Challenge the Atheist!

[rightwinger]

Some day God will deal with the Atheist...

God finds Christians to be pretentious boors

He would rather hang out with atheists

 

[HUGGY]

Of course there is no god. That would be nonsense. It would be interesting though. Something to do when you die. I swear if I believed in god I would figure out a way to die without commiting suicide. All that talk about how great heaven is and everything. Besides you guys are all getting on my nerves.

 

[The Irish Ram]

I'm still laughing about Idaho!
Ready?
Prophecy
Go!

Could you be more specific? To what exactly about prophecy are you referring.

Yeah, Idaho. I was considered Satanic, and even had a girlfriend removed from my life by her parents when they found out. One day she didn't show up at school (our junior year) and I didn't see her again for 4 years, after I had enlisted the USMC. We were sweethearts and both our hearts were broken and there was never any closure. It was very strange. I have to admit, it has contributed to my distrust of religion and its followers.

Well, I have a feeling her parents and not God were responsible for your love life. I went through the exact same thing. Wasn't allowed to leave my house except for school my whole junior year. And he left town so they wouldn't find him floating face down in the river, as per my father's promise.
Don't lose God, because of the behavior of humans.

Prophecy. The ability to see the end from the beginning. 1/4 of the Bible is prediction concerning the future. Humans don't have the ability, so who is it that does?

How about Christ hanging on a cross. That was predicted 500 years before Romans started using crucifixion. or,

The exact date that Israel would become a Nation. or,

After generations of Jews living in other countries, and speaking the language of the countries they were born in, the Bible predicted that the Jews would revive their pure language. No displaced race has ever gone back to their original language, except the Jews.

That rain, of all things, would increase over dry, dusty Israel and they would become fruitful.

(As the rainfall increased dramatically by over 10 percent every decade for the last century the returning Jewish exiles planted over two hundred million trees and transformed the complete environment of the Promised Land.)
From desolate desert to lush oasis. And they sell fruit! Tons and tons or oranges for Europe and the Middle East.

"And the parched ground shall become a pool, and the thirsty land springs of water: in the habitation of dragons, where each lay, shall be grass with reeds and rushes" (Isaiah 35:7).

The Kentucky Derby is this weekend. And none of us can tell you the order in which the horses will all cross the finish line.
God can move forward and backward through the dimension of time.
So, while I wait for Saturday's race, God has already been to Sunday and back.

 

[PratchettFan]

How do you know? What supports your belief? And what if you're wong?

If there is a god as you believe it to be and I am condemned to hell just because I guessed wrong, then I will be in hell and you will spend eternity with a being who thinks that is an appropriate punishment for guessing wrong. You have my sincere pity.

... and I am condemned to hell just because I guessed wrong


no, to reach the Everlasting is to be accomplished while alive, if not it may be in your last breath to know what you have missed out on.


- the Everlasting exists and is what is seen everyday, the accomplishment is seeing it without a body.

and there "is" functionality ... such as becoming a DNA engineer for future generations - someone has to do it.

and there is a God that is the Standard.

I agree. And yet I would be willing to wager that the God that is the Standard you envision is not the one I envision. I know it is not the one anyone who even considers the possibility of hell envisions. So we return to it being a question of my guess vs your guess - but a guess is all either of us brings to the table no matter what you might believe.

 

[Vandalshandle]

I prophecy that an American major league baseball team will win the World Series this year.

 

[PratchettFan]

I prophecy that an American major league baseball team will win the World Series this year.

Yea, and white spheroids shall fly through the air to much cheering and gnashing of teeth.

 

[The Irish Ram]

. and I am condemned to hell just because I guessed wrong

Don't leave you eternity to guesswork. Try homework instead. And no one condemns you to hell. You have a choice.

and:

I prophecy that an American major league baseball team will win the World Series this year.

Let's up the ante. Give me the stats now, on all of the league's players at the end of the season, using the same standards God gave for His prophets, eg Daniel, or Isaiah, keeping in mind that if you are incorrect on any stat, you die. (That way we know you are not guessing).

Who will win the next Nobel prize?
What horse will win the Derby? Which will win the Preakness? The name of the last horse to cross the finish line in both races.
The date when the first cancer cure will be administered?
Name the president of the US, sitting in the oval office 70 years from now..........

 

[Underhill]

. and I am condemned to hell just because I guessed wrong

Don't leave you eternity to guesswork. Try homework instead. And no one condemns you to hell. You have a choice.

and:

I prophecy that an American major league baseball team will win the World Series this year.

