How Should We Change Our Policing to Avoid Chauvin-Floyd Type Mistakes?

[Moonglow]

Yea I say get rid of the problem, let the hyphenated Americans go back to their "home country".

They don't call themselves American africans. They call themselves African Americans. So go back there.

Italian Americans, Asian American, Irish Americans, Native Americans, Hispanic Americans...

African Americans...

Yet your concern is with African Americans,

Why is that...?

Because it's the African ones that cause the problems around here.

It's the meth heads and pill poppers around here but they ain't black...

 

[Polishprince]

The key is for police officers to be better trained to avoid the problem situations and people that lead to the unfortunate and ugly confrontation between Chauvin and Floyd. If Chauvin been flirting with a Donut Waitress, maybe showing her his gun and bragging about how many bad guys he whacked, he wouldn't have come within Floyd's space at all.

It is a police officers job to enforce the law; not avoid career criminals.

If the career criminals are protected friends of the political class who control your pay check and your freedom, then they will be allowed to slide.

 

[EvilCat Breath]

Perhaps a massive education outreach.

There are bold blacks. There are old blacks. There are no bold old blacks. Citizens in ill health have a duty to not commit crimes and put the lives and careers of officers in jeopardy when such ill health over takes them.

 

[OldLady]

I have been thinking about this for the last week and reading on different approaches, and I was wondering what people think about it here.

These would be Federali standards in order to receive Federal policing funds.

1) Cops should be banned from using neck restraint holds. This seems like a very dangerous practice, and when I was infantry training for some Cuban detention camps, we wwere told to not use neck restraints as it is easy to actually kill a person in a dozen different ways. so maybe police should be banned from using it?

2) Cops should have body cams on at all times when on duty. If it stops working they have to go back to theirprecinct and get it fixed before going back out.

3) Cops should have additional training on submission holds, the risks and what not to do.

4) Cops could be tracked on a Federal database for disciplinary action. This way a bad cop from Chicago cant conceal his past nad get hired on in Houston.

5) We should focus more on community outreach programs with police to soften their image more and build relations with the local community. More foot cops less patrol cars.

6) Stop voting into the mayors office people that have a history of slamming on cops.

7) Reduce militarization of our PEACE officers. Not every cop should be SWAT.

8) Increase pay for cops to reduce ned for overtime

9) cops should have random drug tests (especially for steroids)

10) Annual psychological review to help police deal with frustrations from the job, and these should be former cops as well as psychologists/

Good ideas. Riots are awful whenever they happen. Needless death and destruction. But if anything good can come of them and the attention they got for necessary change, grab it.

But if you allow riots to "get attention for necessary change" then you encourage more riots. The only thing riots should get people is arrested.

I think you lost that one. Between the millions of protesters and the riots, they indeed got people's attention and they're going to do something about it.

 

[9thIDdoc]

Yea I say get rid of the problem, let the hyphenated Americans go back to their "home country".

They don't call themselves American africans. They call themselves African Americans. So go back there.

Italian Americans, Asian American, Irish Americans, Native Americans, Hispanic Americans...

African Americans...

Yet your concern is with African Americans,

Why is that...?

Why not just "Americans"? I also question anyone who feels the need to be a hyphenated American especially people who have never even been to the Country/area mentioned.

 

[Care4all]

Yea I say get rid of the problem, let the hyphenated Americans go back to their "home country".

They don't call themselves American africans. They call themselves African Americans. So go back there.

Italian Americans, Asian American, Irish Americans, Native Americans, Hispanic Americans...

African Americans...

Yet your concern is with African Americans,

Why is that...?

Because it's the African ones that cause the problems around here.

Your post was clear.... You were upset that they called themselves African Americans, and should go home to Africa, because they did such....

 

[9thIDdoc]

The key is for police officers to be better trained to avoid the problem situations and people that lead to the unfortunate and ugly confrontation between Chauvin and Floyd. If Chauvin been flirting with a Donut Waitress, maybe showing her his gun and bragging about how many bad guys he whacked, he wouldn't have come within Floyd's space at all.

