How we know Hitler was right wing.

[Pogo]

1. Dictators are bad
2. Leftists are bad
3. Therefore, dictators are leftists.

The "Nazis are leftists!" crowd can go home now. I've got their arguments covered.

Wow another stupid post from a stupid man.....but you were close, you just left out a few dots.

Left wants government control larger and bigger.....and for you marxists, that includes production....ok..so political and economic control......and who has all that stuff........well......
The reason us on the right laugh at that is, how many dictators are there in anarchy? ZERO......we want smaller less powerful governments....and people to solve their own problems....it's really not that difficult. YOUR business is YOUR business.

Your simplisticism is showing.

Leftists don't want government control. Nor do Rightists. Authoritarians want that.

Y'all have been tossing around this horseshoe-shaped line to try to meet at the ends but you can't put these things on a line, no matter how you bend the line. A line is two-dimensional. A better graph, though still inadequate, would be the rectangle with its four compass points, where east-west represents right/left and north-south represents Authoritarian/Libertarian. That way you have all four elements in any combination. On that, Hitler would appear way up in the corner where he could inhabit both the right and the authoritarian.

"How many dictators are there in anarchy"--
How many air conditioners are there in Antarctica? Deep, dood.

 

[P@triot]

Indeed he was, but the 'free market' has not been the goal of any right wing dictator.

That's because they were not "right-wing". The very nature of any dictator is control over others - an inherently left-wing trait/ideology.

 

[P@triot]

I don't know how you could mistake Nazis for being right wing!

That's just crazy talk!

Ok.....? Everyone there is clearly a liberal (who waves the confederate flag more than LIBERALS?!?). Last time I checked, representative Byrd from West Virginia was not only a proud member of the KKK - but he was also a proud dumbocrat who was elected by other racist liberals for many, many decades!

 

[P@triot]

Rottie -

Ay any point you are interested in getting up to speed on this issue, I'm happy to explain a few key points for you. Your illiterate spamming I'm less interested in.

The problem is - you ignore all of they facts. So your idea of "key points" are just fantasy land. Here are the key points for you (and they are indisputable):


Since we know that the right believes in limited government and maximum freedom for the individual, it's very easy to understand that the further right you go, government continues to get smaller and less powerful. As you start to go further right, you reach the libertarian. As you continue, you start to hit the radical fringe - the Sovereign Citizen. This is a person who believes they are "sovereign" unto themselves. They answer to nobody, under any circumstances. They do not recognize the U.S. government. They believe they do not have to pay taxes, they do not have to obey traffic laws, etc. The farthest fringe and the very end is the Anarchist. The anarchist believes in no government and no laws at all.

This radical fringe element of the right is downright scary. They are a menace to society. They will, and often do, commit murder. They are violent, unhinged, pose a real threat to anyone around them.

I do not, under any circumstances, condone their actions or agree with their ideology. A Constitutional government is the backbone of a civilized and peaceful society. Nobody has the right to ignore the laws of a Constitutional government (you do have the right to leave anytime you want if you don't like the laws, but you do not have the right to violate them). I have had heated debates with Sovereign Citizens on this board (most of them posing as "libertarians") who have actually stated that you do not have to stop if an officer attempts to pull you over (no, I'm not joking - they have actually stated that right here on this board), you do not have to provide ID, and you can drive away any time you want. Here are a few examples of the violent and despicable Sovereign Citizen:

• Convicted Oklahoma City bombing conspirator Terry Nichols was a member of the sovereign citizen movement
  
  
• In May 2010, two police officers in West Memphis, Arkansas were shot and killed by Joseph T. Kane after Kane and his father were the subject of a traffic stop. Kane and his father were later identified as members of the sovereign citizen movement.
  
  
• On June 18, 2012, Francis August Schaeffer Cox, who had asserted that he was a sovereign citizen, was found guilty in the United States District Court in Anchorage, Alaska, of several felony charges including conspiracy to commit murder
  
  
• On June 20, 2012, Anson Chi was arrested by federal authorities for allegedly trying to blow up a natural gas pipe line in a residential area of Plano, Texas.
  
