Christians vs. Atheists (the argument)

[Bonzi]

USA and Japan are good comparisons for this because we have similar populations and technological development. We have rampant disorder and crime and Christianity. They don't but Christianity despite centuries of trying never really took hold there. We both play the same videogames but have vastly different violence problems. They don't have as much sexual crime as we do because they accept sexuality as normal. Christianity is decidely anti-sex and we have huge problems with rape and other sex crimes.

You need to read the Song of Solomon.
Christianity is not "anti sex" - God created sex to be enjoyed between a Man and a Woman.
Because sin entered into the world, we have all sort of deviancies and those that become Christian and dedicate their lives to living for God, put aside those sexual desires (or at least try to) - true Christians will.....

Jesus was celibate by all accounts. And Paul (who's arguably more responsible for Christianity proper than Jesus) was WAY against sex. And for a long time, majority opinion of Christians was sex was for procreation only. Not recreation.

Again, read Song of Solomon... you'll like it....

Paul was a human being and yes, single, so, he felt people should be single if possible so all their energy was directed to God's purpose.

Yet, God created Eve for Adam. Also, Paul admitted if people were given to sexual immorality, it would be better for them to be married. He wasn't "anti sex"... just PRO living entirely for God....

 

[CremeBrulee]

USA and Japan are good comparisons for this because we have similar populations and technological development. We have rampant disorder and crime and Christianity. They don't but Christianity despite centuries of trying never really took hold there. We both play the same videogames but have vastly different violence problems. They don't have as much sexual crime as we do because they accept sexuality as normal. Christianity is decidely anti-sex and we have huge problems with rape and other sex crimes.

You need to read the Song of Solomon.
Christianity is not "anti sex" - God created sex to be enjoyed between a Man and a Woman.
Because sin entered into the world, we have all sort of deviancies and those that become Christian and dedicate their lives to living for God, put aside those sexual desires (or at least try to) - true Christians will.....

I actually really like the Song of Solomon from a literary perspective. I think it's beautiful.

 

[Bonzi]

USA and Japan are good comparisons for this because we have similar populations and technological development. We have rampant disorder and crime and Christianity. They don't but Christianity despite centuries of trying never really took hold there. We both play the same videogames but have vastly different violence problems. They don't have as much sexual crime as we do because they accept sexuality as normal. Christianity is decidely anti-sex and we have huge problems with rape and other sex crimes.

You need to read the Song of Solomon.
Christianity is not "anti sex" - God created sex to be enjoyed between a Man and a Woman.
Because sin entered into the world, we have all sort of deviancies and those that become Christian and dedicate their lives to living for God, put aside those sexual desires (or at least try to) - true Christians will.....

Please don't destroy my opinion of you sayinig something like I need to read something as if you're assuming I haven't. I was on track to become a rabbi once upon a time. I am in no way ignorant of the Bible, Christianity, or Judaism.

I have no idea what you know or don't know... but Christianity is not "anti sex" only "anti promiscuity"

 

[Delta4Embassy]

USA and Japan are good comparisons for this because we have similar populations and technological development. We have rampant disorder and crime and Christianity. They don't but Christianity despite centuries of trying never really took hold there. We both play the same videogames but have vastly different violence problems. They don't have as much sexual crime as we do because they accept sexuality as normal. Christianity is decidely anti-sex and we have huge problems with rape and other sex crimes.

You need to read the Song of Solomon.
Christianity is not "anti sex" - God created sex to be enjoyed between a Man and a Woman.
Because sin entered into the world, we have all sort of deviancies and those that become Christian and dedicate their lives to living for God, put aside those sexual desires (or at least try to) - true Christians will.....

Please don't destroy my opinion of you sayinig something like I need to read something as if you're assuming I haven't. I was on track to become a rabbi once upon a time. I am in no way ignorant of the Bible, Christianity, or Judaism.

I have no idea what you know or don't know... but Christianity is not "anti sex" only "anti promiscuity"

"" It's regrettable that St. Augustine's influence and the negative appraisal of sexuality, based on his own struggles to be chaste has so impacted negatively with Christian tradition.".

