How did the Federal Government aquire much of the land in Utah and Neveda?

[JakeStarkey]

Check all the state constitutions on federal land within their boundaries after 1791.

 

[OKTexas]

Conservation is an important job for the government. No other entity could enforce the law or protect the land like a state or federal government can. Creating the National Park system was among Teddy Roosevelt's greatest achievement.

No.. actually it is not... the federal government, unless it is making an owned federal park or using the land for a specific task like a military base or an office building, has no business being a land baron... that land was not intended to remain in federal hands

The Constitution of the State of Nevada disagrees with you.

Because they were extorted into giving it up as a condition of state hood.

 

[OKTexas]

You beat me to it.
I was going to say that the Feds owned the land before there was any States.

Once the states were given sovereignty all land with in their borders should have gone to the states.

In your mind, but that is not what happened.

Ya dumb all I didn't say what happened, I sad what should have happened.

 

[Pheonixops]

Regreening of Cache Valley

Cache Valley was settled by Mormon pioneers in the early 1860s. When they arrived in the area they found rich soil, clear running streams, wild game, and abundant lumber and grazing resources. From 1860–1900, in their efforts to grow their faith communities and turn profits in the national economy, Mormon settlers exploited the natural resources found in Cache Valley and the nearby Bear River Range. During the 1870s and 1880s loggers removed entire forests, and from 1890–1900 thousands of cattle and sheep overgrazed the range. Wherever settlers went they transformed the landscape, hunted wild game, and introduced nonnative plant and animal species.

By the turn of the 20th Century, Cache Valley and the Bear River Range looked substantially different. Where there had once been forests, burned and scarred lands remained. In areas where native grasses had flourished, timothy, sagebrush, and juniper now dominated. Wild game that once roamed the hills had been replaced with cattle and sheep. The compounded effects of resource exploitation ultimately resulted in watershed damage. Mountain streams, which provided water for both townspeople and farmers living in Cache Valley, experienced serious decline.

In 1902, unable to get the water they needed, residents petitioned the federal government to have much of the Bear River Range set aside as a forest reserve. During July 1902 chief grazing officer Albert F. Potter surveyed the Bear River Range on behalf of the federal government. Potter took photos of the area and recorded the general environmental condition of the Bear River Range. On May 29, 1903, President Theodore Roosevelt signed a proclamation creating the Logan Forest Reserve. During the decade following the creation of the Logan Forest Reserve (later renamed Cache National Forest), forest managers and settlers worked to restore, or “re-green” Cache Valley and the Bear River Range.

This is but one example of many where the local people petitioned the Federal Government to take over the land for the protection of the residents of the land.

Add this:
http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...nst-the-federal-government-2.html#post8971411

and the picture becomes quite clear..............

 

[JakeStarkey]

the Mormons were factor in the border between nevada and Utah. Utah had about half of Nevada territory but the gov thought Utah and the Mormons would become to powerful with all that nevada gold and changed the boundary.

btw: I'm going to cache valley aka Logan tomorrow. think I'll go thru Pocatello and see all that famland and avoid the downtown logan traffic

Nah, go over Sardine, drop into the valley, exit on 1000 west south then up to 2500 North (airport road) and right to 91 and then on north to Smithfield and Preston and onto Pocatello.

Beautiful drive. Logan traffic is awful; as bad as Tyler Texas.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Once the states were given sovereignty all land with in their borders should have gone to the states.

In your mind, but that is not what happened.

Ya dumb all I didn't say what happened, I sad what should have happened.

Don't be obtuse. It never should have happened.

 

[Pheonixops]

Conservation is an important job for the government. No other entity could enforce the law or protect the land like a state or federal government can. Creating the National Park system was among Teddy Roosevelt's greatest achievement.

No.. actually it is not... the federal government, unless it is making an owned federal park or using the land for a specific task like a military base or an office building, has no business being a land baron... that land was not intended to remain in federal hands

Did you ever check out the Nevada State Constitution regarding the land owned by the Federal Government?
http://www.usmessageboard.com/polit...nst-the-federal-government-2.html#post8971411

 

[Pheonixops]

Correct me if I am wrong. The federal government, either through conquest or purchase, obtained most of the land. Then they opened land for people in the form of homesteads. We all have seen the pictures of people lining up to race onto federal land to stake a claim. So all the land once belonged to the federal government, WE the people. The Bundy farm is no exception it was made claim to through homesteading. In other words they were given the land. The federal government can also do as they did first at Yellowstone and put federal land as a national park. Private land is bought at prices that usually seem to be low but none the less as far as I know land ownership is recognized.

