Why do people claim the military "risks their lives" to "protect our freedoms"?

[rightwinger]

Saddam was a nasty prick who terrorized his own people
By 2003, he had been contained to the point he was no threat to anyone outside of his own borders.
Hardly a justification for war. But Bush had to trump up claims that he was still actively producing WMDs, was a threat to develop a NUCLEAR BOMB and was going to give them to TERRORISTS

Iraq had to be attacked immediately.......before it was too late

The safety of all Americans depended on it

Did you read the links? Obviously not. There WAS evidence of WMD found in Iraq.

Oh please...save us the revisionist history

Where were the WMDs that justified......we don't want a smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud
Where is the evidence of an ongoing WMD program
Where is the evidence Saddam wanted to give WMDs to terrorists?

Bush lied

Some of Saddam's own top generals believed he had them.

Where was the threat?
Who the hell was Saddam going to use them on?

We invaded him TWICE and they were nowhere to be seen

But they did find some. Not some massive production or anything, but old stock piles, which proves that Saddam had never gotten rid of his laboratories, etc., so the intel wasn't completely false. Also, like I already stated, this illusion was intentionally created by Saddam Hussein. He wanted everyone to believe he had WMDs or had the capabilities to obtain them at least.

Imagine That Wikileaks Docs Show There Were WMDs in Iraq

Several hundred chemical weapons were found, and Saddam had all his WMD scientists and technicians ready. Just end the sanctions and add money, and the weapons would be back in production within a year. At the time of the invasion, all intelligence agencies, world-wide, believed Saddam still had a functioning WMD program. Saddam had shut them down because of the cost, but created the illusion that the program was still operating in order to fool the Iranians. - See more at: Imagine That Wikileaks Docs Show There Were WMDs in Iraq

Ancient chemical weapons that were well past their prime

Hardly the mushroom cloud Bush was predicting

 

[ChrisL]

so the intel wasn't completely false.

Do you not see how laughable that defence is?

I'm just relaying the facts.

 

[ChrisL]

Did you read the links? Obviously not. There WAS evidence of WMD found in Iraq.

Oh please...save us the revisionist history

Where were the WMDs that justified......we don't want a smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud
Where is the evidence of an ongoing WMD program
Where is the evidence Saddam wanted to give WMDs to terrorists?

Bush lied

Some of Saddam's own top generals believed he had them.

Where was the threat?
Who the hell was Saddam going to use them on?

We invaded him TWICE and they were nowhere to be seen

But they did find some. Not some massive production or anything, but old stock piles, which proves that Saddam had never gotten rid of his laboratories, etc., so the intel wasn't completely false. Also, like I already stated, this illusion was intentionally created by Saddam Hussein. He wanted everyone to believe he had WMDs or had the capabilities to obtain them at least.

Imagine That Wikileaks Docs Show There Were WMDs in Iraq

Several hundred chemical weapons were found, and Saddam had all his WMD scientists and technicians ready. Just end the sanctions and add money, and the weapons would be back in production within a year. At the time of the invasion, all intelligence agencies, world-wide, believed Saddam still had a functioning WMD program. Saddam had shut them down because of the cost, but created the illusion that the program was still operating in order to fool the Iranians. - See more at: Imagine That Wikileaks Docs Show There Were WMDs in Iraq

Ancient chemical weapons that were well past their prime

Hardly the mushroom cloud Bush was predicting

But Saddam did and said things to make even his own generals believe that he had them.

And NOBODY can predict the future.

 

[rightwinger]

Oh please...save us the revisionist history

Where were the WMDs that justified......we don't want a smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud
Where is the evidence of an ongoing WMD program
Where is the evidence Saddam wanted to give WMDs to terrorists?

Bush lied

Some of Saddam's own top generals believed he had them.

Where was the threat?
Who the hell was Saddam going to use them on?

We invaded him TWICE and they were nowhere to be seen

But they did find some. Not some massive production or anything, but old stock piles, which proves that Saddam had never gotten rid of his laboratories, etc., so the intel wasn't completely false. Also, like I already stated, this illusion was intentionally created by Saddam Hussein. He wanted everyone to believe he had WMDs or had the capabilities to obtain them at least.

Imagine That Wikileaks Docs Show There Were WMDs in Iraq

Several hundred chemical weapons were found, and Saddam had all his WMD scientists and technicians ready. Just end the sanctions and add money, and the weapons would be back in production within a year. At the time of the invasion, all intelligence agencies, world-wide, believed Saddam still had a functioning WMD program. Saddam had shut them down because of the cost, but created the illusion that the program was still operating in order to fool the Iranians. - See more at: Imagine That Wikileaks Docs Show There Were WMDs in Iraq

Ancient chemical weapons that were well past their prime

Hardly the mushroom cloud Bush was predicting

But Saddam did and said things to make even his own generals believe that he had them.

