Beware the Marxist world of Kamalla Harris: "There’s a big difference between equality and equity."

[Hum Dinger]

Yeah? I fear that too. You don't?

Do you really want to be forced to be "productive"? How is that different than slavery?

I have been forced to be productive since 1975. I need a place to live, food to eat, to support a family and make sure that my children have opportunity.

However, my ability to have any capitalist initiative was destroyed by the extremely low pay when I was young. My employers made sure that I lived paycheck to paycheck - despite the fact that I produced far more than I was being paid. They got wealthy from my hard work, intelligence and naive good will.

That's what capitalism has become - the economically advantaged taking advantage of the economically disadvantaged.

 

[WEATHER53]

The key to understanding the MAGA cult, is that they are Mussolini fascists.

Mussolini was anti-Liberal, Anti-Progressive & Anti-Socialist. His goal was to preserve the Feudal Socio-economic order that had been left after the King of Italy abdicated.

The majority of the people elected to the new Italian Parliament were liberals, progressives and Socialists who had started making major changes to the existing feudal socio-economic order.

Mussolini convinced Italian WWI vets that changing the feudal socio-economic order was Anti-Italian and used them to overthrow the Democratically elected government.

The same thing happened in Spain with Franco - Franco succeeded. Spain remained an economic & cultural shit hole until Franco died 40 years later.

Now the MAGA movement is trying to permanently instantiate a rigid socio-economic order whereby everyone's status is determined by their birth right instead of by personal achievement.

The wealthy are born wealthy, and they deserve to be wealthy for that reason. The poor are born poor, and they deserve to be poor for the same.

We are a very, very long way from being a country where either equality or equity are a reality. But those are goals that every American should believe in. The goals of the fascist MAGA movement are antithetical to American values.

The MAGA cult is trying to stop personal achievement from determining people's status in life- they've mostly been born into a privileged class - they desperately want to keep the socio-economic status the way it is or return things to the way they were.

Only in the mind of the mindless
What utter victim rhetoric
Poor babies just have all their chances at life snatched away by industrious types who apply themselves . Pearl clutching horror that is for the children

 

[WEATHER53]

I have been forced to be productive since 1975. I need a place to live, food to eat, to support a family and make sure that my children have opportunity.

However, my ability to have any capitalist initiative was destroyed by the extremely low pay when I was young. My employers made sure that I lived paycheck to paycheck - despite the fact that I produced far more than I was being paid. They got wealthy from my hard work, intelligence and naive good will.

That's what capitalism has become - the economically advantaged taking advantage of the economically disadvantaged.

You are a true oppressed victim of earning an income . Gasp!
Double gasp

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

Still sounds like the same thing to me. The employer is paying a person at the end of all this yes?

Yes. But the person getting paid is not the determining factor here.

I'm confused about what you're disagreeing with.

Then why are you asking me what I'm confused about?

 

[Curried Goats]

Yes. But the person getting paid is not the determining factor here.

No? It's not their skill and their knowledge as you said earlier? They seem pretty integral to the whole process.

Then why are you asking me what I'm confused about?

For clarification on your gripe. I don't understand the nature of it.

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

He rents the person's life and takes the produce.

Don't be an idiot. No, he does not rent the person's life for Christ's sake.

What that person produces with his or her life (energy, presence, time, their body and mind), belongs to their capitalist master.

It doesn't belong to him, he pays for it.

The person is paid the lowest wage the employer i.e. exploiter can get away paying. Whatever the employer can pay in wages, to possess and sell the products of their employee's labor, is what is paid. Capitalism is based on wages, without it there's no market or paying consumer. Keep that in mind. With the advent of advanced automation and artificial intelligence, socialism becomes a necessity.

What is socialism going to do, pay you for doing nothing?

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

No? It's not their skill and their knowledge as you said earlier? They seem pretty integral to the whole process.

It is not the determining factor in regards to the question of value of the person vis-a-vis the value of the person's work.

For clarification on your gripe. I don't understand the nature of it.

Of course you don't.

 

[TruthNotBS]

​

 

[Curried Goats]

It is not the determining factor in regards to the question of value of the person vis-a-vis the value of the person's work.

Of course you don't.

The person isn't the determining factor in the value of their own work? Yeah. I admit I don't understand that. Happily.

 

[Billo_Really]

'Equity' is hideous, and should not be tolerated in a free capitalistic society!!

We all should be on board for 'equality'. We know, that has not been the case in the past, but the goal starting today, is that everyone should have an equal opportunity.

'Equity' on the other hand, is a whole different animal, and is very un-American!

Not surprisingly, a Marxist will always be for 'equity', where you take and give depending on their needs. "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs". Sound familliar? This is the world that Kamalla Harris wants for America.

"The government cannot deny rights to certain people because they are black, female, Muslim, etc.—this would be unequal treatment. A mandate to foster equity, though, would give the government power to violate these rights in order to achieve identical social results for all people. In accordance with this thinking, the authorities might be justified in giving some people more rights than others."

Kamala Harris Says Equal Outcomes Should Be the Goal of Public Policy​

"There’s a big difference between equality and equity."​

Kamala Harris Says Equal Outcomes Should Be the Goal of Public Policy

"There’s a big difference between equality and equity."

reason.com

Harris is not a Marxist.

 

[AZrailwhale]

No moron. You get paid based on what you can leverage not your value.