  
• On July 19, 2012, Martin Jonassen, who had described himself as a sovereign citizen, was found guilty by a jury in a federal court of kidnapping his 21 year old daughter, who he allegedly had sexually abused, and of obstruction of justice. During the incident, the daughter escaped from a hotel room where Jonassen had been holding her, ran naked into a store and begged for help. Jonassen was caught on surveillance footage chasing her, dragging her out of the store and pushing her into his car. The daughter reportedly "had never been to school and only read books about religion, history and the government approved by her father." She had seen a doctor only once in her life. On February 19, 2013, Jonassen was sentenced to forty years in federal prison
  
  
• On August 27, 2012, Lonnie G. Vernon and Karen Vernon, an Alaska couple who were described as "followers of Schaeffer Cox", pled guilty to conspiracy to commit murder of U.S. District Judge Ralph Beistline, who presided over a federal income tax case based on sovereign-citizen theories which had cost the Vernons their house

Sovereign citizen movement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/quote]

 

[P@triot]

Since we know that the left believes in unlimited government with maximum power, it's very easy to understand that the further left you go, government continues to get larger and more powerful. As you start to go further left, you reach the socialist. As you continue, you start to hit the radical fringe - the Marxists. Finally, the farthest fringe and the very end is the Communist, Fascist, or Totalitarianism . These groups believes in in total government control. A person has no freedoms or rights - they do as instructed by the government for the "good" of the entire nation.

The radical fringe of the left, believe it or not, is actually more scary and dangerous than the radical fringe of the right. While the radical fringe of the right has murderous tendencies, these are almost always limited to individuals or very small groups. The radical fringe of the left, through out history, are responsible for the murder of HUNDREDS of MILLIONS. The well known, notorious examples below:

• Joseph Stalin - estimates are he was responsible for orchestrating the death of anywhere from 40 to 60 million people
  
  
• Adolf Hitler - responsible for orchestrating the death of over 11 million people
  
  
• Vladimir Lenin - estimates are he was responsible for orchestrating the death of nearly 3.5 million people.
  
  
• Benito Mussolini - estimates are he was responsible for orchestrating the death of many thousands
  
  
• Saddam Hussein - estimates are he was responsible for orchestrating the death of many thousands

As you can see, the radical left is far more dangerous than the radical right because of the power handed to them by the people. While the fringe right is limited in the havoc they can wreak because they are extremely limited in their resources, the radical left has nearly unlimited resources because of their control over the government, and hence, the people.

 

[Pogo]

I don't know how you could mistake Nazis for being right wing!

That's just crazy talk!

Ok.....? Everyone there is clearly a liberal (who waves the confederate flag more than LIBERALS?!?). Last time I checked, representative Byrd from West Virginia was not only a proud member of the KKK - but he was also a proud dumbocrat who was elected by other racist liberals for many, many decades!

Umm... West Virginia wasn't part of the Confederacy, dumbass. That was the whole point of seceding from Virginia.

I live in the South and I can assure you-- where there's a Confederate flag there ain't no liberals, and vice versa. And even in the daze before the Southern Strategy and the Civil Rights Act when the Democratic Party dominated the South, they were anything but "liberal". I'm related to some of them. Including Strom Thurmond.


My god, what a maroon... (/offtopic)

 

[Pogo]

Since we know that the left believes in unlimited government with maximum power, it's very easy to understand that the further left you go, government continues to get larger and more powerful. As you start to go further left, you reach the socialist. As you continue, you start to hit the radical fringe - the Marxists. Finally, the farthest fringe and the very end is the Communist, Fascist, or Totalitarianism . These groups believes in in total government control. A person has no freedoms or rights - they do as instructed by the government for the "good" of the entire nation.

The radical fringe of the left, believe it or not, is actually more scary and dangerous than the radical fringe of the right. While the radical fringe of the right has murderous tendencies, these are almost always limited to individuals or very small groups. The radical fringe of the left, through out history, are responsible for the murder of HUNDREDS of MILLIONS. The well known, notorious examples below:

• Joseph Stalin - estimates are he was responsible for orchestrating the death of anywhere from 40 to 60 million people
  
  
• Adolf Hitler - responsible for orchestrating the death of over 11 million people
  
  
• Vladimir Lenin - estimates are he was responsible for orchestrating the death of nearly 3.5 million people.
  
  
• Benito Mussolini - estimates are he was responsible for orchestrating the death of many thousands
  
  
• Saddam Hussein - estimates are he was responsible for orchestrating the death of many thousands

As you can see, the radical left is far more dangerous than the radical right because of the power handed to them by the people. While the fringe right is limited in the havoc they can wreak because they are extremely limited in their resources, the radical left has nearly unlimited resources because of their control over the government, and hence, the people.

Once again in your sublime ignorance, what you describe is progressions of Authoritarianism. That has nothing to do with right or left. Indeed you started on the accurate path and then suddenly out of nowhere shot off to "totalitarianism", which is unrelated to either.

