Why do people claim the military "risks their lives" to "protect our freedoms"?

[Sonny Clark]

Not only is your ignorance stunning you are apparently determined to remain stupid.

Explain the dynamics of the steps another country would have to go through to strip us of our freedom

Then we can discuss who is stupid

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

 

[rdean]

The vast majority of military members go their entire careers without seeing combat. The rise of drone warfare means an increasing number of those who do are still risking not much more than a tax payer bought robot. None of our recent wars actually had anything to do with defending the United States or its citizens' freedom. Afghanistan was supposedly about finding bin Ladin. Iraq was about kicking Saddam out of power to find his non-existent chemical weapons and a few billion tons worth of oil for Bush's butt buddies. The newest Iraq war will be to try to fix the problem of the massive army of genocidal conservative crazies our most recent fuck up there created.

Wouldn't it be more accurate to thank our troops for the sacrifice of six years they could have spent going to college to go out and risk occasional inconvenience for our national oiligarchs' bank accounts?

Afghanistan was just a place to bomb. Republicans even let Bin Laden go.
Iraq was about making oil money and making lots of money for Cheney and Bush's friends.

And being in the military is very dangerous. They practice with live grenades and live ammo. When I was in the service from 1975 to 1979, there were a couple of deaths and a number of serious injuries. An entire tank crew was killed when something exploded. I never did learn the details. One guy was seriously injured when a 5 ton rolled over. People sometimes get shot. Remember, you have a lot of people who have never fired a weapon before who are learning how for the first time and the military doesn't coddle you. At the time, the cold war was still going on and the Unit I was in trained two months out of the year in Grafenwoehr along the border with live rounds and bombs being used on both sides. Of course, Grafenwoehr wasn't our only training.

 

[rightwinger]

Not only is your ignorance stunning you are apparently determined to remain stupid.

Explain the dynamics of the steps another country would have to go through to strip us of our freedom

Then we can discuss who is stupid

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

Hold on a minute.....
Let me pull out my Bill of Rights

Says here......freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom of the press, right to assemble

I don't see where any of those have been jeopardized by modern wars

 

[PratchettFan]

Not only is your ignorance stunning you are apparently determined to remain stupid.

Explain the dynamics of the steps another country would have to go through to strip us of our freedom

Then we can discuss who is stupid

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

Well, for one thing you can ask that question without being afraid someone is going to come to your house tonight and take you away.

 

[Sonny Clark]

Not only is your ignorance stunning you are apparently determined to remain stupid.

Explain the dynamics of the steps another country would have to go through to strip us of our freedom

Then we can discuss who is stupid

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

Well, for one thing you can ask that question without being afraid someone is going to come to your house tonight and take you away.

There's absolutely no guarantee of that. And, that has absolutely nothing to do with freedom. Someone could very well kidnap me today, tonight, tomorrow, or in the future. Also, I could be arrested and thrown into jail today for absolutely no reason. I could be accused of something that I didn't do, and spend the rest of my life in prison. I could be traveling, stopped, and asked for papers to prove I'm a citizen. I could be detained at an airport based on my looks alone. We have many citizens in our jails and prisons that are as innocent as you and I are. We don't have the freedom to communicate without our communications being monitored. We don't have the freedom to fly the American flag in certain communities. So, again, exactly what freedoms do we have in America?

 

[rightwinger]

Not only is your ignorance stunning you are apparently determined to remain stupid.

Explain the dynamics of the steps another country would have to go through to strip us of our freedom

Then we can discuss who is stupid

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

Well, for one thing you can ask that question without being afraid someone is going to come to your house tonight and take you away.

There's absolutely no guarantee of that. And, that has absolutely nothing to do with freedom. Someone could very well kidnap me today, tonight, tomorrow, or in the future. Also, I could be arrested and thrown into jail today for absolutely no reason. I could be accused of something that I didn't do, and spend the rest of my life in prison. I could be traveling, stopped, and asked for papers to prove I'm a citizen. I could be detained at an airport based on my looks alone. We have many citizens in our jails and prisons that are as innocent as you and I are. We don't have the freedom to communicate without our communications being monitored. We don't have the freedom to fly the American flag in certain communities. So, again, exactly what freedoms do we have in America?

