Hillary says NRA needs a "rival" organization of responsible gun owners

[hunarcy]

I cannot fathom why Hillary even opened her mouth. Doesn't she realize that many of the Democrat party are NRA members and avid hunters? I also cannot fathom why Obama, who is supposed to be the leader of the Democrat Party, opted to use executive order to infuriate a whole bunch of voters. He could easily have simply done nothing and eased on out of office. His action will cause some who were sitting on the fence to vote against Hillary especially since she has decided to enter the fray as well. There are an awful lot of Democrats and Independents who are heavily into guns. To me, it's a stupid political move on both Obama's and Hillary's part.

She is NOT trying to take guns away from you.

I have no idea what you mean by a "moderate" gun owner?

In reality, there are only two categories of gun owners.

1) Legal gun owners who obey the law.

2) Criminals who own illegal guns.

And mentally ill people who buy guns legally and then let loose in a public place.

According to the form that is filled out when a person buys a firearm from a FFL dealer, a mentally ill person cannot legally purchase a firearm. So, your attempt to rebut him fails.

How does the seller know the person is mentally ill if he/she has never been hospitalized?

The law says the purchaser must self identify. If he/she does not, then the purchaser should be prosecuted for perjury. Strange how that never happens...it's almost as if some want the system to fail so they can demand even more restrictions.

 

[OKTexas]

i thought open carry was the law of the land in states that allowed hunting. Hard to hunt if you have to conceal your weapon. My opinion is, whatever the police are allowed to do the citizens have the same ability.

Personally I don't think open carry protects a person more then concealed carry. What open carry does is allow a person to know where your weapon is and it might actually be the target of a robbery. Especially women carrying openly.

Police go through a very extensive background check which includes a psychological evaluation.

And we see how well that works out. I don't have a problem with the psychological evaluation, just make it as simple as possible.

Written psyc tests are not simple, they need to be valid and reliable.

Reliability is the degree to which an assessment tool produces stable and consistent results;
Validity refers to how well a test measures what it is purported to measure.

The psyc's taken by LE arew both reliable and valid, it cannot predict how life on the streets will later change a persons behavior.

They do weed out many from consideration as an armed agent of the government.

Yet some still go to the dark side, you can't predict everything, no matter how extensive or costly the tests.

Of course. When did I suggest that was not true?

Just pointing out that no matter how valid and reliable, no tests are perfect. In the reverse they also might weed out, as you put it, some candidates that might make fine officers.

 

[OKTexas]

I cannot fathom why Hillary even opened her mouth. Doesn't she realize that many of the Democrat party are NRA members and avid hunters? I also cannot fathom why Obama, who is supposed to be the leader of the Democrat Party, opted to use executive order to infuriate a whole bunch of voters. He could easily have simply done nothing and eased on out of office. His action will cause some who were sitting on the fence to vote against Hillary especially since she has decided to enter the fray as well. There are an awful lot of Democrats and Independents who are heavily into guns. To me, it's a stupid political move on both Obama's and Hillary's part.

She is NOT trying to take guns away from you.

I have no idea what you mean by a "moderate" gun owner?

In reality, there are only two categories of gun owners.

1) Legal gun owners who obey the law.

2) Criminals who own illegal guns.

And mentally ill people who buy guns legally and then let loose in a public place.

According to the form that is filled out when a person buys a firearm from a FFL dealer, a mentally ill person cannot legally purchase a firearm. So, your attempt to rebut him fails.

How does the seller know the person is mentally ill if he/she has never been hospitalized?

The same way the government knows a person registering to vote is a citizen, they check a box.

No one dies!

Really, how do you prove such a broad, generalized statement?

 

[OKTexas]

So someone gets more rights than me because they got there first?

Again, I don't trust any more gun control legislation while my rights in NYC continue to be infringed.

Why should it take me 3-6 months and $1000 to get a handgun permit for my own home?

Why? Because it's the law. Move to Texas if this upsets you so. There you can parade around the streets with your beloved gun on your hip & be free from the law you oppose.

This whole damn thread exist because you are trying to take that right away from everyone. Why don't you fucking regressives move your asses to States that have laws you support and leave the rest of us alone? Thank for showing you true face, hypocrite.

You can read and comprehend, thus you've proved to be a liar.

