Why is it so hard to have a civil discussion in the Israel/Palestine forum?

[teddyearp]

They tried with their unity government - Israel responded by making up bullshit reasons to attack Gaza, then launched their own terrorist invasion of that area, killing innocent civilians, bombing hospitals and destroying entire neighborhoods.​

​

So, please tell me what you mean by "bullshit reasons"? Do you think the kidnapping and murder of the three kids was made up? Do you think that Israel went in a fired rockets on themselves from Gaza?

 

[Roudy]

He went to put gas in his home I mean van. And then he's showering in the river. Saturday night party at the mosque.

 

[teddyearp]

Roudy, I hate you now. I could have gone the rest of my life forgetting that person and song.

However, isn't that Hebrew on dude's shirt?

 

[Roudy]

Roudy, I hate you now. I could have gone the rest of my life forgetting that person and song.

However, isn't that Hebrew on dude's shirt?

I know! I realized that while watching him sing. I wonder what it says? This is how Boy George I mean Boy Billy looks now, even more hideous than he did when he was young.

 

[Daniyel]

Billo_Really I Think I owe you an answer, and everyone else as well.
THE Reason we can't have a normal discussion or a debate is simple, I had hard time finding the posts but I believe you know what I'm talking about
First time I noticed it was me - I was asking you(Billo) if you care about the Palestinians, answer was no.
Next there is aris2chat asking Beelzebub if he care about the Palestinians or getting a job for them, sort of a 'no'.
So on.

Every point in each debate is not going anywhere because we simply talk about two different things, I've said it before and it saddens me to think I have to say it again, the so called pro-Palestinians are not pro-Palestinians, you can rarely find someone who consider himself/herself a pro-Palestinians in the forum and yes I was looking quite hard for them and this is the all the same out there, as we all discuss about real time issues we reflect the same opinions people have across the globe.

The Pro-Palestinian lobby here is a synonymous for anti-Israel, when every thread goes up its either the anti-Israel team busy pointing fingers, and we - the pro-Israeli side - disproving, so what kind of debate is this? you keep blaming Israel and you seriously expect me to do WHAT?
Bottom line for conclusions should be -
Is there anything productive that could come by that?
Is this really benefit the Palestinians?
What do we can learn from it?

Try adapting this way of thinking and ask yourself honestly if that is what the 'pro-Palestinians' here truly aim for.
Now when every thread about anything goes for mutual benefit goes dry, I can't fall to believe anyone I've met here - with a few exceptions - can answer the questions above if they even bother to, in the positive-productive threads which I've been looking for around here.

I Think its fair I said it quite a few times, I don't care when somebody is pro-Palestinians, and even doesn't have to like Israel at all, this is something we all can work out, but once someone is ANTI it means the train has passed already.

 

[Billo_Really]

Billo_Really I Think I owe you an answer, and everyone else as well.
THE Reason we can't have a normal discussion or a debate is simple, I had hard time finding the posts but I believe you know what I'm talking about
First time I noticed it was me - I was asking you(Billo) if you care about the Palestinians, answer was no.
Next there is aris2chat asking Beelzebub if he care about the Palestinians or getting a job for them, sort of a 'no'.
So on.

Every point in each debate is not going anywhere because we simply talk about two different things, I've said it before and it saddens me to think I have to say it again, the so called pro-Palestinians are not pro-Palestinians, you can rarely find someone who consider himself/herself a pro-Palestinians in the forum and yes I was looking quite hard for them and this is the all the same out there, as we all discuss about real time issues we reflect the same opinions people have across the globe.

The Pro-Palestinian lobby here is a synonymous for anti-Israel, when every thread goes up its either the anti-Israel team busy pointing fingers, and we - the pro-Israeli side - disproving, so what kind of debate is this? you keep blaming Israel and you seriously expect me to do WHAT?
Bottom line for conclusions should be -
Is there anything productive that could come by that?
Is this really benefit the Palestinians?
What do we can learn from it?

