Admit It, You'd Like to Be in a Union Too

[Jarhead]

You're earned sick leave and abused sick leave are different things retard, not theft.

You EARN sick leave when you are sick, by being sick.
If you take sick leave when you are not sick, you are a THIEF.

How can you earn sick leave when you are sick? that makes no damn sense.

you dont earn sick leave. Your employer/union affords you the right to get paid if you are sick and unable to work.

But to use "sick" as an excuse to not work, and still get paid without using your EARNED vacation days...then you are lying to your employer AND stealing wages that were not earned.

 

[High_Gravity]

You EARN sick leave when you are sick, by being sick.
If you take sick leave when you are not sick, you are a THIEF.

How can you earn sick leave when you are sick? that makes no damn sense.

How can an honest person collect money for being sick when he was/is not sick?

I worked for a private company and they also had a sick leave accrual system, most jobs do I believe.

 

[High_Gravity]

You EARN sick leave when you are sick, by being sick.
If you take sick leave when you are not sick, you are a THIEF.

How can you earn sick leave when you are sick? that makes no damn sense.

you dont earn sick leave. Your employer/union affords you the right to get paid if you are sick and unable to work.

But to use "sick" as an excuse to not work, and still get paid without using your EARNED vacation days...then you are lying to your employer AND stealing wages that were not earned.

I understand what you are saying but if I have to have surgery or a medical procedure and I use my sick leave that should be ok, where I work if you are gone for more than 2 days you are required to bring in a doctors note if you use sick leave.

 

[Bass v 2.0]

You're earned sick leave and abused sick leave are different things retard, not theft.

You EARN sick leave when you are sick, by being sick.
If you take sick leave when you are not sick, you are a THIEF.

How can you earn sick leave when you are sick? that makes no damn sense.

He's a retard that knows nothing about the federal system. He's unaware that federal employees who run out of sick days don't get paid unless some other federal workers donates leave time from their own hours and when that runs out its leave without pay, which means sitting home sick with no income and no sick leave time,

 

[Bass v 2.0]

You EARN sick leave when you are sick, by being sick.
If you take sick leave when you are not sick, you are a THIEF.

How can you earn sick leave when you are sick? that makes no damn sense.

you dont earn sick leave. Your employer/union affords you the right to get paid if you are sick and unable to work.

But to use "sick" as an excuse to not work, and still get paid without using your EARNED vacation days...then you are lying to your employer AND stealing wages that were not earned.

No argues that abusing sick leave is wrong but what does that have to do with the topic? That's not a reason to argue against sick leave accrual and or less max sick leave accrual, that's like say since some idiots drink drunk and abuse their driving privileges driving should be restricted for everyone,

 

[whitehall]

Some of us might be union members and some of us might want to latch on to lavish union benefits but all of us are taxpayers. Don't blame the unions for doing there jobs but on the other hand don't freaking riot when governors want to protect taxpayer funds by challenging municipal union powers.

I've always maintained that private unions are fine. More power to them, and they should be free to get what they can from private businesses, provided that the playing field remains level and does not favor one or the other.

However, I think public service unions should be banned, or at the very least, limited in scope and terms of what they can bargain for. Again, the playing field should be level and no one who takes a dime from the unions, should be allowed to have a say in what contracts are awarded to the unions.

BS, I am a federal worker and belong to a union and there is a lot that goes on that you know nothing about, don't make dumb contradicting arguments about level playing fields and advocate limiting public unions because of your envy.

Here you go folks. A federal employee who apparently thinks he is posting an argument when he says "....duh....a lot ...duh goes on...duh that you don't know about".

 

[High_Gravity]

You EARN sick leave when you are sick, by being sick.
If you take sick leave when you are not sick, you are a THIEF.

How can you earn sick leave when you are sick? that makes no damn sense.

He's a retard that knows nothing about the federal system. He's unaware that federal employees who run out of sick days don't get paid unless some other federal workers donates leave time from their own hours and when that runs out its leave without pay, which means sitting home sick with no income and no sick leave time,

Yup thats true, if you run out of leave you stop getting paid and get put on LWOP status, you stop accruing leave also at that point.

 

[Bass v 2.0]

I've always maintained that private unions are fine. More power to them, and they should be free to get what they can from private businesses, provided that the playing field remains level and does not favor one or the other.