I've said this about gun control

• States should decide if they want to license gun owners
• States should decided if they want to register guns
• States should decide on the factors to deny, suspend or revoke a license
• States should decide on the types of weapon to be prohibited
• States should decide on open carry, concealed carry and other forms of transport of guns
• States should decide if guns are allowed in parks and other public places
• States should decide if Cities or Counties can impose stricter rules on gun storage or possession outside the home or business

I don't care what you do in Texas, and rural regions can and should have different gun laws than cities.

I believe any sober, sane and law abiding citizen can have a gun to protect his home or business. Beyond that, guns need to be controlled by whatever democratic process the citizens of the State, region or community decide.

So you think the State can remove your ability to defend yourself against criminals with equal or greater force, where ever that need arises? So I guess the State gets to decide if a law abiding citizen really has a right to life, except in their home. Now I must ask, why you support NYC's ridiculous fees and licensing to just have a gun in your home?

Post where I wrote I supported the NYC law! If you cannot quote my exact post which you alleged I stated what you said, you are a LIAR!

I know I never posted that I supported the law you allege I supported, and unless you can quote where I did and in the thread and post number I did the only conclusion possible is that you are a LIAR!!!

Marty was complaining and asking why NYC charged him a 1000 dollars and took months to get a permit to have a revolver in his home. I'm paraphrasing but you said because it was the law, and if he didn't like it to move to TX. If that wasn't supporting the law, what would you call it?

I'm not going to take the time to do your leg work, feel free to look it up for yourself.

 

[OKTexas]

Why? Because it's the law. Move to Texas if this upsets you so. There you can parade around the streets with your beloved gun on your hip & be free from the law you oppose.

This whole damn thread exist because you are trying to take that right away from everyone. Why don't you fucking regressives move your asses to States that have laws you support and leave the rest of us alone? Thank for showing you true face, hypocrite.

You can read and comprehend, thus you've proved to be a liar.

I've said this about gun control

• States should decide if they want to license gun owners
• States should decided if they want to register guns
• States should decide on the factors to deny, suspend or revoke a license
• States should decide on the types of weapon to be prohibited
• States should decide on open carry, concealed carry and other forms of transport of guns
• States should decide if guns are allowed in parks and other public places
• States should decide if Cities or Counties can impose stricter rules on gun storage or possession outside the home or business

I don't care what you do in Texas, and rural regions can and should have different gun laws than cities.

I believe any sober, sane and law abiding citizen can have a gun to protect his home or business. Beyond that, guns need to be controlled by whatever democratic process the citizens of the State, region or community decide.

So you think the State can remove your ability to defend yourself against criminals with equal or greater force, where ever that need arises? So I guess the State gets to decide if a law abiding citizen really has a right to life, except in their home. Now I must ask, why you support NYC's ridiculous fees and licensing to just have a gun in your home?

Wry doesn't support the Constitution. He's a totalitarian at heart and feels that no amount of government power is too much.

Total ad hominem, lacking substance, evidence and a piss poor example for a mod. You should be fired.

Poor baby, don't like the truth to be pointed out, too bad, sooooooooooo sad.

 

[westwall]

Why? Because it's the law. Move to Texas if this upsets you so. There you can parade around the streets with your beloved gun on your hip & be free from the law you oppose.

This whole damn thread exist because you are trying to take that right away from everyone. Why don't you fucking regressives move your asses to States that have laws you support and leave the rest of us alone? Thank for showing you true face, hypocrite.

You can read and comprehend, thus you've proved to be a liar.

I've said this about gun control

• States should decide if they want to license gun owners
• States should decided if they want to register guns
• States should decide on the factors to deny, suspend or revoke a license
• States should decide on the types of weapon to be prohibited
• States should decide on open carry, concealed carry and other forms of transport of guns
• States should decide if guns are allowed in parks and other public places
• States should decide if Cities or Counties can impose stricter rules on gun storage or possession outside the home or business

I don't care what you do in Texas, and rural regions can and should have different gun laws than cities.

I believe any sober, sane and law abiding citizen can have a gun to protect his home or business. Beyond that, guns need to be controlled by whatever democratic process the citizens of the State, region or community decide.

So you think the State can remove your ability to defend yourself against criminals with equal or greater force, where ever that need arises? So I guess the State gets to decide if a law abiding citizen really has a right to life, except in their home. Now I must ask, why you support NYC's ridiculous fees and licensing to just have a gun in your home?

