Can Obamacare be Fixed?

[dblack]

Explain how ACA manages to "narrow people's chocies".

By constraining the types of policies we can choose. And, of course, by taking away our right to choose entirely different avenues for financing our health care.

Just like most regulations it narrows our choices to what's adequate.

Adequate to make sure that we aren't dumping our personal risks on others.

Right. The question isn't whether it narrows our choices (it does), but who gets to decide what's adequate.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Repeal this immoral law.
By what right do these despots have to impose their vision of healthcare on me or anyone else?

The law is constitutional and ethical and moral, and your are a loony to suggest otherwise.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Repeal this immoral law.
By what right do these despots have to impose their vision of healthcare on me or anyone else?

Since when has fascism ever been concerned with individual rights?

Hit out of the park!

The brown shirts of the reactionary far right do not give a damn about individuals other than themselves.

 

[freedombecki]

Anybody doubting Republican brain washing only has to read the posts here worrying that the insurance companies are not going to be able to make enough profit due to the regulations of Obamacare. Clearly the message from the insurance companies.

Let's throw them more money! Let's make their business easier by eliminating competition. Let the flimflam roll.

What a bunch of puppets.

Let's throw them more money! Let's make their business easier by eliminating competition. Let the flimflam roll.

Damn those solar and wind power scammers! And their enablers in government.

Glad you finally agree.

I've seen their offices. They are vacuuming up all that they need to support even their high living lobbyists.

"You shall not covet anything that is thy neighbor's."

Ancient man organized killing parties to apprehend thieves intent on taking the nice things other people had.

Using the government to do your dirty work is lower than snakesnot, and it will come right back to your doorstep, because "You can't fool all of the people all of the time," to use a more pragmatic and contemporary quotation.

 

[boedicca]

Let's throw them more money! Let's make their business easier by eliminating competition. Let the flimflam roll.

Damn those solar and wind power scammers! And their enablers in government.

Glad you finally agree.

I've seen their offices. They are vacuuming up all that they need to support even their high living lobbyists.

"You shall not covet anything that is thy neighbor's."

Ancient man organized killing parties to apprehend thieves intent on taking the nice things other people had.

Using the government to do your dirty work is lower than snakesnot, and it will come right back to your doorstep, because "You can't fool all of the people all of the time," to use a more pragmatic and contemporary quotation.

Indeed. Big Government Cronyism is actually worse than criminal mugging - because the government sponsors the Cronies, and makes their mugging legal.

 

[PMZ]

By constraining the types of policies we can choose. And, of course, by taking away our right to choose entirely different avenues for financing our health care.

Just like most regulations it narrows our choices to what's adequate.

Adequate to make sure that we aren't dumping our personal risks on others.

Right. The question isn't whether it narrows our choices (it does), but who gets to decide what's adequate.

Every law on the books narrows our choices down to only those things that don't impose on other people.

 

[PMZ]

Let's throw them more money! Let's make their business easier by eliminating competition. Let the flimflam roll.

Damn those solar and wind power scammers! And their enablers in government.

Glad you finally agree.

I've seen their offices. They are vacuuming up all that they need to support even their high living lobbyists.

"You shall not covet anything that is thy neighbor's."

Ancient man organized killing parties to apprehend thieves intent on taking the nice things other people had.

Using the government to do your dirty work is lower than snakesnot, and it will come right back to your doorstep, because "You can't fool all of the people all of the time," to use a more pragmatic and contemporary quotation.

While I like "lower than snakesnot" I hate anarchy. Your chances of a country electing it are zero. Any country. Ever.

 

[PMZ]

I've seen their offices. They are vacuuming up all that they need to support even their high living lobbyists.

"You shall not covet anything that is thy neighbor's."

Ancient man organized killing parties to apprehend thieves intent on taking the nice things other people had.

Using the government to do your dirty work is lower than snakesnot, and it will come right back to your doorstep, because "You can't fool all of the people all of the time," to use a more pragmatic and contemporary quotation.

Indeed. Big Government Cronyism is actually worse than criminal mugging - because the government sponsors the Cronies, and makes their mugging legal.

