Fire the kneelers ... challenge question:

[debbiedowner]

The stadiums remain full every game.

You are a liar. The tv has shown lack of attendance.

This may be the most hilariousest post ever.

----- Here's a guy calling someone else a liar and his refutation consists of ........................... television.

We are led to believe that some easily offended snowflake's claim that tv showing empty seats in a stadium can not be trusted compared to his claim on a message board that NFL stadiums are filled to capacity every Sunday...and you try to defend him.

Bwuhahaha

...stupid f*ing sbowflakes....

Today is Sunday and the NFL plays. And what you will see is the teams that are winning teams will have full stadiums. Those teams that have been losing for the past few years and still are won't. Stadium attendance or lack thereof has nothing to do with the bullshit you white right wing assholes have made up about the flag.

Your claim that teams will have full stadiums is a meaningless opinion that can not be proven...but thanks for wasting our time.

It can't be proven? If you're not blind you can watch a game and prove it to yourself.

 

[Care4all]

For those of you who think the NFL players protesting during the national anthem should be fired, would you also support a team owner who threatened to fire any players who refused to protest? Who didn't kneel?

Why or why not?

The NFL is a business. I believe the owners have the rigjt to fore any worker publicly protesting on company time at the workplace, causing the company millions in revenue.

Let the NFL continue doing what they are doing. When they have destroyed their fan base, lost their tax exempt status, and salaries have been slashed they will eventually change...

"Company time" begins with the kickoff.

Unless, of course, you can be the first to show us what the fuck a jingo ritual has to do with a football game.

Company time starts when they show up on the field in uniform.

or do you believe they get paid by the hour?

i thought they got paid to practice and play football?

 

[IM2]

The stadiums remain full every game.

You are a liar. The tv has shown lack of attendance.

This may be the most hilariousest post ever.

----- Here's a guy calling someone else a liar and his refutation consists of ........................... television.

We are led to believe that some easily offended snowflake's claim that tv showing empty seats in a stadium can not be trusted compared to his claim on a message board that NFL stadiums are filled to capacity every Sunday...and you try to defend him.

Bwuhahaha

...stupid f*ing sbowflakes....

Today is Sunday and the NFL plays. And what you will see is the teams that are winning teams will have full stadiums. Those teams that have been losing for the past few years and still are won't. Stadium attendance or lack thereof has nothing to do with the bullshit you white right wing assholes have made up about the flag.

Your claim that teams will have full stadiums is a meaningless opinion that can not be proven...but thanks for wasting our time.

It's a fact that you will be shown if you watch a game today. What is a meaningless opinion is that attendance has dropped because of the protests.

 

[Auld Phart]

The NFL is a business. I believe the owners have the rigjt to fore any worker publicly protesting on company time at the workplace, causing the company millions in revenue.

Let the NFL continue doing what they are doing. When they have destroyed their fan base, lost their tax exempt status, and salaries have been slashed they will eventually change...

"Company time" begins with the kickoff.

They are under contract, and most certainly with clauses concerning behavior that reflects on the team and the league.

"Company time" is 24/7.

Oh is it.
You're claiming football players are on retainer, just in case a football game suddenly erupts at 3:36 am on a Tuesday?

Link?

are you claiming they get paid by the hour?

Nope. And that's a false dichotomy.

I get paid by the day. Or by the project. When it's a work "day" that day is defined by its hour of beginning and its hour of end. If someone else hires me in the remainder of that day it can be an entirely different employer. And if it's a project it's from when the project begins (kickoff) to when it ends (clock hits zero).

When that day or project is over ---- it's over. You want me to come back for another day or another project, that costs extra.

Again the poster is invited to show us anybody's football contract, anywhere, that puts them on retainer 24/7.

There are of course such employments. For people who deal with actual emergencies. A football game cannot be described as an 'emergency'.

But again --- prove me wrong about that.

Sorry, they represent the team from the minute they suit up.

They get paid for practice, they get paid for skull sessions in the locker room, they get paid for time spent on the field.

Including the time the Anthem plays.

 

[easyt65]

That ruling did not just apply to those children. The NFL cannot set rules that are against the supreme law of the land.

No private business can.

So the NFL is violating the Constitution by suppressing players' freedom of speech by not allowing them to write on their shoes or wear patches honoring fallen police officers?!