 

[P@triot]

I agree - because the two extremes are closer to each other than they are to the centre - which is one of the main reasons that we see posters here thinking the two extremes must actually be the same thing.

The left-wing horseshoe political schema is obvious bull crap. It's just another attempt to fool people into believing that fascists are not leftists when they actually are leftists.

Well said BP... I can't stand their lies and their backpedalling.

They start off with the pure insanity that "Hitler was right-wing". When you smack them up side their heads with facts, they get angry (hoping to intimidate you out of the argument). When you stick with it and more people continue to pound their stupid asses with facts, then they try to "good cop" you into agreeing with them. Suddenly the new narrative is "well, it's actually like a horseshoe that comes so far around, the complete opposite ends of the spectrum touch". I mean, how in the hell does that make any sense?!?

It's literally the equivalent of saying the more radically hot it gets and the more radically cold it gets, the more they come around and meet at the end of a horseshoe! When something is on opposite ends of the spectrum, it is on opposite ends of the spectrum and no amount of liberal "oh shit, how do we explain Hitler as a conservative" mumbo-jumbo can change that fact.

 

[P@triot]

I don't know how you could mistake Nazis for being right wing!

That's just crazy talk!

Ok.....? Everyone there is clearly a liberal (who waves the confederate flag more than LIBERALS?!?). Last time I checked, representative Byrd from West Virginia was not only a proud member of the KKK - but he was also a proud dumbocrat who was elected by other racist liberals for many, many decades!

Umm... West Virginia wasn't part of the Confederacy, dumbass. That was the whole point of seceding from Virginia.

I live in the South and I can assure you-- where there's a Confederate flag there ain't no liberals, and vice versa. And even in the daze before the Southern Strategy and the Civil Rights Act when the Democratic Party dominated the South, they were anything but "liberal". I'm related to some of them. Including Strom Thurmond.


My god, what a maroon...

Wow - what does Senator Byrd (who was not even BORN during the Civil War) have to do with the "Confederacy"

To recap (for those distracted by Pogo here trying to distract you): Senator Byrd was a PROUD member of the KKK. He was also a PROUD member of the Dumbocrats. And he was elected for about 5 decades to the Senate by other racist dumbocrats (it sure as HELL wasn't conservatives that elected that jack ass over and over and over).

 

[P@triot]

Since we know that the left believes in unlimited government with maximum power, it's very easy to understand that the further left you go, government continues to get larger and more powerful. As you start to go further left, you reach the socialist. As you continue, you start to hit the radical fringe - the Marxists. Finally, the farthest fringe and the very end is the Communist, Fascist, or Totalitarianism . These groups believes in in total government control. A person has no freedoms or rights - they do as instructed by the government for the "good" of the entire nation.

The radical fringe of the left, believe it or not, is actually more scary and dangerous than the radical fringe of the right. While the radical fringe of the right has murderous tendencies, these are almost always limited to individuals or very small groups. The radical fringe of the left, through out history, are responsible for the murder of HUNDREDS of MILLIONS. The well known, notorious examples below:

• Joseph Stalin - estimates are he was responsible for orchestrating the death of anywhere from 40 to 60 million people
  
  
• Adolf Hitler - responsible for orchestrating the death of over 11 million people
  
  
• Vladimir Lenin - estimates are he was responsible for orchestrating the death of nearly 3.5 million people.
  
  
• Benito Mussolini - estimates are he was responsible for orchestrating the death of many thousands
  
  
• Saddam Hussein - estimates are he was responsible for orchestrating the death of many thousands

As you can see, the radical left is far more dangerous than the radical right because of the power handed to them by the people. While the fringe right is limited in the havoc they can wreak because they are extremely limited in their resources, the radical left has nearly unlimited resources because of their control over the government, and hence, the people.

Once again in your sublime ignorance, what you describe is progressions of Authoritarianism. That has nothing to do with right or left. Indeed you started on the accurate path and then suddenly out of nowhere shot off to "totalitarianism", which is unrelated to either.

Hey genius - the political scale goes left to right. No matter how badly you wish that weren't true, it is. Now, in his desperation to garner support for his radical ideology (ie communism/socialism/marxism), Saigon has tried to make the case that Hitler is on the right side of that political scale lmao.

However, FACTS show that the further right you go, government size and power shrinks until it ceases to exist (Soveriegn Citizen, Anarchist). The further left you go, government size and power grows until it has complete and total control (wow - that means - gasp! Authoritarian!).

