91 Million Armed American Civilians Makes Me Feel Damned Good

[Skull Pilot]

So the fuck what

You keep saying that the CDC is barred from doing gun research and it is not and never has been

Why do you keep insisting it is barred when it is proven that you are WRONG again?

Because it hasn't been proven wrong. They said guns are dangerous to their owners, and the NRA shit themselves and got their funding cut.

Trying to argue a technicality that flies in the face of reality is stupid.

But that's gun nuts. Don't let any reality threaten their need to compensate.

The funding for the research was never cut.
The only prohibition was that federal money for the studies could not be used to promote gun control

 

[martybegan]

Again, the States can form militias if they choose, the PEOPLE keep the right to arms.

That happens to be your interpretation. The courts interpreted differently from 1787-2008, and probably will interpret it that way again now that Scalia is being ass-raped by Satan like he deserves.

Stop quoting that debunked and trashed study from decades ago. It makes you look stupider than you actually are.

Yawn, guy, stomping your little feet and saying "I don't want Kellerman to be right" doesn't debunk anything.

No, but Big Pharma makes products that fuck up more than 33,000 a year.

Hey, if you want to regulate guns like we regulate big pharma, I'm all for that.

Actually they didn't, because the idea that a lawful citizen could be denied ownership of a firearm was a concept that only came about in the 60's and 70's, and only in progressive hellhole towns.

Kellerman is as wrong as you are, about pretty much everything.

and stop combining responses, you lazy bastard.

 

[2aguy]

So the FBI's statistics are based on case studies, but you reject that based on what you read on anonymous internet forums? Brilliant.

I reject it based on common sense. Common sense says that excited people only inflicting fatalities .1% of the time is darned unlikely.

actual research shows you are wrong...normal people do not shoot other people unless they are pressed to the worst extreme....you are the one who has the issue, not normal people......

 

[2aguy]

Moron......when the national socialist brown shirts were beating up their enemies and destroying their businesses...the police didn't stop them....and since their victims were unarmed, those acts silenced the opposition to the nazis as they rose to power........nothing stops a brown shirt beating like shooting them....but they couldn't....so those who opposed the nazis were forced to cower in fear......the nazis rose to power because they opposition was unarmed...twit....

Actually, the brownshirts and communists beat each other up all the time... which is why Weimar Germany tightened the gun laws. Then the Rich in Germany decided Hitler could be worked with, as long as he got rid of hte Brownshirts, which he did. Obviously your ignorance of the history of Nazi Germany is vast.

Moron.....they disarmed the enemies of the national socialists...and the jews.....who were attacking their political enemies with beatings and killings and no one could stop them because the police did nothing....

 

[2aguy]

[

Sorry but no. The CDC publishes data on gun deaths all the time as does the FBI

The CDC was only prohibited from spending money on gun control advocacy not from doing any studies

The NRA has blocked gun violence research for 20 years. Let's end its stranglehold on science.

Remarkably, that approach has continued to the present day: After theNewtown massacre of schoolchildren in 2012, President Obama issued an executive order instructing the CDC to “conduct or sponsor research into the causes of gun violence and the ways to prevent it.” But the agency has refused unless it receives a specific appropriation to cover the research. Congress played its obligatory role in acting as the NRA’s cat’s-paw by repeatedly rejecting bills to provide $10 million for the work.

“Removing the money from the budget and enacting the Dickey Amendment were the first and second shots across the bow by the NRA,” Rosenberg said. “The third shot is the idea that if you do this research, you’ll be hassled” by the NRA. “The result is that the CDC basically does nothing in gun violence research. If research on cancer were stopped for a single day, there would be a huge protest. But this research has been stopped for 20 years.”

And it's understandable. The NRA sells a lie, that a gun in your home makes you safer.

It doesn't.

Moron.....we have linked to actual gun research done by the CDC in the last 10 years.......they can do all the research they want, they just can't advocate against civil rights....

 

[2aguy]

So the fuck what

You keep saying that the CDC is barred from doing gun research and it is not and never has been

Why do you keep insisting it is barred when it is proven that you are WRONG again?

Because it hasn't been proven wrong. They said guns are dangerous to their owners, and the NRA shit themselves and got their funding cut.

Trying to argue a technicality that flies in the face of reality is stupid.

But that's gun nuts. Don't let any reality threaten their need to compensate.

200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s......357 million guns in private hands in 2016......and the accidental gun death rate and the non fatal gun accident rate went down ....last year there was an increase that went along with 37 million new guns being bought......but nothing you have said is true.....

200 million guns in private hands in the 1990s to 357 million guns in private hands in 2016 and the gun murder rate went down 49%.....the gun accident rate went down, the violent crime rate went down.....

Over 20 years of actual statistics shows that anti gunners are wrong.....more guns in the hands of law abiding people does not increase the gun crime rate or the gun murder rate...they are wrong on their core belief about guns in this country....and all of their other beliefs as well.....