And NOBODY can predict the future.

Saddam was no more of a threat in 2003 than he was in 1993

 

[cnm]

I'm just relaying the facts.

Which are laughable.

 

[ChrisL]

I'm just relaying the facts.

Which are laughable.

So you prefer non-facts and opinions to the facts? Now THAT is laughable.

 

[ChrisL]

Some of Saddam's own top generals believed he had them.

Where was the threat?
Who the hell was Saddam going to use them on?

We invaded him TWICE and they were nowhere to be seen

But they did find some. Not some massive production or anything, but old stock piles, which proves that Saddam had never gotten rid of his laboratories, etc., so the intel wasn't completely false. Also, like I already stated, this illusion was intentionally created by Saddam Hussein. He wanted everyone to believe he had WMDs or had the capabilities to obtain them at least.

Imagine That Wikileaks Docs Show There Were WMDs in Iraq

Several hundred chemical weapons were found, and Saddam had all his WMD scientists and technicians ready. Just end the sanctions and add money, and the weapons would be back in production within a year. At the time of the invasion, all intelligence agencies, world-wide, believed Saddam still had a functioning WMD program. Saddam had shut them down because of the cost, but created the illusion that the program was still operating in order to fool the Iranians. - See more at: Imagine That Wikileaks Docs Show There Were WMDs in Iraq

Ancient chemical weapons that were well past their prime

Hardly the mushroom cloud Bush was predicting

But Saddam did and said things to make even his own generals believe that he had them.

And NOBODY can predict the future.

Saddam was no more of a threat in 2003 than he was in 1993

Oh jeez, it must have slipped my mind how you are privy to ALL government secrets and intelligence data. Lol. YOU must know better than military advisers who are employed by the government, etc.

 

[cnm]

So you prefer non-facts and opinions to the facts? Now THAT is laughable.

No. I like laughing at the US public which sucked up the story of significant WMD when the US government's own statements gave it the lie.

 

[TheGreatGatsby]

The vast majority of military members go their entire careers without seeing combat. The rise of drone warfare means an increasing number of those who do are still risking not much more than a tax payer bought robot. None of our recent wars actually had anything to do with defending the United States or its citizens' freedom. Afghanistan was supposedly about finding bin Ladin. Iraq was about kicking Saddam out of power to find his non-existent chemical weapons and a few billion tons worth of oil for Bush's butt buddies. The newest Iraq war will be to try to fix the problem of the massive army of genocidal conservative crazies our most recent fuck up there created.

Wouldn't it be more accurate to thank our troops for the sacrifice of six years they could have spent going to college to go out and risk occasional inconvenience for our national oiligarchs' bank accounts?

I think you have an agenda. If you want to debate the real value of the military, then you shouldn't make it about 'genocidal conservative crazies' Especially while you have a very 'liberal' president in office continuing the rampage. Next time, how about a sincere effort dude.

DROPS THE MIC__

 

[ChrisL]

So you prefer non-facts and opinions to the facts? Now THAT is laughable.

No. I like laughing at the US public which sucked up the story of significant WMD when the US government's own statements gave it the lie.

Well, I'm sorry about all of that, but the facts say otherwise. Also, multiple sources I've quoted have agreed that Saddam purposely set it up to look as if he did have them. Even he admitted to doing that, so, unlike your earlier accusation against me about "lying" I have not lied about anything. Like I told you, all of the information I have relayed was obtained from links, which I have also posted.

 

[cnm]

Well, I'm sorry about all of that, but the facts say otherwise. [...] Even he admitted to doing that, so, unlike your earlier accusation against me about "lying" I have not lied about anything.

What facts say the US public did not suck up the story of significant Iraq WMD that the US government's own statements gave the lie to?

Where did I accuse you of lying?

 

[Dot Com]

The vast majority of military members go their entire careers without seeing combat. The rise of drone warfare means an increasing number of those who do are still risking not much more than a tax payer bought robot. None of our recent wars actually had anything to do with defending the United States or its citizens' freedom. Afghanistan was supposedly about finding bin Ladin. Iraq was about kicking Saddam out of power to find his non-existent chemical weapons and a few billion tons worth of oil for Bush's butt buddies. The newest Iraq war will be to try to fix the problem of the massive army of genocidal conservative crazies our most recent fuck up there created.

Wouldn't it be more accurate to thank our troops for the sacrifice of six years they could have spent going to college to go out and risk occasional inconvenience for our national oiligarchs' bank accounts?

Fox News tells the life-long civilian watchers to believe it so they do.

