History Always Repeats Its Self: The Crisis in Ukraine Has Happened Before

[tavlee123]

The current government in Ukraine is tearing the country in half, and a civil war seems imminent. On the side of Kiev you find American and EU(NATO) support. On the east you find Russian support. These two factions have increased in intensity and the end result is becoming clear. We are heading into a war that no one, but the government wants. Kiev is currently being run by a government with no elected power, only martial power. In a recorded call Victoria Nuland, the secretary of state for European and Eurasian affairs, can be heard hand picking the current government head. The party receiving the most American and EU aid is known as the Svoboda party, a party that only four years ago was on the EU's watch list for being Ant-Semitic, Xenophobic, Violent, and unstable. These are the men running Ukraine, unelected. If you are unaware there was a referendum or vote in the east of Ukraine and Crimea. This referendum showed that of the 75% of people who voted, 97% of them voted to become independent of Kiev, and hopefully to be absorbed into Russia. This referendum was declared illegal in the West and was condemned by many white house officials such as John Kerry. why? How is it any less legal then the current government, where thugs under the guise of the "national guard' beat people in the streets and murder protestors like in Odessa? Its not, Common law is on the side of the Eastern Ukrainian people. All of this so called illegal activity is being blamed on its so called instigator, Russia. Lets go back to the beginning of this crisis. The dissention began, not because of Russia, but because of the EU and NATO. An ultimatum was made to Ukraine via a public statement that either Ukraine could join the EU or be tied to Russia, but not both. To join the club, Ukraine had to dump its oldest trading partner with which Ukraine shares Family ties. If I offered you a million dollars to never talk to your mother again, would you take it? This is what we did, and it created a rift. sides were taken, and the riots began. We instigated this crisis, and then when Russia stepped in to aid its old friend, we passed the torch of blame onto them. We drew up sanctions against Russia in an attempt to silence them and get them to back off. This backfired, Russia and China are now in Alliance both militarily and economically, and they are pushing back. We have entered into an economic war, with a nation that holds the largest percentile of our debt. The Dollar is under threat because of what we did, now China and Russia plan on selling goods exclusively in Yen, Rubles, and Gold. This will cripple the Value of the Dollar, leaving us with only three options. Major Economic reforms that under the current powers is impossible, defaulting on our loans which would shatter our economy, or the most dangerous of all, an escalation from economic war to physical war. This last scenario is what the evidence leans towards. NATO and the US have sent warships and carriers to the Balkan and Black seas. The US has deployed several Airborne divisions in neighboring Estonia. Four-hundred Black Water Mercs are currently in Ukraine putting down "rebellion". NATO is trying to encircle Russia by adding Finland and Sweden. lastly we are running military games in Europe and the pacific. Russia and China seem to be preparing as well. Joint military games off the coast of England and France and in the pacific. The most frightening preparation of all is a signed order by Putin to retaliate to any act of aggression with tactical NUCLEAR strikes on NATO sites. We are heading for a war unlike anything the world has seen, but it can be stopped if this message is spread and if the people demand that our government stand down and admit that they made a mistake in Ukraine as well as Syria. Only then can we hope to turn things around. This is not a necessary war, the Soviet Union is long dead, but our government still sees its face in Russia. It wants to finish the job, and wipe out its only major rivals in the world at your expense. The saying goes that history always repeats its self so let me share one story with you from antiquity. The two largest powers in the world much like Russia and the US, were once known as Rome and Carthage. They fought three wars known as the Punic wars. The first two Punic wars parallel the world wars and cold war of modern times. The first was based on the balance of power in the Mediterranean, like that of Europe in WWI. Rome won the war and made Carthage pay through the teeth for it. Years later Hannibal sought revenge, much like the Germans under Hitler. The economy was restored and an Army was raised. He tortured Rome for years, but in the end Rome won by attacking the heart of Carthage. It destroyed the Carthaginian economy, but they were spared annihilation, much like the soviet union after the cold war. forty years later, Carthage became an economic powerhouse, but posed no threat to Rome. Rome needed an excuse, so it used Numidia, Carthage's old client state, much like the relationship between Ukraine and Russia. When Numidia's new Roman supported king encroached on Carthaginian land, after much diplomacy, Carthage defended itself, and there was the excuse to begin the third and final Punic war. Rome thought it would be easy, but Carthage fought with full intent to the death. the war lasted for years, with many Roman and Carthaginian casualties. Eventually Rome entered the City of Carthage and when it did it leveled the city, every brick, every man, all were lain to waste. Rome lost its counterbalance and from there no nation could keep it in check. thus was born the Roman empire. without the Fall of Carthage Rome would have never been the empire it rose to be. We are on the precipice of such an empire, a global empire. The book called "the Grand Chessboard outlines this process and we are following it to the letter. This book has been a governing force in American and European politics since 1977 and by its design the soviet union fell. The power however didn't stay in the west as was intended and now we go to finish the job we began and the only obstacles lie in Eurasia. The excuse we need lies in Ukraine.

