Why does your religion condemn people?

[G.T.]

I have offered to answer it in the Bull Ring. One on one. You against me.

So, you won't accept my challenge?

Your "challenge". You're challenged enough.

I'm not the one who is afraid to debate you in the Bull Ring. You are.

You're afraid to answer my questions, going to a private booth won't change that.

I'll engage you in the discussion - let's ignore the triggered dingerred in the background and show him how its done.

First, we need to establish a definition for morals that we can both agree on, to ensure we're speaking of the same concept within the discussion. Go ahead and define that, see if we agree, and ask your questions.

There are no moral standards, especially not from a god that boasts about drowning nearly all of humanity. But it's fun to confuse the autistic kid with.

I understand your conclusion, but I was seeing if you wanted to adequately cross-examine it to determine if there's any holes. I guess that I would start by saying that there's necessarily moral standards, because by invoking the word standard ....all you've done is invoke causal norms. Know what I mean? In any sentient commune there's "standards" for every concept - so your use of words there wasn't absolute enough to iron down the concept you're going for. I agree about your views on the God of the Bible, he's a relativist in terms of morals like everyone else, only - he's the only one if he DOES exist that has no excuse for his hypocrisy. I've always said that if the God of the Bible is the creator of existence, he's not worthy of my worship. Old covenant or new.

Anyhoo, define morals in terms of your own understanding of the concept.....

 

[Mickiel]

Why does your religion condemn people;, Why? Explain that to me.

 

[G.T.]

Why does your religion condemn people;, Why? Explain that to me.

I think that the obvious reason that the writers concocted condemnations in their Fiction was obviously to deter certain behavior for their own means.

 

[Mickiel]

Why does your religion condemn people;, Why? Explain that to me.

I think that the obvious reason that the writers concocted condemnations in their Fiction was obviously to deter certain behavior for their own means.

Which is obvious manipulation;

and boy was it a strong historical manipulation that seduced a world and ruined a way of perceiving an unknown god.

 

[Taz]

Hate is a big part of religion.

 

[Mickiel]

Hate is a big part of religion.

Well yes it is. Sadly it is.

 

[G.T.]

Hate is a big part of humans, Religion is just some of their excuse.

 

[Mickiel]

Hate is a big part of humans, Religion is just some of their excuse.

I agree, both hate and religion run through the veins of humanity. And both have had some serious impact on our conscious awareness. And the way we have been conscious of religion has exposed our weakness to each other ; how one human leader can seriously impact a group of humans.

 

[G.T.]

Hate is a big part of humans, Religion is just some of their excuse.

I agree, both hate and religion run through the veins of humanity. And both have had some serious impact on our conscious awareness. And the way we have been conscious of religion have exposed our weakness to each other ; how one human leader can seriously impact a group of humans.

Well, the good news is that the discussion is no longer taboo, and these ideas are debated between theists and non on stages across the globe, now. It also coincides with folks dropping their religious affiliations, numerically. The facts of the matter are, nobody has proven their God without any logical leaps and for many folks that's no longer enough.

 

[Mickiel]

Hate is a big part of humans, Religion is just some of their excuse.

I agree, both hate and religion run through the veins of humanity. And both have had some serious impact on our conscious awareness. And the way we have been conscious of religion have exposed our weakness to each other ; how one human leader can seriously impact a group of humans.

Well, the good news is that the discussion is no longer taboo, and these ideas are debated between theists and non on stages across the globe, now. It also coincides with folks dropping their religious affiliations, numerically. The facts of the matter are, nobody has proven their God without any logical leaps and for many folks that's no longer enough.

Well proving the existence of God can be a misnomer; it can be a contradiction to a mind that has no experience in using its spiritual insight , because it evolves beyond the physical and gets into another instinct that all humans have, but don't really use. Just as any knowledge that confronts the human reasoning, spiritual knowledge has been corrupted within humanity , so we have had to deal with that corruption , even in our awareness of there being a power other than mankind in existence. In my view, we are not alone in the universe ; in reality. I sense something else ; some other presence within my conscious spiritual insight. I cannot fully explain it, but I can explain some of it.

I am conscious of a God , and history has always been conscious of it, in one form or another. And we can only be conscious of, those things we are conscious of. I know that I have in me , emotional content , of which I can both reason with it and feel things with it. With my reason, I can determine that I have a consciousness , and that my consciousness is free to both accept and reject things ; and I reason and accept that there exist another world that I cannot define as much as I would like to. Something inside of the mirror. A missing link in our awareness.