Wry doesn't support the Constitution. He's a totalitarian at heart and feels that no amount of government power is too much.

Total ad hominem, lacking substance, evidence and a piss poor example for a mod. You should be fired.

Completely and totally accurate which bears on your opinions. Thus it is totally pertinent to the post you made, and the OP. You're welcome.

 

[OKTexas]

Obviously not because the people's elected reps have consistently refused to pass that garbage into law.

When The People want effective gun-control badly enough they will force their elected reps to execute their Will.

Certain states enacted that crap. So they got it. But the country as a whole is rejecting it and has consistently for 20 years.

Don't kid yourself... mandatory national standards for licensing, registration, sales, training, etc., are probably closer than you'd like to believe.

I'll comply with that kind of crap just as soon as you can prove the criminals are.

Think about your post. If you don't comply with the law, you are a criminal. That's self evident.

Great, because the supreme court says criminals can't be compelled to register their firearms, that nasty 5th Amendment gets in the way.

 

[BULLDOG]

Nope.There are lots of us ex-NRA members who want nothing more than reasonable controls on who gets guns. Gun owners are not the problem. Gun nuts are.

Finally..will you explain "Reasonable controls," you keep saying strings of words that have "Reasonable," in them but then you don't follow up with actual reasonable controls.............it would be nice if for once you guys did that.

No matter what I say, you would refuse to see reason. It's a waste of time repeating the same things you have been repeatedly told, but chose to ignore. Your willful ignorance is complete,and you are of no use but to laugh at and point out you obvious stupidity. Believe what you will.

 

[westwall]

Nope.There are lots of us ex-NRA members who want nothing more than reasonable controls on who gets guns. Gun owners are not the problem. Gun nuts are.

Finally..will you explain "Reasonable controls," you keep saying strings of words that have "Reasonable," in them but then you don't follow up with actual reasonable controls.............it would be nice if for once you guys did that.

No matter what I say, you would refuse to see reason. It's a waste of time repeating the same things you have been repeatedly told, but chose to ignore. Your willful ignorance is complete,and you are of no use but to laugh at and point out you obvious stupidity. Believe what you will.

I hope you're talking to yourself in the mirror when you spew that crap...for crap is what it is...

 

[westwall]

I despise Hillary as much as I do the Gun lobbyist like the NRA. But she is right, despite she is a leftist. The NRA and the pro gun crowd yield WAY more power that can be justified by common consensus, it MONEY talking here. Democracy isn't about rule by the elitist of any ilk.

If that were true it wouldn't be the elitist billionaires who are pushing for gun control now would it. Doesn't it give you pause that the uber wealthy are not only taking all of your money, controlling all of your opportunities and now they want to take away your ability to defend yourself.....from THEM.

It's become rule by money, pacs or lawyers or whoever. Millionaires are one thing, but a million people giving a dollar to support the NRA when the far bigger majority doesn't have a pac or a gun to defend them things get dicey if not sad. Not what freedom in this country was about, is it?

The Founders made sure that we had firearms so that billionaires wouldn't be able to buy every politician out there to pass the laws they want that turn us all into slaves in one form or other. So, yes, guns are EXACTLY what freedom is about in this country. Were it not for them you would be some poorly paid factory worker somewhere. If even that good...

 

[BULLDOG]

Nope.There are lots of us ex-NRA members who want nothing more than reasonable controls on who gets guns. Gun owners are not the problem. Gun nuts are.

Finally..will you explain "Reasonable controls," you keep saying strings of words that have "Reasonable," in them but then you don't follow up with actual reasonable controls.............it would be nice if for once you guys did that.

No matter what I say, you would refuse to see reason. It's a waste of time repeating the same things you have been repeatedly told, but chose to ignore. Your willful ignorance is complete,and you are of no use but to laugh at and point out you obvious stupidity. Believe what you will.

I hope you're talking to yourself in the mirror when you spew that crap...for crap is what it is...

Sorry, but I really don't care what the people from the party of death panels, FEMA prisons, conspiracy theories, tin foil hats,.and militias think.

 

[OKTexas]

Nope.There are lots of us ex-NRA members who want nothing more than reasonable controls on who gets guns. Gun owners are not the problem. Gun nuts are.