That is ok, but the NFL can't insist they respect the national anthem?

Bwuhahahaha....

 

[Auld Phart]

For those of you who think the NFL players protesting during the national anthem should be fired, would you also support a team owner who threatened to fire any players who refused to protest? Who didn't kneel?

Why or why not?

The NFL is a business. I believe the owners have the rigjt to fore any worker publicly protesting on company time at the workplace, causing the company millions in revenue.

Let the NFL continue doing what they are doing. When they have destroyed their fan base, lost their tax exempt status, and salaries have been slashed they will eventually change...

"Company time" begins with the kickoff.

Unless, of course, you can be the first to show us what the fuck a jingo ritual has to do with a football game.

Company time starts when they show up on the field in uniform.

or do you believe they get paid by the hour?

i thought they got paid to practice and play football?

They don't get paid for skull sessions in the locker room?

they don't get paid if they aren't in uniform'

they don't get paid for being on the field before the game starts?

 

[Billy_Kinetta]

For those of you who think the NFL players protesting during the national anthem should be fired, would you also support a team owner who threatened to fire any players who refused to protest? Who didn't kneel?

Why or why not?

The NFL is a business. I believe the owners have the rigjt to fore any worker publicly protesting on company time at the workplace, causing the company millions in revenue.

Let the NFL continue doing what they are doing. When they have destroyed their fan base, lost their tax exempt status, and salaries have been slashed they will eventually change...

"Company time" begins with the kickoff.

They are under contract, and most certainly with clauses concerning behavior that reflects on the team and the league.

"Company time" is 24/7.

You're probably right about the clause, but is it bad behavior to all? As one who served 4 years way back when it doesn't really bother me. It may not be the best way to protest, but I simply don't care and don't feel it's a slap in the face of veterans who served so they can do this.

I consider it disrespectful, and a protest based upon nonsense.

I dropped NFL football some time ago. The fans will decide.

 

[Billy_Kinetta]

The supreme court says you, Jones and your imagined millions are wrong.

Again, tou are a liar.

Players are banned from wearing comments on cleats - where is the freedom of speech then?

The USSC did not say Freedom of Speech = Freedom from consequences...

The supreme court ruled 74 years ago that no one has the right to mandate what people do during the anthem or any similar ceremony.

West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette (1943) ruled that school students could not be forced to do this:

​

>> In the 1930s, the government of Nazi Germany began arresting thousands of Jehovah's Witnesses who refused to salute the Nazi flag and sent them to concentration camps. The Witnesses taught and still teach that the obligation imposed by the law of God is superior to that of laws enacted by temporal government. Their religious beliefs include a literal version of Exodus, Chapter 20, verses 4 and 5, which says: 'Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; thou shalt not bow down thyself to them nor serve them.' They consider that the flag is an 'image' within this command. For this reason, they refused to salute the flag. Children of Jehovah's Witnesses had been expelled from school and were threatened with exclusion for no other cause. Officials threatened to send them to reformatories maintained for criminally inclined juveniles. Parents of such children had been prosecuted and were being threatened with prosecutions for causing delinquency. In 1935, 9-year-old Carlton Nichols was expelled from school and his father arrested in Lynn, Massachusetts for such a refusal. Additional refusals followed, one such leading to Minersville School District v. Gobitis[2] Even after the Gobitis decision, Jehovah's Witnesses continued to refuse to say the pledge. <<
​

Whelp --- there it is Sleazy, your precedent for punitive measures on refusal to follow mob mentality ---- Nazi Germany. Be proud.

Apples and screwdrivers.

Children by law must attend school. Hence the ruling, which was correct for the issue.

The NFL is a private business. No one is forced to be there. They can set their own rules.

That ruling did not just apply to those children. The NFL cannot set rules that are against the supreme law of the land.

No private business can.

Oh?

 

[IM2]

The people that want them fired are control freaks and do not believe in having rights or freedoms...

Sounds like a Democrat.

The republican party caused the great depression. And this group has no real idea of what really happened to Detroit.

Or the many dead rural towns that exist in republican controlled states.

 

[IM2]

For those of you who think the NFL players protesting during the national anthem should be fired, would you also support a team owner who threatened to fire any players who refused to protest? Who didn't kneel?

Why or why not?

