A simple economic lesson... raise capital gains to 43% will do what?

[Markle]

You are confused Moon Bat.

I'll make it concise for you so you will understand.

"Hey lets use the pressure of the government to make lenders give money to people that have neither the means or the inclination to pay it back. You know, for social justice reasons. What could possible go wrong?"

You are 110% right.

I have been a Realtor since March of 1974. I was also very active in the local, state, and national associations serving as an officer at all three levels.

You refer to it and you are right. Into 2006 and 2007 there were NO DOC LOANS. I was stunned. The intent was for people working for tips and other cash businesses did not have to support the income they claimed with anything. Since it was available to some, it had to be available to all. I don't have a clue as to the overall impact but at the same time, hot shows on TV were like "Flip This House". Millions of folks were encouraged to refinance their house and buy a "fixer-upper". Like every pyramid scheme, those last in, got screwed. Millions of those folks also did not have the personality to go with the risk inherent in owning rental properties or flipping houses.

I had an opportunity to buy a house at a very attractive price. I went into my bank and talked to my banker, I told them I wanted this house, and I needed a loan for about $150,000. For every income property, I had ever bought I needed tax returns, income and loss statements, and whatever. BEFORE I got back to my office, I received a call that my loan had been approved and when did I want to close? Insane!

 

[rightwinger]

what? you proposed treating everything as ordinary income and taxing it all the same! i was discussing that and asking you about it

There is no reason that investment income should be taxed at lower rates than earned income

 

[struth]

There is no reason that investment income should be taxed at lower rates than earned income

there are tons of reasons why....but if someone wants to do it, fine...I was just asking about it. He already seemed to suggest one loophole to his new law....

 

[Markle]

I agree 100% and more facts supporting the contention which was VERIFIED by Barney Frank!
For years, Frank was a staunch supporter of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the giant government housing agencies that played such an enormous role in the financial meltdown that thrust the economy into the Great Recession. But in a recent CNBC interview, Frank told me that he was ready to say goodbye to Fannie and Freddie.
"I hope by next year we'll have abolished Fannie and Freddie," he said. Remarkable. And he went on to say that "it was a great mistake to push lower-income people into housing they couldn't afford and couldn't really handle once they had it." He then added, "I had been too sanguine about Fannie and Freddie."

Barney Frank Comes Home to the Facts | RealClearPolitics

Can you teach an old dog new tricks? In politics, the answer is usually no. Most elected officials cling to their ideological biases, despite the real-world facts that disprove their theories time...

www.realclearpolitics.com

And the beginning of the crisis was in 1995.......
And it was a lawsuit brought by Obama in Chicago..

With landmark lawsuit, Barack Obama pushed banks to give subprime loans to Chicago’s African-Americans​

President Barack Obama was a pioneering contributor to the national subprime real estate bubble, and roughly half of the 186 African-American clients in his landmark 1995 mortgage discrimination lawsuit against Citibank have since gone bankrupt or received foreclosure notices

With landmark lawsuit, Barack Obama pushed banks to give subprime loans to Chicago’s African-Americans

President Barack Obama was a pioneering contributor to the national subprime real estate bubble.

dailycaller.com

True!

At one time, Barney Frank was a ranking member of the committee that oversaw Fannie and Freddie. At the same time, Barney's lover was a director for one of the entities. The more loans they bought, the more money Barney's lover made.

Barney Frank in 2005: What Housing Bubble?


Barney Frank on the Bill O'Reilly Show

 

[struth]

True!

At one time, Barney Frank was a ranking member of the committee that oversaw Fannie and Freddie. At the same time, Barney's lover was a director for one of the entities. The more loans they bought, the more money Barney's lover made.

Barney Frank in 2005: What Housing Bubble?


Barney Frank on the Bill O'Reilly Show

Frank and Company totally ignored the warning, and attempts to fix the problem.

 

[rightwinger]

there are tons of reasons why....but if someone wants to do it, fine...I was just asking about it. He already seemed to suggest one loophole to his new law....

Earned income creates wealth
It should be taxed at lower rates

 

[struth]

Earned income creates wealth
It should be taxed at lower rates

you mean ordinary income?

Yes, it does, by taking it and investing it.

I don't disagree that it should be taxed at a lower rate then it currently is.

 

[Flash]

You are 110% right.

I have been a Realtor since March of 1974. I was also very active in the local, state, and national associations serving as an officer at all three levels.

You refer to it and you are right. Into 2006 and 2007 there were NO DOC LOANS. I was stunned. The intent was for people working for tips and other cash businesses did not have to support the income they claimed with anything. Since it was available to some, it had to be available to all. I don't have a clue as to the overall impact but at the same time, hot shows on TV were like "Flip This House". Millions of folks were encouraged to refinance their house and buy a "fixer-upper". Like every pyramid scheme, those last in, got screwed. Millions of those folks also did not have the personality to go with the risk inherent in owning rental properties or flipping houses.