 

[cnm]

Here is one of the US government's own statements that gave the lie to the assertion of Iraq's significant WMD.

2001: Powell & Rice Declare Iraq Has No WMD and Is Not a Threat

http://www.cs.cornell.edu

But two years earlier, Powell said just the opposite. The occasion was a press conference on 24 February 2001 during Powell's visit to Cairo, Egypt. Answering a question about the US-led sanctions against Iraq, the Secretary of State said:

We had a good discussion, the Foreign Minister and I and the President and I, had a good discussion about the nature of the sanctions -- the fact that the sanctions exist -- not for the purpose of hurting the Iraqi people, but for the purpose of keeping in check Saddam Hussein's ambitions toward developing weapons of mass destruction. We should constantly be reviewing our policies, constantly be looking at those sanctions to make sure that they are directed toward that purpose. That purpose is every bit as important now as it was ten years ago when we began it. And frankly they have worked. He has not developed any significant capability with respect to weapons of mass destruction. He is unable to project conventional power against his neighbors. So in effect, our policies have strengthened the security of the neighbors of Iraq...​

 

[rightwinger]

Where was the threat?
Who the hell was Saddam going to use them on?

We invaded him TWICE and they were nowhere to be seen

But they did find some. Not some massive production or anything, but old stock piles, which proves that Saddam had never gotten rid of his laboratories, etc., so the intel wasn't completely false. Also, like I already stated, this illusion was intentionally created by Saddam Hussein. He wanted everyone to believe he had WMDs or had the capabilities to obtain them at least.

Imagine That Wikileaks Docs Show There Were WMDs in Iraq

Several hundred chemical weapons were found, and Saddam had all his WMD scientists and technicians ready. Just end the sanctions and add money, and the weapons would be back in production within a year. At the time of the invasion, all intelligence agencies, world-wide, believed Saddam still had a functioning WMD program. Saddam had shut them down because of the cost, but created the illusion that the program was still operating in order to fool the Iranians. - See more at: Imagine That Wikileaks Docs Show There Were WMDs in Iraq

Ancient chemical weapons that were well past their prime

Hardly the mushroom cloud Bush was predicting

But Saddam did and said things to make even his own generals believe that he had them.

And NOBODY can predict the future.

Saddam was no more of a threat in 2003 than he was in 1993

Oh jeez, it must have slipped my mind how you are privy to ALL government secrets and intelligence data. Lol. YOU must know better than military advisers who are employed by the government, etc.

Oddly it does seem I do

Back in 2003, I was openly saying that Saddam was no threat and was contained. I was told ........you don't know what Bush knows, there is stuff they are not releasing

Seems I was right

 

[ChrisL]

But they did find some. Not some massive production or anything, but old stock piles, which proves that Saddam had never gotten rid of his laboratories, etc., so the intel wasn't completely false. Also, like I already stated, this illusion was intentionally created by Saddam Hussein. He wanted everyone to believe he had WMDs or had the capabilities to obtain them at least.

Imagine That Wikileaks Docs Show There Were WMDs in Iraq

Several hundred chemical weapons were found, and Saddam had all his WMD scientists and technicians ready. Just end the sanctions and add money, and the weapons would be back in production within a year. At the time of the invasion, all intelligence agencies, world-wide, believed Saddam still had a functioning WMD program. Saddam had shut them down because of the cost, but created the illusion that the program was still operating in order to fool the Iranians. - See more at: Imagine That Wikileaks Docs Show There Were WMDs in Iraq

Ancient chemical weapons that were well past their prime

Hardly the mushroom cloud Bush was predicting

But Saddam did and said things to make even his own generals believe that he had them.

And NOBODY can predict the future.

Saddam was no more of a threat in 2003 than he was in 1993

Oh jeez, it must have slipped my mind how you are privy to ALL government secrets and intelligence data. Lol. YOU must know better than military advisers who are employed by the government, etc.

Oddly it does seem I do

Back in 2003, I was openly saying that Saddam was no threat and was contained. I was told ........you don't know what Bush knows, there is stuff they are not releasing

Seems I was right

 

[MikeK]

Horseshit. How may years have you been peddling that yarn? Democrats and Republicans were on the Intel oversight committees. And what lies? WMD were found, the lefties are the liars. If what you think is true there would have been hearings on it and possible treason charges. The libs hated Bush with a passion and apparently there are still a few holdovers with Bush Derangement Syndrome.

If you truly believe that you should be able to tell us specifically what types of WMD were found and why Hussein or any of his generals didn't use them against the military force that incisively invaded and essentially destroyed their nation?

Do you suppose they didn't use them because they didn't want to make us mad? Or do you suppose they didn't use them because they didn't exist?

