Faith alone saves?

[buttercup]

Pharisees didnt even believe in Christ...try again

You're being deliberately obtuse.

The point is, the Pharisees were good Jews.

They strictly adhered to the Sabbath.

They gave money to the temple.

They prayed constantly.

But -- they did not have love in their hearts.

So they lacked Faith

The Pharisees had faith. They would not have acted as they did if they lacked faith.

What they lacked was love.

They did not have faith in Jesus. They didn't even have faith in the God they claimed to believe in. So no, they did not have faith. They had religion. Like you. Try again.

 

[Blackrook]

Faith alone saves?

No, it does not.

The Pharisees had faith.

The demons in hell have faith.

A man can have faith and still live a very evil life.

Paul taught that faith means nothing if you don't have love.

To answer this question you must determine the definition of faith. Faith from Bible is believing that God exists and he gave his own son for our lives reach heaven.
Jews can't be saved if they don't believe that Jesus died for our souls.

Other people use the term "Faith" loosely like they have faith Alabama will win on Saturday.

But Jesus met with Moses and Elijah, so they're in heaven.

Jesus mentioned in a parable that Abraham is in heaven.

So, there's Jews in heaven.

And, it would make no sense if Jews don't go to heaven.

 

[Blackrook]

Pharisees didnt even believe in Christ...try again

You're being deliberately obtuse.

The point is, the Pharisees were good Jews.

They strictly adhered to the Sabbath.

They gave money to the temple.

They prayed constantly.

But -- they did not have love in their hearts.

So they lacked Faith

The Pharisees had faith. They would not have acted as they did if they lacked faith.

What they lacked was love.

They did not have faith in Jesus. They didn't even have faith in the God they claimed to believe in. So no, they did not have faith. They had religion. Like you. Try again.

The Pharisees had faith in God. It is ridiculous to say they didn't.

 

[Jackson]

No he does not

1If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but do not have love, I have become a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3And if I give all my possessions to feed the poor, and if I surrender my body to be burned, but do not have love, it profits me nothing.
4Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant, 5does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered, 6does not rejoice in unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth; 7bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

8Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part; 10but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away. 11When I was a child, I used to speak like a child, think like a child, reason like a child; when I became a man, I did away with childish things. 12For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known. 13But now faith, hope, love, abide these three; but the greatest of these is love.

Dont see anything there about it being the basis of salvation

Faith, by itself, won't save you.

Faith can by itself save you. If you live your life with so many sins such drug abuse, robbery, violence, you can turn it around and find God, learn about Jesus and God and save yourself.
Love is part of faith. You can't love Jesus and God without having the faith you will be saved by asking for forgiveness and pray.

 

[Blackrook]

No he does not

1If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but do not have love, I have become a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3And if I give all my possessions to feed the poor, and if I surrender my body to be burned, but do not have love, it profits me nothing.
4Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant, 5does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered, 6does not rejoice in unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth; 7bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

8Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part; 10but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away. 11When I was a child, I used to speak like a child, think like a child, reason like a child; when I became a man, I did away with childish things. 12For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known. 13But now faith, hope, love, abide these three; but the greatest of these is love.

Dont see anything there about it being the basis of salvation

Faith, by itself, won't save you.

Faith can by itself save you. If you live your life with so many sins such drug abuse, robbery, violence, you can turn it around and find God, learn about Jesus and God and save yourself.
Love is part of faith. You can't love Jesus and God without having the faith you will be saved by asking for forgiveness and pray.

You can have faith without love.

My mother had very strong faith.

She had no love for anyone, even herself.

 

[buttercup]

Pharisees didnt even believe in Christ...try again

You're being deliberately obtuse.

The point is, the Pharisees were good Jews.

They strictly adhered to the Sabbath.

They gave money to the temple.

They prayed constantly.

But -- they did not have love in their hearts.

So they lacked Faith

The Pharisees had faith. They would not have acted as they did if they lacked faith.

What they lacked was love.

They did not have faith in Jesus. They didn't even have faith in the God they claimed to believe in. So no, they did not have faith. They had religion. Like you. Try again.

The Pharisees had faith in God. It is ridiculous to say they didn't.

They had belief in God, yes. But faith is more than mere belief. The bible says even the demons believe... and tremble.

They rejected Jesus, who was God in the flesh. So they did not have faith in God. The New Testament makes that abundantly clear. In fact, Jesus had the harshest words for those like the Pharisees, who were religious but empty inside, and who apparently only cared about their own agendas.

 

[buttercup]

You can have faith without love.

My mother had very strong faith.

She had no love for anyone, even herself.

Ok, your statement above shows that you don't understand faith or what it means to be saved.