Try adapting this way of thinking and ask yourself honestly if that is what the 'pro-Palestinians' here truly aim for.
Now when every thread about anything goes for mutual benefit goes dry, I can't fall to believe anyone I've met here - with a few exceptions - can answer the questions above if they even bother to, in the positive-productive threads which I've been looking for around here.

I Think its fair I said it quite a few times, I don't care when somebody is pro-Palestinians, and even doesn't have to like Israel at all, this is something we all can work out, but once someone is ANTI it means the train has passed already.

I don't care about the Palestinian's. And why should I? They don't affect my daily life in any way. The same goes for Israel. It doesn't affect my daily life. Jews don't affect my daily life. Muslims don't affect my daily life. With that being said, why would I waste time and energy in my own life hating or supporting either one?

But I will tell you what I do hate. Hypocrites. I hate hypocrites! I hate people who think they can live by a different set of rules than everyone else, which is what I believe Israel thinks it can do. The biggest problem with hypocrites, is they never take responsibility for the things they do. Take you question, for example...

you keep blaming Israel and you seriously expect me to do WHAT?

...the entire focus is on Israel being "blamed". Not, "should they be blamed", just that they are simply "blamed". My initial response would be, "Why can't you be blamed?" "Why do you have a cow when you are?" "If you are responsible for a particular action, why wouldn't you be blamed?"

The most perfect example of this is the occupation and blockade. Israel started those. Israel is maintaining those. Israel is responsible for those. Israel is to blame for those. And if that is causing all the rocket fire and violence against Israel, why can't you accept that and ask you government, "What the fuck?" Why can't you address your role in all the violence? But you don't do that. You're just pissed people have the gall to blame Israel. It's as if Israel is this sacred cow you can't say anything against.

And one of my faults is, I just love carving up sacred cows. If you're the kind of person who thinks "he's all that", I'm your worst nightmare.

 

[Billo_Really]

So, please tell me what you mean by "bullshit reasons"? Do you think the kidnapping and murder of the three kids was made up? Do you think that Israel went in a fired rockets on themselves from Gaza?

They said Hamas did it, when Hamas didn't do it.

 

[Billo_Really]

Of course I did, I stated they should seek a legitimate way to find a solution not through terrorism or killing of their own people, you have done nothing but defend their rockets, maiming and killing.

No you didn't! I listed 3 examples of them using legitimate ways to find a solution and you haven't commented on any of them . You're playing word games.

 

[Daniyel]

Billo_Really I Think I owe you an answer, and everyone else as well.
THE Reason we can't have a normal discussion or a debate is simple, I had hard time finding the posts but I believe you know what I'm talking about
First time I noticed it was me - I was asking you(Billo) if you care about the Palestinians, answer was no.
Next there is aris2chat asking Beelzebub if he care about the Palestinians or getting a job for them, sort of a 'no'.
So on.

Every point in each debate is not going anywhere because we simply talk about two different things, I've said it before and it saddens me to think I have to say it again, the so called pro-Palestinians are not pro-Palestinians, you can rarely find someone who consider himself/herself a pro-Palestinians in the forum and yes I was looking quite hard for them and this is the all the same out there, as we all discuss about real time issues we reflect the same opinions people have across the globe.

The Pro-Palestinian lobby here is a synonymous for anti-Israel, when every thread goes up its either the anti-Israel team busy pointing fingers, and we - the pro-Israeli side - disproving, so what kind of debate is this? you keep blaming Israel and you seriously expect me to do WHAT?
Bottom line for conclusions should be -
Is there anything productive that could come by that?
Is this really benefit the Palestinians?
What do we can learn from it?

Try adapting this way of thinking and ask yourself honestly if that is what the 'pro-Palestinians' here truly aim for.
Now when every thread about anything goes for mutual benefit goes dry, I can't fall to believe anyone I've met here - with a few exceptions - can answer the questions above if they even bother to, in the positive-productive threads which I've been looking for around here.

I Think its fair I said it quite a few times, I don't care when somebody is pro-Palestinians, and even doesn't have to like Israel at all, this is something we all can work out, but once someone is ANTI it means the train has passed already.