 

[G.T.]

Hate is a big part of humans, Religion is just some of their excuse.

I agree, both hate and religion run through the veins of humanity. And both have had some serious impact on our conscious awareness. And the way we have been conscious of religion have exposed our weakness to each other ; how one human leader can seriously impact a group of humans.

Well, the good news is that the discussion is no longer taboo, and these ideas are debated between theists and non on stages across the globe, now. It also coincides with folks dropping their religious affiliations, numerically. The facts of the matter are, nobody has proven their God without any logical leaps and for many folks that's no longer enough.

Well proving the existence of God can be a misnomer; it can be a contradiction to a mind that has no experience in using its spiritual insight , because it evolves beyond the physical and gets into another instinct that all humans have, but don't really use. Just as any knowledge that confronts the human reasoning, spiritual knowledge has been corrupted within humanity , so we have had to deal with that corruption , even in our awareness of there being a power other than mankind in existence. In my view, we are not alone in the universe ; in reality. I sense something else ; some other presence within my conscious spiritual insight. I cannot fully explain it, but I can explain some of it.

I am conscious of a God , and history has always been conscious of it, in one form or another. And we can only be conscious of, those things we are conscious of. I know that I have in me , emotional content , of which I can both reason with it and feel things with it. With my reason, I can determine that I have a consciousness , and that my consciousness is free to both accept and reject things ; and I reason and accept that there exist another world that I cannot define as much as I would like to. Something inside of the mirror. A missing link in our awareness.

Those reasons, intuitions and feelings that you have fall short of a good reason, just from my perspective, to believe in anything whatsoever.

 

[Mickiel]

Hate is a big part of humans, Religion is just some of their excuse.

I agree, both hate and religion run through the veins of humanity. And both have had some serious impact on our conscious awareness. And the way we have been conscious of religion have exposed our weakness to each other ; how one human leader can seriously impact a group of humans.

Well, the good news is that the discussion is no longer taboo, and these ideas are debated between theists and non on stages across the globe, now. It also coincides with folks dropping their religious affiliations, numerically. The facts of the matter are, nobody has proven their God without any logical leaps and for many folks that's no longer enough.

Well proving the existence of God can be a misnomer; it can be a contradiction to a mind that has no experience in using its spiritual insight , because it evolves beyond the physical and gets into another instinct that all humans have, but don't really use. Just as any knowledge that confronts the human reasoning, spiritual knowledge has been corrupted within humanity , so we have had to deal with that corruption , even in our awareness of there being a power other than mankind in existence. In my view, we are not alone in the universe ; in reality. I sense something else ; some other presence within my conscious spiritual insight. I cannot fully explain it, but I can explain some of it.

I am conscious of a God , and history has always been conscious of it, in one form or another. And we can only be conscious of, those things we are conscious of. I know that I have in me , emotional content , of which I can both reason with it and feel things with it. With my reason, I can determine that I have a consciousness , and that my consciousness is free to both accept and reject things ; and I reason and accept that there exist another world that I cannot define as much as I would like to. Something inside of the mirror. A missing link in our awareness.

Those reasons, intuitions and feelings that you have fall short of a good reason, just from my perspective, to believe in anything whatsoever.

Well I understand your reasoning , but I also understand mine. I just see certain things in both math and reasoning,. If I walk down a street and find a dime on the ground , I think nothing of it. If I walk ( Or reason ), a bit more and discover five dimes on the ground, ( or gain more knowledge ), I may now suspect something is amiss. If I go further and find ten dimes on the ground, but now each dime is standing on its edge and in rows of two , I can rightly reason that this was " Purposely done". That this now has a purpose behind it.

Well I view the universe like that ; I view our existence like that. I think it was purposely done, this whole humanity thing.

 

[G.T.]

Hate is a big part of humans, Religion is just some of their excuse.

I agree, both hate and religion run through the veins of humanity. And both have had some serious impact on our conscious awareness. And the way we have been conscious of religion have exposed our weakness to each other ; how one human leader can seriously impact a group of humans.

Well, the good news is that the discussion is no longer taboo, and these ideas are debated between theists and non on stages across the globe, now. It also coincides with folks dropping their religious affiliations, numerically. The facts of the matter are, nobody has proven their God without any logical leaps and for many folks that's no longer enough.