The NFL is a business. I believe the owners have the rigjt to fore any worker publicly protesting on company time at the workplace, causing the company millions in revenue.

Let the NFL continue doing what they are doing. When they have destroyed their fan base, lost their tax exempt status, and salaries have been slashed they will eventually change...

"Company time" begins with the kickoff.

They are under contract, and most certainly with clauses concerning behavior that reflects on the team and the league.

"Company time" is 24/7.

You're probably right about the clause, but is it bad behavior to all? As one who served 4 years way back when it doesn't really bother me. It may not be the best way to protest, but I simply don't care and don't feel it's a slap in the face of veterans who served so they can do this.

I consider it disrespectful, and a protest based upon nonsense.

I dropped NFL football some time ago. The fans will decide.

And no one gives a fuck about your opinion. The fans have decided. Because the fans do not approve of what Trump has tried to do.

 

[mudwhistle]

The people that want them fired are control freaks and do not believe in having rights or freedoms...

Sounds like a Democrat.

The republican party caused the great depression. And this group has no real idea of what really happened to Detroit.

Or the many dead rural towns that exist in republican controlled states.

Which great depression? The one in the 30s when Democrats were running things, or the fake depression the Democrats caused in 2008?

 

[IM2]

"Company time" begins with the kickoff.

They are under contract, and most certainly with clauses concerning behavior that reflects on the team and the league.

"Company time" is 24/7.

Oh is it.
You're claiming football players are on retainer, just in case a football game suddenly erupts at 3:36 am on a Tuesday?

Link?

are you claiming they get paid by the hour?

Nope. And that's a false dichotomy.

I get paid by the day. Or by the project. When it's a work "day" that day is defined by its hour of beginning and its hour of end. If someone else hires me in the remainder of that day it can be an entirely different employer. And if it's a project it's from when the project begins (kickoff) to when it ends (clock hits zero).

When that day or project is over ---- it's over. You want me to come back for another day or another project, that costs extra.

Again the poster is invited to show us anybody's football contract, anywhere, that puts them on retainer 24/7.

There are of course such employments. For people who deal with actual emergencies. A football game cannot be described as an 'emergency'.

But again --- prove me wrong about that.

Sorry, they represent the team from the minute they suit up.

They get paid for practice, they get paid for skull sessions in the locker room, they get paid for time spent on the field.

Including the time the Anthem plays.

So? Regardless of all that, they have constitutional; rights.

 

[Care4all]

"Company time" begins with the kickoff.

They are under contract, and most certainly with clauses concerning behavior that reflects on the team and the league.

"Company time" is 24/7.

Oh is it.
You're claiming football players are on retainer, just in case a football game suddenly erupts at 3:36 am on a Tuesday?

Link?

are you claiming they get paid by the hour?

Nope. And that's a false dichotomy.

I get paid by the day. Or by the project. When it's a work "day" that day is defined by its hour of beginning and its hour of end. If someone else hires me in the remainder of that day it can be an entirely different employer. And if it's a project it's from when the project begins (kickoff) to when it ends (clock hits zero).

When that day or project is over ---- it's over. You want me to come back for another day or another project, that costs extra.

Again the poster is invited to show us anybody's football contract, anywhere, that puts them on retainer 24/7.

There are of course such employments. For people who deal with actual emergencies. A football game cannot be described as an 'emergency'.

But again --- prove me wrong about that.

Sorry, they represent the team from the minute they suit up.

They get paid for practice, they get paid for skull sessions in the locker room, they get paid for time spent on the field.

Including the time the Anthem plays.

so maybe the owners should not take the government's money for the 'patriotism', and ditch the whole thing? Would that make it better?

 

[Pogo]

The supreme court says you, Jones and your imagined millions are wrong.

Again, tou are a liar.

Players are banned from wearing comments on cleats - where is the freedom of speech then?

The USSC did not say Freedom of Speech = Freedom from consequences...

The supreme court ruled 74 years ago that no one has the right to mandate what people do during the anthem or any similar ceremony.