Father Thomas Raush, Chair of
Theological Studies, Loyola Marymount University

The 4th century Bishop, St. Augustine, a man who admitted he had major personal problems with sex, ended up shaping Christian views on sex. His problems with sex were so pronounced that modern-day psychology would list them as obsessive-compulsive and borderline psychotic. He got the basics of his ideas from the prevailing mind-vs-body views popular at the time -- views which have long been repudiated by more enlightened thinking.

After reportedly leading a wanton and lascivious lifestyle, Augustine left his mistress and children and totally reversed himself by vowing to be celibate. Thereafter he saw the "flesh" as wicked, flawed and sinful. Augustine also saw himself as staunchly Catholic.

Given St. Augustine's strong anti-sex views, it will surprise and maybe baffle some that this sainted man felt that prostitution was necessary in society. According to a quote: "If you expel prostitution from society you will unsettle everything on account of lusts."

According to Father Thomas Raush, Chair of Theological Studies, Loyola Marymount University, "It's regrettable that St. Augustine's influence and the negative appraisal of sexuality, based on his own struggles to be chaste, has so impacted negatively with Christian tradition."

It will probably be equally surprising to many that Thomas Aquinas, another major influence in Christianity, also felt that prostitution was a necessary evil for a society.

We cite these examples, not to advocate prostitution, but to show just how much views on sexuality have changed over the years -- even within the Church."
The Ancient Roots of Judeo-Christian Sexual Prohibitions

A commonly seen tactic in every "cult" is controlling sexuality. Was in evidence in Waco with the Branch Davidians where only Koresh could have sex. And see it in the mainstream religions where you can only have sex once married (more or less.) And back then marriage wasn't the love-based thing it's become but a matter of propety, ownership, and jealousy.

If you don't believe Christianity is anti-sex google it. With all due respect you're absolutely totally completely and utterly wrong.

 

[CremeBrulee]

I can understand preaching AGAINST it for peace reasons.

If you read the Bible, the Apostles in Acts going forward were not violent. They were persecuted, but, very strong in their faith and suffered for it.

We are to be the same... speaking in love and truth (what Christians believe to be truth).....

Unfortunately, there are may people that use the title Christian that are not OR have been taught false doctrine.

In evangelicals' defense, my neighbors next-door, and 2 doors adown are both ultra-religious. Neither's ever even hinted on the subject of religion to me. Shrug.

Complete opposite for me. My religious neighbors are always telling me I'm going to hell if I don't start believing. My Friday's are spent hearing how God will make me spend eternity in flame and agony, but that he loves me enough to welcome me to heaven, if only I accept Jesus into my heart.

 

[Bonzi]

If you don't believe Christianity is anti-sex google it. With all due respect you're absolutely totally completely and utterly wrong

Let me re-phrase TRUE Christianity, true Christians are not "anti sex" - God gave us sex for reproduction and enjoyment. To be had and for both purposes between a married man and woman.

I am not saying that people professing Christianity have not been "anti sex" - I'm just saying God is not. And really, that is all that matters. And Christianity is living for God, and acknowledging Jesus as the sacrifice for our sins.

 

[Bonzi]

I can understand preaching AGAINST it for peace reasons.

If you read the Bible, the Apostles in Acts going forward were not violent. They were persecuted, but, very strong in their faith and suffered for it.

We are to be the same... speaking in love and truth (what Christians believe to be truth).....

Unfortunately, there are may people that use the title Christian that are not OR have been taught false doctrine.

In evangelicals' defense, my neighbors next-door, and 2 doors adown are both ultra-religious. Neither's ever even hinted on the subject of religion to me. Shrug.

Complete opposite for me. My religious neighbors are always telling me I'm going to hell if I don't start believing. My Friday's are spent hearing how God will make me spend eternity in flame and agony, but that he loves me enough to welcome me to heaven, if only I accept Jesus into my heart.

That's not how Christians are to evangelize.
Anyone that reads the New Testament can see that.
The apostles and even Jesus himself didn't go around using scare tactics. The spoke truth, but never told people they were going to Hell in that way..........

 

[gtopa1]

I do think most (on here) hate God/Christians yet, have no good explanation why...
I honestly don't think it's because they think we are harmful to society....

I suspect that we value each other...unbelievers included....as equals and those who object see themselves as superior. I suspect its all about pride really.

Greg

 

[gtopa1]

I can understand preaching AGAINST it for peace reasons.

If you read the Bible, the Apostles in Acts going forward were not violent. They were persecuted, but, very strong in their faith and suffered for it.

