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This Michael Bellesiles?Your criticism of a group defending the 2nd amendment is backed by the same logic of somebody saying Whites should be allowed to inslave all African Americans again, on a constitutional basis of thinking not a moral basis of thinking. We're expressly guaranteed the right to bear arms in the 2nd amendment of the US constitution, just like how we're no longer allowed to inslave people based on the 13th amendment. The constitution is a universal living document that is to be used fully, not to be taken out of context and scrutinized clause by clause. If you use one part of it, you must use all of it. Any person disagreeing with me is in no way different than somebody who uses specific verses from the Bible to support their agenda, yet disregards the rest of it. I have the posthumous logic and principals of 40 of the most highly regarded and intelligent free-thinkers of modern history backing my position.
First, the word is "Enslave", not "inslave". I usually don't make a big deal about typos, but this wasn't a typo.
Second, the notion that the second amendment was about individual gun ownership is a recent invention. For most of history, it was understood to mean the right of states to have militias, not the right of individuals to own guns, which were for the most part rarely owned by private citizens until recently.
When industrialization made weapons like the Thompson Sub-machine gun available, the government moved to ban such weapons. (US v. Miller). Even Heller, which embraces the crackpot NRA position, still had to do some mighty fine parsing to make sure that people weren't out there buying their own mortars and recoiless rockets.
Michael Bellesiles, is that you? LOL!
In two scholarly articles,[15][16] law professor James Lindgren of Northwestern University noted that in Arming America, Bellesiles had
Critics also identified problems with Bellesiles's methods of citation. Cramer noted that Bellesiles had misrepresented a passage by George Washington about the quality of three poorly prepared militia units as if his criticism applied to the militia in general. (Washington had noted that the three units were exceptions to the rule.)[17] Cramer wrote, "It took me twelve hours of hunting before I found a citation that was completely correct. In the intervening two years, I have spent thousands of hours chasing down Bellesiless citations, and I have found many hundreds of shockingly gross falsifications." Wikipedia, Michael A Bellesiles.
- purported to count guns in about a hundred wills from 17th- and 18th-century Providence, Rhode Island, but these did not exist because the decedents had died intestate (i.e., without wills);
- purported to count nineteenth-century San Francisco County probate inventories, but these had been destroyed in the 1906 earthquake and fire;
- reported a national mean for gun ownership in 18th-century probate inventories that was mathematically impossible;
- misreported the condition of guns described in probate records in a way that accommodated his thesis;
- miscited the counts of guns in nineteenth-century Massachusetts censuses and militia reports,
- had more than a 60% error rate in finding guns listed as part of estates in Vermont records; and
- had a 100% error rate in the cited gun-related homicide cases of seventeenth-century Plymouth, MA.
This Michael Bellesiles?First, the word is "Enslave", not "inslave". I usually don't make a big deal about typos, but this wasn't a typo.
Second, the notion that the second amendment was about individual gun ownership is a recent invention. For most of history, it was understood to mean the right of states to have militias, not the right of individuals to own guns, which were for the most part rarely owned by private citizens until recently.
When industrialization made weapons like the Thompson Sub-machine gun available, the government moved to ban such weapons. (US v. Miller). Even Heller, which embraces the crackpot NRA position, still had to do some mighty fine parsing to make sure that people weren't out there buying their own mortars and recoiless rockets.
Michael Bellesiles, is that you? LOL!
In two scholarly articles,[15][16] law professor James Lindgren of Northwestern University noted that in Arming America, Bellesiles had
Critics also identified problems with Bellesiles's methods of citation. Cramer noted that Bellesiles had misrepresented a passage by George Washington about the quality of three poorly prepared militia units as if his criticism applied to the militia in general. (Washington had noted that the three units were exceptions to the rule.)[17] Cramer wrote, "It took me twelve hours of hunting before I found a citation that was completely correct. In the intervening two years, I have spent thousands of hours chasing down Bellesiless citations, and I have found many hundreds of shockingly gross falsifications." Wikipedia, Michael A Bellesiles.
- purported to count guns in about a hundred wills from 17th- and 18th-century Providence, Rhode Island, but these did not exist because the decedents had died intestate (i.e., without wills);
- purported to count nineteenth-century San Francisco County probate inventories, but these had been destroyed in the 1906 earthquake and fire;
- reported a national mean for gun ownership in 18th-century probate inventories that was mathematically impossible;
- misreported the condition of guns described in probate records in a way that accommodated his thesis;
- miscited the counts of guns in nineteenth-century Massachusetts censuses and militia reports,
- had more than a 60% error rate in finding guns listed as part of estates in Vermont records; and
- had a 100% error rate in the cited gun-related homicide cases of seventeenth-century Plymouth, MA.