The problem was that the Western States were not as lush as the Eastern States were.
The homesteaders needed more that 160 aces in order to make a good living on the land.
Many could not make it with just that amount and they went bust or just gave up and gave the land back to the government.
This is how the Federal came to own much more of land in the West.
Then the States did their own management until the Federal Land Policy and Management Act of 1976 when it turned it over for the Federal Government to manage the land.
This is when much of the problems began with fights over grazing and water use started.

There was the 1934 Taylor Grazing Act that preceded the FLPMA of 1976.

Taylor Grazing Act

 

[Pheonixops]

Conservation is an important job for the government. No other entity could enforce the law or protect the land like a state or federal government can. Creating the National Park system was among Teddy Roosevelt's greatest achievement.

So 85% of Nevada is national park land?

It is Federally owned land.

 

[Plasmaball]

No.. actually it is not... the federal government, unless it is making an owned federal park or using the land for a specific task like a military base or an office building, has no business being a land baron... that land was not intended to remain in federal hands

Federal Parks are what I was talking about.

Here's the problem: the EPA treats the ENTIRE UNITED STATES as though it is a national park for the preservation of endangered species (except when the feds allow their cronies to kill said endangered species with a green energy project).

and the thread just went stupid.
Sigh.....BLM can be traced all the way back to 1812,Then you have the Mexican/America war and treaty,Then the homestead actin 1860, then you have the merger in 1946 i think?Of two agencies, Some other acts in the 70's and viola, you have what we have today.

This is naturally an overly simple version of events,but people arent really interested in the history, because it pokes holes in their argument about Bundy.

 

[Plasmaball]

you know a lot of this info is on the BLM website....oh thats a government website so its all a lie.

 

[OKTexas]

In your mind, but that is not what happened.

Ya dumb all I didn't say what happened, I sad what should have happened.

Don't be obtuse. It never should have happened.

So you're saying a state should not have control over the land within it's borders? Exactly what it the point of being a sovereign state.

 

[Pheonixops]

Ya dumb all I didn't say what happened, I sad what should have happened.

Don't be obtuse. It never should have happened.

So you're saying a state should not have control over the land within it's borders? Exactly what it the point of being a sovereign state.

Do you think that the State of Virginia should be in control of the military bases located within it's borders?

 

[Plasmaball]

So a factual thread dies off, but the threads where ignorance is king still gets posts....

That sums up these supporters of Bundy and the overall conservative movement.

 

[Erand7899]

Regreening of Cache Valley

Cache Valley was settled by Mormon pioneers in the early 1860s. When they arrived in the area they found rich soil, clear running streams, wild game, and abundant lumber and grazing resources. From 1860–1900, in their efforts to grow their faith communities and turn profits in the national economy, Mormon settlers exploited the natural resources found in Cache Valley and the nearby Bear River Range. During the 1870s and 1880s loggers removed entire forests, and from 1890–1900 thousands of cattle and sheep overgrazed the range. Wherever settlers went they transformed the landscape, hunted wild game, and introduced nonnative plant and animal species.

By the turn of the 20th Century, Cache Valley and the Bear River Range looked substantially different. Where there had once been forests, burned and scarred lands remained. In areas where native grasses had flourished, timothy, sagebrush, and juniper now dominated. Wild game that once roamed the hills had been replaced with cattle and sheep. The compounded effects of resource exploitation ultimately resulted in watershed damage. Mountain streams, which provided water for both townspeople and farmers living in Cache Valley, experienced serious decline.

In 1902, unable to get the water they needed, residents petitioned the federal government to have much of the Bear River Range set aside as a forest reserve. During July 1902 chief grazing officer Albert F. Potter surveyed the Bear River Range on behalf of the federal government. Potter took photos of the area and recorded the general environmental condition of the Bear River Range. On May 29, 1903, President Theodore Roosevelt signed a proclamation creating the Logan Forest Reserve. During the decade following the creation of the Logan Forest Reserve (later renamed Cache National Forest), forest managers and settlers worked to restore, or “re-green” Cache Valley and the Bear River Range.

This is but one example of many where the local people petitioned the Federal Government to take over the land for the protection of the residents of the land.

Most of the federal public lands were acquired by a federal demand that most if, not all, unclaimed land be transferred to the federal government as a requirement for statehood. This applied to most of the Western states and that is where the vast majority of federal public lands are located. Some of these lands were assigned to the forest service, and the rest were turned over to be managed by the BLM.

Both the US Forest Service and the BLM did a fine job of managing the public lands until the extremist environmentalists began to gain control over both agencies. These extremists want the public lands closed to public use, and they will not rest until they get what they want.