Another nail in Trump's coffin about to be pounded...

[WaitingFor2020]

The ACA replacement suggested by Trump is yet another fuck up.....

Follow this.......

Trump (going considerably back from his bullshit promise that his HC plan would cover EVERYBODY, be CHEAPER, and be BETTER)......is now laying out his new plan.

He proposes to allow pre-existing conditions to be insured, BUT has eliminated the mandate.....which anyone with a few functioning brain cells knows is WHAT insurance companies need to help defray the costs of insuring someone with diabetes.

But, it goes further.....Trump wants t give "tax credits" to the poor to help in paying for their health coverage........BUT, we should know that most of the poor pay little or NO taxes, so that these credits are meaningless....SWo these poor are royally screwed.

Wait until those coal miners in WVA and KY wwho "loved" Trump find out what he has done for them..........It'd be almost funny if it weren't so fucking sad.....

my my how did we ever survive before the almighty obama was prez

A lot of people didn't. They were at the mercy of the insurance company's bottom line. Even Ben Carson has said insurance companies/corporations have no business being in health care because the only way they can profit is by denying claims. Getting it yet, Frito-brain?

 

[Spare_change]

You're making the same old rhetorical argument - one without a shred of facts in it.

You claim that health insurance can be unaffordable for some. But you fail to recognize the refundable tax credits in which the other taxpayers give a gift so that you can buy insurance. Now, reality tells us that there will be certain percentage of people who will take the gift, and buy a new TV, instead of buying health insurance. You can't fix stupid.

Every sane person realizes that we will be paying for health care insurance for other people - we always have, and we always will. It's built right into our insurance policies (unfunded care drives hospital/doctor costs up, which drives insurance costs up), and we'll pay for it in a tax credit. We recognize that, and we accept that.

Your supposed approach to expanding Medicare, etc. is nothing more than socialized medicine that puts the government in charge of your healthcare. Instead, the new approach allows you to tailor your medical services to your needs, and you don't have to pay for those services for others that you don't want to.

Your argument looks good on paper - but it doesn't pass the harsh light of reality.

There will be millions who don't have coverage, and you and I will pay for them one way or the other. And what I'm proposing is not socialized medicine. And ironically, the "harsh light of reality" is what I deal with when helping my clients, their kids, and the employees of my business owner clients.

I know that you're ideologically obligated to oppose government at almost every turn, and I can see that you're fine with our seven-headed hydra.

So we'll see. And if folks can't afford coverage, too bad for them, they and their families probably deserve what happens to them.

Why should we care, anyway?
.

LOL ---- believe me, I am NOT "ideologically obligated".

I've been on your side ... I used to own a wealth management firm, and I've seen how it actually works. Interesting, isn't it, that your "seven-headed hydra" contains seven government programs, or programs dictated by the government.

That's more than a coincidence. Who do you suppose has created the monster we live with?

The government, of course. I'm tempted to say that they'll never get their act together enough to do what I want, but I don't know. The mess they're offering now won't work, and then there will be a kneejerk reaction in the other direction, because that's what we do.

What concerns me is that when that happens, we'll go to real socialized medicine, single payer, instead of what I want.

The GOP knows pure free market health care won't work, and they don't have to balls to do anything else beyond tweaking Obamacare. So be careful what you wish for, single payer is still a possibility.
.

You're opposed to single payer - and you say the free market approach won't work. What's your recommendaton? What do you want?

I've already said it: Expand the current Medicare/Medicare Supplement/Medicare Advantage system to all. Among other things, it would accomplish the following:

• End the insane, inefficient, inconsistent, seven-headed delivery/payment system we have now
• Retain free market competition and innovation on non-Medicare-approved services
• Take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers
• Provide a comprehensive public foundation for preventive & diagnostic treatment
• Simplify coverage schedules for health insurers
• Create a massive new preventive/diagnostic provider cottage industry
• Give people portability so that they're not stuck keeping a job for the insurance
• Eliminate traffic jams in ER once people no longer have to use them for basic care
• Open up massive new markets for insurers

... off the top of my head. Or, we can continue with the seven-headed beast and Frankenstein's Monster 2.0.
.

Explain how that is different than socialized medicine.

 

[WaitingFor2020]

The ACA replacement suggested by Trump is yet another fuck up.....

Follow this.......

Trump (going considerably back from his bullshit promise that his HC plan would cover EVERYBODY, be CHEAPER, and be BETTER)......is now laying out his new plan.

He proposes to allow pre-existing conditions to be insured, BUT has eliminated the mandate.....which anyone with a few functioning brain cells knows is WHAT insurance companies need to help defray the costs of insuring someone with diabetes.