Actually the best scapegoat is " Big Government Cronyism" because it's a complete abstraction. It allows you to blame everyone for everything and create a completely unsolvable set of problems.

It's the whiners nirvana.

 

[dblack]

Just like most regulations it narrows our choices to what's adequate.

Adequate to make sure that we aren't dumping our personal risks on others.

Right. The question isn't whether it narrows our choices (it does), but who gets to decide what's adequate.

Every law on the books narrows our choices down to only those things that don't impose on other people.

As I've pointed out, a lack of insurance doesn't impose on anyone else.

 

[freedombecki]

I've seen their offices. They are vacuuming up all that they need to support even their high living lobbyists.

"You shall not covet anything that is thy neighbor's."

Ancient man organized killing parties to apprehend thieves intent on taking the nice things other people had.

Using the government to do your dirty work is lower than snakesnot, and it will come right back to your doorstep, because "You can't fool all of the people all of the time," to use a more pragmatic and contemporary quotation.

Indeed. Big Government Cronyism is actually worse than criminal mugging - because the government sponsors the Cronies, and makes their mugging legal.

That's why I'm grateful Judicial Watch is monitoring the situation in their Annual list of the 10 Most Corrupt Politicians in alphabetical order, 2012:

Rep. Vern Buchanan (R-FL)
Secretary of Energy Steven Chu
Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and UN Ambassador Susan Rice
Attorney General Eric Holder
Rep. Jesse Jackson Jr. (D-IL)
Sen. Robert Menendez (D-NJ)
President Barack Obama
Sen. Harry Reid (D-NV)
Rep. David Rivera (R-FL)
Secretary of Health and Human Services Kathleen Sebelius

Dishonorable Mentions for 2012 include:

• Former Sen. John Edwards (D-NC)
• Rep. Michael Grimm (R-NY)
• Secretary of Homeland Security Janet Napolitano
• Gen. David Petraeus
• Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-MA)
• Rep. Maxine Waters (D-CA)

Ten Most Corrupt Politicians, 2012

Why are we keeping these people in office?

 

[PMZ]

"You shall not covet anything that is thy neighbor's."

Ancient man organized killing parties to apprehend thieves intent on taking the nice things other people had.

Using the government to do your dirty work is lower than snakesnot, and it will come right back to your doorstep, because "You can't fool all of the people all of the time," to use a more pragmatic and contemporary quotation.

Indeed. Big Government Cronyism is actually worse than criminal mugging - because the government sponsors the Cronies, and makes their mugging legal.

That's why I'm grateful Judicial Watch is monitoring the situation in their Annual list of the 10 Most Corrupt Politicians in alphabetical order, 2012:

Rep. Vern Buchanan (R-FL)
Secretary of Energy Steven Chu
Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and UN Ambassador Susan Rice
Attorney General Eric Holder
Rep. Jesse Jackson Jr. (D-IL)
Sen. Robert Menendez (D-NJ)
President Barack Obama
Sen. Harry Reid (D-NV)
Rep. David Rivera (R-FL)
Secretary of Health and Human Services Kathleen Sebelius

Dishonorable Mentions for 2012 include:

• Former Sen. John Edwards (D-NC)
• Rep. Michael Grimm (R-NY)
• Secretary of Homeland Security Janet Napolitano
• Gen. David Petraeus
• Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-MA)
• Rep. Maxine Waters (D-CA)

Ten Most Corrupt Politicians, 2012

Why are we keeping these people in office?

Why are you unable to make up your own mind? Sheeple all in a row.

 

[PMZ]

Right. The question isn't whether it narrows our choices (it does), but who gets to decide what's adequate.

Every law on the books narrows our choices down to only those things that don't impose on other people.

As I've pointed out, a lack of insurance doesn't impose on anyone else.

As I've pointed out, full comprehensive insurance is the most effective way of achieving a healthy population.

I don't know why you believe that an unhealthy population is more competitive in the global market.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Ancient man organized killing parties to apprehend thieves intent on taking the nice things other people had.

Our segregationists were quite good at extra-judicial murder as well.

 

[KevinWestern]

OK, suppose a miracle happens and Obama, Senator Reid and Rep Boner all get together and decide to change the Obamacare law so that it works better for the general public.