It is a police officers job to enforce the law; not avoid career criminals.

If the career criminals are protected friends of the political class who control your pay check and your freedom, then they will be allowed to slide.

If so then they are in violation of the law. It should be noted that the "political class" are elected by the People or appointed by people who were. Issues with their actions? Don't vote for them.

 

[Care4all]

Yea I say get rid of the problem, let the hyphenated Americans go back to their "home country".

They don't call themselves American africans. They call themselves African Americans. So go back there.

Italian Americans, Asian American, Irish Americans, Native Americans, Hispanic Americans...

African Americans...

Yet your concern is with African Americans,

Why is that...?

Why not just "Americans"? I also question anyone who feels the need to be a hyphenated American especially people who have never even been to the Country/area mentioned.

We are proud of being a melting pot of the world....

The only nation in the world that basically comprised their citizenry, from around the world.... near any nationality, could become, an American.

THAT is what makes us great, and greater than other nations.... That, is our strength, not a weakness.

 

[9thIDdoc]

Yea I say get rid of the problem, let the hyphenated Americans go back to their "home country".

They don't call themselves American africans. They call themselves African Americans. So go back there.

Italian Americans, Asian American, Irish Americans, Native Americans, Hispanic Americans...

African Americans...

Yet your concern is with African Americans,

Why is that...?

Why not just "Americans"? I also question anyone who feels the need to be a hyphenated American especially people who have never even been to the Country/area mentioned.

We are proud of being a melting pot of the world....

The only nation in the world that basically comprised their citizenry, from around the world.... near any nationality, could become, an American.

THAT is what makes us great, and greater than other nations.... That, is our strength, not a weakness.

Actually that is pretty much true of all nations and beside the point in any case.

 

[9thIDdoc]

Yea I say get rid of the problem, let the hyphenated Americans go back to their "home country".

They don't call themselves American africans. They call themselves African Americans. So go back there.

Italian Americans, Asian American, Irish Americans, Native Americans, Hispanic Americans...

African Americans...

Yet your concern is with African Americans,

Why is that...?

Why not just "Americans"? I also question anyone who feels the need to be a hyphenated American especially people who have never even been to the Country/area mentioned.

We are proud of being a melting pot of the world....

The only nation in the world that basically comprised their citizenry, from around the world.... near any nationality, could become, an American.

THAT is what makes us great, and greater than other nations.... That, is our strength, not a weakness.

“In the first place, we should insist that if the immigrant who comes here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace, or origin. But this is predicated upon the person's becoming in every facet an American, and nothing but an American...There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag... We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people.”
― Theodore Roosevelt

 

[toomuchtime_]

I have been thinking about this for the last week and reading on different approaches, and I was wondering what people think about it here.

These would be Federali standards in order to receive Federal policing funds.

1) Cops should be banned from using neck restraint holds. This seems like a very dangerous practice, and when I was infantry training for some Cuban detention camps, we wwere told to not use neck restraints as it is easy to actually kill a person in a dozen different ways. so maybe police should be banned from using it?

2) Cops should have body cams on at all times when on duty. If it stops working they have to go back to theirprecinct and get it fixed before going back out.

3) Cops should have additional training on submission holds, the risks and what not to do.

4) Cops could be tracked on a Federal database for disciplinary action. This way a bad cop from Chicago cant conceal his past nad get hired on in Houston.

5) We should focus more on community outreach programs with police to soften their image more and build relations with the local community. More foot cops less patrol cars.

6) Stop voting into the mayors office people that have a history of slamming on cops.

7) Reduce militarization of our PEACE officers. Not every cop should be SWAT.

8) Increase pay for cops to reduce ned for overtime

9) cops should have random drug tests (especially for steroids)

10) Annual psychological review to help police deal with frustrations from the job, and these should be former cops as well as psychologists/

Your premises are all wrong. No mistakes were made in the George Floyd case. He died of natural causes, sudden cardiac arrest, while in police custody. The knee on his neck did not compress his carotid arteries of larynx and therefore did not endanger his life.