 

[2aguy]

Hey dumbass, if you think these internet forums constitute even a tiny percentage of actual gun owners, you are a total moron. What is the actual number of people who fantasized about shooting someone? 5? 6? A dozen? 12 people would constitute 0.000004% of the population. It amounts to 0.000013% of the 91 million gun owners. If you have 75 people fantasizing about killing someone, you are still only dealing with 0.000024% of the population or 0.000082% of the gun owners. And yet, this is what you insist is the truth about gun owners?

No, not gun owners.

The gun nuts. The NRA members. The scary people who own 20 guns and complain about that day they want to fight the government.

Yet these guys never seem to encounter the criminals who they never, ever seem to shoot. (most of the 200 "Self-defense homicides' are in fact domestic violence where the victim wins, as opposed to the thousands where she loses because there was a gun in the house.)

But don't worry. We'll just cut f unding to gun studies so we don't know how bad the problem is. and some clown like Kleck can come along and claim there are millions of DGU's and no one will contradict him because no one is applying, you know, science.

Lie after lie......actual research into these very topics show you have no idea what you are talking about....tell me...does it hurt when you keep pulling things out of your ass....?

 

[2aguy]

Hey dumbass, if you think these internet forums constitute even a tiny percentage of actual gun owners, you are a total moron. What is the actual number of people who fantasized about shooting someone? 5? 6? A dozen? 12 people would constitute 0.000004% of the population. It amounts to 0.000013% of the 91 million gun owners. If you have 75 people fantasizing about killing someone, you are still only dealing with 0.000024% of the population or 0.000082% of the gun owners. And yet, this is what you insist is the truth about gun owners?

No, not gun owners.

The gun nuts. The NRA members. The scary people who own 20 guns and complain about that day they want to fight the government.

Yet these guys never seem to encounter the criminals who they never, ever seem to shoot. (most of the 200 "Self-defense homicides' are in fact domestic violence where the victim wins, as opposed to the thousands where she loses because there was a gun in the house.)

But don't worry. We'll just cut f unding to gun studies so we don't know how bad the problem is. and some clown like Kleck can come along and claim there are millions of DGU's and no one will contradict him because no one is applying, you know, science.

And your problem....it isn't just Kleck.....40 years of research shows that defensive gun use is common....and even the bill clinton Department of Justice research, done specifically to rebut Kleck...showed 1,500,000 defensive gun uses a year........

Self defense with a gun:

Self defense with a gun......40 years of actual research...the group that did the study, the year of the study, and then the number of defensive gun uses.....and in parentheses....wether police and military defensive use was included.....

A quick guide to the studies and the numbers.....the full lay out of what was studied by each study is in the links....
GunCite-Gun Control-How Often Are Guns Used in Self-Defense

GunCite Frequency of Defensive Gun Use in Previous Surveys

Field...1976....3,052,717 ( no cops, military)

DMIa 1978...2,141,512 ( no cops, military)

L.A. TIMES...1994...3,609,68 ( no cops, military)

Kleck......1994...2.5 million ( no cops, military)

Obama's CDC....2013....500,000--3million

--------------------


Bordua...1977...1,414,544

DMIb...1978...1,098,409 ( no cops, military)

Hart...1981...1.797,461 ( no cops, military)

Mauser...1990...1,487,342 ( no cops, military)

Gallup...1993...1,621,377 ( no cops, military)

DEPT. OF JUSTICE...1994...1.5 million ( the bill clinton study)

Journal of Quantitative Criminology--- 989,883 times per year."

(Based on survey data from a 2000 study published in the Journal of Quantitative Criminology,[17] U.S. civilians use guns to defend themselves and others from crime at least 989,883 times per year.[18])

Paper: "Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment." By David McDowall and others. Journal of Quantitative Criminology, March 2000. Measuring Civilian Defensive Firearm Use: A Methodological Experiment - Springer


-------------------------------------------

Ohio...1982...771,043

Gallup...1991...777,152

Tarrance... 1994... 764,036 (no cops, military)

Lawerence Southwich Jr. 400,000 fewer violent crimes and at least 800,000 violent crimes deterred..

*****************************************
If you take the studies from that Kleck cites in his paper, 16 of them....and you only average the ones that exclude military and police shootings..the average becomes 2 million...I use those studies because I have the details on them...and they are still 10 studies (including Kleck's)....

 

[JoeB131]

And you base this on what?? What sort of science is involved in your claim?

Posted it earlier in the thread. Gun owners are less than 22% of the population.

Batshit crazy Guns nuts are a smaller percentage than that. Sadly, we've let you dominate the conversation too much.

 

[JoeB131]

Lie after lie......actual research into these very topics show you have no idea what you are talking about....tell me...does it hurt when you keep pulling things out of your ass....?

The actual research is horseshit by the NRA>

Again, let's have the CDC do a real study, then we can have research.

 

[JoeB131]

Actually they didn't, because the idea that a lawful citizen could be denied ownership of a firearm was a concept that only came about in the 60's and 70's, and only in progressive hellhole towns.