Let's up the ante. Give me the stats now, on all of the league's players at the end of the season, using the same standards God gave for His prophets, eg Daniel, or Isaiah, keeping in mind that if you are incorrect on any stat, you die. (That way we know you are not guessing).

Who will win the next Nobel prize?
What horse will win the Derby? Which will win the Preakness? The name of the last horse to cross the finish line in both races.
The date when the first cancer cure will be administered?
Name the president of the US, sitting in the oval office 70 years from now..........

A few large problems with that.

The prophets didn't spew names and dates. They made references to future events in a general sense. Israel will come back as a nation... those kinds of things.

Also, who is to say that events do not happen because of prophecy. Israel is a great example. Many people thought setting the Jews up in Israel was a fulfillment of prophecy and thus a good idea.

 

[PratchettFan]

. and I am condemned to hell just because I guessed wrong

Don't leave you eternity to guesswork. Try homework instead. And no one condemns you to hell. You have a choice.

Yes. I did that. That's how I came up with my guess. I simply do not confuse a guess with knowledge. Nor do I confuse your guess with knowledge.

Your statement about hell is nonsense. That is akin to my holding a gun to your head and telling you to do something or die. If you refuse, it wasn't me who killed you. It was your choice. Pure nonsense.

 

[Vandalshandle]

"Who will win the next Nobel prize?
What horse will win the Derby? Which will win the Preakness? The name of the last horse to cross the finish line in both races.
The date when the first cancer cure will be administered?
Name the president of the US, sitting in the oval office 70 years from now.......... '

A scientist will win the next noble Prize
A brown horse will win the derby
Cancer will be cured in 2087
The president 70 years from now will be: Jose, Jesus, Rodriguez, Guadalupe, Francsico, III
__________________

 

[Vandalshandle]

. and I am condemned to hell just because I guessed wrong

Don't leave you eternity to guesswork. Try homework instead. And no one condemns you to hell. You have a choice.

Yes. I did that. That's how I came up with my guess. I simply do not confuse a guess with knowledge. Nor do I confuse your guess with knowledge.

Your statement about hell is nonsense. That is akin to my holding a gun to your head and telling you to do something or die. If you refuse, it wasn't me who killed you. It was your choice. Pure nonsense.

For god so loved the world that he created man, and then condemned him to everlasting torture and damnation if he doubts anything that Pat Robertson says.

 

[emilynghiem]

Agnostic, really, but that isn't as good a title. I don't believe in a God or gods. I also don't believe there necessarily isn't a God or gods. I've been an agnostic all my life, despite being raised in Idaho.

But, anyway, bring the questions or attacks and I'll do my best to address them.

Ready? Go!

Do you believe there is some intelligent order to the laws in the world,
such as laws of science and laws of human nature or how the conscience works.

Are you okay with both nontheists and theists agreeing that regardless
if some God created these laws, or if they naturally exist as 'self-evident'
or "self-existent" then we can all still agree on the content of those
laws so we can work together to achieve greater good for mutual benefit,
regardless if we personify God or just believe in natural laws existing on their own.

What do you suggest for bringing people together on this level?
What do you think needs to be corrected, or what can be taught to get
people on the same page with following universal laws we agree upon
regardless if we have different beliefs about the source of these laws? Thanks!

 

[emilynghiem]

Don't leave you eternity to guesswork. Try homework instead. And no one condemns you to hell. You have a choice.

Yes. I did that. That's how I came up with my guess. I simply do not confuse a guess with knowledge. Nor do I confuse your guess with knowledge.

Your statement about hell is nonsense. That is akin to my holding a gun to your head and telling you to do something or die. If you refuse, it wasn't me who killed you. It was your choice. Pure nonsense.

For god so loved the world that he created man, and then condemned him to everlasting torture and damnation if he doubts anything that Pat Robertson says.

Somehow i don't think that threats of hell are scary enough to stop people from wrong.

Please see my other thread, asking if it's scarier to be reincarnated as lesser creatures reborn into a life of suffering, to warn people not to abuse privileges in this life.

If this is how Buddhists raise their kids, with threats of being reborn as cockroaches if they are bad, would this explain how Asian parents get their kids to obey and honor them?

 

[The Irish Ram]

Don't leave you eternity to guesswork. Try homework instead. And no one condemns you to hell. You have a choice.

Yes. I did that. That's how I came up with my guess. I simply do not confuse a guess with knowledge. Nor do I confuse your guess with knowledge.

Your statement about hell is nonsense. That is akin to my holding a gun to your head and telling you to do something or die. If you refuse, it wasn't me who killed you. It was your choice. Pure nonsense.