I don't care about the Palestinian's. And why should I? They don't affect my daily life in any way. The same goes for Israel. It doesn't affect my daily life. Jews don't affect my daily life. Muslims don't affect my daily life. With that being said, why would I waste time and energy in my own life hating or supporting either one?

But I will tell you what I do hate. Hypocrites. I hate hypocrites! I hate people who think they can live by a different set of rules than everyone else, which is what I believe Israel thinks it can do. The biggest problem with hypocrites, is they never take responsibility for the things they do. Take you question, for example...

you keep blaming Israel and you seriously expect me to do WHAT?

...the entire focus is on Israel being "blamed". Not, "should they be blamed", just that they are simply "blamed". My initial response would be, "Why can't you be blamed?" "Why do you have a cow when you are?" "If you are responsible for a particular action, why wouldn't you be blamed?"

The most perfect example of this is the occupation and blockade. Israel started those. Israel is maintaining those. Israel is responsible for those. Israel is to blame for those. And if that is causing all the rocket fire and violence against Israel, why can't you accept that and ask you government, "What the fuck?" Why can't you address your role in all the violence? But you don't do that. You're just pissed people have the gall to blame Israel. It's as if Israel is this sacred cow you can't say anything against.

And one of my faults is, I just love carving up sacred cows. If you're the kind of person who thinks "he's all that", I'm your worst nightmare.

Lets hold on a little, you said none of this conflict affects your wonderful life but for some reason you are still certain Israel is the hypocritical institute responsible for the biggest atrocities in the world, assume it somehow doesn't oppose itself I want to ask you, you don't consider yourself a hypocrite? Forget Israel for once- is that ONLY Israel's fault entirely? I mean at some point you do need to stop, take a deep breath and observe the situation as it is, you keep telling us WE are the hypocrites that you hate and in the same breath you have no reason to hate us, so I do hope it sinks in but lets go for a practical questions:
1. When did Israel avoided responsibility?(2-3 cases will do)
2. When did you had ONE thing to favor Israel by the pro-Israeli voice rather than opposing? (Assuming we both agree Israel isn't responsible for everything bad in this world)
3. Do you consider anyone else an hypocrite except Israel(or the pro-Israelis?)

 

[Mindful]

I addressed every single thing you said whether it made a point or not.

No you didn't!

Did you address the illegal and immoral occupation and blockade, which happens to be the reasons Israel gets rockets? No.

Did you address the 3 examples I gave of the Pals seeking a more civilized resolution to the conflict, after you inferred they didn't? No.

Did you address why Israel is the one breaking all the ceasefires? No.​

Then how can you possibly say you addressed everything I said?

Of course I did, I stated they should seek a legitimate way to find a solution not through terrorism or killing of their own people, you have done nothing but defend their rockets, maiming and killing.

Has it been mentioned yet: the Scuds raining down on Tel Aviv during Gulf War 1? And Israel took it, with no retaliation, despite not being involved in the conflict.

 

[Alex.]

No you didn't!

Yes I did.

 

[Billo_Really]

Yes I did.

Like I said, you're playing word games.

Hey, if you want to be a troll, be a troll. It's your call.

 

[Billo_Really]

Has it been mentioned yet: the Scuds raining down on Tel Aviv during Gulf War 1? And Israel took it, with no retaliation, despite not being involved in the conflict.

You got a link showing Iraq shot at Israel?

 

[Alex.]

Yes I did.

Like I said, you're playing word games.

Hey, if you want to be a troll, be a troll. It's your call.

I answered you. You did not like my answer. Now you are attacking me by calling me names. This is another reason why there can be no civil discussion in the Israel/Palestine forum. When you ask the question in your own OP look in the mirror.

 

[teddyearp]

So, please tell me what you mean by "bullshit reasons"? Do you think the kidnapping and murder of the three kids was made up? Do you think that Israel went in a fired rockets on themselves from Gaza?

They said Hamas did it, when Hamas didn't do it.

Nope, one of Hamas' clerics was caught on video in Turkey admitting to it.