Yes you as a citizen can be arrested for no reason. But you have individual rights once you are arrested.....you have a right to remain silent, right to an attorney, right to see the evidence against you, right to trial by a jury of your peers

Those are your freedoms

 

[Sonny Clark]

Not only is your ignorance stunning you are apparently determined to remain stupid.

Explain the dynamics of the steps another country would have to go through to strip us of our freedom

Then we can discuss who is stupid

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

Hold on a minute.....
Let me pull out my Bill of Rights

Says here......freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom of the press, right to assemble

I don't see where any of those have been jeopardized by modern wars

No, but they have been modified, some taken away, and others that depend on the mood of law enforcement personnel. The right to privacy is a joke. Freedom of the press depends on what one says, and in what context. Freedom of speech depends on who you're speaking to or about, and whether it can be considered as a threat or terroristic act. The right to assemble depends on how many assemble, location, time of day, and in some cases, a permit is required.

 

[Sonny Clark]

Not only is your ignorance stunning you are apparently determined to remain stupid.

Explain the dynamics of the steps another country would have to go through to strip us of our freedom

Then we can discuss who is stupid

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

Well, for one thing you can ask that question without being afraid someone is going to come to your house tonight and take you away.

There's absolutely no guarantee of that. And, that has absolutely nothing to do with freedom. Someone could very well kidnap me today, tonight, tomorrow, or in the future. Also, I could be arrested and thrown into jail today for absolutely no reason. I could be accused of something that I didn't do, and spend the rest of my life in prison. I could be traveling, stopped, and asked for papers to prove I'm a citizen. I could be detained at an airport based on my looks alone. We have many citizens in our jails and prisons that are as innocent as you and I are. We don't have the freedom to communicate without our communications being monitored. We don't have the freedom to fly the American flag in certain communities. So, again, exactly what freedoms do we have in America?

Yes you as a citizen can be arrested for no reason. But you have individual rights once you are arrested.....you have a right to remain silent, right to an attorney, right to see the evidence against you, right to trial by a jury of your peers

Those are your freedoms

Those are things that can happen after your freedom has been taken away. The point is that by being arrested and detained, and being innocent of any crime, your freedom has been taken away. This happens every single day somewhere in America. Freedom means innocent until proven guilty, and not being arrested and/or jailed until you have been proven to be guilty of wrong-doing.

 

[rightwinger]

Explain the dynamics of the steps another country would have to go through to strip us of our freedom

Then we can discuss who is stupid

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

Well, for one thing you can ask that question without being afraid someone is going to come to your house tonight and take you away.

There's absolutely no guarantee of that. And, that has absolutely nothing to do with freedom. Someone could very well kidnap me today, tonight, tomorrow, or in the future. Also, I could be arrested and thrown into jail today for absolutely no reason. I could be accused of something that I didn't do, and spend the rest of my life in prison. I could be traveling, stopped, and asked for papers to prove I'm a citizen. I could be detained at an airport based on my looks alone. We have many citizens in our jails and prisons that are as innocent as you and I are. We don't have the freedom to communicate without our communications being monitored. We don't have the freedom to fly the American flag in certain communities. So, again, exactly what freedoms do we have in America?

Yes you as a citizen can be arrested for no reason. But you have individual rights once you are arrested.....you have a right to remain silent, right to an attorney, right to see the evidence against you, right to trial by a jury of your peers

Those are your freedoms

Those are things that can happen after your freedom has been taken away. The point is that by being arrested and detained, and being innocent of any crime, your freedom has been taken away. This happens every single day somewhere in America. Freedom means innocent until proven guilty, and not being arrested and/or jailed until you have been proven to be guilty of wrong-doing.

Sorry...not getting into a silly argument with an anarchist

 

[Sonny Clark]

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

Well, for one thing you can ask that question without being afraid someone is going to come to your house tonight and take you away.