Well proving the existence of God can be a misnomer; it can be a contradiction to a mind that has no experience in using its spiritual insight , because it evolves beyond the physical and gets into another instinct that all humans have, but don't really use. Just as any knowledge that confronts the human reasoning, spiritual knowledge has been corrupted within humanity , so we have had to deal with that corruption , even in our awareness of there being a power other than mankind in existence. In my view, we are not alone in the universe ; in reality. I sense something else ; some other presence within my conscious spiritual insight. I cannot fully explain it, but I can explain some of it.

I am conscious of a God , and history has always been conscious of it, in one form or another. And we can only be conscious of, those things we are conscious of. I know that I have in me , emotional content , of which I can both reason with it and feel things with it. With my reason, I can determine that I have a consciousness , and that my consciousness is free to both accept and reject things ; and I reason and accept that there exist another world that I cannot define as much as I would like to. Something inside of the mirror. A missing link in our awareness.

Those reasons, intuitions and feelings that you have fall short of a good reason, just from my perspective, to believe in anything whatsoever.

Well I understand your reasoning , but I also understand mine. I just see certain things in both math and reasoning,. If I walk down a street and find a dime on the ground , I think nothing of it. If I walk ( Or reason ), a bit more and discover five dimes on the ground, ( or gain more knowledge ), I may now suspect something is amiss. If I go further and find ten dimes on the ground, but now each dime is standing on its edge and in rows of two , I can rightly reason that this was " Purposely done". That this now has a purpose behind it.

Well I view the universe like that ; I view our existence like that. I think it was purposely done, this whole humanity thing.

I don't see any reason to believe the Universe was purposely done. We have knowledge of dimes, how they're made, gravity, etc. to conclude that analogy. There's a good 30-minute discussion on this "implied designer" discussion which dissects it down to nonsense pretty eloquently....I can dig for it if you'd like, but you don't seem to want to be "unconvinced" or to "debate" god vs. not god, so I'll refrain for now bruvva.

 

[Mickiel]

I agree, both hate and religion run through the veins of humanity. And both have had some serious impact on our conscious awareness. And the way we have been conscious of religion have exposed our weakness to each other ; how one human leader can seriously impact a group of humans.

Well, the good news is that the discussion is no longer taboo, and these ideas are debated between theists and non on stages across the globe, now. It also coincides with folks dropping their religious affiliations, numerically. The facts of the matter are, nobody has proven their God without any logical leaps and for many folks that's no longer enough.

Well proving the existence of God can be a misnomer; it can be a contradiction to a mind that has no experience in using its spiritual insight , because it evolves beyond the physical and gets into another instinct that all humans have, but don't really use. Just as any knowledge that confronts the human reasoning, spiritual knowledge has been corrupted within humanity , so we have had to deal with that corruption , even in our awareness of there being a power other than mankind in existence. In my view, we are not alone in the universe ; in reality. I sense something else ; some other presence within my conscious spiritual insight. I cannot fully explain it, but I can explain some of it.

I am conscious of a God , and history has always been conscious of it, in one form or another. And we can only be conscious of, those things we are conscious of. I know that I have in me , emotional content , of which I can both reason with it and feel things with it. With my reason, I can determine that I have a consciousness , and that my consciousness is free to both accept and reject things ; and I reason and accept that there exist another world that I cannot define as much as I would like to. Something inside of the mirror. A missing link in our awareness.

Those reasons, intuitions and feelings that you have fall short of a good reason, just from my perspective, to believe in anything whatsoever.

Well I understand your reasoning , but I also understand mine. I just see certain things in both math and reasoning,. If I walk down a street and find a dime on the ground , I think nothing of it. If I walk ( Or reason ), a bit more and discover five dimes on the ground, ( or gain more knowledge ), I may now suspect something is amiss. If I go further and find ten dimes on the ground, but now each dime is standing on its edge and in rows of two , I can rightly reason that this was " Purposely done". That this now has a purpose behind it.

Well I view the universe like that ; I view our existence like that. I think it was purposely done, this whole humanity thing.

I don't see any reason to believe the Universe was purposely done. We have knowledge of dimes, how they're made, gravity, etc. to conclude that analogy. There's a good 30-minute discussion on this "implied designer" discussion which dissects it down to nonsense pretty eloquently....I can dig for it if you'd like, but you don't seem to want to be "unconvinced" or to "debate" god vs. not god, so I'll refrain for now bruvva.

Oh sometimes I have my doubts , belief in God has not been easy or automatic for me. And I am not an average debator, its hard for me to explain myself at times; I can go off into space at any given moment. I hold no interest in convincing anyone of God, I really don't care to do that. We are free to believe as we wish. I think what we believe is meaningless to God.