West Virginia State Board of Education v. Barnette (1943) ruled that school students could not be forced to do this:

​

>> In the 1930s, the government of Nazi Germany began arresting thousands of Jehovah's Witnesses who refused to salute the Nazi flag and sent them to concentration camps. The Witnesses taught and still teach that the obligation imposed by the law of God is superior to that of laws enacted by temporal government. Their religious beliefs include a literal version of Exodus, Chapter 20, verses 4 and 5, which says: 'Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; thou shalt not bow down thyself to them nor serve them.' They consider that the flag is an 'image' within this command. For this reason, they refused to salute the flag. Children of Jehovah's Witnesses had been expelled from school and were threatened with exclusion for no other cause. Officials threatened to send them to reformatories maintained for criminally inclined juveniles. Parents of such children had been prosecuted and were being threatened with prosecutions for causing delinquency. In 1935, 9-year-old Carlton Nichols was expelled from school and his father arrested in Lynn, Massachusetts for such a refusal. Additional refusals followed, one such leading to Minersville School District v. Gobitis[2] Even after the Gobitis decision, Jehovah's Witnesses continued to refuse to say the pledge. <<
​

Whelp --- there it is Sleazy, your precedent for punitive measures on refusal to follow mob mentality ---- Nazi Germany. Be proud.

Apples and screwdrivers.

Children by law must attend school. Hence the ruling, which was correct for the issue.

The NFL is a private business. No one is forced to be there. They can set their own rules.

They can, and do. And those rules do not require anyone to take any particular body position for the national anthem. So much for that point.

But the real point here, as well as in the Earnest Starr case I linked earlier, is what this blind obsequious mob mentality leads to. Where it takes us when drones just fall into lockstep without ever asking questions about "why are we doing this". You know, like that question I put at the beginning of the thread about what the fuck a national anthem has to do with a football game -- the one nobody can answer. We could substitute "schoolroom" for "football game" and it would be the same question.

I wasn't aware of that SCOTUS case until IM2 brought it up and I've never been a Jehovah's Witness but it does reflect the same point I've been making for literally years about both the flag and the anthem ---- idol worship, also known as fetishism. An idol is an inanimate object declared to be Divine and its worship declared mandatory. Hence the schoolchildren forced to murmur "I pledge allegiance to the Flag" ---- NOT, you'll notice, "I pledge allegiance to a nation" but to an inanimate piece of cloth. And hence also the butthurt snowflakes enraged that somebody out there doesn't fall down and genuflect to a piece of music to which they pledge the same sicko fetishism.

But the analogy of where mob mentality leads doesn't need to be Nazi Germany. Here's another example.

​

Those people are literally stayin' alive by marching and applauding. Because if they don't, fascists like Sleazy will kill them.

They have to march to stay alive --- we don't. Yet.

And yet there walk among us wags to fall into this same lockstep voluntarily. Because they don't have the cojones to stand up to it.

 

[Auld Phart]

They are under contract, and most certainly with clauses concerning behavior that reflects on the team and the league.

"Company time" is 24/7.

Oh is it.
You're claiming football players are on retainer, just in case a football game suddenly erupts at 3:36 am on a Tuesday?

Link?

are you claiming they get paid by the hour?

Nope. And that's a false dichotomy.

I get paid by the day. Or by the project. When it's a work "day" that day is defined by its hour of beginning and its hour of end. If someone else hires me in the remainder of that day it can be an entirely different employer. And if it's a project it's from when the project begins (kickoff) to when it ends (clock hits zero).

When that day or project is over ---- it's over. You want me to come back for another day or another project, that costs extra.

Again the poster is invited to show us anybody's football contract, anywhere, that puts them on retainer 24/7.

There are of course such employments. For people who deal with actual emergencies. A football game cannot be described as an 'emergency'.

But again --- prove me wrong about that.

Sorry, they represent the team from the minute they suit up.

They get paid for practice, they get paid for skull sessions in the locker room, they get paid for time spent on the field.

Including the time the Anthem plays.

So? Regardless of all that, they have constitutional; rights.

yup

they also have to live up to their contracts.

If their contract states they have to wear tutus while sitting on the bench, they have 2 choices

wear the tutu, or quit

if the contract, or the team manager says they have to stand for the anthem, they have 2 choices

stand, or walk

 

[Crixus]

For those of you who think the NFL players protesting during the national anthem should be fired, would you also support a team owner who threatened to fire any players who refused to protest? Who didn't kneel?

Why or why not?

If they were drawing the focus from anything other then football their ass needs to just stay in the locker room. Maybe Mr. Kaepernik should have spoken to Tim Tbow about how that go's ?