Not true. Miller vs. US was decided in the 1930's after the Feds passed the US Firearms act.

The NFA was passed in 1934 as a response to gangsters using machine guns.

Now, here was the things. Back in the 1960's, they passed sensible gun laws and the NRA was completely on board. It wasn't until the 1970s you got the crazy nuts taking over saying the nutty shit you have going on today, like gun ownership is a right.

 

[JoeB131]

Wait for it... wait for it...

And your problem....it isn't just Kleck.....

SSSPPPPPPOOOOOOGEEEE!!!!

Guy, I don't even read this horseshit, the first 50 times you posted it..

DGU's are a fantasy. If they happened at the rate you claim,we'd all know of 100 DGU incidents.

I don't know of one.

I do know of two gun suicides and one gun murder and one attempted gun murder.

 

[martybegan]

Actually they didn't, because the idea that a lawful citizen could be denied ownership of a firearm was a concept that only came about in the 60's and 70's, and only in progressive hellhole towns.

Not true. Miller vs. US was decided in the 1930's after the Feds passed the US Firearms act.

The NFA was passed in 1934 as a response to gangsters using machine guns.

Now, here was the things. Back in the 1960's, they passed sensible gun laws and the NRA was completely on board. It wasn't until the 1970s you got the crazy nuts taking over saying the nutty shit you have going on today, like gun ownership is a right.

because idiots like you decided to try to disarm lawful citizens, like in NYC, Chicago, and Washington D.C, and it took decades for the cases to consolidate and make their way through the courts.

The Sullivan Act in NYC was passed in the 30's due to mafia violence, it doesn't make it constitutional, just well defended by constitution hating judges of your mentality.

 

[martybegan]

Wait for it... wait for it...

And your problem....it isn't just Kleck.....

SSSPPPPPPOOOOOOGEEEE!!!!

Guy, I don't even read this horseshit, the first 50 times you posted it..

DGU's are a fantasy. If they happened at the rate you claim,we'd all know of 100 DGU incidents.

I don't know of one.

I do know of two gun suicides and one gun murder and one attempted gun murder.

Kind of tough to see shit if you don't get out of your basement.

Fucking liar.

 

[WinterBorn]

And you base this on what?? What sort of science is involved in your claim?

Posted it earlier in the thread. Gun owners are less than 22% of the population.

Batshit crazy Guns nuts are a smaller percentage than that. Sadly, we've let you dominate the conversation too much.

I see. More of your invented facts.

 

[JoeB131]

because idiots like you decided to try to disarm lawful citizens, like in NYC, Chicago, and Washington D.C, and it took decades for the cases to consolidate and make their way through the courts.

The Sullivan Act in NYC was passed in the 30's due to mafia violence, it doesn't make it constitutional, just well defended by constitution hating judges of your mentality.

Guy, the problem with your thinking is that you really think that's there's a good reason to let people own guns.

There isn't. You don't need a gun. You want a gun. Generally for dumb reasons, but that's another discussion.

And letting you have one because a bunch of slave rapists who shit in chamber pots couldn't word a militia amendment properly isn't a good enough reason. Nor is "I'm scared of the darkies".

 

[martybegan]

because idiots like you decided to try to disarm lawful citizens, like in NYC, Chicago, and Washington D.C, and it took decades for the cases to consolidate and make their way through the courts.

The Sullivan Act in NYC was passed in the 30's due to mafia violence, it doesn't make it constitutional, just well defended by constitution hating judges of your mentality.

Guy, the problem with your thinking is that you really think that's there's a good reason to let people own guns.

There isn't. You don't need a gun. You want a gun. Generally for dumb reasons, but that's another discussion.

And letting you have one because a bunch of slave rapists who shit in chamber pots couldn't word a militia amendment properly isn't a good enough reason. Nor is "I'm scared of the darkies".

Not your call, and not governments in my case. I am a law abiding citizen and I have a Right to Keep and Bear Arms, and until you repeal the 2nd amendment, go fuck yourself.

 

[martybegan]

And you base this on what?? What sort of science is involved in your claim?

Posted it earlier in the thread. Gun owners are less than 22% of the population.

Batshit crazy Guns nuts are a smaller percentage than that. Sadly, we've let you dominate the conversation too much.

I see. More of your invented facts.

Joe makes more shit up then Farkey, and that's a lot of made up shit.

 

[JoeB131]

Kind of tough to see shit if you don't get out of your basement.

Fucking liar.

wouldn't know, guy, I don't own a basement on either of my properties.

What I do know is my next door neighbor shot himself in 2010 because despite the fact he had a whole host of issues, he was able to get a gun.

But not before he shot a bullet through the common area of the complex where we live.

 

[JoeB131]

Not your call, and not governments in my case. I am a law abiding citizen and I have a Right to Keep and Bear Arms, and until you repeal the 2nd amendment, go fuck yourself.

So what do you do when Hillary's replacement for Scalia decides the second amendment is about Militias again, and we have gun laws passing judicial muster?