Lost his Bancroft Prize in 2001 when his scurrilous claims were exposed by Professor Lindgren. First time for every fraud in the publishing world is such a sad thing.
But unfortunately, lies live on when political gain is the prize. /shaking head.
Firstly, genocide is not "cool," and genocide was attempted by both sides, not just white against the red man as you are implicating.
Guns have been part of our heritage, their use is written into the Second Amendment, and all your blathering is not changing the Founders' gift to free people nor our resolve in remaining free from government oppression through our most traditional understanding of ownership of guns and citizens of the United States of America.
]
Firstly, genocide is not "cool," and genocide was attempted by both sides, not just white against the red man as you are implicating.
We invaded their land, we used our technological superiority to all but exterminate them, and then we exagerated the few times we fought back to rationalize it... And today, decent people feel guilty abuot the whole thing...
Guns have been part of our heritage, their use is written into the Second Amendment, and all your blathering is not changing the Founders' gift to free people nor our resolve in remaining free from government oppression through our most traditional understanding of ownership of guns and citizens of the United States of America.
]
Horseshit. Just because we've always been doing something, is not a good reason to keep doing it.
I don't worry about the government "oppressing" me. I worry some whack is going to shoot up a public place I might happen to be in because you made it too easy to get a military grade weapon.
Thankfully, people are standing up to the bullies at the NRA... finally.
The wars are over, Joe.Firstly, genocide is not "cool," and genocide was attempted by both sides, not just white against the red man as you are implicating.
We invaded their land, we used our technological superiority to all but exterminate them, and then we exagerated the few times we fought back to rationalize it... And today, decent people feel guilty abuot the whole thing...
Guns have been part of our heritage, their use is written into the Second Amendment, and all your blathering is not changing the Founders' gift to free people nor our resolve in remaining free from government oppression through our most traditional understanding of ownership of guns and citizens of the United States of America.
]
Horseshit. Just because we've always been doing something, is not a good reason to keep doing it.
I don't worry about the government "oppressing" me. I worry some whack is going to shoot up a public place I might happen to be in because you made it too easy to get a military grade weapon.
Thankfully, people are standing up to the bullies at the NRA... finally.
Firstly, genocide is not "cool," and genocide was attempted by both sides, not just white against the red man as you are implicating.
We invaded their land, we used our technological superiority to all but exterminate them, and then we exagerated the few times we fought back to rationalize it... And today, decent people feel guilty abuot the whole thing...
Guns have been part of our heritage, their use is written into the Second Amendment, and all your blathering is not changing the Founders' gift to free people nor our resolve in remaining free from government oppression through our most traditional understanding of ownership of guns and citizens of the United States of America.
]
Horseshit. Just because we've always been doing something, is not a good reason to keep doing it.
I don't worry about the government "oppressing" me. I worry some whack is going to shoot up a public place I might happen to be in because you made it too easy to get a military grade weapon.
Thankfully, people are standing up to the bullies at the NRA... finally.
The main problem with gun grabbers is they can never conceive that a government would do evil to its citizens.
The main problem with gun grabbers is they can never conceive that a government would do evil to its citizens.
If government attempts to do evil to its citizens, whether the citizens are armed or not will make no difference.
I don't worry about the government "oppressing" me.
I worry some whack is going to shoot up a public place I might happen to be in because you made it too easy to get a military grade weapon.
Thankfully, people are standing up to the bullies at the NRA... finally.
The main problem with gun grabbers is they can never conceive that a government would do evil to its citizens.
I don't worry about the government "oppressing" me.
Because you are too stupid and ignorant to know the threat, hell, you probably enjoy getting cavity searched by the TSA.
[
I worry some whack is going to shoot up a public place I might happen to be in because you made it too easy to get a military grade weapon.
A single shot auto-loader is not a military grade weapon stupid shit.
[
Thankfully, people are standing up to the bullies at the NRA... finally.
The NRA are the bullies? lolol And the 24/7 coverage given by the media on this massacre isnt bullying on gun owners and the NRA at all, right?
Fuck you, Joe, you stupid liar.
The main problem with gun grabbers is they can never conceive that a government would do evil to its citizens.
The problem with the gun nuts is that they think the government really is always evil. Except when they are awaiting their disability check at the trailer park.
I don't worry about the government "oppressing" me.
Because you are too stupid and ignorant to know the threat, hell, you probably enjoy getting cavity searched by the TSA.
Don't know, that's never happened to me. Of course, I don't act suspiciously and mutter about the evil "gummit" while I'm waiting in line, either. That's probably what your problem is.
I'm not even sure how to address this bit of stupidity. The only diffrence between an AR-15 and an M-16 is that it can't fire full auto.