However, I think public service unions should be banned, or at the very least, limited in scope and terms of what they can bargain for. Again, the playing field should be level and no one who takes a dime from the unions, should be allowed to have a say in what contracts are awarded to the unions.

BS, I am a federal worker and belong to a union and there is a lot that goes on that you know nothing about, don't make dumb contradicting arguments about level playing fields and advocate limiting public unions because of your envy.

Here you go folks. A federal employee who apparently thinks he is posting an argument when he says "....duh....a lot ...duh goes on...duh that you don't know about".

Here you go, a rightwingtard arguing against federal workers and unions he knows nothing about,

 

[High_Gravity]

Actually when I worked for a private company I earned more money in bonuses and gift cards for special celebrations like Christmas, birthdays etc. shit I used to get a $350 bonus every 3 months, thats something you never see in the government sector.

 

[Bass v 2.0]

Actually when I worked for a private company I earned more money in bonuses and gift cards for special celebrations like Christmas, birthdays etc. shit I used to get a $350 bonus every 3 months, thats something you never see in the government sector.

I work under the Army Working Capital Fund which means my salary is *NOT* directly paid for by an appropriation from Congress, ie, tax payers dollars, the organization I work for operates similar to and competes for contracts and work like a private organization and against private contractors, these retards have never heard of Working Capital funds that some federal workers work under, these funds operate based on revenue done by work meaning we earn our own.

 

[High_Gravity]

Actually when I worked for a private company I earned more money in bonuses and gift cards for special celebrations like Christmas, birthdays etc. shit I used to get a $350 bonus every 3 months, thats something you never see in the government sector.

I work under the Army Working Capital Fund which means my salary is *NOT* directly paid for by an appropriation from Congress, ie, tax payers dollars, the organization I work for operates similar to and competes for contracts and work like a private organization and against private contractors, these retards have never heard of Working Capital funds that some federal workers work under, these funds operate based on revenue done by work meaning we earn our own.

I just think so many people hate Obama and the government their taking out their frustrations directly on government employee, just my opinion.

 

[MikeK]

Public opinon is turning against unions with a vengeance that's just a fact. The work performed by union workers isn't priceless after all.

There are examples of abusive union power, such as the UAW in the 1970s, but such examples are the exceptions and not the rule. The vast majority of unions are ethically managed and base their equitable demands on careful assessment of an employers ability to comfortably and reasonably comply. So what we are seeing today is extreme overreaction on the part of the general public, which is fueled by right-wing corporatist propaganda, and which is determined to crush the union movement, thereby effectively tossing out the baby with the bathwater.

This trend is seriously self-defeating even to those who do not belong to unions and resent being unable to join one. Because whatever their existing occupation their wages are based on levels established over the years by the existence and the influence of unions. Were it not for unions the American worker would still be a wage slave working a 60+ hour week with no overtime standard, no benefits, no vacations or pensions. And because a rising tide raises all boats those in professional and white-collar occupations are similarly affected by the blood, sweat and tears efforts and sacrifices of the union movement -- which gave rise to the American Middle Class.

Unions are democratic entities. While it is convenient for all concerned to blame abusive union practices on union leadership in most examples the fault lies with membership. How many union members attend union meetings and pay attention to emerging issues? And how many are willing to vote against demands which they know to be excessive?

Those who dislike unions and are inclined to vote against union interests should learn more about the history of unions http://www.aflcio.org/aboutus/history/history/ and make a point of watching some interesting and entertaining as well as educational movies about unions, such as

Harlan County USA
The Molly McGuires
On The Waterfront
The Organizer
Native Land
Norma Rae
Matewan
Hoffa

Fix the unions. Don't kill them.

 

[Bass v 2.0]

Actually when I worked for a private company I earned more money in bonuses and gift cards for special celebrations like Christmas, birthdays etc. shit I used to get a $350 bonus every 3 months, thats something you never see in the government sector.

I work under the Army Working Capital Fund which means my salary is *NOT* directly paid for by an appropriation from Congress, ie, tax payers dollars, the organization I work for operates similar to and competes for contracts and work like a private organization and against private contractors, these retards have never heard of Working Capital funds that some federal workers work under, these funds operate based on revenue done by work meaning we earn our own.