 

[Blackrook]

Pharisees didnt even believe in Christ...try again

You're being deliberately obtuse.

The point is, the Pharisees were good Jews.

They strictly adhered to the Sabbath.

They gave money to the temple.

They prayed constantly.

But -- they did not have love in their hearts.

So they lacked Faith

The Pharisees had faith. They would not have acted as they did if they lacked faith.

What they lacked was love.

They did not have faith in Jesus. They didn't even have faith in the God they claimed to believe in. So no, they did not have faith. They had religion. Like you. Try again.

The Pharisees had faith in God. It is ridiculous to say they didn't.

They had belief in God, yes. But faith is more than mere belief. The bible says even the demons believe... and tremble.

They rejected Jesus, who was God in the flesh. So they did not have faith in God. The New Testament makes that abundantly clear. In fact, Jesus had the harshest words for those like the Pharisees, who were religious but empty inside, and who apparently only cared about their own agendas.

You are agreeing with me, but disagreeing with me.

The Pharisees had very strong faith in God.

They did not have love for their fellow human beings.

 

[Blackrook]

You can have faith without love.

My mother had very strong faith.

She had no love for anyone, even herself.

Ok, your statement above shows that you don't understand faith or what it means to be saved.

I know what it means to have faith without love.

 

[Jackson]

Do we know all the laws that God sets forth for being admitted to heaven? We don't really understand our own hearts at times. God does.

You are having a problem with your religion. Then the religion is not for you. Find a religion that allows divorced people to date and love again without the hoops to jump. Take you time and get to know about each possibility then spend some time getting to know it.

Pray for a sign from above and wait. It will come

 

[buttercup]

Pharisees didnt even believe in Christ...try again

You're being deliberately obtuse.

The point is, the Pharisees were good Jews.

They strictly adhered to the Sabbath.

They gave money to the temple.

They prayed constantly.

But -- they did not have love in their hearts.

So they lacked Faith

The Pharisees had faith. They would not have acted as they did if they lacked faith.

What they lacked was love.

They did not have faith in Jesus. They didn't even have faith in the God they claimed to believe in. So no, they did not have faith. They had religion. Like you. Try again.

The Pharisees had faith in God. It is ridiculous to say they didn't.

They had belief in God, yes. But faith is more than mere belief. The bible says even the demons believe... and tremble.

They rejected Jesus, who was God in the flesh. So they did not have faith in God. The New Testament makes that abundantly clear. In fact, Jesus had the harshest words for those like the Pharisees, who were religious but empty inside, and who apparently only cared about their own agendas.

You are agreeing with me, but disagreeing with me.

The Pharisees had very strong faith in God.

They did not have love for their fellow human beings.

No, they did not. They rejected Jesus, and the bible is clear that without the Son, you don't have the Father! (1 John 2:23)

They did not have faith in God. They were religious, and cared more about appearances and their own agendas. That is why Jesus said they were like cups that are clean on the outside but dirty on the inside.

 

[Jackson]

No he does not

1If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but do not have love, I have become a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3And if I give all my possessions to feed the poor, and if I surrender my body to be burned, but do not have love, it profits me nothing.
4Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant, 5does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered, 6does not rejoice in unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth; 7bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

8Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part; 10but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away. 11When I was a child, I used to speak like a child, think like a child, reason like a child; when I became a man, I did away with childish things. 12For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known. 13But now faith, hope, love, abide these three; but the greatest of these is love.

Dont see anything there about it being the basis of salvation

Faith, by itself, won't save you.

Faith can by itself save you. If you live your life with so many sins such drug abuse, robbery, violence, you can turn it around and find God, learn about Jesus and God and save yourself.
Love is part of faith. You can't love Jesus and God without having the faith you will be saved by asking for forgiveness and pray.

You can have faith without love.

My mother had very strong faith.

She had no love for anyone, even herself.

I can't disagree with you for I didn't know your mother. Did she go too church? Did she love you.

 

[Blackrook]

There are many Christians of strong faith who have no love in their hearts.

 

[Blackrook]

No he does not

1If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but do not have love, I have become a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3And if I give all my possessions to feed the poor, and if I surrender my body to be burned, but do not have love, it profits me nothing.
4Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant, 5does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered, 6does not rejoice in unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth; 7bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

8Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part; 10but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away. 11When I was a child, I used to speak like a child, think like a child, reason like a child; when I became a man, I did away with childish things. 12For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known. 13But now faith, hope, love, abide these three; but the greatest of these is love.

Dont see anything there about it being the basis of salvation

Faith, by itself, won't save you.

Faith can by itself save you. If you live your life with so many sins such drug abuse, robbery, violence, you can turn it around and find God, learn about Jesus and God and save yourself.
Love is part of faith. You can't love Jesus and God without having the faith you will be saved by asking for forgiveness and pray.