Police brutality is 99% myth. In nearly every case in which it is alleged, the police are dealing with a subject who is resisting arrest and has to be subdued. Considering our huge population, there are remarkably few cases in which even a hint of police brutality is apparent.

Black lives matter is 100% bullshit. It began as a protest to the shooting of Trayvon Martin, which had nothing to do with the police, and was promoted by unprincipled politicians, most notably Obama and Clinton, who painted a target on a police officer's back in Ferguson Missouri despite the fact that all the evidence corroborated the cop's claim that he shot Michael Brown in self defense, as Obama's Justice Department later confirmed.

https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/opa/press-releases/attachments/2015/03/04/doj_report_on_shooting_of_michael_brown_1.pdf

Since nearly all cases in which allegations of police brutality arise are cases in which the subject resists lawful orders from police, by encouraging young black men to believe their lives are endangered by any contact with police it encourages resistance and puts the subjects in danger.

The only way to reduce crime and to avoid violent confrontations between police and criminal suspects is community policing, which requires a police presence just about everywhere and therefore large increases int the numbers of police, but the most troubled cities can't afford the cost and today's racist bullshit about police brutality is opposed to any measures that do not blame everything on police without any rational basis in fact or logic.

 

[JimBowie1958]

 

[harmonica]

The key is for police officers to be better trained to avoid the problem situations and people that lead to the unfortunate and ugly confrontation between Chauvin and Floyd. If Chauvin been flirting with a Donut Waitress, maybe showing her his gun and bragging about how many bad guys he whacked, he wouldn't have come within Floyd's space at all.

..pilots are trained and experts--yet they ''kill'' hundreds of innocents, sometimes
1. these are dynamic situations--
2. for some cops, it's their FIRST time in physical contact with a jackass..for others, they don't do it ''''everyday''' = not much experience
3. it's like combat, you can train for years, but it's not like the real thing...

 

[harmonica]

..choke holds don't matter.....they went apeshit when MBrown ATTACKED a cop and Wilson shot him....and they shot ASterling.......and they shot KScott

 

[JimBowie1958]

Why not just "Americans"? I also question anyone who feels the need to be a hyphenated American especially people who have never even been to the Country/area mentioned.

We are proud of being a melting pot of the world....
The only nation in the world that basically comprised their citizenry, from around the world.... near any nationality, could become, an American.
THAT is what makes us great, and greater than other nations.... That, is our strength, not a weakness.

Melting but not a stew pot.

And it is our strength and it was, interestingly, Rome's strength too in its earliest history, before the Republic. Rome accepted immigrants and they obtained knowledge from around the world by doing so.

Rome melded these various separate technologies to make their aqueducts, their legions and their ships. Romes diversity of culture made Rome strong and thriving as it has us also.

Romes problems got out of hand socially when they let their great trading families displace their military families. These new Oligarchs bought the land up around Rome to build huge slave plantations and the dispossessed Roman citizens moved to Rome to live off the public dole and became morally degenerate and a mob that could riot and destroy over a stupid chariot race.

We need moral vigor as well as diversity and representative democratic Republican government, but we are no better than our constituent parts.

 

[JimBowie1958]

..choke holds don't matter....

Choke holds matter if it is YOUR neck in the hold, dude.

 

[harmonica]

..choke holds don't matter....

Choke holds matter if it is YOUR neck in the hold, dude.

most of the deaths are not choke holds

 

[JimBowie1958]

most of the deaths are not choke holds

That is true, but it is still too dangerous to use on citizens whose guilt is not proven unless the cops life is in danger, like the suspect has grabbed a knife or is a professional fighter, etc

 

[harmonica]

....if a criminal has caused shit before--especially armed robbery--and is killed, I say GOOD----that's the way of the world ....he got a second chance and didn't take it
....that goes for ANY color criminal
...I don't care if they get shot in the back--good riddance
...just think if your parents or grandparents got robbed by some thug