We are to be the same... speaking in love and truth (what Christians believe to be truth).....

Unfortunately, there are may people that use the title Christian that are not OR have been taught false doctrine.

In evangelicals' defense, my neighbors next-door, and 2 doors adown are both ultra-religious. Neither's ever even hinted on the subject of religion to me. Shrug.

What the hell is "ultra-religious"???

Greg

 

[gtopa1]

I can understand preaching AGAINST it for peace reasons.

If you read the Bible, the Apostles in Acts going forward were not violent. They were persecuted, but, very strong in their faith and suffered for it.

We are to be the same... speaking in love and truth (what Christians believe to be truth).....

Unfortunately, there are may people that use the title Christian that are not OR have been taught false doctrine.

In evangelicals' defense, my neighbors next-door, and 2 doors adown are both ultra-religious. Neither's ever even hinted on the subject of religion to me. Shrug.

Complete opposite for me. My religious neighbors are always telling me I'm going to hell if I don't start believing. My Friday's are spent hearing how God will make me spend eternity in flame and agony, but that he loves me enough to welcome me to heaven, if only I accept Jesus into my heart.

Maybe you should leave the Convent??

OK: practical and it works. Some morons were regularly telling my older brother that being Catholic is being Satanic. When they refused to come to his satanic mass he exorcised them out of the house with blasphemies that would make your eyes water. They never came back.

I am sure he got a lot of Hail Marys the next time he went to confession.

Greg

 

[CremeBrulee]

I can understand preaching AGAINST it for peace reasons.

If you read the Bible, the Apostles in Acts going forward were not violent. They were persecuted, but, very strong in their faith and suffered for it.

We are to be the same... speaking in love and truth (what Christians believe to be truth).....

Unfortunately, there are may people that use the title Christian that are not OR have been taught false doctrine.

In evangelicals' defense, my neighbors next-door, and 2 doors adown are both ultra-religious. Neither's ever even hinted on the subject of religion to me. Shrug.

Complete opposite for me. My religious neighbors are always telling me I'm going to hell if I don't start believing. My Friday's are spent hearing how God will make me spend eternity in flame and agony, but that he loves me enough to welcome me to heaven, if only I accept Jesus into my heart.

That's not how Christians are to evangelize.
Anyone that reads the New Testament can see that.
The apostles and even Jesus himself didn't go around using scare tactics. The spoke truth, but never told people they were going to Hell in that way..........

One of them has the memorized the New Testament from what I can tell. They are Pentecostals so there is also a lot of talk about the Holy Spirit and speaking in tongues. I have some new neighbors but am rather reluctant to let them know I don't believe. I live in the country so people around here have gotten pretty suspicious and less than friendly when I tell them.

 

[gtopa1]

I can understand preaching AGAINST it for peace reasons.

If you read the Bible, the Apostles in Acts going forward were not violent. They were persecuted, but, very strong in their faith and suffered for it.

We are to be the same... speaking in love and truth (what Christians believe to be truth).....

Unfortunately, there are may people that use the title Christian that are not OR have been taught false doctrine.

In evangelicals' defense, my neighbors next-door, and 2 doors adown are both ultra-religious. Neither's ever even hinted on the subject of religion to me. Shrug.

Complete opposite for me. My religious neighbors are always telling me I'm going to hell if I don't start believing. My Friday's are spent hearing how God will make me spend eternity in flame and agony, but that he loves me enough to welcome me to heaven, if only I accept Jesus into my heart.

That's not how Christians are to evangelize.
Anyone that reads the New Testament can see that.
The apostles and even Jesus himself didn't go around using scare tactics. The spoke truth, but never told people they were going to Hell in that way..........

Most critics seem to criticise the style rather than the content. As much as I respect people of faith I do find the TV Evangelists rather overbearing. Not my style.

Greg

 

[Delta4Embassy]

I can understand preaching AGAINST it for peace reasons.

If you read the Bible, the Apostles in Acts going forward were not violent. They were persecuted, but, very strong in their faith and suffered for it.

We are to be the same... speaking in love and truth (what Christians believe to be truth).....

Unfortunately, there are may people that use the title Christian that are not OR have been taught false doctrine.

In evangelicals' defense, my neighbors next-door, and 2 doors adown are both ultra-religious. Neither's ever even hinted on the subject of religion to me. Shrug.

