some examples are:
F-1 and M-1 classification must also be accompanied by an I-20.
I J-1 or J-2 designation must be accompanied by an DS2019.
Refugee, asylee and parolee classifications must be accompanied by additional documentation.

• I-571 Travel Document/Refugee Travel Permit**
• I-512 Parole Letter Accepted**
• IJO- Asylum or Cancellation of Removal - Immigration Judges Order granting Asylum or Cancellation of Removal.**

** These documents will only be accepted with a supporting document, including but not limited to a Passport, Florida Driver License or Identification Card, Driver License from any other state, Employment Authorization Card, Employer Identification, Identification from home country, Identification from school or college, Social Security Card (Chapter 322, Florida Statutes, requires the Department to see proof of social security number for the issuance of driver license and identification cards) or other US BCIS document.

Notes:
All required and supporting documents MUST be original or certified.
Documents must be valid for more than 30 days from the date of issuance.
Non-U.S. citizens applying for an original driver license will be issued a 30-day, no photo, paper temporary permit and a receipt. Non-U.S. citizens applying for an identification card will be issued a receipt.
All records are transmitted to our database in Tallahassee, where the information will be examined and run against FDLE, FBI and US BCIS databases.
Upon identity and legal status verification, a driver license or identification card will be issued within 30 days from Tallahassee, mailed to the address on the driver record. The license or identification card will be issued for the period of time specified on the US BCIS document, up to a maximum of one year.
If a problem is detected, a denial of issuance letter will be mailed to the

Once again pick another state and tell the same lie, the more states make the requirements more stringent to combat undocumented aliens from procuring them for such purposes.
Any Mexican can rent a mobile home / apartment / house and have service turned on both gas and electric, but this no more guarantees they have the right to vote in our election process's ..................

they require it NOW, or since 2010, but they did not require proof of citizenship from 1993 until the law changed and in that time period, these people were more than likely able to get other forms of legal ID's with their Driver's Licenses.

I lived in Florida for 17 years,both east coast and west coast, south and central... my husband is a born and bread Floridian and my parents and my sister and all of my husband's family, still live there....granted, I haven't lived there for well over a decade...but it still interests me and I try to follow what is going on there.

 

[DrDoomNGloom]

they require it NOW, or since 2010, but they did not require proof of citizenship from 1993 until the law changed and in that time period, these people were more than likely able to get other forms of legal ID's with their Driver's Licenses.

I lived in Florida for 17 years,both east coast and west coast, south and central... my husband is a born and bread Floridian and my parents and my sister and all of my husband's family, still live there....granted, I haven't lived there for well over a decade...but it still interests me and I try to follow what is going on there.

It was easy enough to Google, but you had a talking point and wanted to make use of it ....................
Times are changing, as we observe the current stance or lack of stance against undocumented immigrants from the federal government, states do more and more to intervene in the best interest of their constituents. There are many places in America against the flow or undocumented immigrants and their perceived influence in the current status quote .....................

Just as I commented earlier, it has been common practice for immigrant workers to group up 10 or 20 to a mobile home, most have the same Sir name and therefore producing utility bills is easy, but by no means guarantees the owner has the legal right to vote.

This is what these threads have consisted of, the express need to positively Identify an individual and be able to determine whether the said individual has the right to vote in said election.

 

[Care4all]

they require it NOW, or since 2010, but they did not require proof of citizenship from 1993 until the law changed and in that time period, these people were more than likely able to get other forms of legal ID's with their Driver's Licenses.

I lived in Florida for 17 years,both east coast and west coast, south and central... my husband is a born and bread Floridian and my parents and my sister and all of my husband's family, still live there....granted, I haven't lived there for well over a decade...but it still interests me and I try to follow what is going on there.

It was easy enough to Google, but you had a talking point and wanted to make use of it ....................
Times are changing, as we observe the current stance or lack of stance against undocumented immigrants from the federal government, states do more and more to intervene in the best interest of their constituents. There are many places in America against the flow or undocumented immigrants and their perceived influence in the current status quote .....................

Just as I commented earlier, it has been common practice for immigrant workers to group up 10 or 20 to a mobile home, most have the same Sir name and therefore producing utility bills is easy, but by no means guarantees the owner has the legal right to vote.