 

[waltky]

Could Ukraine end up in 2nd Balkan War?...

Frustrations Grow as Ukranians Ready for Presidential Vote
May 23, 2014 — As Ukrainians brace themselves for Sunday’s presidential election, frustrations are growing. At least 21 have been killed since Thursday in escalating violence in east Ukraine.

And there are fears that the election may not mark the end of the months-long Ukraine crisis but the start of just another stage in the conflict. Odessa-native and activist Lisa Smith – she kept the family name of an ex-American husband – said she is frightened. “I am very worried that a war will start,” she said, speaking just yards from where she was on February 20 when more than 50 protesters of the old government were gunned down by snipers.

The 23-year-old documentary-maker said she still hasn’t recovered from the turmoil and bloodshed she witnessed in Kyiv’s Independence Square, or Maiden, during the weeks-long effort to topple ex-President Viktor Yanukovych. And she frets that nothing might change after the election. “My other big fear is that the person who gets elected will be the same as our last president – a person who steals everything from the country,” she said. “I think we need reform in every ministry.”

Voters ready

Ukrainians appear eager to vote and replace an interim government that is widely unpopular and seen by many in the east and south as illegitimate. Pollsters expect at least a 70 percent turnout. The latest opinion survey this week suggests that election-front-runner Petro Poroshenko, a pro-Western billionaire nicknamed the “chocolate king” for his candy empire, is widening his lead over second-placed Yulia Tymoshenko, a former prime minister. The poll shows Poroshenko getting 44 per cent support among those planning to vote and Tymoshenko just 8 per cent. Polling data is prompting media commentators to wonder if the businessman and former minister will secure 50 percent of the vote on Sunday, making a second round next month unnecessary. Tymoshenko is seen as a throwback to a graft-filled past that Maiden activists want to leave behind. “The Yanukovych regime was an alliance of corrupt politicians and oligarchs,” said Vadim Baranski, an advertising executive, who took time off work to protest through the winter at Maiden.

A pro-Russian fighter takes a photo on his cell phone of a burning cafe after impact of a mortar bomb, during fighting between Ukrainian government troops and pro-Russian militants at a checkpoint near the major highway which links Kharkiv, outside Slovya

Taking coffee in a café in Pushkinskaya Street in central Kyiv, the 32-year-old looks up at the warm spring sun and smiles ruefully at the cold he endured in mid-winter on the barricades in the Maiden. He said he doesn’t want that struggle to be wasted and remains suspicious of the “chocolate king.” “Poroshenko might not be too bad but Kyiv has turned to oligarchs to help them against the eastern separatists,” he said, referring among others to Ukraine’s richest oligarch, Rinat Akhmetov, the coal and steel magnate. Akhmetov last week threw his weight behind the pro-unity cause and urged his workers in east Ukraine to see off separatists. Continuing corruption remains the biggest fear of voters. In an opinion poll conducted for the U.S. non-profit the International Foundation for Electoral Systems in May, those surveyed were highly pessimistic that the engrained graft linking politics and business could be overcome. Fifty-six percent said most Ukrainians looked at corruption as a fact of life in the country and more than 90 percent said they have had to pay a bribe to the police and the courts.

Keen for change

See also:

Worries Grow Over Ukraine ‘Yugoslav Scenario
May 23, 2014: WASHINGTON — When Russian President Vladimir Putin reclaimed Crimea for Moscow, he called the territory “inseparable” from the motherland.