This is not rocket science. It's just common sense.

 

[Pogo]

Ok.....? Everyone there is clearly a liberal (who waves the confederate flag more than LIBERALS?!?). Last time I checked, representative Byrd from West Virginia was not only a proud member of the KKK - but he was also a proud dumbocrat who was elected by other racist liberals for many, many decades!

Umm... West Virginia wasn't part of the Confederacy, dumbass. That was the whole point of seceding from Virginia.

I live in the South and I can assure you-- where there's a Confederate flag there ain't no liberals, and vice versa. And even in the daze before the Southern Strategy and the Civil Rights Act when the Democratic Party dominated the South, they were anything but "liberal". I'm related to some of them. Including Strom Thurmond.


My god, what a maroon...

Wow - what does Senator Byrd (who was not even BORN during the Civil War) have to do with the "Confederacy"

To recap (for those distracted by Pogo here trying to distract you): Senator Byrd was a PROUD member of the KKK. He was also a PROUD member of the Dumbocrats. And he was elected for about 5 decades to the Senate by other racist dumbocrats (it sure as HELL wasn't conservatives that elected that jack ass over and over and over).

Uhhhhhhh..... see all those flags in the pix? The ones with the big blue X on them? Have any idea what that flag represents? You actually already mentioned it, immediately before Senator Byrd. Who was from... duuuhhh... West Virginia.

And somehow "PROUD" doesn't seem to follow from the known facts, such as this interview from twenty years ago:
>> Q: What has been your biggest mistake and your biggest success?

A: Well, it's easy to state what has been my biggest mistake. The greatest mistake I ever made was joining the Ku Klux Klan. And I've said that many times. But one cannot erase what he has done. He can only change his ways and his thoughts. That was an albatross around my neck that I will always wear. You will read it in my obituary that I was a member of the Ku Klux Klan.

Contrast that with an interview Thurmond gave Joseph Stroud of the Charlotte Observer in July 1998 to commemorate the 50th anniversary of his presidential bid on the segregationist Dixiecrat ticket. Asked if he wanted to apologize, Thurmond said, "I don't have anything to apologize for," and "I don't have any regrets." Asked if he thought the Dixiecrats were right, Thurmond said, "Yes, I do." Thurmond said this four years ago! <<

(Article from 2007; Byrd interview from 1993)

Thurmond would be a prime example of one of those "proud Democrats" who was never a liberal. That's why he switched to Republican in 1964, two months after the Civil Rights Act passed.

Fun facts. Amaze your friends.
Oh sorry, well imagine you have friends, then amaze them.

(/STILL offtopic)

 

[Pogo]

I agree - because the two extremes are closer to each other than they are to the centre - which is one of the main reasons that we see posters here thinking the two extremes must actually be the same thing.

The left-wing horseshoe political schema is obvious bull crap. It's just another attempt to fool people into believing that fascists are not leftists when they actually are leftists.

Well said BP... I can't stand their lies and their backpedalling.

They start off with the pure insanity that "Hitler was right-wing". When you smack them up side their heads with facts, they get angry (hoping to intimidate you out of the argument).

Oh, you mean like with big bad fonts and bold faces? Like this?

You really just summed up the entire problem with libtards. Words mean nothing to them. That's why the pervert the Constitution.

or do you mean like...

You cannot "blow" FACTS "out of the water" dumb fuck.

They were the National SOCIALIST Party

That one's got pretty colours. Much louder. Good for shouting people down.

When you stick with it and more people continue to pound their stupid asses with facts, then they try to "good cop" you into agreeing with them. Suddenly the new narrative is "well, it's actually like a horseshoe that comes so far around, the complete opposite ends of the spectrum touch". I mean, how in the hell does that make any sense?!?

I agree, it doesn't. Said that before. That's why I think this one is more descriptive.

- still not adequate but allows more breathing room than that one-dimensional line.

However it doesn't really serve your agenda of morphing Adolf Hitler into a leftist, so you may not want to go there.

 

[bripat9643]

I don't know how you could mistake Nazis for being right wing!

That's just crazy talk!

How do your pictures prove that Nazis are right-wing?

Let me guess, I bet he's saying because they have uniforms and a rea militaristic......which is ANOTHER way of looking at the spectrum...but it's weak and doesnt make sense. Not many cultures arent militaristic.......