I had an opportunity to buy a house at a very attractive price. I went into my bank and talked to my banker, I told them I wanted this house, and I needed a loan for about $150,000. For every income property, I had ever bought I needed tax returns, income and loss statements, and whatever. BEFORE I got back to my office, I received a call that my loan had been approved and when did I want to close? Insane!

The CRA put government pressure on the lenders to give credit to anyone, regardless of the ability to pay back the loan. It was designed to get more Black home ownership but it wound up essentially being for everybody.

It was a disaster.

Then when it went south the Democrats, who had just taken over Congress, didn't do their oversight. They just bailed out the lenders with our children's money.

 

[Markle]

I thought you would say that
Your broker knows better and plays you for a sucker

If Biden’s policies are so bad for your wallet, why is the market booming?

How desperate are you?

The failed Harris/Biden administration is literally pumping TRILLIONS of dollars into the economy. They are paying millions of people to NOT work and millions more a monthly stipend because they have kids.

Come on man, you're not ignorant. Desperate, yes, ignorant, no.

 

[rightwinger]

How desperate are you?

The failed Harris/Biden administration is literally pumping TRILLIONS of dollars into the economy. They are paying millions of people to NOT work and millions more a monthly stipend because they have kids.

Come on man, you're not ignorant. Desperate, yes, ignorant, no.

The Amazing Biden has a record stock market
Great time to be an investor
Great time to be an American

 

[struth]

The Amazing Biden has a record stock market
Great time to be an investor
Great time to be an American

You think the folks Xiden and Harris are paying to not work are investing that money?

As far as the folks that are working, Xiden's inflation is eating up all their extra money...so they don't have any to invest

The only folks benefiting from Xiden's trillion dollar dump into the market are the uber rich dem donors.....

 

[Markle]

Listen man I'm not going to sit here and go through every single tax loop hole rich people can use to get out of paying their fair share in taxes. But you see that is why people making $400k+ a year can have such a low effective tax rate. So you can keep blathering on and on about how bad the poor guy who makes $400k a year has it, but we all know what is really going on.

Then just share with us a couple. Share with us what tax "loopholes" are available to "rich" people that is not available to lower-income workers.

As you know, the distribution of income taxes paid is grossly out of balance. Shouldn't everyone pay toward supporting our government?

 

[Markle]

I don’t think you’re aware of what life is like as a poor person.

What is your point?

You're right, I have no clue as to what life is like as a poor person. I made good decisions.

 

[pknopp]

Sure you can. Say bub bye to Medicaid, Medicare, welfare, subsidies, tons of ways to cut spending. Pass the fucking Balanced Budget Amendment and put the dollar back onto the Gold Standard.

Fail. You didn't address what I said. You created an entirely different argument. All the same, I'm not interested in fairy tales as I've said. We aren't going back to the gold standard so that is not an answer.

 

[Toro]

• President Joe Biden is expected to raise long-term capital-gains tax for the wealthiest Americans to 43.4%, including a surtax. That would be higher than the top federal tax rate on wage income. How the Biden capital gains tax proposal would hit the wealthy

How the Biden capital gains tax proposal would hit the wealthy

President Joe Biden is expected to double the top long-term capital gains rate to 43.4%. But investors shouldn't necessarily rush for the exits.

www.cnbc.com

"Unintended Consequences"...
1) Analyses show that every 10% gain in the capital gains tax rate leads to a 7% change in capital gains realizations. That suggests Biden’s rate increase — which represents a 66% effective increase in the rate, could lead to a 45% to 50% increase in capital gains sales, which could create a large downward force in the market.
So this would mean 401K fund managers would be selling easily 50% reduction in values.
So what are 401ks value today:
About one-third of U.S. adults (35%) said they personally owned stocks, bonds or mutual funds outside of retirement accounts in a Pew Research Center survey from September 2019.
With 39% of the $6 trillion total 401K assets invested in the market..or about $2.4 Trillion will be at risk of dropping at least 50% in value.

401(k) Plan Research: FAQs

Frequently Asked Questions About 401(k) Plan Research How la

www.ici.org

Now that is just the affect on stock market and then on 401ks and then on the 60 million Americans with 401ks.