 

[Care4all]

The people that want them fired are control freaks and do not believe in having rights or freedoms...

Sounds like a Democrat.

The republican party caused the great depression. And this group has no real idea of what really happened to Detroit.

Or the many dead rural towns that exist in republican controlled states.

Which great depression? The one in the 30s when Democrats were running things, or the fake depression the Democrats caused in 2008?

oh jebus! Your ignorance is bliss, isn't it!

 

[Auld Phart]

They are under contract, and most certainly with clauses concerning behavior that reflects on the team and the league.

"Company time" is 24/7.

Oh is it.
You're claiming football players are on retainer, just in case a football game suddenly erupts at 3:36 am on a Tuesday?

Link?

are you claiming they get paid by the hour?

Nope. And that's a false dichotomy.

I get paid by the day. Or by the project. When it's a work "day" that day is defined by its hour of beginning and its hour of end. If someone else hires me in the remainder of that day it can be an entirely different employer. And if it's a project it's from when the project begins (kickoff) to when it ends (clock hits zero).

When that day or project is over ---- it's over. You want me to come back for another day or another project, that costs extra.

Again the poster is invited to show us anybody's football contract, anywhere, that puts them on retainer 24/7.

There are of course such employments. For people who deal with actual emergencies. A football game cannot be described as an 'emergency'.

But again --- prove me wrong about that.

Sorry, they represent the team from the minute they suit up.

They get paid for practice, they get paid for skull sessions in the locker room, they get paid for time spent on the field.

Including the time the Anthem plays.

so maybe the owners should not take the government's money for the 'patriotism', and ditch the whole thing? Would that make it better?

that would be up to them.

til they do....

 

[Care4all]

Oh is it.
You're claiming football players are on retainer, just in case a football game suddenly erupts at 3:36 am on a Tuesday?

Link?

are you claiming they get paid by the hour?

Nope. And that's a false dichotomy.

I get paid by the day. Or by the project. When it's a work "day" that day is defined by its hour of beginning and its hour of end. If someone else hires me in the remainder of that day it can be an entirely different employer. And if it's a project it's from when the project begins (kickoff) to when it ends (clock hits zero).

When that day or project is over ---- it's over. You want me to come back for another day or another project, that costs extra.

Again the poster is invited to show us anybody's football contract, anywhere, that puts them on retainer 24/7.

There are of course such employments. For people who deal with actual emergencies. A football game cannot be described as an 'emergency'.

But again --- prove me wrong about that.

Sorry, they represent the team from the minute they suit up.

They get paid for practice, they get paid for skull sessions in the locker room, they get paid for time spent on the field.

Including the time the Anthem plays.

So? Regardless of all that, they have constitutional; rights.

yup

they also have to live up to their contracts.

If their contract states they have to wear tutus while sitting on the bench, they have 2 choices

wear the tutu, or quit

if the contract, or the team manager says they have to stand for the anthem, they have 2 choices

stand, or walk

and if their contract does not say that? You force the issue anyway, eh?

 

[Correll]

For those of you who think the NFL players protesting during the national anthem should be fired, would you also support a team owner who threatened to fire any players who refused to protest? Who didn't kneel?

Why or why not?

The NFL is a business. I believe the owners have the rigjt to fore any worker publicly protesting on company time at the workplace, causing the company millions in revenue.

Let the NFL continue doing what they are doing. When they have destroyed their fan base, lost their tax exempt status, and salaries have been slashed they will eventually change...

Agreed.


The hypothetical owner would have that right.


The right to show America that he is an anti-American piece of shit.


And yes, in that scenario, as in the real one, my hope would be that America as a whole would turn their backs on these assholes, and let football die.

But America is more than uptight conservatives. There are football fans who appreciate what the players are doing. If it were truly as one-sided as you pretend, all these players would be fired already.

I'm not pretending that it is one sided. I am well aware that Patriotism has been under constant assault from the Left for many decades and that has had some results.

Plenty of Americans have been taught to be ashamed of either themselves, their culture, their race, their nation or various combinations.


But regardless, my point stands.


The players are expressing contempt for the fans.



They manage to turn off half their fan base, and they would have to radically alter their sport to survive, AND get used to far less money.





AND, if they turn off enough, then fans won't get that unity with their peers feeling, and then you are losing not only the patriotic fans.