Asking for some editing behavior changes. (Selective Quoting)

[flacaltenn]

Get Chicharron the "admin" to go into the software and out "multi quote"...after Semana Santa I suppose ? WyTF does a site have monitors that cant handle admin access ?

It's a long story.. We used to be coupled and overlapped with Admin when I joined Mod Staff back in 2012 or so... And we had an Admin for USMB that DID give a couple mods Admin access. But the parent company reorganized and mod staff has been given PRETTY AUTONOMOUS control over editorial decisions, rules, and member service -- so it's NOT all bad..

And frankly, after 30 years in high tech, and having very high standards for both hardware/software, I just cannot DEAL with the buggy crap that passes for expensive applications these days.. It truly irks me..

 

[flacaltenn]

OMG.

I yam doomed.

Yeah. I'm that bad.

I just learned how to do smilies!

It's summer school time for you young lady.... LOL,...

 

[OldLady]

If someone alters my words in a quote box I report them. But nothing happens to them. They ought to be banned for at least a month. Hell hath no fury like an English major misquoted.

 

[Jitss617]

Mod staff has been working with the IT consultants to find a FIX for the mile long quotes you get when folks JUST use the big static "reply" button at the bottom of every post next to the "post rating - like" button.. Quotes stack up pretty quickly if EVERYBODY does it that way in a thread.. IMO and opinion of others, there SHOULD BE a "depth of quotes" setting in the newest version of Xenforo, but at their USER forum, there's no clear guidance on FINDING IT or using it...

So we have an outbreak of "infectious quoting" goin on here, and mod staff is ASKING you to learn to use the "selective quoting" options in the interim to practice "quote distancing" from each other..

Here's the quick start version of the tip.. Might be difficult or even impossible on MOBILE -- but if it IS -- you guys get a pass while everyone helps to "break up the spread"...

1) Instead of just pounding the big REPLY button, go to the material content you want to quote and HIGHLIGHT only the material YOU WANT to respond to..
2) When you're done highlighting, a little drop down panel will pop up at the lower right of the material you quoted. There are 2 buttons of choice.. One is "reply" the other is "+quote"... Let's deal only with the "reply" option and the "+quote:" can be for the grad level class or for you to experiment with..
3) When you choose the "reply" from the highlighted material it goes into your editing box -- ready for you to respond. Respond to THAT material..
4) You can REPEAT this again for a 2nd Part of the material you want to respond to.. Just go back to the post you're quoting from and highlight ANOTHER "chunk of wisdom" you want to comment on.. MAKE SURE your CURSOR in the editing box is at the END of where you were typing a response BEFORE you hit the drop down reply and send it to the edit box.. You can FIX the position of these "additional quotes" if it ends up in the wrong place...
5) Not only can use this selective quoting for responding to ONE older post at a time, YOU COULD drop sections of OTHER member quotes into the same reply if you wanted to.. I don't advise that because you might confuse members as to WHOM you're trolling at the moment.. LOL....

We will be pulling some strings on Xenforo for a REAL answer.. But in the meantime, you'll help make USMB more readable and also cut down on the #of Post Alerts you're receiving from threads you left DAYS before...

Thanks and Stay Well

Thank you! Also when someone responds to something I said I click expand and I have to scroll for miles! Annoying

 

[deannalw]

It's summer school time for you young lady.... LOL,...

Check it out!


I've been doing this all over the place now, lol!

Like a cat with a new ball of yarn.

 

[deannalw]

If someone alters my words in a quote box I report them. But nothing happens to them. They ought to be banned for at least a month. Hell hath no fury like an English major misquoted.

Ok nazi

You are in a no flame, behave yourself zone.

Stupid.

 

[flacaltenn]

OK -- final exam time.. Your summer is YOURS !!!

Now -- can ya keep up???

Check it out!

I did and I'm impressed.. Where are those gold stars???

I've been doing this all over the place now, lol!

Just dont pull this stunt in the FZ -- they'll make fun of you...

Like a cat with a new ball of yarn.

We don't have to spend much on you... Would ya like an empty cardboard box to go with the yarn???

 

[iceberg]

I've been deleting the nested quotes ... easy peasy ...

It's a pain in the ass to even try to read posts that are 1 line of text and 10 pages of lines.

 

[rightwinger]

I've been deleting the nested quotes ... easy peasy ...

It's a pain in the ass to even try to read posts that are 1 line of text and 10 pages of lines.

When are they going to fix it?

We didn’t have these problems with the old format and we had more functions.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Above all else, there is one thing I think can be done to most greatly mitigate the problem cause by the endlessly-nested quotes.

It has long been the case, even before the Upgrayedd, that what is displayed, initially, is the top of the whole quote chain. This includes all the So-and-So Said: lines, and, if there is room after that, the first part of the earliest actual quote in the chain. To see the latest quote, to which the post you're now reading is an actual reply, you have to click the “Click to expand…” link, and expand the entire block.