But, it goes further.....Trump wants t give "tax credits" to the poor to help in paying for their health coverage........BUT, we should know that most of the poor pay little or NO taxes, so that these credits are meaningless....SWo these poor are royally screwed.

Wait until those coal miners in WVA and KY wwho "loved" Trump find out what he has done for them..........It'd be almost funny if it weren't so fucking sad.....

This is step in the right direction.

WVA and KY will be able to do thier own now that we won't be carrying the cost of the freeloaders in blue states.

Let the low IQ red state shit stains die

Red States Are Welfare Queens


The 7 Biggest Deadbeat States Who Mooch Off Taxpayers All Vote Republican

Yep! So stupid they continually vote against their own interests

 

[WaitingFor2020]

This is step in the right direction.

WVA and KY will be able to do thier own now that we won't be carrying the cost of the freeloaders in blue states.

Just wait until the CBO crunches the numbers......
I'm going to LOVE it.

The same CBO that screwed up the numbers on Obamacare.

I am sure you will.

Why don't you pull your head out of your ass and get over your butthurt ?

You lost.

Suck on it.

Ha! Trump is going to suck the life out of his idiot minions, too. You're just too stupid to know it yet

 

[tyroneweaver]

The ACA replacement suggested by Trump is yet another fuck up.....

Follow this.......

Trump (going considerably back from his bullshit promise that his HC plan would cover EVERYBODY, be CHEAPER, and be BETTER)......is now laying out his new plan.

He proposes to allow pre-existing conditions to be insured, BUT has eliminated the mandate.....which anyone with a few functioning brain cells knows is WHAT insurance companies need to help defray the costs of insuring someone with diabetes.

But, it goes further.....Trump wants t give "tax credits" to the poor to help in paying for their health coverage........BUT, we should know that most of the poor pay little or NO taxes, so that these credits are meaningless....SWo these poor are royally screwed.

Wait until those coal miners in WVA and KY wwho "loved" Trump find out what he has done for them..........It'd be almost funny if it weren't so fucking sad.....

my my how did we ever survive before the almighty obama was prez

A lot of people didn't. They were at the mercy of the insurance company's bottom line. Even Ben Carson has said insurance companies/corporations have no business being in health care because the only way they can profit is by denying claims. Getting it yet, Frito-brain?

Worked for me. I've never had a claim denied.
But that's the problem you libs have. Since it worked for me that wasn't fair. So you took over the "entire" system.
My wife has been a medical secretary up until she retired. People weren't denied insurance.
They were denied what wasn't covered under their plan.

 

[Mac1958]

There will be millions who don't have coverage, and you and I will pay for them one way or the other. And what I'm proposing is not socialized medicine. And ironically, the "harsh light of reality" is what I deal with when helping my clients, their kids, and the employees of my business owner clients.

I know that you're ideologically obligated to oppose government at almost every turn, and I can see that you're fine with our seven-headed hydra.

So we'll see. And if folks can't afford coverage, too bad for them, they and their families probably deserve what happens to them.

Why should we care, anyway?
.

LOL ---- believe me, I am NOT "ideologically obligated".

I've been on your side ... I used to own a wealth management firm, and I've seen how it actually works. Interesting, isn't it, that your "seven-headed hydra" contains seven government programs, or programs dictated by the government.

That's more than a coincidence. Who do you suppose has created the monster we live with?

The government, of course. I'm tempted to say that they'll never get their act together enough to do what I want, but I don't know. The mess they're offering now won't work, and then there will be a kneejerk reaction in the other direction, because that's what we do.

What concerns me is that when that happens, we'll go to real socialized medicine, single payer, instead of what I want.

The GOP knows pure free market health care won't work, and they don't have to balls to do anything else beyond tweaking Obamacare. So be careful what you wish for, single payer is still a possibility.
.

You're opposed to single payer - and you say the free market approach won't work. What's your recommendaton? What do you want?

I've already said it: Expand the current Medicare/Medicare Supplement/Medicare Advantage system to all. Among other things, it would accomplish the following:

• End the insane, inefficient, inconsistent, seven-headed delivery/payment system we have now
• Retain free market competition and innovation on non-Medicare-approved services
• Take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers
• Provide a comprehensive public foundation for preventive & diagnostic treatment
• Simplify coverage schedules for health insurers
• Create a massive new preventive/diagnostic provider cottage industry
• Give people portability so that they're not stuck keeping a job for the insurance
• Eliminate traffic jams in ER once people no longer have to use them for basic care
• Open up massive new markets for insurers

... off the top of my head. Or, we can continue with the seven-headed beast and Frankenstein's Monster 2.0.
.

Explain how that is different than socialized medicine.

Come on. Socialized medicine would not have the integral free market Medicare Supplement/Medicare Advantage component. You don't see a United Health Care or Cigna in Cuba.