There's absolutely no guarantee of that. And, that has absolutely nothing to do with freedom. Someone could very well kidnap me today, tonight, tomorrow, or in the future. Also, I could be arrested and thrown into jail today for absolutely no reason. I could be accused of something that I didn't do, and spend the rest of my life in prison. I could be traveling, stopped, and asked for papers to prove I'm a citizen. I could be detained at an airport based on my looks alone. We have many citizens in our jails and prisons that are as innocent as you and I are. We don't have the freedom to communicate without our communications being monitored. We don't have the freedom to fly the American flag in certain communities. So, again, exactly what freedoms do we have in America?

Yes you as a citizen can be arrested for no reason. But you have individual rights once you are arrested.....you have a right to remain silent, right to an attorney, right to see the evidence against you, right to trial by a jury of your peers

Those are your freedoms

Those are things that can happen after your freedom has been taken away. The point is that by being arrested and detained, and being innocent of any crime, your freedom has been taken away. This happens every single day somewhere in America. Freedom means innocent until proven guilty, and not being arrested and/or jailed until you have been proven to be guilty of wrong-doing.

Sorry...not getting into a silly argument with an anarchist

No problem. I didn't see it as an argument, I saw it as a discussion. And, I'm no anarchist. But, we'll leave it at that since you would rather not discuss whether or not we have freedom in America. Thanks.

 

[jasonnfree]

Everyone who enlists into military service implicitly agrees to serve in combat. You go where you are told to go and do what you are told to do. It is possible to enlist for an MOS (or branch of the service) that makes you extremely unlikely to see combat, but there are no guarantees. I saw many personnel clerks, supply clerks, and cooks doing guard duty overnight in Vietnam, where the dangers were analogous to what combat soldiers saw.

The U.S. is not just a country like Latvia that can focus all of its "defense" energies on fighting territorial threats on its own borders. We are a global force for peace and security, and have signed numerous treaties that oblige us to protect and defend the people of scores of nations if and when they are threatened by outside governments. Thus, our military people and assets can be called upon to defend the people of any number of countries from threats, both internal and external, as required by these treaties and constitutionally by our Congress and/or President. And YOU, PERSONALLY are responsible for these military obligations and undertakings because YOU, PERSONALLY either voted for the political office-holders, or you are obliged by law to live by their decisions under our democratic republican principles of governance.

Anyone signing up for military service is presumed to be aware of these realities.

Like it or not, EVERY U.S. legal resident is subject to conscription into the military service. The Federal Government has elected to staff our armed forces with volunteers, but this is merely a temporary policy choice that could be reversed on a moment's notice through action by Congress and the President. If the number of volunteers is ever insufficient to accomplish the missions we have undertaken, or if we are invaded by overwhelming military forces, you can be certain that the military draft will be re-instituted, and you can also rest assured that such an action is entirely legal and Constitutional. YOU could be obliged to serve, against your will, or be incarcerated for not doing so.

So it is not completely fatuous to understand that because there are enough people who voluntarily enter military service, YOU, PERSONALLY, are off the hook for that service. Otherwise, you, personally, would be subject to the military draft. And this applies whether you are male, female, "Black," Hispanic, or homo-fucking-sexual.

So it is entirely appropriate for you to thank soldiers and sailors whom you encounter for their service, you pathetic ingrate.

There's much truth in what you say. America protects the world. South Korea would probably be under North Korea rule by now if not for USA. Other countries helped also but USA did the majority of the work during the Korean conflict. As for as the draft though, only males of a certain age are required to register. I've asked around and the average kid doesn't know he's breaking the law by not registering. Most aren't even aware of the law.

 

[jasonnfree]

Well, for one thing you can ask that question without being afraid someone is going to come to your house tonight and take you away.