What is really needed here, is for the non-expanded form of the quote block to be arranged so that it prioritizes the most recent quotes in the chain, instead of the most distantly-past quotes as it now does; that is, that without hitting the “Click to expand…” link, what is displayed in the quote chain in a reply includes the most recent quote, the next most recent, if there is room, the next most recent after that, and so on, as those are what are more important i understanding the context of the current pos.

———

Of course, a big part of the issue, too, is that unlike every other forum I've ever been on, the default, when quoting a post, is to quote the entire chain of posts quoted in that one to which you are replying. On every other forum, only the actual post to which you are replying is quoted, and not those quoted in it.

I do see, in many instances, legitimate need to quote back a layer or two, to preserve context, but in many cases here, quoting the entire quote chain leading up to the current post gets rather ridiculous.

What I think would work well,is for there to be a default of perhaps two or three layers back, that get quoted, with a drop-down or some other control that you can select to change that on a post-by-post basis, if you just that deeper quoting is needed in a particular post, or perhaps no quoting back beyond the post to which one is directly replying. That's a determination that really should be made by the person posting a reply, at the time the reply is made, and I am all for making it easier to do so.

 

[DrLove]

Mod staff has been working with the IT consultants to find a FIX for the mile long quotes you get when folks JUST use the big static "reply" button at the bottom of every post next to the "post rating - like" button.. Quotes stack up pretty quickly if EVERYBODY does it that way in a thread.. IMO and opinion of others, there SHOULD BE a "depth of quotes" setting in the newest version of Xenforo, but at their USER forum, there's no clear guidance on FINDING IT or using it...

So we have an outbreak of "infectious quoting" goin on here, and mod staff is ASKING you to learn to use the "selective quoting" options in the interim to practice "quote distancing" from each other..

Here's the quick start version of the tip.. Might be difficult or even impossible on MOBILE -- but if it IS -- you guys get a pass while everyone helps to "break up the spread"...

1) Instead of just pounding the big REPLY button, go to the material content you want to quote and HIGHLIGHT only the material YOU WANT to respond to..
2) When you're done highlighting, a little drop down panel will pop up at the lower right of the material you quoted. There are 2 buttons of choice.. One is "reply" the other is "+quote"... Let's deal only with the "reply" option and the "+quote:" can be for the grad level class or for you to experiment with..
3) When you choose the "reply" from the highlighted material it goes into your editing box -- ready for you to respond. Respond to THAT material..
4) You can REPEAT this again for a 2nd Part of the material you want to respond to.. Just go back to the post you're quoting from and highlight ANOTHER "chunk of wisdom" you want to comment on.. MAKE SURE your CURSOR in the editing box is at the END of where you were typing a response BEFORE you hit the drop down reply and send it to the edit box.. You can FIX the position of these "additional quotes" if it ends up in the wrong place...
5) Not only can use this selective quoting for responding to ONE older post at a time, YOU COULD drop sections of OTHER member quotes into the same reply if you wanted to.. I don't advise that because you might confuse members as to WHOM you're trolling at the moment.. LOL....

We will be pulling some strings on Xenforo for a REAL answer.. But in the meantime, you'll help make USMB more readable and also cut down on the #of Post Alerts you're receiving from threads you left DAYS before...

Thanks and Stay Well

This is the only board I've ever been on which didn't limit the quotes to a person responding directly to something you said. Nothing more annoying than making endless trips to the Alert section only to find some mundane back and forth argument that has nothing to do with you, or even with the OP. Thanks for working on it, and for the tips!

 

[SassyIrishLass]

Lol a site change should take 24 hours or less....this dump took a month.

Beta is your friend. Total incompetence

 

[Bob Blaylock]

By the way... There is a rule in the Posting Guidelines on our Home Page, that when QUOTING a member --- you CANNOT shorten the quote in a manner that changes the INTENT of the poster you are quoting.. SO -- if you're adapting to this "selective quoting" technique, give a FAIR REPRESENTATION of what the member was asserting.. In a way that DOESN'T give a "cable network news" type of quote that is OUT OF CONTEXT...

I think it should be obvious that intentionally changing someone else's quote, with the intent of making it appear that someone meant something different than what he originally wrote, is wrong, and ought not be allowed. Editing down a quote, to remove superfluous stuff, and emphasize the part to which one is responding, on te other hand, is legitimate, and often necessary to preserve clarity.

I hope that in enforcing such a rule, it is clearly understood that the judgement as to whether a quote has been wrongfully edited is often highly subjective, and that the one doing the editing is being given a reasonable benefit of doubt.


On a somewhat related note, I'd like to bring up a practice that is common ad accepted on every other forum in which I've ever participated, but apparently not here, as I've been dinged for it a few times. I'd like to suggest that it ought to be allowed here, provided that when one does it, one makes it very clear that that is what one is doing.

It consists of editing a quote, in such a manner that might change or even reverse its meaning,but where the edits are made obvious, and where it is followed by a statement such as “Fixed it for you.”. In fact, on most other forums, the abbreviation “FIFY” is understood as having that meaning, and being an acceptable alternative to spelling out the whole phrase.

Sometimes, it is used to express near, but not-quite complete agreement; sometimes it is used to express complete disagreement; sometimes it is used for humorous effect; sometimes even as a form of mockery.