401(k) Plan Research: FAQs

Frequently Asked Questions About 401(k) Plan Research How la

www.ici.org

Now what about jobs in America?
At one point under Trump

U.S. companies have repatriated $1 trillion since tax overhaul​

U.S. companies have repatriated $1 trillion since tax overhaul

That's still short of the $4 trillion in overseas profits that President Trump would return as a result of the 2017 tax law.

www.latimes.com

Corporations have brought back more than $1 trillion of overseas profits to the U.S. since Congress overhauled the international tax system and prodded companies to repatriate offshore funds, a report showed Thursday. (snip)
Investment banks and think tanks have estimated that American corporations held $1.5 trillion to $2.5 trillion in offshore cash at the time the law was enacted. Before the overhaul, companies were incentivized to keep profits overseas because they owed a 35% tax when bringing it back and could defer payment by keeping funds offshore.
The law set a one-time 15.5% tax rate on cash and 8% on non-cash or illiquid assets.
Compare and contrast the way that Presidents Trump and Obama chose to stimulate the American economy, each of them generating roughly a trillion dollars in “stimulus.”

One trillion dollars have flowed into the American economy as Trump’s tax law changes allowed companies to repatriate profits without tax penalty

President Trump’s tax reform has delivered more than a trillion dollars of stimulus to the American economy through corporations repatriating profits held overseas in order to avoid penalties that the tax law had imposed on bringing home the fu...

www.americanthinker.com

In summary folks... all the economic benefits of the "repatriation" and the capital gains tax cuts will result in nearly $10 trillion in economic losses to 60 million Americans at the minimum!

I'm not a fan of raising capital gains taxes, and think they should be lower.

However, when Trump cut capital gains taxes, almost all of the savings went into share buybacks, not capex. And most of those buybacks were done by the same Big Tech companies that so many on the alt-right hate these days.

There are proposals to ban share buybacks, or tax them. I oppose both. However, I don't think cutting capital gains taxes helps the working class. They mostly help the upper middle class and rich. That includes me. But most here won't benefit.

 

[gipper]

What is your point?

You're right, I have no clue as to what life is like as a poor person. I made good decisions.

Yeah poor people are poor because they made bad decisions.

Proof you’re uninformed.

 

[GMCGeneral]

Fail. You didn't address what I said. You created an entirely different argument. All the same, I'm not interested in fairy tales as I've said. We aren't going back to the gold standard so that is not an answer.

Sure it is. Get the Fed out of the babysitting business.

 

[Who_Me?]

Way to discourage investment and reduce economic growth just so you can expand social programs.

 

[pknopp]

Sure it is. Get the Fed out of the babysitting business.

Keep dreaming, it will solve nothing.

 

[Rigby5]

Maximum capital Gains rates have gone all over the place form a high of 70% to 18%. Regardless of rates, people continue to invest. There is no clear correlation between maximum capital gains rate and economic growth.

Since 1921, capital gains rate has been less than half the normal tax rate.

US Federal Capital Gains Tax Rate History - Historical Data

Historical data back to 1916 for maximum capital gains tax rates for the United States of America (USA).

www.forbestadvice.com

{...
Year Capital Gains Max

​

​	​	​	​	​	​
1916​	​	​	​	15%​	​
1917​	​	​	​	67%​	​
1918​	​	​	​	77%​	​
1919-21​	​	​	​	73%​	​
1922​	​	​	​	12.50%​	​
1923​	​	​	​	12.50%​	​
1924​	​	​	​	12.50%​	​
1925-28​	​	​	​	12.50%​	​
1929​	​	​	​	12.50%​	​
1930-31​	​	​	​	12.50%​	​
1932-33​	​	​	​	12.50%​	​
1934-35​	​	​	​	31.50%​	​
1936-37​	​	​	​	39%​	​
1938-40​	​	​	​	30%​	​
1941​	​	​	​	30%​	​
1942-43​	​	​	​	25%​	​

​

1944-45​	​	​	​	25%​	​
1946-47​	​	​	​	25%​	​
1948-49​	​	​	​	25%​	​
1950​	​	​	​	25%​	​
51-64​	​	​	​	25%​	​
64-67​	​	​	​	25%​	​
1968​	​	​	​	26.90%​	​
1969​	​	​	​	27.50%​	​
1970​	​	​	​	32.30%​	​
1971​	​	​	​	34.30%​	​
1972-75​	​	​	​	36.50%​	​
1976-77​	​	​	​	39.90%​	​
1978​	​	​	​	39%​	​
1979-80​	​	​	​	28%​	​
1981​	​	​	​	23.70%​	​
1982-86​	​	​	​	20%​	​
1987​	​	​	​	28%​	​
1988-90*​	​	​	​	28%/33%​	​
1991-92​	​	​	​	28.90%​	​
1993-96​	​	​	​	29.20%​	​
1997-2000​	​	​	​	21.20%​	​
2001​	​	​	​	21.20%​	​
2002​	​	​	​	21.20%​
2003-05​	​	​	​	16.10%​
2006-07​	​	​	​	15.70%​	​
2008-09​	​	​	​	15.40%​	​
2010-12​	​	​	​	15%​	​
2013-on​	​	​	​	25%​