You can have faith without love.

My mother had very strong faith.

She had no love for anyone, even herself.

I can't disagree with you for I didn't know your mother. Did she go too church? Did she love you.

My mother had strong faith, she never missed Mass.

She did not love me.

 

[Jackson]

Pharisees didnt even believe in Christ...try again

You're being deliberately obtuse.

The point is, the Pharisees were good Jews.

They strictly adhered to the Sabbath.

They gave money to the temple.

They prayed constantly.

But -- they did not have love in their hearts.

So they lacked Faith

The Pharisees had faith. They would not have acted as they did if they lacked faith.

What they lacked was love.

They did not have faith in Jesus. They didn't even have faith in the God they claimed to believe in. So no, they did not have faith. They had religion. Like you. Try again.

The Pharisees had faith in God. It is ridiculous to say they didn't.

They had belief in God, yes. But faith is more than mere belief. The bible says even the demons believe... and tremble.

They rejected Jesus, who was God in the flesh. So they did not have faith in God. The New Testament makes that abundantly clear. In fact, Jesus had the harshest words for those like the Pharisees, who were religious but empty inside, and who apparently only cared about their own agendas.

You are agreeing with me, but disagreeing with me.

The Pharisees had very strong faith in God.

They did not have love for their fellow human beings.

No, they did not. They rejected Jesus, and the bible is clear that without the Son, you don't have the Father! (1 John 2:23)

They did not have faith in God. They were religious, and cared more about appearances and their own agendas. That is why Jesus said they were like cups that are clean on the outside but dirty on the inside.

Have you heard of Jews For Jesus?

 

[buttercup]

You can have faith without love.

My mother had very strong faith.

She had no love for anyone, even herself.

Ok, your statement above shows that you don't understand faith or what it means to be saved.

I know what it means to have faith without love.

No, a true saving faith does not exist without LOVE. As Jackson already told you, love is part of faith.

A true saving faith means being born again. When you are born again, you are a new creation, not the "natural man" you were in the past.

Your problem is you are putting the cart before the horse, like most works-based religious types do.

Get saved first, then the fruit will come! You are trying to make the "fruit" the means for salvation, rather than the result of salvation.

 

[Jackson]

No he does not

1If I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but do not have love, I have become a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. 2If I have the gift of prophecy, and know all mysteries and all knowledge; and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but do not have love, I am nothing. 3And if I give all my possessions to feed the poor, and if I surrender my body to be burned, but do not have love, it profits me nothing.
4Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous; love does not brag and is not arrogant, 5does not act unbecomingly; it does not seek its own, is not provoked, does not take into account a wrong suffered, 6does not rejoice in unrighteousness, but rejoices with the truth; 7bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

8Love never fails; but if there are gifts of prophecy, they will be done away; if there are tongues, they will cease; if there is knowledge, it will be done away. 9For we know in part and we prophesy in part; 10but when the perfect comes, the partial will be done away. 11When I was a child, I used to speak like a child, think like a child, reason like a child; when I became a man, I did away with childish things. 12For now we see in a mirror dimly, but then face to face; now I know in part, but then I will know fully just as I also have been fully known. 13But now faith, hope, love, abide these three; but the greatest of these is love.

Dont see anything there about it being the basis of salvation

Faith, by itself, won't save you.

Faith can by itself save you. If you live your life with so many sins such drug abuse, robbery, violence, you can turn it around and find God, learn about Jesus and God and save yourself.
Love is part of faith. You can't love Jesus and God without having the faith you will be saved by asking for forgiveness and pray.

You can have faith without love.

My mother had very strong faith.

She had no love for anyone, even herself.

I can't disagree with you for I didn't know your mother. Did she go too church? Did she love you.

My mother had strong faith, she never missed Mass.

She did not love me.

It's very hard for me to understand to going to mass and not have hove for Jesus and God.
It must have been very hard for you to learn to love.

 

[buttercup]

My mother had strong faith, she never missed Mass.

She did not love me.

Please substitute the word "faith" with religion. If your mom did not have love in her heart but never missed a mass, then it sounds like she had RELIGION, not faith.

A true faith in God involves surrender. Doing God's will, not out of duty, but out of a genuine LOVE and respect for God and His will. And God's will is for us to love.... to love God, and others. That is the first and second most important commands.

 

[Blackrook]

Paul made it quite clear that faith, hope and love are different things and all three are required.

But he also made it clear that even the strongest faith will not avail you if you do not have love.

 

[Blackrook]

You are muddying the waters.

Faith is belief in God.

It is possible to believe in God, but not love him, or feel him loving you.

I have suffered this condition for many years.