But this is the only forum I've ever been on on which it was not allowed.

I'm sure I got dinged for this example, though it was allowed to remain.

If you're a f'ing Rusky I'll head down there and kick kiss your butt

Fixed it for you.

———

 

[Bob Blaylock]

This is the only board I've ever been on which didn't limit the quotes to a person responding directly to something you said. Nothing more annoying than making endless trips to the Alert section only to find some mundane back and forth argument that has nothing to do with you, or even with the OP.

That's a minor gripe of mine, as well. Possibly even having abandoned a particular discussion, after it deteriorated too far from its original context, I'll continue to get notified that I was quoted, for posts where my last post is many layers down the quote chain, very far removed from the current context of the post for which I got notified.

Making it easier for posters to limit the depth of back-quoting, and strongly encouraging them to do so, would go a long way toward mitigating this. Perhaps also implementing some setting by which each user is able to specify that he will only be notified of being quoted, if his post is no more than X (where X is a number that each user can select for himself, perhaps otherwise defaulting to two or three, at most) layers back in the quote chain, would be good too.

 

[OldLady]

Hey, FCT, as long as you're here:

WHERE ARE OUR NEW REACTION DOOHICKEYS? You've been promising them "nexr week" for a month now.

If we're breaking old habits by not just hitting reply to a post with a long string, it's only fair we get a more grown up choice in the reactions.

 

[OldLady]

Making it easier for posters to limit the depth of back-quoting,

It's easy. It's just remembering, breaking old habits.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Not really directly on-topic in this thread, but another thread in which I brought this up seems to have been ignored, so I'm putting this here, where I hope it will not be:

Tapatalk support vanished with the Upgrayedd. Tapatalk now no longer even recognizes the existence of this forum.

At the same time, the web interface for editing messages now works very, very badly on mobile devices, where it worked quite well before the Upgrayedd.

Any hope of getting these fixed? As things currently stand, it is much more difficult to participate in this forum from a mobile device than it was before the Upgrayedd. I find this ironic, since somewhere in the aftermath, I saw an explicit statement that part of the purpose of the Upgrayedd was to improve support for mobile devices, but the reality is that mobile devices were much, much better supported by this forum before the Upgrayedd.

 

[Monk-Eye]

" Volume As A Substitute For Value "

* Enforcing Client Oversight To Avert Storage Fluff And Pointless References *

It does not appear that the Multi-Quote button is working correctly as there does not appear to be a difference in the number of quotes ( nested are included ) whether it is optioned or not .

Perhaps the issue is that the Multi-Quote feature is should also be implemented with a Multi-Quote limit of 1 , so that any reply to a post would only copy the previous response and any multi-quote selected and not all nested quotes .

It would be purposeful to ensure that manually adding additional quotes , nested or otherwise , would not be blocked from posting .

vBulletin Manual - Message Posting and Editing Options

www.vbulletin.com

Multi-Quote Quote Limit
Enter a value to limit the number of quotes that can be created with Multi-Quote, once this limit is reached the user will be unable to add any more quotes.

Multi-Quote Enabled
If this option is enabled, an additional button will appear on posts. A user may click as many of these buttons as they wish. Once they click a reply button, the content of each of the selected posts will be quoted and shown in the reply window.

* Awe Crap *

That was for vBulletin .

This is for XenForo - Nested Quotes .

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Oh, here's another nasty issue.

When you go to the “All posts” under the “What's new” menu, of course, you get a list of all the threads in which posts have occurred, in reverse chronological order of the last post. This page, by default, “refreshes” every sixty seconds.

There is not any circumstances that I can imagine, under which I would want a page like this to “refresh” while I am trying to read through it, and pick out links to follow therefrom. At best, it is extremely annoying and disruptive when the page “refreshes”, causing me to lose my place in it.

Clicking on the icon circled here in green will temporarily turns this feature off, but it always eventually turns on again.

If this “feature” were to be eradicated completely, I would shed no tears for it, and I doubt anyone else would, either. At the very least, this feature really needs to be turned off by default, and certainly, if a user turns it off, it should never turn on again unless the user explicitly indicates that he wants it turned on.

[/I]

 

[flacaltenn]

I think it should be obvious that intentionally changing someone else's quote, with the intent of making it appear that someone meant something different than what he originally wrote, is wrong, and ought not be allowed. Editing down a quote, to remove superfluous stuff, and emphasize the part to which one is responding, on te other hand, is legitimate, and often necessary to preserve clarity.

I hope that in enforcing such a rule, it is clearly understood that the judgement as to whether a quote has been wrongfully edited is often highly subjective, and that the one doing the editing is being given a reasonable benefit of doubt.

You're correct and we do make that judgement.. When somebody ignores the IMPORTANT points and just takes "a sound bite" -- that's changing the INTENT of the post..

When you're using selective editing however, and addressing the whole quote piece by piece, we take into account EVERYTHING you're addressing in your reply.. But you should make sure that if you're punking someone back in ONE place in the reply -- you also have responded to enough topical material in other selected quotes in your reply...