This is what these threads have consisted of, the express need to positively Identify an individual and be able to determine whether the said individual has the right to vote in said election.

And my suggestion is that all of this vetting takes place during the registration process and the State vets applicants before they ever make it on to the voter roll roster at the voting booths....

IF Florida now has a means through their driver's license system since 2010, or any system, to identify those who are illegal and on the voter rolls, then for goodness sakes, remove/purge these illegals from the voter roll! WHY haven't they?

 

[DrDoomNGloom]

they require it NOW, or since 2010, but they did not require proof of citizenship from 1993 until the law changed and in that time period, these people were more than likely able to get other forms of legal ID's with their Driver's Licenses.

I lived in Florida for 17 years,both east coast and west coast, south and central... my husband is a born and bread Floridian and my parents and my sister and all of my husband's family, still live there....granted, I haven't lived there for well over a decade...but it still interests me and I try to follow what is going on there.

It was easy enough to Google, but you had a talking point and wanted to make use of it ....................
Times are changing, as we observe the current stance or lack of stance against undocumented immigrants from the federal government, states do more and more to intervene in the best interest of their constituents. There are many places in America against the flow or undocumented immigrants and their perceived influence in the current status quote .....................

Just as I commented earlier, it has been common practice for immigrant workers to group up 10 or 20 to a mobile home, most have the same Sir name and therefore producing utility bills is easy, but by no means guarantees the owner has the legal right to vote.

This is what these threads have consisted of, the express need to positively Identify an individual and be able to determine whether the said individual has the right to vote in said election.

And my suggestion is that all of this vetting takes place during the registration process and the State vets applicants before they ever make it on to the voter roll roster at the voting booths....

IF Florida now has a means through their driver's license system since 2010, or any system, to identify those who are illegal and on the voter rolls, then for goodness sakes, remove/purge these illegals from the voter roll! WHY haven't they?

Ok, now that you are vetted we need just to make sure it is you when you come to vote, of course unless during all this vetting you are going to vote once cleared.
I mean you had to prove who you were and that you had the appropriate clearance to vote(if an immigrant), so now we have a roll of voters who have been vetted, how do we know when you show up, that your name is on the list?? Are we just supposed to take your word?? Will that work for an airline or the bank??
We proved who we were when bought the tickets, so will TSA just let us board sans ID??
We opened our bank account with proper ID, can anyone now claim to be me and make a with drawl from that bank without showing proper ID??
Even if I have the proper account numbers and name and address, you don't think I will have to show ID??

I rented a car over the intardnet, when I show up at Avis will they let me have it just by stating who I am??
Can you not continue on with the common sense into the voting process??

 

[DrDoomNGloom]

Most of the 3rd world countries dip a finger of voters who have cast ballots already in ink, indelible ink, you only get one vote and then the blue / black digit precludes you from voting again ............... this is a bit low tech, but would insure only one vote is cast per person, could we at least agree on some rudimentary fraud protection in our voting process??

Just to make sure we are on the same page, we are talking Frog protection, right ??

 

[M14 Shooter]

they require it NOW, or since 2010, but they did not require proof of citizenship from 1993 until the law changed and in that time period, these people were more than likely able to get other forms of legal ID's with their Driver's Licenses.

I lived in Florida for 17 years,both east coast and west coast, south and central... my husband is a born and bread Floridian and my parents and my sister and all of my husband's family, still live there....granted, I haven't lived there for well over a decade...but it still interests me and I try to follow what is going on there.

It was easy enough to Google, but you had a talking point and wanted to make use of it ....................
Times are changing, as we observe the current stance or lack of stance against undocumented immigrants from the federal government, states do more and more to intervene in the best interest of their constituents. There are many places in America against the flow or undocumented immigrants and their perceived influence in the current status quote .....................

Just as I commented earlier, it has been common practice for immigrant workers to group up 10 or 20 to a mobile home, most have the same Sir name and therefore producing utility bills is easy, but by no means guarantees the owner has the legal right to vote.

This is what these threads have consisted of, the express need to positively Identify an individual and be able to determine whether the said individual has the right to vote in said election.

And my suggestion is that all of this vetting takes place during the registration process and the State vets applicants before they ever make it on to the voter roll roster at the voting booths....

None of which matters w/ positive ID at the poll.