For god so loved the world that he created man, and then condemned him to everlasting torture and damnation if he doubts anything that Pat Robertson says.

What you say^ vs what the Lord says:

John 12:47 And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.

Your debt is paid, and your ticket is stamped, because you have a Father that loves you enough to hold you unaccountable for the shit that should send you to Hell.
And all you have to do to redeem your ticket to Paradise is say, "Thank you".
Tough love, huh?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Agnostic, really, but that isn't as good a title. I don't believe in a God or gods. I also don't believe there necessarily isn't a God or gods. I've been an agnostic all my life, despite being raised in Idaho.

But, anyway, bring the questions or attacks and I'll do my best to address them.

Ready? Go!

The only ‘challenge’ for the ‘atheist’ is to get off the pot and acknowledge the fact that religion and god are creations of man.

 

[hobelim]

Colorado,
You have my sympathies for being raised in Idaho. However, you should consider yourself lucky. It would only have been worse if you had been raised in Utah.

I think this is a good thread, but I would not expect much philisophical debate. Captives of organized religions usually take the shortcut, and just condemn, rather than debate., such as, "Some day God will deal with the Atheist... "

Whether God does not exist and especially if he does it would have been better to have spent your entire life as an atheist than to have spent your entire life believing in a triune edible mangod that does not exist.

sitting on the fence is a cop out. what does it take, about three minutes to decide whether one persons or another persons religious beliefs about God are irrational or impossible?

Who over the age of 12 could possibly have a functioning brain and remain undecided whether it is possible that one God is triune and edible or there is has never been any such living being ever in existence?

 

[PratchettFan]

Yes. I did that. That's how I came up with my guess. I simply do not confuse a guess with knowledge. Nor do I confuse your guess with knowledge.

Your statement about hell is nonsense. That is akin to my holding a gun to your head and telling you to do something or die. If you refuse, it wasn't me who killed you. It was your choice. Pure nonsense.

For god so loved the world that he created man, and then condemned him to everlasting torture and damnation if he doubts anything that Pat Robertson says.

Somehow i don't think that threats of hell are scary enough to stop people from wrong.

Please see my other thread, asking if it's scarier to be reincarnated as lesser creatures reborn into a life of suffering, to warn people not to abuse privileges in this life.

If this is how Buddhists raise their kids, with threats of being reborn as cockroaches if they are bad, would this explain how Asian parents get their kids to obey and honor them?

You need to go back and re-examine the concept of rebirth.

 

[Underhill]

"Who will win the next Nobel prize?
What horse will win the Derby? Which will win the Preakness? The name of the last horse to cross the finish line in both races.
The date when the first cancer cure will be administered?
Name the president of the US, sitting in the oval office 70 years from now.......... '

A scientist will win the next noble Prize
A brown horse will win the derby
Cancer will be cured in 2087
The president 70 years from now will be: Jose, Jesus, Rodriguez, Guadalupe, Francsico, III
__________________

Except the bible doesn't give dates.

So Cancer will be cured someday. And the President at some point will be a darker man than those who came before...

My favorite are some of the prophecies in Revelation. Horseman blowing horns... I once read a book from the 50's that speculated that it could have meant our Mounted Calvary Jeeps laying on the horn.

 

[hobelim]

"Who will win the next Nobel prize?
What horse will win the Derby? Which will win the Preakness? The name of the last horse to cross the finish line in both races.
The date when the first cancer cure will be administered?
Name the president of the US, sitting in the oval office 70 years from now.......... '

A scientist will win the next noble Prize
A brown horse will win the derby
Cancer will be cured in 2087
The president 70 years from now will be: Jose, Jesus, Rodriguez, Guadalupe, Francsico, III
__________________

Except the bible doesn't give dates.

So Cancer will be cured someday. And the President at some point will be a darker man than those who came before...

My favorite are some of the prophecies in Revelation. Horseman blowing horns... I once read a book from the 50's that speculated that it could have meant our Mounted Calvary Jeeps laying on the horn.

A trumpet in scripture is symbolic of a prophet. Elijah was called the trumpet of God.

 

[BreezeWood]

no, to reach the Everlasting is to be accomplished while alive, if not it may be in your last breath to know what you have missed out on.

- the Everlasting exists and is what is seen everyday, the accomplishment is seeing it without a body.

and there "is" functionality ... such as becoming a DNA engineer for future generations - someone has to do it.

and there is a God that is the Standard.

How do you know that?

... just knowing their is an Apex is enough for some ... surly you are not the same today as when you were born ?


* the progression of knowledge leads somewhere.