You're giving him too much credit. I think the logic goes something like this:

1. Neo Nazis wear uniforms.
2. Real Nazis wore uniforms
3. real Nazis were right-wing.
4. Therefor neo Nazis are right-wing.
5. Therefor Nazis are right-wing.

Stupid, I know, but all the arguments that are used to claim that Nazis were right-wing are just as stupid.

 

[bripat9643]

It must be hell to live in a world where one enslaves oneself to labels, but I can tell you I'm not on welfare, I don't want or need gun control or vocational tests, or soda bans, or thermostat controls. And I love to drive.

Must suck royally to be forced to put everyone in little boxes, all made out of ticky tacky and they all look just the same. BOR-ing.

(/Utterly offtopic)

You love to drive? The how do you feel about Obama's new EPA regulations and scheme to limit drilling on public lands?

 

[bripat9643]

1. Dictators are bad
2. Leftists are bad
3. Therefore, dictators are leftists.

The "Nazis are leftists!" crowd can go home now. I've got their arguments covered.

1. We want Hitler to be a right-winger
2. Hitler is a right-winger

 

[Political Junky]

1. Dictators are bad
2. Leftists are bad
3. Therefore, dictators are leftists.

The "Nazis are leftists!" crowd can go home now. I've got their arguments covered.

1. We want Hitler to be a right-winger
2. Hitler is a right-winger

History is working against you. You might try some of the history sources that Saigon recommended earlier. It seems you have none of your own.

 

[bripat9643]

Umm... West Virginia wasn't part of the Confederacy, dumbass. That was the whole point of seceding from Virginia.

I live in the South and I can assure you-- where there's a Confederate flag there ain't no liberals, and vice versa. And even in the daze before the Southern Strategy and the Civil Rights Act when the Democratic Party dominated the South, they were anything but "liberal". I'm related to some of them. Including Strom Thurmond.


My god, what a maroon... (/offtopic)

Your belief that liberal democrats aren't racists is false. LBJ was a well known racist and a liberal Democrat. Al Gore Sr. was a liberal Democrat and a segregationist. Sen. J. William Fulbright, Clinton's mentor, was a well known racist. 21 Democrat senators voted against the 1964 civil rights act. More Republicans voted for it than Democrats.

 

[bripat9643]

I agree, it doesn't. Said that before. That's why I think this one is more descriptive.

- still not adequate but allows more breathing room than that one-dimensional line.

However it doesn't really serve your agenda of morphing Adolf Hitler into a leftist, so you may not want to go there.

That's just another chart left-wingers invented to obfuscate the fact that Nazis are left-wingers. It's modeled on the libertarian political plane that has economic control on one axis and social control on the perpendicular axis. Leftist show up on the upper right corner of that chart. The Left-right axis is the same as the economic axis on the libertarian chart.

However, this chart is flattering to Democrats because the fact is that most if them would be at the very bottom.

 

[bripat9643]

1. Dictators are bad
2. Leftists are bad
3. Therefore, dictators are leftists.

The "Nazis are leftists!" crowd can go home now. I've got their arguments covered.

1. We want Hitler to be a right-winger
2. Hitler is a right-winger

History is working against you. You might try some of the history sources that Saigon recommended earlier. It seems you have none of your own.

I've already read plenty of pinko intellectual propaganda.

 

[Pogo]

Umm... West Virginia wasn't part of the Confederacy, dumbass. That was the whole point of seceding from Virginia.

I live in the South and I can assure you-- where there's a Confederate flag there ain't no liberals, and vice versa. And even in the daze before the Southern Strategy and the Civil Rights Act when the Democratic Party dominated the South, they were anything but "liberal". I'm related to some of them. Including Strom Thurmond.


My god, what a maroon... (/offtopic)

Your belief that liberal democrats aren't racists is false. LBJ was a well known racist and a liberal Democrat. Al Gore Sr. was a liberal Democrat and a segregationist. Sen. J. William Fulbright, Clinton's mentor, was a well known racist. 21 Democrat senators voted against the 1964 civil rights act. More Republicans voted for it than Democrats.

Everything you've got in that post is either undocumented speculation or in the case of the last sentence, flat out bullshit, but none of that is the topic here. Feel free to take it to a new thread where it may be merrily shot down, but for the purposes here amend your last sentence to: "more liberals (of both parties) voted for it than conservatives (of both parties) and you'll have something closer to an understanding of how things actually work.

In other words -- get over this simplistic toy-soldier game of "Democrats" and "Republicans". Politics is not a freaking board game where every piece is clearly red or blue.