Finally..will you explain "Reasonable controls," you keep saying strings of words that have "Reasonable," in them but then you don't follow up with actual reasonable controls.............it would be nice if for once you guys did that.

No matter what I say, you would refuse to see reason. It's a waste of time repeating the same things you have been repeatedly told, but chose to ignore. Your willful ignorance is complete,and you are of no use but to laugh at and point out you obvious stupidity. Believe what you will.

So far none of you regressives have been able to articulate what constitutes reasonable controls and show how they will effectively stop criminals from getting guns which is supposedly your only goal, correct?

 

[Rustic]

Nope.There are lots of us ex-NRA members who want nothing more than reasonable controls on who gets guns. Gun owners are not the problem. Gun nuts are.

Finally..will you explain "Reasonable controls," you keep saying strings of words that have "Reasonable," in them but then you don't follow up with actual reasonable controls.............it would be nice if for once you guys did that.

No matter what I say, you would refuse to see reason. It's a waste of time repeating the same things you have been repeatedly told, but chose to ignore. Your willful ignorance is complete,and you are of no use but to laugh at and point out you obvious stupidity. Believe what you will.

I hope you're talking to yourself in the mirror when you spew that crap...for crap is what it is...

Sorry, but I really don't care what the people from the party of death panels, FEMA prisons, conspiracy theories, tin foil hats,.and militias think.

Quit barking up the wrong tree then, criminal control not gun control.

 

[BULLDOG]

I despise Hillary as much as I do the Gun lobbyist like the NRA. But she is right, despite she is a leftist. The NRA and the pro gun crowd yield WAY more power that can be justified by common consensus, it MONEY talking here. Democracy isn't about rule by the elitist of any ilk.

If that were true it wouldn't be the elitist billionaires who are pushing for gun control now would it. Doesn't it give you pause that the uber wealthy are not only taking all of your money, controlling all of your opportunities and now they want to take away your ability to defend yourself.....from THEM.

It's become rule by money, pacs or lawyers or whoever. Millionaires are one thing, but a million people giving a dollar to support the NRA when the far bigger majority doesn't have a pac or a gun to defend them things get dicey if not sad. Not what freedom in this country was about, is it?

The Founders made sure that we had firearms so that billionaires wouldn't be able to buy every politician out there to pass the laws they want that turn us all into slaves in one form or other. So, yes, guns are EXACTLY what freedom is about in this country. Were it not for them you would be some poorly paid factory worker somewhere. If even that good...

And yet those billionaires, with the constant support of the right, did turn us into wage slaves, and they packed all those good paying factory jobs and shipped them over seas. Now there aren't any factory jobs her, poorly paid or not.

 

[westwall]

I despise Hillary as much as I do the Gun lobbyist like the NRA. But she is right, despite she is a leftist. The NRA and the pro gun crowd yield WAY more power that can be justified by common consensus, it MONEY talking here. Democracy isn't about rule by the elitist of any ilk.

If that were true it wouldn't be the elitist billionaires who are pushing for gun control now would it. Doesn't it give you pause that the uber wealthy are not only taking all of your money, controlling all of your opportunities and now they want to take away your ability to defend yourself.....from THEM.

It's become rule by money, pacs or lawyers or whoever. Millionaires are one thing, but a million people giving a dollar to support the NRA when the far bigger majority doesn't have a pac or a gun to defend them things get dicey if not sad. Not what freedom in this country was about, is it?

The Founders made sure that we had firearms so that billionaires wouldn't be able to buy every politician out there to pass the laws they want that turn us all into slaves in one form or other. So, yes, guns are EXACTLY what freedom is about in this country. Were it not for them you would be some poorly paid factory worker somewhere. If even that good...

And yet those billionaires, with the constant support of the right, did turn us into wage slaves, and they packed all those good paying factory jobs and shipped them over seas. Now there aren't any factory jobs her, poorly paid or not.

The right? Are you stoned or just stupid? In 1932 the richest two percent of this countries population controlled 76% of the nations wealth. Democrats took over BOTH houses for forty continuous years and they held the POTUS for a good portion of that 40 year run as well. The percentages had changed to ONE percent controlling NINETY percent of this nations wealth... so tell me silly boy, who the fuck were the Democrats working for because it pretty clearly wasn't the poor and middle class.