Medicare Supplements fill the (significant) gaps in Medicare coverage. Medicare Advantage plans completely take over for Medicare and function essentially as an HMO. Even with strong regulations (many of which are on the marketing side to protect seniors), insurance companies have flourished with both plans because they have been free to add extra goodies for competitive edge.

And by the way, right now Medicare covers 80% of expenses. We could - and you have never seen this idea anywhere - have a sliding scale where Medicare only covers 40% or 50% when we're younger and healthier and the free market plans would cover the rest when those premiums would be lower, and then have that co-insurance increase with age. Then we include basic low income provisions, some smart tort reform, and off we go. And I guarantee you that countries like England, France, Germany and Sweden will be watching closely.

One system, not seven (7). Clear plan choices and coverages, not hundreds. Preventive, diagnostic and basic care for all. Complete portability. Free market competition and innovation. The only things standing in the way here are PARTISAN POLITICS, radio talk show hosts and cowardly politicians.
.

 

[Spare_change]

LOL ---- believe me, I am NOT "ideologically obligated".

I've been on your side ... I used to own a wealth management firm, and I've seen how it actually works. Interesting, isn't it, that your "seven-headed hydra" contains seven government programs, or programs dictated by the government.

That's more than a coincidence. Who do you suppose has created the monster we live with?

The government, of course. I'm tempted to say that they'll never get their act together enough to do what I want, but I don't know. The mess they're offering now won't work, and then there will be a kneejerk reaction in the other direction, because that's what we do.

What concerns me is that when that happens, we'll go to real socialized medicine, single payer, instead of what I want.

The GOP knows pure free market health care won't work, and they don't have to balls to do anything else beyond tweaking Obamacare. So be careful what you wish for, single payer is still a possibility.
.

You're opposed to single payer - and you say the free market approach won't work. What's your recommendaton? What do you want?

I've already said it: Expand the current Medicare/Medicare Supplement/Medicare Advantage system to all. Among other things, it would accomplish the following:

• End the insane, inefficient, inconsistent, seven-headed delivery/payment system we have now
• Retain free market competition and innovation on non-Medicare-approved services
• Take a massive cost monkey off the backs of American employers
• Provide a comprehensive public foundation for preventive & diagnostic treatment
• Simplify coverage schedules for health insurers
• Create a massive new preventive/diagnostic provider cottage industry
• Give people portability so that they're not stuck keeping a job for the insurance
• Eliminate traffic jams in ER once people no longer have to use them for basic care
• Open up massive new markets for insurers

... off the top of my head. Or, we can continue with the seven-headed beast and Frankenstein's Monster 2.0.
.

Explain how that is different than socialized medicine.

Come on. Socialized medicine would not have the integral free market Medicare Supplement/Medicare Advantage component. You don't see a United Health Care or Cigna in Cuba.

Medicare Supplements fill the (significant) gaps in Medicare coverage. Medicare Advantage plans completely take over for Medicare and function essentially as an HMO. Even with strong regulations (many of which are on the marketing side to protect seniors), insurance companies have flourished with both plans because they have been free to add extra goodies for competitive edge.

And by the way, right now Medicare covers 80% of expenses. We could - and you have never seen this idea anywhere - have a sliding scale where Medicare only covers 40% or 50% when we're younger and healthier and the free market plans would cover the rest when those premiums would be lower, and then have that co-insurance increase with age. Then we include basic low income provisions, some smart tort reform, and off we go. And I guarantee you that countries like England, France, Germany and Sweden will be watching closely.

One system, not seven (7). Clear plan choices and coverages, not hundreds. Preventive, diagnostic and basic care for all. Complete portability. Free market competition and innovation. The only things standing in the way here are PARTISAN POLITICS, radio talk show hosts and cowardly politicians.
.

That's nothing more than another stop on the road to socialized medicine. Today, you propose a sliding scale of 40%, tomorrow it's 45% (after all, nobody likes to actually pay for what they get), and the day after it's 80% again. I don't see the advantage (other than to providers) of having a subsidized healthcare insurance.

You're right, though - we need to eliminate the seven choice system. But, the only way to do that is to eliminate them all. (And, I say this as an eligible user of Medicare, Tricare, and the VA system). There is only one thing - and one thing, alone - that will drive down the cost of anything - including healthcare - and that is competition. As long as politicians can trade entitlements for votes, we will always have the mess we have today.

I recognize that most people have constructed their retirement life around the supposition that Medicare, etc. will always be there, so there needs to be some long-term phase-out program. I also recognize that there will always be some who can't provide for themselves, so there needs to be a medical safety net (undoubtedly taxpayer funded). But, in the long term, the only way to control costs is to allow unfettered competition.