There's absolutely no guarantee of that. And, that has absolutely nothing to do with freedom. Someone could very well kidnap me today, tonight, tomorrow, or in the future. Also, I could be arrested and thrown into jail today for absolutely no reason. I could be accused of something that I didn't do, and spend the rest of my life in prison. I could be traveling, stopped, and asked for papers to prove I'm a citizen. I could be detained at an airport based on my looks alone. We have many citizens in our jails and prisons that are as innocent as you and I are. We don't have the freedom to communicate without our communications being monitored. We don't have the freedom to fly the American flag in certain communities. So, again, exactly what freedoms do we have in America?

Yes you as a citizen can be arrested for no reason. But you have individual rights once you are arrested.....you have a right to remain silent, right to an attorney, right to see the evidence against you, right to trial by a jury of your peers

Those are your freedoms

Those are things that can happen after your freedom has been taken away. The point is that by being arrested and detained, and being innocent of any crime, your freedom has been taken away. This happens every single day somewhere in America. Freedom means innocent until proven guilty, and not being arrested and/or jailed until you have been proven to be guilty of wrong-doing.

Sorry...not getting into a silly argument with an anarchist

No problem. I didn't see it as an argument, I saw it as a discussion. And, I'm no anarchist. But, we'll leave it at that since you would rather not discuss whether or not we have freedom in America. Thanks.

Well, you're still allowed to do negative posts about USA, so it's not all that bad here.

 

[9thIDdoc]

You have the right to remain ignorant of your freedoms and just how good you have it. You have the right to elect representatives who agree with your ideas of what rights you should have no matter how idiotic they are. We have built a system designed to assure fair and equal rights. If the system is not perfect or if it does not operate perfectly it is your responsibility to fix it. Sitting around whining about it just makes you look like a spoiled child.

 

[PratchettFan]

Not only is your ignorance stunning you are apparently determined to remain stupid.

Explain the dynamics of the steps another country would have to go through to strip us of our freedom

Then we can discuss who is stupid

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

Well, for one thing you can ask that question without being afraid someone is going to come to your house tonight and take you away.

There's absolutely no guarantee of that. And, that has absolutely nothing to do with freedom. Someone could very well kidnap me today, tonight, tomorrow, or in the future. Also, I could be arrested and thrown into jail today for absolutely no reason. I could be accused of something that I didn't do, and spend the rest of my life in prison. I could be traveling, stopped, and asked for papers to prove I'm a citizen. I could be detained at an airport based on my looks alone. We have many citizens in our jails and prisons that are as innocent as you and I are. We don't have the freedom to communicate without our communications being monitored. We don't have the freedom to fly the American flag in certain communities. So, again, exactly what freedoms do we have in America?

And yet here you are, posting without any concern that would happen. It always amazes me how spoiled people are.

 

[9thIDdoc]

as the draft though, only males of a certain age are required to register. I've asked around and the average kid doesn't know he's breaking the law by not registering. Most aren't even aware of the law.

Best remember that that is subject to change at discretion of the government. The system was changed before I got my draft notice.

 

[Sonny Clark]

Not only is your ignorance stunning you are apparently determined to remain stupid.

Explain the dynamics of the steps another country would have to go through to strip us of our freedom

Then we can discuss who is stupid

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

Well, for one thing you can ask that question without being afraid someone is going to come to your house tonight and take you away.

There's absolutely no guarantee of that. And, that has absolutely nothing to do with freedom. Someone could very well kidnap me today, tonight, tomorrow, or in the future. Also, I could be arrested and thrown into jail today for absolutely no reason. I could be accused of something that I didn't do, and spend the rest of my life in prison. I could be traveling, stopped, and asked for papers to prove I'm a citizen. I could be detained at an airport based on my looks alone. We have many citizens in our jails and prisons that are as innocent as you and I are. We don't have the freedom to communicate without our communications being monitored. We don't have the freedom to fly the American flag in certain communities. So, again, exactly what freedoms do we have in America?

And yet here you are, posting without any concern that would happen. It always amazes me how spoiled people are.

It's all by chance and luck. Some are fortunate and lucky, and others aren't.