 

[G.T.]

Well, the good news is that the discussion is no longer taboo, and these ideas are debated between theists and non on stages across the globe, now. It also coincides with folks dropping their religious affiliations, numerically. The facts of the matter are, nobody has proven their God without any logical leaps and for many folks that's no longer enough.

Well proving the existence of God can be a misnomer; it can be a contradiction to a mind that has no experience in using its spiritual insight , because it evolves beyond the physical and gets into another instinct that all humans have, but don't really use. Just as any knowledge that confronts the human reasoning, spiritual knowledge has been corrupted within humanity , so we have had to deal with that corruption , even in our awareness of there being a power other than mankind in existence. In my view, we are not alone in the universe ; in reality. I sense something else ; some other presence within my conscious spiritual insight. I cannot fully explain it, but I can explain some of it.

I am conscious of a God , and history has always been conscious of it, in one form or another. And we can only be conscious of, those things we are conscious of. I know that I have in me , emotional content , of which I can both reason with it and feel things with it. With my reason, I can determine that I have a consciousness , and that my consciousness is free to both accept and reject things ; and I reason and accept that there exist another world that I cannot define as much as I would like to. Something inside of the mirror. A missing link in our awareness.

Those reasons, intuitions and feelings that you have fall short of a good reason, just from my perspective, to believe in anything whatsoever.

Well I understand your reasoning , but I also understand mine. I just see certain things in both math and reasoning,. If I walk down a street and find a dime on the ground , I think nothing of it. If I walk ( Or reason ), a bit more and discover five dimes on the ground, ( or gain more knowledge ), I may now suspect something is amiss. If I go further and find ten dimes on the ground, but now each dime is standing on its edge and in rows of two , I can rightly reason that this was " Purposely done". That this now has a purpose behind it.

Well I view the universe like that ; I view our existence like that. I think it was purposely done, this whole humanity thing.

I don't see any reason to believe the Universe was purposely done. We have knowledge of dimes, how they're made, gravity, etc. to conclude that analogy. There's a good 30-minute discussion on this "implied designer" discussion which dissects it down to nonsense pretty eloquently....I can dig for it if you'd like, but you don't seem to want to be "unconvinced" or to "debate" god vs. not god, so I'll refrain for now bruvva.

Oh sometimes I have my doubts , belief in God has not been easy or automatic for me. And I am not an average debator, its hard for me to explain myself at times; I can go off into space at any given moment. I hold no interest in convincing anyone of God, I really don't care to do that. We are free to believe as we wish. I think what we believe is meaningless to God.

When I take my deep dives into origins, I like for my mind to wander into the Computer-program theories and such...because they're fun

But, being and still am agnostic. Mebbe I'll have to die that way, that's alright. Being a seeker is enjoyable.

 

[ding]

I don't see any reason to believe the Universe was purposely done.

Then you are ignoring the principle of cause and effect.

 

[G.T.]

I don't see any reason to believe the Universe was purposely done.

Then you are ignoring the principle of cause and effect.

If someone not dingerred cares to see how Id walk through this do-do response, they can feel free to present it and expect a well reasoned response. Dingerred isnt bright enough to bother explaining things to.

 

[ding]

I don't see any reason to believe the Universe was purposely done.

Then you are ignoring the principle of cause and effect.

If someone not dingerred cares to see how Id walk through this do-do response, they can feel free to present it and expect a well reasoned response. Dingerred isnt bright enough to bother explaining things to.

You live at the bottom of the pyramid and you think I'm the one who doesn't have well reasoned responses?

 

[G.T.]

I don't see any reason to believe the Universe was purposely done.

Then you are ignoring the principle of cause and effect.

If someone not dingerred cares to see how Id walk through this do-do response, they can feel free to present it and expect a well reasoned response. Dingerred isnt bright enough to bother explaining things to.

You live at the bottom of the pyramid and you think I'm the one who doesn't have well reasoned responses?

View attachment 197196

Good, dingerred. Your opinion of me is irrelevant to your command of me respecting your intellect. You dont possess such a thing. Its ok, other folks do.

You're a puddle of piss that's next to dark fury's camper toilet...in my super humble opinion only, of course.

 

[ding]

We live in a universe governed by rules. Where every effect had a cause. The definition of "reason" is a cause, explanation, or justification for an action or event. Which means that every thing that has happened in the universe happened for a reason because there was a cause. The definition of "purpose" is the reason for which something is done or created or for which something exists. Which means that since everything happened for a reason there is a purpose for everything.