What the hell is "ultra-religious"???

Greg

Religious homeschooling, run a home church out of their apartment (2 doors down one anyway,) weekly Bible study with neighbors.

If not so tolerant of stupid people it'd be really annoying. Plus, just about every adult atheist began as a reliigous child so I actually encourage it.

 

[gtopa1]

I can understand preaching AGAINST it for peace reasons.

If you read the Bible, the Apostles in Acts going forward were not violent. They were persecuted, but, very strong in their faith and suffered for it.

We are to be the same... speaking in love and truth (what Christians believe to be truth).....

Unfortunately, there are may people that use the title Christian that are not OR have been taught false doctrine.

In evangelicals' defense, my neighbors next-door, and 2 doors adown are both ultra-religious. Neither's ever even hinted on the subject of religion to me. Shrug.

Complete opposite for me. My religious neighbors are always telling me I'm going to hell if I don't start believing. My Friday's are spent hearing how God will make me spend eternity in flame and agony, but that he loves me enough to welcome me to heaven, if only I accept Jesus into my heart.

That's not how Christians are to evangelize.
Anyone that reads the New Testament can see that.
The apostles and even Jesus himself didn't go around using scare tactics. The spoke truth, but never told people they were going to Hell in that way..........

One of them has the memorized the New Testament from what I can tell. They are Pentecostals so there is also a lot of talk about the Holy Spirit and speaking in tongues. I have some new neighbors but am rather reluctant to let them know I don't believe. I live in the country so people around here have gotten pretty suspicious and less than friendly when I tell them.

As I say; not my style. Their basic message of God's love and salvation I completely agree with. The Holy Spirit was with His Church long before the Pentecostal Movement "rediscovered" it all. It's all there the the House Papers of the Catholic Church.............mostly called the Bible now.

Greg

 

[Bonzi]

If not so tolerant of stupid people it'd be really annoying

no need to be mean.....

 

[Delta4Embassy]

If not so tolerant of stupid people it'd be really annoying

no need to be mean.....

Unless stating the truth is mean...As per my other thread in Health proved religious people have lower IQs.

 

[Bonzi]

.... having been a member of a few churches, I find self-proclaimed Christians to be not that much different from the world, and in many cases, worse (in the way of being hospitable, sacrificial and caring....)

This is why many people turn to the Mormon faith, they have it down pat - but their doctrine is so screwed up it's pathetic......

Unfortunately, modern churches and religions almost always take their eyes off God.. and the focus ultimately becomes something else ... or things get twisted.....

 

[Bonzi]

If not so tolerant of stupid people it'd be really annoying

no need to be mean.....

Unless stating the truth is mean...As per my other thread in Health proved religious people have lower IQs.

so, you think I am stupid? you may not know but do I strike you as stupid?
would you be willing to label me as stupid simply based on my belief in God?

 

[gtopa1]

I can understand preaching AGAINST it for peace reasons.

If you read the Bible, the Apostles in Acts going forward were not violent. They were persecuted, but, very strong in their faith and suffered for it.

We are to be the same... speaking in love and truth (what Christians believe to be truth).....

Unfortunately, there are may people that use the title Christian that are not OR have been taught false doctrine.

In evangelicals' defense, my neighbors next-door, and 2 doors adown are both ultra-religious. Neither's ever even hinted on the subject of religion to me. Shrug.

What the hell is "ultra-religious"???

Greg

Religious homeschooling, run a home church out of their apartment (2 doors down one anyway,) weekly Bible study with neighbors.

If not so tolerant of stupid people it'd be really annoying. Plus, just about every adult atheist began as a reliigous child so I actually encourage it.

I have some very good friends who did just that and are wonderful people. Their kids have turned out quite solid types with families of their own. They seem not to have missed out on much...except the drugs and sex at school stuff. But anyway I think the homeschooling thing is an overreaction to what are really fairly small...though significant..."off the rails" kids.

Greg

 

[gtopa1]

If not so tolerant of stupid people it'd be really annoying

no need to be mean.....

Unless stating the truth is mean...As per my other thread in Health proved religious people have lower IQs.

so, you think I am stupid? you may not know but do I strike you as stupid?
would you be willing to label me as stupid simply based on my belief in God?

Only if he's stupid. lol

Greg