It still has the power, the range and the accuracy of the M-16, and a pretty decent fire rate.
Fire it into a classroom of preschoolers, they don't stand a chance.
Thankfully, people are standing up to the bullies at the NRA... finally.
The NRA are the bullies? lolol And the 24/7 coverage given by the media on this massacre isnt bullying on gun owners and the NRA at all, right?
Fuck you, Joe, you stupid liar.
So you want to pretend this massacre didn't happen? I'm not sure how this is "bullying" the gun owners.
I would think responsible gun owners would want guns kept out of the hands of a Lanza as much as any other sane person would.
But you just couldn't get LaPeirre to say that restricting ANY kind of gun was the answer.
The 2nd amendment had nothing to do with an armed citizenry why is that so hard for the gun nuts to understand.
You gun huggers must be retarded if you think that would make you safe.
And if you think limitations would work then you are a hypocrite.
Arming everyone demonstrates a level of stupidity hardly reached in other areas of debate.
No, dumbass, if you would pay attention and be honest for once in your fucking life, you would know that for 2A folks it isnt that the government*is* always evil that is key, but that the government is *always* capable of becoming evil and thus should have restrictions on the scope of its poer and authority.
No, dumbass, if you would pay attention and be honest for once in your fucking life, you would know that for 2A folks it isnt that the government*is* always evil that is key, but that the government is *always* capable of becoming evil and thus should have restrictions on the scope of its poer and authority.
Governments are usually the reflection of the people they rule. If a government becomes evil, it's usually because the people have become evil.
And arming a few assholes isn't going to change that.
No, dumbass, if you would pay attention and be honest for once in your fucking life, you would know that for 2A folks it isnt that the government*is* always evil that is key, but that the government is *always* capable of becoming evil and thus should have restrictions on the scope of its poer and authority.
Governments are usually the reflection of the people they rule. If a government becomes evil, it's usually because the people have become evil. And arming a few assholes isn't going to change that.
The 2nd amendment had nothing to do with an armed citizenry why is that so hard for the gun nuts to understand. I was in a crowded mall last evening and thought imagine everyone armed. You gun huggers must be retarded if you think that would make you safe. And if you think limitations would work then you are a hypocrite.
Arming everyone demonstrates a level of stupidity hardly reached in other areas of debate. Why do we not have hand grenades, missiles and bazookas too. All who live in a 'well regulated militia' raise your hand. Guns are only a symbol for the wingnuts, like most symbols of the right, empty of consequence, actual concern or even common sense.
"The logic is inexorable: as more private individuals acquire guns, the power of the police declines, personal security becomes more a matter of self-help, and the unarmed have an increasing incentive to get guns, until everyone is armed. When most citizens then have the ability to kill anyone in their vicinity in an instant, everyone is less secure than they would be if no one had guns other than the members of a democratically accountable police force.
The logic of private gun possession is thus similar to that of the nuclear arms race. When only one state gets nuclear weapons, it enhances its own security but reduces that of others, which have become more vulnerable. The other states then have an incentive to get nuclear weapons to try to restore their security. As more states get them, the incentives for others increase. If eventually all get them, the potential for catastrophe whether through irrationality, misperception, or accident is great. Each states security is then much lower than it would be if none had nuclear weapons." Gun 'Control' Is Not Enough - NYTimes.com
"In 1991, Warren E. Burger, the conservative chief justice of the Supreme Court, was interviewed on the MacNeil/Lehrer NewsHour about the meaning of the Second Amendment's "right to keep and bear arms." Burger answered that the Second Amendment "has been the subject of one of the greatest pieces of fraud--I repeat the word 'fraud'--on the American public by special interest groups that I have ever seen in my lifetime." In a speech in 1992, Burger declared that "the Second Amendment doesn't guarantee the right to have firearms at all. "In his view, the purpose of the Second Amendment was "to ensure that the 'state armies'--'the militia'--would be maintained for the defense of the state." Cass R. Sunstein, The Most Mysterious Right, National Review http://72.52.208.92/~gbpprorg/obama/Cass_Sunstein_Quotes.pdf
"Late in 1997, Eric took notice of school shooters. "Every day news broadcasts stories of students shooting students, or going on killing sprees," he wrote. He researched the possibilities for an English paper. Guns were cheap and readily available. Gun Digest said you could get a Saturday night special for $69. And schools were easy targets. "It is just as easy to bring a loaded handgun to school as it is to bring a calculator," Eric wrote... "Ouch!" his teacher responded in the margin. Overall, he rated it "thorough & logical. Nice job." 'Columbine' p199 Dave Cullen
The 2nd amendment had nothing to do with an armed citizenry why is that so hard for the gun nuts to understand.