 

[PratchettFan]

Explain the dynamics of the steps another country would have to go through to strip us of our freedom

Then we can discuss who is stupid

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

Well, for one thing you can ask that question without being afraid someone is going to come to your house tonight and take you away.

There's absolutely no guarantee of that. And, that has absolutely nothing to do with freedom. Someone could very well kidnap me today, tonight, tomorrow, or in the future. Also, I could be arrested and thrown into jail today for absolutely no reason. I could be accused of something that I didn't do, and spend the rest of my life in prison. I could be traveling, stopped, and asked for papers to prove I'm a citizen. I could be detained at an airport based on my looks alone. We have many citizens in our jails and prisons that are as innocent as you and I are. We don't have the freedom to communicate without our communications being monitored. We don't have the freedom to fly the American flag in certain communities. So, again, exactly what freedoms do we have in America?

And yet here you are, posting without any concern that would happen. It always amazes me how spoiled people are.

It's all by chance and luck. Some are fortunate and lucky, and others aren't.

Right. You are so used to freedom you don't even realize it is there. I guess that is what happens when something is just handed to you. You never learn to value it.

 

[Sonny Clark]

Please explain what freedoms we have in America. Thanks in advance.

Well, for one thing you can ask that question without being afraid someone is going to come to your house tonight and take you away.

There's absolutely no guarantee of that. And, that has absolutely nothing to do with freedom. Someone could very well kidnap me today, tonight, tomorrow, or in the future. Also, I could be arrested and thrown into jail today for absolutely no reason. I could be accused of something that I didn't do, and spend the rest of my life in prison. I could be traveling, stopped, and asked for papers to prove I'm a citizen. I could be detained at an airport based on my looks alone. We have many citizens in our jails and prisons that are as innocent as you and I are. We don't have the freedom to communicate without our communications being monitored. We don't have the freedom to fly the American flag in certain communities. So, again, exactly what freedoms do we have in America?

And yet here you are, posting without any concern that would happen. It always amazes me how spoiled people are.

It's all by chance and luck. Some are fortunate and lucky, and others aren't.

Right. You are so used to freedom you don't even realize it is there. I guess that is what happens when something is just handed to you. You never learn to value it.

Well, it's not "there", and I'm not use to anything close to it. Also, nothing has been handed to me. I've paid my dues, for many years. Oh, I value freedom, and fully understand what it is and what it means. The difference is, that I see and face reality instead of living in a fairy tale world, and accustom to how I'd like for it to be, as opposed to how it actually is. What dues have you paid?

 

[MikeK]

[...]
I'd like to see a 2 year mandatory duty so this kind of stupidity wouldn't be floating around.

In other words you like to see the Draft activated. So would I.

If the Draft were still active you may rest assured Bush could not have gotten away with invading Iraq.

 

[Sonny Clark]

You have the right to remain ignorant of your freedoms and just how good you have it. You have the right to elect representatives who agree with your ideas of what rights you should have no matter how idiotic they are. We have built a system designed to assure fair and equal rights. If the system is not perfect or if it does not operate perfectly it is your responsibility to fix it. Sitting around whining about it just makes you look like a spoiled child.

FYI - There are no "fair and equal rights". Everyone does not receive the same rights, justice, nor freedoms. Pay close attention to what goes on in this country and you'll quickly see the injustices, lost rights, and freedom taken away. Do you call placing innocent citizens in our jails and prison freedom? Do you call different levels of punishment that depends on your wealth, connections, and the number of lawyers one can hire, justice? Do you call the absence of privacy "the right to privacy" as guaranteed by the Constitution? What don't you see taking place on a daily basis in this country? Don't you follow the news and read the many stories concerning lost freedom, lost rights, and the shameful injustices in out corrupt judicial system? FYI - Bringing important issues before the public is in no way whining. It is our duty as citizens to keep each other informed. Had you rather everyone remain silent and living in a comfy bubble where the truth is never spoken or discussed? Also, electing representatives, given the choices, is hardly going to make a difference. Do you know what a professional politician is? Do you know what they do? Do you know that once elected to office, they exert their will, and not the will of the people?