 

[ChrisL]

Here is one of the US government's own statements that gave the lie to the assertion of Iraq's significant WMD.

2001: Powell & Rice Declare Iraq Has No WMD and Is Not a Threat

http://www.cs.cornell.edu

But two years earlier, Powell said just the opposite. The occasion was a press conference on 24 February 2001 during Powell's visit to Cairo, Egypt. Answering a question about the US-led sanctions against Iraq, the Secretary of State said:

We had a good discussion, the Foreign Minister and I and the President and I, had a good discussion about the nature of the sanctions -- the fact that the sanctions exist -- not for the purpose of hurting the Iraqi people, but for the purpose of keeping in check Saddam Hussein's ambitions toward developing weapons of mass destruction. We should constantly be reviewing our policies, constantly be looking at those sanctions to make sure that they are directed toward that purpose. That purpose is every bit as important now as it was ten years ago when we began it. And frankly they have worked. He has not developed any significant capability with respect to weapons of mass destruction. He is unable to project conventional power against his neighbors. So in effect, our policies have strengthened the security of the neighbors of Iraq...​

Mmm-hmm, and things change, and so do opinions. Sometimes, people might learn certain facts to change their opinions. so what is your point? Oh, let me guess, that George W. Bush was just evil and wanted to kill Iraqis and US military members for the hell of it. Or maybe it was because of the oil? Some people have such a one-track mind. Hopefully you are all aware that there were more than likely multiple reasons why the president, as well as congress, agreed to go to war. As much as you would like to think or try to convince the weak minded people that it was because republicans are evil, that is more than likely not the case. Lol.

 

[ChrisL]

Horseshit. How may years have you been peddling that yarn? Democrats and Republicans were on the Intel oversight committees. And what lies? WMD were found, the lefties are the liars. If what you think is true there would have been hearings on it and possible treason charges. The libs hated Bush with a passion and apparently there are still a few holdovers with Bush Derangement Syndrome.

If you truly believe that you should be able to tell us specifically what types of WMD were found and why Hussein or any of his generals didn't use them against the military force that incisively invaded and essentially destroyed their nation?

Do you suppose they didn't use them because they didn't want to make us mad? Or do you suppose they didn't use them because they didn't exist?

"Yellow cake" is one substance that had been found.

 

[rightwinger]

Ancient chemical weapons that were well past their prime

Hardly the mushroom cloud Bush was predicting

But Saddam did and said things to make even his own generals believe that he had them.

And NOBODY can predict the future.

Saddam was no more of a threat in 2003 than he was in 1993

Oh jeez, it must have slipped my mind how you are privy to ALL government secrets and intelligence data. Lol. YOU must know better than military advisers who are employed by the government, etc.

Oddly it does seem I do

Back in 2003, I was openly saying that Saddam was no threat and was contained. I was told ........you don't know what Bush knows, there is stuff they are not releasing

Seems I was right

Seems I was not alone in my assessment

The following is a transcript of the remarks then-Sen. Barack Obama delivered in Chicago on Oct. 2, 2002. In his speech, Obama said that what he was opposed to was "a dumb war ... a rash war." He said the war was a "cynical attempt" to shove "ideological agendas down our throats" and would distract from domestic problems such as poverty and health care.


What I am opposed to is a dumb war. What I am opposed to is a rash war. What I am opposed to is the cynical attempt by Richard Perle and Paul Wolfowitz and other armchair, weekend warriors in this administration to shove their own ideological agendas down our throats, irrespective of the costs in lives lost and in hardships borne.

What I am opposed to is the attempt by political hacks like Karl Rove to distract us from a rise in the uninsured, a rise in the poverty rate, a drop in the median income — to distract us from corporate scandals and a stock market that has just gone through the worst month since the Great Depression. That's what I'm opposed to. A dumb war. A rash war. A war based not on reason but on passion, not on principle but on politics. Now let me be clear — I suffer no illusions about Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal man. A ruthless man. A man who butchers his own people to secure his own power. He has repeatedly defied UN resolutions, thwarted UN inspection teams, developed chemical and biological weapons, and coveted nuclear capacity. He's a bad guy. The world, and the Iraqi people, would be better off without him.

But I also know that Saddam poses no imminent and direct threat to the United States or to his neighbors, that the Iraqi economy is in shambles, that the Iraqi military a fraction of its former strength, and that in concert with the international community he can be contained until, in the way of all petty dictators, he falls away into the dustbin of history. I know that even a successful war against Iraq will require a U.S. occupation of undetermined length, at undetermined cost, with undetermined consequences. I

 

[cnm]

so what is your point?

Your WMD facts are laughable as a defence.