 

[teddyearp]

Has it been mentioned yet: the Scuds raining down on Tel Aviv during Gulf War 1? And Israel took it, with no retaliation, despite not being involved in the conflict.

You got a link showing Iraq shot at Israel?

Here: BBC ON THIS DAY 18 1991 Iraqi Scud missiles hit Israel

 

[Billo_Really]

I answered you. You did not like my answer. Now you are attacking me by calling me names. This is another reason why there can be no civil discussion in the Israel/Palestine forum. When you ask the question in your own OP look in the mirror.

No you didn't answer me! You didn't address anything I said. You just repeated a blanket statement about not pursuing "legitimate resolutions", after I gave you 3 examples that they did. You didn't address any of them. I also asked you a direct question, which you didn't bother to answer and now claim you did. What post of yours commented on Israel constantly breaking the ceasefires? Anyone can look at your prior posts and see you haven't commented on it at all. But yet you claim you did.

And I didn't call you names. I said, "...if you wanted to be a troll...", which means, I attacked your actions and not you personally.

 

[Billo_Really]

Nope, one of Hamas' clerics was caught on video in Turkey admitting to it.

Israeli police said they didn't.

We could do this all day.

 

[teddyearp]

I don't care about the Palestinian's. And why should I? They don't affect my daily life in any way. The same goes for Israel. It doesn't affect my daily life. Jews don't affect my daily life. Muslims don't affect my daily life. With that being said, why would I waste time and energy in my own life hating or supporting either one?

So, if this is the case, why do you get so emotionally involved to the point of cussing everyone out, with the exception of this thread. Here we are wondering if someone hacked your account, lol. And I realize that you answered that in the second paragraph of your post that I am leaving out in this quote because . . .

The most perfect example of this is the occupation and blockade. Israel started those. Israel is maintaining those. Israel is responsible for those. Israel is to blame for those. And if that is causing all the rocket fire and violence against Israel, why can't you accept that and ask you government,

In all honesty, I believe here we could be arguing about which came frist the chicken or the egg.

 

[Billo_Really]

Lets hold on a little, you said none of this conflict affects your wonderful life but for some reason you are still certain Israel is the hypocritical institute responsible for the biggest atrocities in the world,

I did not say my life was wonderful, Israeli hypocrisy should be taken on a case-by-case basis and I didn't say they were the biggest atrocities in the world.

assume it somehow doesn't oppose itself I want to ask you, you don't consider yourself a hypocrite?

Sometimes yes, sometimes no. We are all hypocrites at one time or another.

As an example, I think my countries' foreign policy in the ME is partly to blame for 9/11 and that we should revise that foreign policy as much as we can to remove any motivation for another 9/11. But I draw the line at national security. If such "revision" involves compromising our national security, then I'm against it. That's a hypocritical position on my part.

Forget Israel for once- is that ONLY Israel's fault entirely?

I've never posted anything saying it's Israel's fault entirely. My issue is with those who think it's not Israel's fault at all.

I mean at some point you do need to stop, take a deep breath and observe the situation as it is, you keep telling us WE are the hypocrites that you hate and in the same breath you have no reason to hate us, so I do hope it sinks in but lets go for a practical questions:
1. When did Israel avoided responsibility?(2-3 cases will do)
2. When did you had ONE thing to favor Israel by the pro-Israeli voice rather than opposing? (Assuming we both agree Israel isn't responsible for everything bad in this world)
3. Do you consider anyone else an hypocrite except Israel(or the pro-Israelis?)

My answers are as follows:

1. Israel avoided responsibility when:
a) when they blamed Hamas for the reason for the blockade of Gaza.
b) when they blamed Egypt for starting the '67 war.
c) when they blamed Hamas for the killing of innocent civilians in Gaza
from Israeli missiles.
2. One pro-Israeli voice I "favored", was:
a) when Lipbush admitted she can't stand the Likud Party.
b) when the Israeli security chief admitted Iran is not seeking to build a
nuclear weapon.
c) anything the Israeli left has to say.
3. Who I consider a "hypocrite", is always done on a case-by-case basis. So to answer your question, yes, yes I do.