Your value is what allows you leverage. If you provide no value to your employer, he fires you when you complain and gets a more pliable employee.

 

[Curried Goats]

Your value is what allows you leverage. If you provide no value to your employer, he fires you when you complain and gets a more pliable employee.

Your value is only part of what allows you leverage.

 

[AZrailwhale]

In profits. That's value for the employer, profits. Your employer owns everything you produce and provides you with a wage, which is worth much less than the market value of what you're producing.

And every employee is free to take his skills and sell them on the open market and take the financial risks the employer does. That's what capitalism is at its base.

 

[AZrailwhale]

Wrong

You confuse normal behavior with an obligation. It is normal behavior to try and help others in need but that is volunatry it is not an obligation. Nor does this imply an obligation beyond a negative one.

So you first point is debunked

your second point does not even address any of my statements it is merely a rehash of the flase claims you originally made. Yes cooperation allows people to thrive. But cooperation by definition is volunarty not forced nor does it come from obligation. It comes from regonition of mutual benefit. So your second point is debunked.

Claiming that infrastructure comes from public moeny does not prove that it HAS to be funded by public money,

Social contracts are imasginary they are notr some sort of foundational truth. they are ambiguous and used in your case as nothing more than an excuse to force others to act think and behave as you wish.

Your is the dangerous fallacy. You post long winded hyperpbole and rheotric to justify force and violence. As all marxists do,

We have no obligation beyond non interference. everyone is capable of providing their own basics in a captialist society and succeeding beyond that

No one has the right to the product of another. Your claim to the contrary is defense of true exploitation which is what amrxism is about

A good example would be California's toll freeways. they are paid for and maintained by private industry and turn a nice profit.

 

[Ghost of a Rider]

The person isn't the determining factor in the value of their own work? Yeah. I admit I don't understand that. Happily.

Not what I said, dumbass.

 

[AZrailwhale]

I've always been disgusted by the response of Conservatives to the phrase:

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs"

It seems that Conservatives only pay attention to the second half of the statement: "to each according to his needs". That idea is absolutely unacceptable to them. They thrive on the suffering of others - to make themselves feel superior.

What Conservatives tend to ignore is the first half of that statement: "From each according to his ability"

If everyone produced "according to his ability", we would have abundance that would exponentially surpass what was needed to provide for everyone's needs.

But that's also what Conservative fear - they would be forced to be productive.

In the minds of Conservatives, the modern "American Dream" is to be super wealthy without making any productive contribution to society. They want to own everything and control everything without so much as lifting a finger to produce anything.

And your attitude disgusts me. Why should anyone have the fruits of their labor taken from them to support someone else who refuses to produce. It's the old parable of the ant and grasshopper. Also, humans NEVER produce up to their capacity when the fruits of their labor are seized and given to others.

 

[sparky]

That's what capitalism has become - the economically advantaged taking advantage of the economically disadvantaged.

Yet in a capitalist system ,you could have been one of the 'economically advantaged' , in a socialist system you would not have had such an opportunity Dinger

~S~

 

[Curried Goats]

Not what I said, dumbass.

So what are you saying because the original person I was responding to seems to have understood me just fine?

 

[Soupnazi630]

I've always been disgusted by the response of Conservatives to the phrase:

"From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs"

It seems that Conservatives only pay attention to the second half of the statement: "to each according to his needs". That idea is absolutely unacceptable to them. They thrive on the suffering of others - to make themselves feel superior.

What Conservatives tend to ignore is the first half of that statement: "From each according to his ability"

If everyone produced "according to his ability", we would have abundance that would exponentially surpass what was needed to provide for everyone's needs.

But that's also what Conservative fear - they would be forced to be productive.

In the minds of Conservatives, the modern "American Dream" is to be super wealthy without making any productive contribution to society. They want to own everything and control everything without so much as lifting a finger to produce anything.

I cant speak for conservatives. But in fact Ihave never heard them say any such thing. Maybe you have so be it.

But in fact both parts of that phrase are evil and horrific. Taken together they are a description of universal slavery which isn fact the heart and soul of marxism.

it does not matter which society or era of history you pick. Slavery exists for one reason and one reason only which is to force others to work for the slave owner or owners.

Every human is limited in how much labor they can perform. Therefore slaves are force to labor for others within the limits of their ability " from each according to his ability " .

Then of course every slave is provided with the basic necessities to live. " to each according to his need."


This is how slavery ALWAYS works and not coincidentally how communism would work. It does not matter whether it is one man with a whip extracting your labor or the collective extracting it through government coercion. This is also why people are correcct in saying marxism goes against human nature.

When you extract peoples labor by force they produce as LITTLE as possible. which means you never get greater abundance as you claimed. You get less for every one. This is why every communist nation exists in poverty while capitalist nations thrive

It is still slavery and the worst form of evil

 

[AZrailwhale]

You do sound like a loser. Does it keep you up at night worrying about losing. Equity does not keep the best down because it is not about being the best. Best is just a word. It is about understanding that all men and women are created equal.

But you believe your better than everyone else that why you will do anything to win even cheat.

You are an idiot. Here is an example; two workers, one produces fifty widgets an hour, the other produces two widgets an hour. You want them both to be paid the same. What happens when people like you get the power to implement their totally unrealistic and stupid ideas, is that the worker making fifty widgets an hour starts making two widgets an hour just like the worker he is subsidizing.