 

[BULLDOG]

I despise Hillary as much as I do the Gun lobbyist like the NRA. But she is right, despite she is a leftist. The NRA and the pro gun crowd yield WAY more power that can be justified by common consensus, it MONEY talking here. Democracy isn't about rule by the elitist of any ilk.

If that were true it wouldn't be the elitist billionaires who are pushing for gun control now would it. Doesn't it give you pause that the uber wealthy are not only taking all of your money, controlling all of your opportunities and now they want to take away your ability to defend yourself.....from THEM.

It's become rule by money, pacs or lawyers or whoever. Millionaires are one thing, but a million people giving a dollar to support the NRA when the far bigger majority doesn't have a pac or a gun to defend them things get dicey if not sad. Not what freedom in this country was about, is it?

The Founders made sure that we had firearms so that billionaires wouldn't be able to buy every politician out there to pass the laws they want that turn us all into slaves in one form or other. So, yes, guns are EXACTLY what freedom is about in this country. Were it not for them you would be some poorly paid factory worker somewhere. If even that good...

And yet those billionaires, with the constant support of the right, did turn us into wage slaves, and they packed all those good paying factory jobs and shipped them over seas. Now there aren't any factory jobs her, poorly paid or not.

The right? Are you stoned or just stupid? In 1932 the richest two percent of this countries population controlled 76% of the nations wealth. Democrats took over BOTH houses for forty continuous years and they held the POTUS for a good portion of that 40 year run as well. The percentages had changed to ONE percent controlling NINETY percent of this nations wealth... so tell me silly boy, who the fuck were the Democrats working for because it pretty clearly wasn't the poor and middle class.

Don't care what happened in the first part of last century. What does the right do now other than degrade the poor and give shit to the rich?

 

[Sun Devil 92]

Eventually responsible gun owners will defeat the NRA terrorists.

"Eventually".....yes......someday......

hahahahahahahahahahaha

 

[LeftofLeft]

Hillary or anyone is more than welcome to start another organization for gun owners. It's called Capitalism. Capitalists start rival or alternative organizations all of the time because they believe there is a need that is not being met or that the organization can do better than the established organization, in this case the NRA.

Hillary says "we need an alternative to the NRA". Fine, let the Market determine that. But, being a Democrat, she won't leave it up to the Market. She will push for mandate that the organization be taxpayer funded. Or, perhaps pass legislation requiring all citizens to purchase membership.

 

[westwall]

If that were true it wouldn't be the elitist billionaires who are pushing for gun control now would it. Doesn't it give you pause that the uber wealthy are not only taking all of your money, controlling all of your opportunities and now they want to take away your ability to defend yourself.....from THEM.

It's become rule by money, pacs or lawyers or whoever. Millionaires are one thing, but a million people giving a dollar to support the NRA when the far bigger majority doesn't have a pac or a gun to defend them things get dicey if not sad. Not what freedom in this country was about, is it?

The Founders made sure that we had firearms so that billionaires wouldn't be able to buy every politician out there to pass the laws they want that turn us all into slaves in one form or other. So, yes, guns are EXACTLY what freedom is about in this country. Were it not for them you would be some poorly paid factory worker somewhere. If even that good...

And yet those billionaires, with the constant support of the right, did turn us into wage slaves, and they packed all those good paying factory jobs and shipped them over seas. Now there aren't any factory jobs her, poorly paid or not.

The right? Are you stoned or just stupid? In 1932 the richest two percent of this countries population controlled 76% of the nations wealth. Democrats took over BOTH houses for forty continuous years and they held the POTUS for a good portion of that 40 year run as well. The percentages had changed to ONE percent controlling NINETY percent of this nations wealth... so tell me silly boy, who the fuck were the Democrats working for because it pretty clearly wasn't the poor and middle class.

Don't care what happened in the first part of last century. What does the right do now other than degrade the poor and give shit to the rich?

Yep, you're just stupid. Thanks for the confirmation. 1972 is far from the first part of the last century moron. That's why this country is going to hell, you idiots don't have the slightest clue what the hell is going on and your are blissful in your ignorance.

 

[Iceweasel]

One of the smartest things Dems could do politically is to drop their opposition to guns and invite responsible gun owners into the fold. The GOP would freak out.

That made no sense. Are gun owners disinvited into the Democrat party? Why are liberals so fucking stupid anyway? Seriously, how do you manage life's complexities when simple shit is out of your reach?