What would you want to be changed?

Costs are rising BECAUSE of the insurance model. We - the consumers - do not price shop, and therefore there's not much incentive for a doc to charge $250/visit vs $125/visit.

Obamacare does nothing to change this broken insurance model, as it only forces people to buy the insurance! How in the hell is that supposed to drive costs down (especially when throwing in preexisting conditions)?

If they want to fix Obamacare, they need to start by adding some element of price shopping to the healthcare market. A lot of companies are doing this now with the HSA (health savings accounts) that encourage patients to compare price/quality of the doctors they choose.

Just my two bits.

 

[dblack]

Every law on the books narrows our choices down to only those things that don't impose on other people.

As I've pointed out, a lack of insurance doesn't impose on anyone else.

As I've pointed out, full comprehensive insurance is the most effective way of achieving a healthy population.

I don't know why you believe that an unhealthy population is more competitive in the global market.

It's not the job of government to "achieve a healthy population". If that's your aim, we should start up state fat farms and mandate our diets as well. But that's simply not the kind of government I want. I can't imagine why you would.

 

[KevinWestern]

Every law on the books narrows our choices down to only those things that don't impose on other people.

As I've pointed out, a lack of insurance doesn't impose on anyone else.

As I've pointed out, full comprehensive insurance is the most effective way of achieving a healthy population.

I don't know why you believe that an unhealthy population is more competitive in the global market.

Full and comprehensive (mandatory) insurance is also extremely expensive and CAN make someone's life worse off if they are not actually sick.

A population with no disposable income is also less competitive in the global market..

 

[PMZ]

OK, suppose a miracle happens and Obama, Senator Reid and Rep Boner all get together and decide to change the Obamacare law so that it works better for the general public.

What would you want to be changed?

Costs are rising BECAUSE of the insurance model. We - the consumers - do not price shop, and therefore there's not much incentive for a doc to charge $250/visit vs $125/visit.

Obamacare does nothing to change this broken insurance model, as it only forces people to buy the insurance! How in the hell is that supposed to drive costs down (especially when throwing in preexisting conditions)?

If they want to fix Obamacare, they need to start by adding some element of price shopping to the healthcare market. A lot of companies are doing this now with the HSA (health savings accounts) that encourage patients to compare price/quality of the doctors they choose.

Just my two bits.

Costs are rising because health care delivery is as progressive a market as exists. People are not willing to pass up any opportunity for a long productive life. We are, first and foremost, survivors. It's hard wired. That makes healthcare among the most research and development oriented markets with the attendant costs and new product stream benefits. And minimal price competition.

Insurance premiums, first, follow health care delivery ever escalating costs.

Given that, the best tool for enhanced competition is consumer information. That's the biggest aspect of Obamacare, and it gets more necessary everyday as businesses realize that pernicious unemployment is an opportunity to pay workers less, and backing away from health care insurance that used to be table stakes is now possible.

Over my entire career my employers did the competitive research for me. And they had huge clout to negotiate prices for me. That picture is changing before our eyes.

I personally don't think that the researching benefits of Obamacare are an improvement over what my companies did for me, but the option to continue what works best is not available any longer as we didn't legislate it into place. And the benefit that I realized is available to only a relatively few today.

The Republican alternative of doing nothing assumes that if government does nothing, nothing changes, which is pure delusion.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

OK, suppose a miracle happens and Obama, Senator Reid and Rep Boner all get together and decide to change the Obamacare law so that it works better for the general public.

What would you want to be changed?

It doesn't matter if it can be fixed, it needs to go period.

 

[PMZ]

OK, suppose a miracle happens and Obama, Senator Reid and Rep Boner all get together and decide to change the Obamacare law so that it works better for the general public.

What would you want to be changed?

It doesn't matter if it can be fixed, it needs to go period.

As good a picture of Republicanism as I can imagine.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

OK, suppose a miracle happens and Obama, Senator Reid and Rep Boner all get together and decide to change the Obamacare law so that it works better for the general public.

What would you want to be changed?

It doesn't matter if it can be fixed, it needs to go period.

As good a picture of Republicanism as I can imagine.

That's what the country was built to be A REPUBLIC.