Putin justified the annexation by asserting the right to protect “millions [of Russians who] went to bed in one country and woke up abroad, overnight becoming minorities in the former Soviet republics.” If the refrain sounds familiar, think back 20 years ago to the Yugoslav breakup. Moscow’s moves have raised fears that Ukraine could plunge into the cycle of bloodshed and vengeance that killed more than 200,000 people and drove 3.5 million from their homes in the Balkan wars of the 1990s. “Putin and the people in Russia who are talking about reuniting Russians, how they are artificially divided, and how this is a legitimate aim, are raising the questions that [late Serbian and Yugoslav President Slobodan] Milosevic raised when he was talking about Bosnia and some other places. I think that’s very dangerous,” said James Collins, a former U.S. ambassador to Russia.

Both conflicts date back to the 1991 collapse of two multi-national, federal, communist states, the Soviet Union and Yugoslavia. Large numbers of Russians and Serbs – the dominant nationalities in those federations – found themselves spread among newly independent countries, notably Ukraine, Bosnia and Croatia. Now, analysts say, an eerily similar script is unfolding to that which fueled Yugoslavia’s bloody breakup.

Nationalism and perception

After Ukraine’s president, Viktor Yanukovych, was chased from power in February, nationalists in parliament attempted to repeal a controversial law that allowed the official use of Russian and other “regional languages” in areas where they are predominantly spoken. The law’s passage in 2012 had triggered violent street rallies and even a brawl among legislators. In a conciliatory gesture, interim President Oleksandr Turchynov vetoed the repeal bill. Along with Prime Minister Arseniy Yatsenyuk, he has since pledged to strengthen the rights of Russian-speakers. “The Ukrainian government is ready to conduct full-fledged constitutional reform which will strengthen the powers of the regions,” Yatsenyuk said last month in a televised address. Similar tensions had simmered in Croatia following the victory of conservative nationalists in the 1990 elections, after which the right-wing government only slowly granted concessions to minorities. By 1991, Croatian Serb uprisings – organized and armed by Belgrade – had turned into full-blown civil war.

A pro-Russian armed man guards a barricade in Slaviansk, Ukraine. The sticker on his rifle reads "Republic of Donetsk."

As in Croatia, Yatsenyuk’s attempts to distance his administration from the nationalist fringe appear to have fallen flat among anti-government rebels in eastern Ukraine. They mistrust Kyiv and the pro-Western revolution known as Maidan that began there. “Whatever really happened in Maidan, people in the east believed it was a return to what they’d seen in 2005-09 [when former pro-Western President Viktor] Yushchenko moved to ‘Ukrainianize’ the east and south,” said Vladislav Zubok, a Russian Cold War expert teaching at the London School of Economics.

During that period, monuments to World War II partisan Stepan Bandera were erected and those of Soviet soldiers taken down. Bandera is seen in western Ukraine as a nationalist hero but reviled in the east and by Russia, Poland and Jewish groups as a Nazi puppet. “The issue resurfaced [in 2013-14] and was magnified by [Russian] propaganda, so people in the east reacted to the Maidan heroes as fascists. It’s a highly divisive issue that goes beyond even economic interests. Rhetoric is hugely important,” Zubok said.

Greater Serbia and ‘Novorossiya’

 

[Indofred]

The current government in Ukraine.

Shhh - stop telling the truth.
The U.S. governments wants everyone to think the nasty horrible Russians caused all this and are doing to it to the legitimate government of that country.

If you let people know, the government took over by an American sponsored coup, and the pro Russia groups held a democratic election to join Russia, you'll ruin a well set up American/EU propaganda machine.
Forum members like you should be banned - it takes months of hard work and a large pile of American taxpayers' money to lie that way and you ruin it all with the truth.
And what about the American taxpayer funded arms sales, sorry, aid to that country?
Thatll have to stop as well.

You bastard.

 

[tavlee123]

Glad you liked it. Interesting page by the way. I did a protest sign project on Israel's "RED LINE" against Iran's "nukes". It was nice seeing it so well formatted.

 

[bendog]

History does not "repeat" itself. However, Putin really does see US/Western manipulation everywhere, and even paranoids have real enemies.