I just think so many people hate Obama and the government their taking out their frustrations directly on government employee, just my opinion.

They're terribly misguided people that are brainwashed.

 

[whitehall]

Maybe lefties are confused about the role of government. The government isn't an employment office dedicated to hiring as many people is it can and offering them a decent living. I'm sorry and it might seem cold hearted but if we can get the job done with ten people we need to get rid of the other four or five. If we have ten thousand redundant commissions we need to merge them and get rid of the 8,000 that aren't needed. The preamble to the Constitution listed the duties of the federal government in two sentences, "To provide for the common defense" and "to promote the general welfare". Government doesn't create wealth, it confiscates money.

 

[Bass v 2.0]

Maybe lefties are confused about the role of government. The government isn't an employment office dedicated to hiring as many people is it can and offering them a decent living. I'm sorry and it might seem cold hearted but if we can get the job done with ten people we need to get rid of the other four or five. If we have ten thousand redundant commissions we need to merge them and get rid of the 8,000 that aren't needed. The preamble to the Constitution listed the duties of the federal government in two sentences, "To provide for the common defense" and "to promote the general welfare". Government doesn't create wealth, it confiscates money.

Shut up with this partisan BS, enough already.

 

[MikeK]

Maybe lefties are confused about the role of government. The government isn't an employment office dedicated to hiring as many people is it can and offering them a decent living. I'm sorry and it might seem cold hearted but if we can get the job done with ten people we need to get rid of the other four or five. If we have ten thousand redundant commissions we need to merge them and get rid of the 8,000 that aren't needed. The preamble to the Constitution listed the duties of the federal government in two sentences, "To provide for the common defense" and "to promote the general welfare". Government doesn't create wealth, it confiscates money.

Expedient hiring, while it might appear redundant and wasteful, is the way FDR managed to pull America out of the depression and foster the most impressive economic revival in history. In the simplest terms, the expedient creation of jobs, which is funded by increased taxation on upper income levels, is one very effective (and necessary) means of redistributing the Nation's wealth resources.

While it is easy to say, ". . . get rid of the other four or five," what you're saying in recessive times like these is increase unemployment, which is to increase poverty and homelessness, which is contributing to a very destructive social malignancy.

Whether or not it is "cold-hearted" to say "get rid of the other four or five," unless you can solve one problem without creating another of equal or possibly greater diimension, it is rather thoughtless. So what do you suggest we do with "the other four or five?"

With regard to your observation of the "common defense" and "general welfare" clauses in the Preamble, you must understand the Constituion was written at a time when the size and complexity of the modern United States was beyond the ability of the Framers to imagine. So the demands of our Union's maintenance require that such Constitutional specifications be regarded as minimum rather than maximum considerations. Simply stated, it would be impossible for the United States to function as a manageable entity were the prescriptions and principles of the Constitution adhered to without certain logical adjustments and practical interpretations.

 

[Avatar4321]

Ive never wanted to be in a union. In fact, id make every effort to oppose being in one if i had an option. I want to be judged according to my own merits. and Id rather own my own business.

 

[Avatar4321]

Maybe lefties are confused about the role of government. The government isn't an employment office dedicated to hiring as many people is it can and offering them a decent living. I'm sorry and it might seem cold hearted but if we can get the job done with ten people we need to get rid of the other four or five. If we have ten thousand redundant commissions we need to merge them and get rid of the 8,000 that aren't needed. The preamble to the Constitution listed the duties of the federal government in two sentences, "To provide for the common defense" and "to promote the general welfare". Government doesn't create wealth, it confiscates money.

Shut up with this partisan BS, enough already.

There is nothing partisan about the truth.

 

[daveman]

Useless fucktards have no arguments than to argue about the exc eptions and not the rule, dickheads.

Why do you fear your compensation being based on your performance?

Why do you fear arguing on topic and use strawmen?

When I want your opinion, I'll...I'll...

Well, hell. I dunno. I can't ever see myself wanting your opinion.

 

[daveman]

So using your logic; those who are unemployed were not the "best" or "most productive" or "union" employees? Interesting.

or...

Victims of a downturn in business...

But yes...the most productive, efficient, dedicated workers are the last to lose their jobs.

DO you not see the logic in it?

Yeah sure.........

So we'll just put you down in the "Can't See The Logic" column.